Who's right here?
coinut1799
Posts: 318
A few weeks ago I attended a coin show in Pittston, PA. At the time 90% silver melt value was approximately $26, or $13 per 90% half.
Two guys were looking for silver "bargains" at the show. One dealer had generic half dollars marked at between 7 and 8 dollars per coin. The guys saw this, bought a bunch, and walked the coins over to another dealer who paid them $13 each for melt. They did this two or three times before another dealer noticed what was going on and began yelling that the guys were taking advantage of the dealer and put a stop to it.
So the issue is, who is in the right here? Does the customer have an obligation to tell the dealer that his prices are too low, or are they entitled to rip off as much stuff as possible? The above scenario actually happened. Any thoughts?
Two guys were looking for silver "bargains" at the show. One dealer had generic half dollars marked at between 7 and 8 dollars per coin. The guys saw this, bought a bunch, and walked the coins over to another dealer who paid them $13 each for melt. They did this two or three times before another dealer noticed what was going on and began yelling that the guys were taking advantage of the dealer and put a stop to it.
So the issue is, who is in the right here? Does the customer have an obligation to tell the dealer that his prices are too low, or are they entitled to rip off as much stuff as possible? The above scenario actually happened. Any thoughts?
No good deed goes unpunished
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Comments
Good for the two guys who were doing this. They spotted an opportunity and jumped on it.
To me, the vigilante dealers that interfered were the ones in the wrong.
<< <i>A few weeks ago I attended a coin show in Pittston, PA. At the time 90% silver melt value was approximately $26, or $13 per 90% half.
Two guys were looking for silver "bargains" at the show. One dealer had generic half dollars marked at between 7 and 8 dollars per coin. The guys saw this, bought a bunch, and walked the coins over to another dealer who paid them $13 each for melt. They did this two or three times before another dealer noticed what was going on and began yelling that the guys were taking advantage of the dealer and put a stop to it.
So the issue is, who is in the right here? Does the customer have an obligation to tell the dealer that his prices are too low, or are they entitled to rip off as much stuff as possible? The above scenario actually happened. Any thoughts? >>
A collector taking advantage of a dealer is sort of like "man bites dog".
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>A few weeks ago I attended a coin show in Pittston, PA. At the time 90% silver melt value was approximately $26, or $13 per 90% half.
Two guys were looking for silver "bargains" at the show. One dealer had generic half dollars marked at between 7 and 8 dollars per coin. The guys saw this, bought a bunch, and walked the coins over to another dealer who paid them $13 each for melt. They did this two or three times before another dealer noticed what was going on and began yelling that the guys were taking advantage of the dealer and put a stop to it.
So the issue is, who is in the right here? Does the customer have an obligation to tell the dealer that his prices are too low, or are they entitled to rip off as much stuff as possible? The above scenario actually happened. Any thoughts? >>
Someone took advantage of the free enterprise and commerce system to their advantage. Nothing wrong. The dealer selling should know what they're doing and pricing, if not, their loss.
That said, I personally have no problem at all with them walking the floor. If someone is selling cheaper than than someone else then why shouldn't a person be able to take advantage of the situation.
<< <i>The dealers paid a fee to set up at that show. That fee gives them the right to buy and sell back and forth. The "two guys" paid no such fee. One or two transactions back and forth probably would have been overlooked. A half dozen wouldn't be.
That said, I personally have no problem at all with them walking the floor. If someone is selling cheaper than than someone else then why shouldn't a person be able to take advantage of the situation. >>
If these deals were happening at tables the fee part does not matter to me. Attendees are not limited to the amount of transactions they can have at the tables, normally they are encouraged to have as many as possible.
...buyer beware!
<< <i>...buyer beware!
...seller besmart!
<< <i>The dealers paid a fee to set up at that show. That fee gives them the right to buy and sell back and forth. The "two guys" paid no such fee. One or two transactions back and forth probably would have been overlooked. A half dozen wouldn't be.
That said, I personally have no problem at all with them walking the floor. If someone is selling cheaper than than someone else then why shouldn't a person be able to take advantage of the situation. >>
So only those who paid to set up a table are allowed to buy and sell at a show? Say that out loud a few times. How stupid does your statement sound now?
<< <i>So the issue is, who is in the right here? Does the customer have an obligation to tell the dealer that his prices are too low, or are they entitled to rip off as much stuff as possible? The above scenario actually happened. Any thoughts? >>
I don't see any issue here at all. Why would a buyer have any obligation to a seller other than to pay for the merchandise they are buying?
You ask a pointedly loaded question: "are they entitled to rip off as much stuff as possible?"
No one is "entitled" to rip-off anyone, and no one was being ripped-off in your scenario. You had two parties engaging in commerce. Why did you use the term "rip off" to describe the transactions that were taking place? You were a witness to free-market capitalism before the other dealer interfered with the process.
If I were selling $20 bills for $15 each, how many of those would you buy??? The only correct answer would be: I would buy every single last one of them.
<< <i>The other day I was perusing through a pawnshop where the seller was selling 90% halves for $10 each. I thought I was being helpful in sharing with him that they were then about $13.50 melt value and that he might want to adjust his prices. He exclaimed that he bought them low already, had them for awhile and sure wasn't taking a loss so he was not going to change the price! So next time keep the trap shut and just buy them. >>
That's a reality... sometimes, proud people feel attacked when you try to help. Help yourself [to inexpensive bullion].
<< <i>The dealers paid a fee to set up at that show. That fee gives them the right to buy and sell back and forth. The "two guys" paid no such fee. One or two transactions back and forth probably would have been overlooked. A half dozen wouldn't be. >>
This makes no sense. Don't dealers have the opportunity to buy and sell among themselvers before the show opens to the general public? Dealers want customers that buy their coins and they want customers that will sell them coins. So, who is harmed when someone buys from a dealer at his sell price and then sells to a dealer at his buy price?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
I agree with the poster that said the language in the original post was loaded. No one was being ripped off. The buyers were not helping themselves to a five finger discount. They are under no obligation to tell the DEALER his price was low. This is not the little old lady scenario.
edited for spelling
Please visit my website Millcitynumismatics.com
<< <i>
<< <i>...buyer beware!
...seller besmart!
...
<< <i>The dealer was a jealous schmuck. Or maybe a putz.
Both---a schmucknputz.
RMR: 'Wer, wenn ich schriee, hörte mich denn aus der Engel Ordnungen?'
CJ: 'No one!' [Ain't no angels in the coin biz]
<< <i>A few weeks ago I attended a coin show in Pittston, PA. At the time 90% silver melt value was approximately $26, or $13 per 90% half.
Two guys were looking for silver "bargains" at the show. One dealer had generic half dollars marked at between 7 and 8 dollars per coin. The guys saw this, bought a bunch, and walked the coins over to another dealer who paid them $13 each for melt. They did this two or three times before another dealer noticed what was going on and began yelling that the guys were taking advantage of the dealer and put a stop to it.
So the issue is, who is in the right here? Does the customer have an obligation to tell the dealer that his prices are too low, or are they entitled to rip off as much stuff as possible? The above scenario actually happened. Any thoughts? >>
I was just at a coin show this past weekend, at one of the first tables that I stopped to take a look at some books I noticed a fellow sitting down going through the dealers quarter's book, he was popping out washies one after another- then I looked at the price- $7 each! And most looked like they were BU late 1950's coins. I stepped across the isle to sell the silver I had brought to the show and got $29X face no hassle. The guy buying all the quarters got them at 28X face, if I had been a few minutes earlier I thought to myself I could have made a quick couple of bucks! I noticed walking around later and looking at a few dealers albums that this was kind of typical, I saw many silver washies still priced at between $6 and $7- I guess the dealers hadn't had time to reprice everything after last weeks rise- but then again maybe they just wanted to move the low end stuff.
<< <i>IMHO, the "other" dealer that started yelling was the one in the wrong. He should have pulled the dealer doing the selling aside and explained the current market price. Up to that point, a dealer (or someone pretending to be a dealer) set up at a coin show, marked prices on his coins and was selling them. >>
<< <i>I saw many silver washies still priced at between $6 and $7- I guess the dealers hadn't had time to reprice everything after last weeks rise- but then again maybe they just wanted to move the low end stuff. >>
Dealers should have signs now advising that marked prices of silver coins may be overridden based on spot price movements.
<< <i>
<< <i>I saw many silver washies still priced at between $6 and $7- I guess the dealers hadn't had time to reprice everything after last weeks rise- but then again maybe they just wanted to move the low end stuff. >>
Dealers should have signs now advising that marked prices of silver coins may be overridden based on spot price movements. >>
Yes, overwritten by their pen BEFORE the show!
Seller- thebigeng; morgansforever; bolivarshagnasty
Buyer-nibanny; derryb; zubie; smittys; konsole; tootawl; socalbigmark; fullcameo; coinkid855
<< <i>If I were the buyer I would feel guilty doing that to someone. Buy $200 worth of silver, sell for $300, come back to buy $300 and sell for $450..........I know it is okay to get a good deal but that scenario, going back and forth multiple times seems Dirty! >>
That's why I would have bought it all the first time!
<< <i>The dealer was a jealous schmuck. Or maybe a putz.
<< <i>If I were the buyer I would feel guilty doing that to someone. Buy $200 worth of silver, sell for $300, come back to buy $300 and sell for $450..........I know it is okay to get a good deal but that scenario, going back and forth multiple times seems Dirty! >>
I hope it is nice on the planet you are living on.
<< <i>That's why I would have bought it all the first time! >>
and tried to bargain him down some, so he wouldn't get suspicious.
<< <i>The other day I was perusing through a pawnshop where the seller was selling 90% halves for $10 each. I thought I was being helpful in sharing with him that they were then about $13.50 melt value and that he might want to adjust his prices. He exclaimed that he bought them low already, had them for awhile and sure wasn't taking a loss so he was not going to change the price! So next time keep the trap shut and just buy them. >>
You will find this scenario often, especially when coins are not a major part of their operation. The merchandise is marked-up when it comes in the door and sells when it sells. They made the profit they wanted and I try not to feel dirty when I purchased 90% Kennedy's @ $5.50 each recently.
Now I imagine what probably happened here was that the "owner" paid for the coins at the 40% rate. Should I have "educated" the owner so he makes a windfall? I am sure that he wouldn't go back to the orignal seller and give them more $. I paid the owner what he asked, he made a profit and I made a profit.
Joe.
<< <i>The dealers paid a fee to set up at that show. That fee gives them the right to buy and sell back and forth. The "two guys" paid no such fee. One or two transactions back and forth probably would have been overlooked. A half dozen wouldn't be.
That said, I personally have no problem at all with them walking the floor. If someone is selling cheaper than than someone else then why shouldn't a person be able to take advantage of the situation. >>
As long as the "two guys" bought and sold from/to someone who did pay the fee they did nothing wrong.
<< <i>
<< <i>If I were the buyer I would feel guilty doing that to someone. Buy $200 worth of silver, sell for $300, come back to buy $300 and sell for $450..........I know it is okay to get a good deal but that scenario, going back and forth multiple times seems Dirty! >>
I hope it is nice on the planet you are living on. >>
It is nice here. LONELY, but nice.