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Hoard of Gold (U.S.) Coins found
ricko
Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
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ricko
Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
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<< <i>If the coins are declared Treasure, they will become Crown property and will be valued. Hackney Museum wants to acquire them and the money paid would be split between the land owner and the finders. >>
Crown property?
Too many positive BST transactions with too many members to list.
<< <i>
<< <i>If the coins are declared Treasure, they will become Crown property and will be valued. Hackney Museum wants to acquire them and the money paid would be split between the land owner and the finders. >>
Crown property? >>
Crown property as in it becomes property of the UK government.
Authorized dealer for PCGS, PCGS Currency, NGC, NCS, PMG, CAC. Member of the PNG, ANA. Member dealer of CoinPlex and CCE/FACTS as "CH5"
Interesting find nonetheless!
This is not an archeological hoard. This is someone's relatively recent stash.
--Severian the Lame
<< <i>I'm not much of a fan of the UK government being able to claim found hoards as they see fit--but I understand that these hoards are seen as national treasures and ultimately, in those cases where the government takes them, they *seem* to treat the finders fairly.
>>
As I understand it, this law (last codified in 1996 if memory serves) has been quite successful in getting people to report historical finds. Now that it is generally understood that the finders are taken care of, there is less incentive to hide finds. This is a much bigger deal in the UK since they have lots more history than us - and lots of goodies still in the ground.
<< <i>The publication or writer is greatly exaggerating the value of the coins, saying "worth hundreds of thousands of Pounds.". In the photo they look to be in XF-AU condition. At $1400 each that's $112,000. The Pound is trading at $1.59 today, which makes the hoard worth slightly over 70,000 Pounds. >>
You might very well be right. But do you know for a fact that all of the coins are common dates (as factored into your value estimate)?
<< <i>
<< <i>The publication or writer is greatly exaggerating the value of the coins, saying "worth hundreds of thousands of Pounds.". In the photo they look to be in XF-AU condition. At $1400 each that's $112,000. The Pound is trading at $1.59 today, which makes the hoard worth slightly over 70,000 Pounds. >>
You might very well be right. But do you know for a fact that all of the coins are common dates (as factored into your value estimate)? >>
This was the minimum value. Since some were dated as early as 1854, it's likely they are worth much more.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>This is someone's relatively recent stash. >>
The newest coin was dated 1913 so the hoard was likely buried around the first world war.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>The publication or writer is greatly exaggerating the value of the coins, saying "worth hundreds of thousands of Pounds.". In the photo they look to be in XF-AU condition. At $1400 each that's $112,000. The Pound is trading at $1.59 today, which makes the hoard worth slightly over 70,000 Pounds. >>
You might very well be right. But do you know for a fact that all of the coins are common dates (as factored into your value estimate)? >>
This was the minimum value. Since some were dated as early as 1854, it's likely they are worth much more. >>
That was my thought as well. But the post I responded to made it sound as if it were a given that the coins were worth roughly (only) $1400 each, on average.
From the photo the coins look in fair shape is that common
with buried gold??
That there is some dirty gold!
<< <i>
<< <i>The publication or writer is greatly exaggerating the value of the coins, saying "worth hundreds of thousands of Pounds.". In the photo they look to be in XF-AU condition. At $1400 each that's $112,000. The Pound is trading at $1.59 today, which makes the hoard worth slightly over 70,000 Pounds. >>
You might very well be right. But do you know for a fact that all of the coins are common dates (as factored into your value estimate)? >>
Of course not; your guess is as good as mine. Odds are that they are all common, so the number I picked seemed like a reasonable one upon which to base a more realistic guesstimate than the figure quoted in the article.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>The publication or writer is greatly exaggerating the value of the coins, saying "worth hundreds of thousands of Pounds.". In the photo they look to be in XF-AU condition. At $1400 each that's $112,000. The Pound is trading at $1.59 today, which makes the hoard worth slightly over 70,000 Pounds. >>
You might very well be right. But do you know for a fact that all of the coins are common dates (as factored into your value estimate)? >>
Of course not; your guess is as good as mine. Odds are that they are all common, so the number I picked seemed like a reasonable one upon which to base a more realistic guesstimate than the figure quoted in the article. >>
I wouldn't count on it, but hope that someone actually looked at the coins/dates and based their estimate on that. Sadly, I admit, that sight-unseen, I would take your guesstimate over theirs.
don't count your chickens before they're hatched
Crown property as in it becomes property of the UK government. >>
It could be worse, just imagine if, as government property, each coin is stamped with the queen's broad arrow.
cool story, thanks for sharing.
<< <i>WOW !!! A very kool find presumably buried around WWI. Possibly to hide them from German invaders ??? >>
Germany did not pose a credible invasion threat in WWI. The scary time for Britain - they had at least a few false alarms - was July through September 1940 after the fall of France.
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
March of Time - 27 Centuries in Gold
https://coins.www.collectors-society.com/WCM/CoinCustomSetView.aspx?s=36590
They were uncovered by two residents who decided to do gardening with a couple of friends. A spade hit something hard. Expecting to remove a brick or a rock, they found themselves staring at glistening gold.
Ouch, I hope it wasn't one of the rare ones!
I knew it would happen.
I reckon a lot of gold was buried about that time for the same reason.
God Save the Queen.
Please take some time to remember the US Army (especially the Infantry and Armor Divisions), the AAC, and the USMC. And remember the USN (who delivered most of them to their destiny).
If you are looking for vacation ideas, consider the US cemeteries in Normandy and other European locations.
<< <i>So, if your spade hit those coins would you have turned them in? I would have to think long and hard about that. >>
Since they are U.S. double eagles, I would keep them. If they were ancient or medieval era coins of a historical or archaeological research interest, I would turn them in.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Please clarify. Is that any group of coins or 300 year old coins?
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
England, Northern Ireland, and Wales
The Act uses the term treasure instead of treasure trove; the latter term is now confined to objects found before the Act came into force. Objects falling within the following definition are "treasure" under the Act:[39][40]
1. If the object is not a coin,[41] it must be at least 300 years old[42] and at least 10%[43] precious metal (that is, gold or silver)[44] by weight.
2. If the object is a coin, it must either be:
* one of at least two coins in the same find[45] which are at least 300 years old at that time and are at least 10% precious metal by weight; or
* one of at least ten coins in the same find which are at least 300 years old at that time.
3. Any object at least 200 years old when found which belongs to a class of objects of outstanding historical, archaeological or cultural importance that has been designated as treasure by the Secretary of State.[46] As of 2006, the following classes of objects had been so designated:[47]
* Any object, other than a coin, any part of which is base metal (that is, not gold or silver),[48] which when found is one of at least two base metal objects in the same find which are of prehistoric date.[49]
* Any object, other than a coin, which is of prehistoric date, and any part of which is gold or silver.
4. Any object which would have been treasure trove if found before 24 September 1997.
5. Any object which, when found, is part of the same find as:
* an object within head (1), (2), (3) or (4) above found at the same time or earlier; or
* an object found earlier which would be within head (1), (2) or (3) above if it had been found at the same time.
Treasure does not include unworked natural objects, or minerals extracted from a natural deposit, or objects that have been designated not to be treasure[50] by the Secretary of State.[51] Objects falling within the definition of wreck[52] are also not treasure.[39][53]
Scotland
The Treasure Act 1996 does not apply in Scotland.[69] Treasure trove in Scotland is dealt with under the common law of Scotland. The general rule that governs bona vacantia ("vacant goods") – that is, objects that are lost, forgotten or abandoned – is quod nullius est fit domini regis ("that which belongs to nobody becomes our Lord the King's [or Queen's]"),[70][71] and the law of treasure trove is a specialized application of that rule.[72] As in England, the Crown in Scotland has a prerogative right to treasure trove[73] for it is one of the regalia minora ("minor things of the King"),[74] that is, property rights which the Crown may exercise as it pleases and which it may alienate (transfer to another party).[75]
To qualify as treasure trove, an object must be precious, it must be hidden, and there must be no proof of its property or reasonable presumption of its former ownership. Unlike under English common law, treasure is not restricted to only gold and silver objects.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Treasure_trove