After the seller's initial post, viewing the auction listing and looking at the feedback, I'm a lot more sympathetic towards the buyer.
The way the listing mentions the payment terms, "PLEASE PAY WITHIN 5 DAYS", it's reads as a request as opposed to a mandatory condition of the auction and historically eBay doesn't consider a payment late until 10 days.
The part that bothers me is that the seller gave him a NPB strike, the guy paid, and yet he didn't pull the strike and had ample time (9 days) to pull the strike and he didn't.
Some of my best customers take 2 weeks to pay.
My advice is to re-think needing the payment within 5 days and don't send out reminders after 3 days.
Buyers should pay within a day or two. Ten days is the max.
I did receive payment in 16 days a few times, 1 day before ebay closed the dispute.
Some buyers just need to get their act together.
I just had a buyer claim they could not pay due to their PP acount being frozen waiting on a letter from PP. 2 days after my auction closed, they had one close. They received payment from their buyer no problem. Non-paying bidder report was filed (13 days no payment yet).
The OP can think what he wants of me. I was late in paying (out of pure stupidity). When the NPB was sent and I saw it, I sent a Paypal payment and said sorry for the late payment...no excuses just that I was sorry.
Here is the info from the NPB that was opened for all to see (since the OP wants this public)
after he closed the NPB he had them issue the strike right away. This was what upset me. So, I contacted Ebay and had the strike removed as I was not in the wrong at this point. I then left what I felt was proper feedback.
Case closed.
Anyone that want's to judge me or block me from bidding on their items please feel free to do so but, after a long many years on Ebay I have made a lot of mistakes and a lot of good transactions. This was a mistake by me for not
A. paying sooner or, B. contacting the seller that payment would be sent soon
Here is a PERFECT example of one of my mistakes. Steve and I had a deal with a sour taste to it (he was not at fault) that I over reacted too. However, the past is the past and he has shown me time and time again that people are good (well most of them).
I have dealt witht the buyer in this situation and have never had a problem. He is also an excellent seller with stellar FB. Payment should have been sent sooner but I think the seller's reaction was a little overboard.
Unless it wsa a BIN, I can tolerate waiting 10 days for payment.
<< <i>I have dealt witht the buyer in this situation and have never had a problem. He is also an excellent seller with stellar FB. Payment should have been sent sooner but I think the seller's reaction was a little overboard.
Unless it wsa a BIN, I can tolerate waiting 10 days for payment.
I blame Canada. >>
It is true Canada could be to blame. The snow up here 354 days a year really gets to us.
<< <i>Friendly reminders always sent on the 3rd day.............Card was no longer available for sale after 10 days of non-payment......hell, as far as i knew he may never pay! >>
I just went through all of my ebay emails and other then when the OP opened the NPB I never received any communication from them until last night. Not even an invoice was sent. Now that being said, He may have sent one but Ebay did not show it to me under my messages.
<< <i>I state clearly.......payment requested within 5 days, realizing they have 7 per TOS with EBAY before i can file an NPB. It was a 7 day auction. I am sorry , if you can't pay in 7 days, DO NOT BID!
NPBs with valid explanations for the delay should contact their seller.
NPBs should not be allowed to leave FB, unless the NPB discovered some fraud on the part of the seller after the sale and decided not to pay.
exactly! >>
I agree with this. I pay for everything I buy immediately or the day after if I'm not at the computer when the auction ends. I realize that sometimes people are out of town, etc...but 7 days is more than enough time to click on the "send money" button on paypal. It takes all of 30 seconds to pay for an item won. Anything more is just someone slow rolling or regretting buying the item.
<< <i>I pay at auctions end or the next morning. I want my stuff shipped as soon as possible, I don't like to wait and delaying payment delays shipment. >>
Exactly. I also ship everything the day of payment or the next morning if it is at night, even though I have a more than fulltime job and am busy most of the time. I can't stand to get slow rolled on payment or shipping.
I should have paid sooner. Actually I should have paid right away. This was a mistake on my part for not paying right away. I did still want the card. Was not upset about the final price or anything of the sort.
From there this has snowballed out of control. I think the OP is most upset about the feedback I left. However, after the way I was treated I felt it was fair. I regret not paying sooner but not about the way I handled things once payment was sent.
Let's see. You claim the buyer entered into a contract when he bought your card. Where in the contract does it say you're allowed to do what you did. You were paid for the card, refunded the money, and then refused to sell the card. The buyer honored the contract. You're the one who broke the contract by making up some crazy new 10 day rule. To answer the question in the title of this thread, yes you are.
<< <i>"DOUCHE BAG OR NOT? YOU MAKE THE CALL........"
Let's see. You claim the buyer entered into a contract when he bought your card. Where in the contract does it say you're allowed to do what you did. You were paid for the card, refunded the money, and then refused to sell the card. The buyer honored the contract. You're the one who broke the contract by making up some crazy new 10 day rule. To answer the question in the title of this thread, yes you are. >>
DISAGREE 100% EBAY says after 7 days sellers can file an NPB. After that time period he has no obligation to sell it to that buyer. How does he know payment is ever coming?
Also, if you read the op the seller is upset by the negative feedback left by the"buyer". I also agree was undeserved. It looks as if the auction was not BIN, some are confused by this.
"You must understand the difference in things that are similar, and the similarity of things that are different"
I think both buyer and seller acted in haste by their actions. This can still be fixed and out of consideration for each other, should be fixed. Apologize to each other, accept that you both acted in haste, and fix it. Artistlost indicated that he already got the NPB strike removed, and now he should be willing to revise his negative feedback that he left for the seller. You both acted within ebay's processes to a degree, so use ebay's processes to revise the neg and move on. Really very simple IMO.
I should have paid sooner. Actually I should have paid right away. This was a mistake on my part for not paying right away. I did still want the card. Was not upset about the final price or anything of the sort.
From there this has snowballed out of control. I think the OP is most upset about the feedback I left. However, after the way I was treated I felt it was fair. I regret not paying sooner but not about the way I handled things once payment was sent.
mathew >>
Matt, maybe you guys can "kiss and make-up"? Agree to send OP a check, if he agrees to send you the card?
<< <i>I think both buyer and seller acted in haste by their actions. This can still be fixed and out of consideration for each other, should be fixed. Apologize to each other, accept that you both acted in haste, and fix it. Artistlost indicated that he already got the NPB strike removed, and now he should be willing to revise his negative feedback that he left for the seller. You both acted within ebay's processes to a degree, so use ebay's processes to revise the neg and move on. Really very simple IMO.
Mike >>
Do a live kiss and make up for everyone here that read this entire thread.
<< <i>I think both buyer and seller acted in haste by their actions. This can still be fixed and out of consideration for each other, should be fixed. Apologize to each other, accept that you both acted in haste, and fix it. Artistlost indicated that he already got the NPB strike removed, and now he should be willing to revise his negative feedback that he left for the seller. You both acted within ebay's processes to a degree, so use ebay's processes to revise the neg and move on. Really very simple IMO. >>
I have sent an email to Ebay requesting that the feedback be removed (below). We'll see how it goes from there.
Email sent
"Feedback > Understanding the Feedback system > Feedback removal policy
Item number(s): 300312524642
Message: Hello,
After having many talks with the seller I would like to have the feedback I left removed. We both acted too quickly and would like to have this situation end better. If I can provide any further information please let me know and thanks.
mathew hodgins"
As to the card. I was already offered another one from a board member and will be dealing with them.
Even though I have requested the feedback be removed, I still do not appreciate how the seller acted in regards to the transaction or in how they had to air this all here. I have no plans to deal with them again. There will be no hug or kiss
I truly wish that I had so little going on in my life where whether a buyer paid for a $16 card within 7 or 10 days card even entered into my conscious mind to the point where I would:
a) refund his money and refuse the transaction b) complain to ebay that I was paid 3 days late c) get into a back and forth with him over it d) start a thread about it
As far as I'm concerned who's right and who's wrong in this is immaterial. Not everybody is going to do everything perfectly 100% of the time, so the adult thing to do is give a reasonable amount of leeway in most/all situations, and I think a 3-day window is reasonable.
<< <i>We have community member (who shall remain nameless) who decides after ten days of non-payment (no communication from him) and a NPB filed on him to finally pay for his EBAY auction. Well at that point the card is no longer for sale and his paypal is refunded promptly. Today i notice he has left a negative for me (my first in 10 years).........which is not the end of the world it just really pi$$ed me off! Why should a buyer who has an NPB filed against them be allowed to leave ANY FEEDBACK, much less a negative! I hope he reads this and responds...................ONE vote for DOUCHE BAG. Thoughts? >>
<< <i>I truly wish that I had so little going on in my life where whether a buyer paid for a $16 card within 7 or 10 days card even entered into my conscious mind to the point where I would:
a) refund his money and refuse the transaction b) complain to ebay that I was paid 3 days late c) get into a back and forth with him over it d) start a thread about it
As far as I'm concerned who's right and who's wrong in this is immaterial. Not everybody is going to do everything perfectly 100% of the time, so the adult thing to do is give a reasonable amount of leeway in most/all situations, and I think a 3-day window is reasonable.
Is this really how you spend your life? Wow. >>
If someone didn't pay me for 10 days I'd be pissed. Yes, it's only for $16 but it's the principle. I have people that are late on car loans all the time and they are charged a late fee along with having their credit ruined. It's just common courtesy really.
The buyer said that he was in the wrong and is having the feedback removed, which is the thing to do. I know that people make mistakes or forget things, but how is the op in the wrong for starting a thread about a sportcard sale in a sportscard forum? Is this really how you spend your life by criticizing everyone for things that make no difference to you? WOW.
I got no problem with the OP, he clearly states in his auctions that he expects payment within 5 days so if you dont want to abide by his rules then by all meens dont bid- but to not buy from him because of this thread is silly if you ask me.
As far as artis_lost is concerned it was a simple mistake which he has clearly attempted to make good on so I got no problem with him either.
<< <i>As far as I'm concerned who's right and who's wrong in this is immaterial. Not everybody is going to do everything perfectly 100% of the time, so the adult thing to do is give a reasonable amount of leeway in most/all situations, and I think a 3-day window is reasonable. >>
the op didn't do anything wrong, but he does seem like an angry person. as a fellow alabamian, i say cheer up - our backwards-ass state just became a little less ass-backwards the hops have been freed
The buyer said that he was in the wrong and is having the feedback removed, which is the thing to do. I know that people make mistakes or forget things, but how is the op in the wrong for starting a thread about a sportcard sale in a sportscard forum? Is this really how you spend your life by criticizing everyone for things that make no difference to you? WOW.
No one's saying the OP is "wrong". All I'm saying is that if my life gets to the point where I get truly upset because somebody paid for a $16 card three days late you can come over my house and choke me to death because my quality of life has degenerated to the point where life is not worth living.
Quite a plethora of replies/ideas about me and the buyer. I am not an angry seller, just po'd about a negative that i feel is unwarranted. The buyer did apologize for not paying within 7 days. Fine no problem, apology accepted , however after 7 days i was well within my rights to file an NPB. Also within my rights to proceed with that transaction or not (ebays words, not mine). I offered to mutually agree to cancel the transaction, he refused. The money amount is irrelevant .99 or $99, or $16 in this case............................................................its all about the principle, and yes i am old school. Anyone who doesn't wish to pay within 7 days PLEASE DO NOT BID on my auctions. If i can ship within a few days, you can pay within a few also. If some want to wait 14-60 days for payment, thats on you, for me it's 7 days. Some of you also probably get mad at the cop who gives you a speeding ticket, when you ARE speeding. We have rules, laws and regulations we all have to follow everyday, this is no different.
Comments
The way the listing mentions the payment terms, "PLEASE PAY WITHIN 5 DAYS", it's reads as a request as opposed to a mandatory condition of the auction and historically eBay doesn't consider a payment late until 10 days.
The part that bothers me is that the seller gave him a NPB strike, the guy paid, and yet he didn't pull the strike and had ample time (9 days) to pull the strike and he didn't.
Some of my best customers take 2 weeks to pay.
My advice is to re-think needing the payment within 5 days and don't send out reminders after 3 days.
I did receive payment in 16 days a few times, 1 day before ebay closed the dispute.
Some buyers just need to get their act together.
I just had a buyer claim they could not pay due to their PP acount being frozen waiting on a letter from PP. 2 days after my auction closed, they had one close. They received payment from their buyer no problem. Non-paying bidder report was filed (13 days no payment yet).
Dave
Well this was nice to wake up to today.
I am the buyer of the card in question.
The OP can think what he wants of me. I was late in paying (out of pure stupidity). When the NPB was sent and I saw it, I sent a Paypal payment and said sorry for the late payment...no excuses just that I was sorry.
Here is the info from the NPB that was opened for all to see (since the OP wants this public)
after he closed the NPB he had them issue the strike right away. This was what upset me. So, I contacted Ebay and had the strike removed as I was not in the wrong at this point. I then left what I felt was proper feedback.
Case closed.
Anyone that want's to judge me or block me from bidding on their items please feel free to do so but, after a long many years on Ebay I have made a lot of mistakes and a lot of good transactions. This was a mistake by me for not
A. paying sooner or,
B. contacting the seller that payment would be sent soon
mathew
drugs of choice
NHL hall of fame rookies
mathew
drugs of choice
NHL hall of fame rookies
<< <i>No the buyer is not a doucehbag.
Steve >>
Thanks Steve,
Here is a PERFECT example of one of my mistakes. Steve and I had a deal with a sour taste to it (he was not at fault) that I over reacted too. However, the past is the past and he has shown me time and time again that people are good (well most of them).
mathew
drugs of choice
NHL hall of fame rookies
<< <i>We have community member (who shall remain nameless) >>
Next time...just name names...you gave everyone the means to do so...so, save them the trouble and just list it.
mathew
drugs of choice
NHL hall of fame rookies
Unless it wsa a BIN, I can tolerate waiting 10 days for payment.
I blame Canada.
<< <i>I have dealt witht the buyer in this situation and have never had a problem. He is also an excellent seller with stellar FB. Payment should have been sent sooner but I think the seller's reaction was a little overboard.
Unless it wsa a BIN, I can tolerate waiting 10 days for payment.
I blame Canada. >>
It is true Canada could be to blame. The snow up here 354 days a year really gets to us.
mathew
drugs of choice
NHL hall of fame rookies
<< <i>
IMO, buyers should not be allowed to leave NEGs just because
they are mad that a seller filed a permitted NPB. >>
Just to clarify too. I did not leave feedback as a result of the NPB files. I left it as the seller would not complete the transaction.
mathew
drugs of choice
NHL hall of fame rookies
Again, BIN with immediate payment...saves so many issues for both buyers and sellers.
<< <i>Friendly reminders always sent on the 3rd day.............Card was no longer available for sale after 10 days of non-payment......hell, as far as i knew he may never pay! >>
I just went through all of my ebay emails and other then when the OP opened the NPB I never received any communication from them until last night. Not even an invoice was sent. Now that being said, He may have sent one but Ebay did not show it to me under my messages.
mathew
drugs of choice
NHL hall of fame rookies
If for some reason no communication is forthcoming then after that file with ebay.
Under no circumstances should you not give the buyer the full extra 7 days that the NPB allows.
If the buyer then pays within that time frame you should complete the deal.
The buyer in this case is an upstanding member of this community who pays whenever he buys.
One last comment unless you use the immediate payment required on a BIN the above should also apply.
Some folks use the BIN but can't pay until payday.
I can't believe all this stress was over a 16.00 transaction, I have done 200.00 and 100.00 transactions with this buyer and everything
always worked out fine. The sour one was as much my fault that time as it was Matts. FWIW.
Steve
<< <i>I state clearly.......payment requested within 5 days, realizing they have 7 per TOS with EBAY before i can file an NPB. It was a 7 day auction. I am sorry , if you can't pay in 7 days, DO NOT BID!
NPBs with valid explanations for the delay should contact
their seller.
NPBs should not be allowed to leave FB, unless the NPB
discovered some fraud on the part of the seller after the
sale and decided not to pay.
exactly! >>
I agree with this. I pay for everything I buy immediately or the day after if I'm not at the computer when the auction ends. I realize that sometimes people are out of town, etc...but 7 days is more than enough time to click on the "send money" button on paypal. It takes all of 30 seconds to pay for an item won. Anything more is just someone slow rolling or regretting buying the item.
<< <i>I pay at auctions end or the next morning. I want my stuff shipped as soon as possible, I don't like to wait and delaying payment delays shipment. >>
Exactly. I also ship everything the day of payment or the next morning if it is at night, even though I have a more than fulltime job and am busy most of the time. I can't stand to get slow rolled on payment or shipping.
I should have paid sooner. Actually I should have paid right away. This was a mistake on my part for not paying right away. I did still want the card. Was not upset about the final price or anything of the sort.
From there this has snowballed out of control. I think the OP is most upset about the feedback I left. However, after the way I was treated I felt it was fair. I regret not paying sooner but not about the way I handled things once payment was sent.
mathew
drugs of choice
NHL hall of fame rookies
Let's see. You claim the buyer entered into a contract when he bought your card. Where in the contract does it say you're allowed to do what you did. You were paid for the card, refunded the money, and then refused to sell the card. The buyer honored the contract. You're the one who broke the contract by making up some crazy new 10 day rule. To answer the question in the title of this thread, yes you are.
I too pay ASAP because I want my item sooner.
However there are some buyers that can't pay within 20 minutes of auctions end and
IMO it is nothing to freak out over. My best customers pay after 7 days, they are the ones that
seem to bid all the time on my auctions. Making unreasonable TOS on your auctions is counterproductive.
Steve
<< <i>"DOUCHE BAG OR NOT? YOU MAKE THE CALL........"
Let's see. You claim the buyer entered into a contract when he bought your card. Where in the contract does it say you're allowed to do what you did. You were paid for the card, refunded the money, and then refused to sell the card. The buyer honored the contract. You're the one who broke the contract by making up some crazy new 10 day rule. To answer the question in the title of this thread, yes you are. >>
DISAGREE 100% EBAY says after 7 days sellers can file an NPB. After that time period he has no obligation to sell it to that buyer. How does he know payment is ever coming?
Also, if you read the op the seller is upset by the negative feedback left by the"buyer". I also agree was undeserved. It looks as if the auction was not BIN, some are confused by this.
Mike
<< <i>Let's stop this ball rolling anymore.
I should have paid sooner. Actually I should have paid right away. This was a mistake on my part for not paying right away. I did still want the card. Was not upset about the final price or anything of the sort.
From there this has snowballed out of control. I think the OP is most upset about the feedback I left. However, after the way I was treated I felt it was fair. I regret not paying sooner but not about the way I handled things once payment was sent.
mathew >>
Matt, maybe you guys can "kiss and make-up"? Agree to send OP a check, if he agrees to send you the card?
And then agree to remove the neg fdbk?
rd
Quicksilver Messenger Service - Smokestack Lightning (Live) 1968
Quicksilver Messenger Service - The Hat (Live) 1971
<< <i>I think both buyer and seller acted in haste by their actions. This can still be fixed and out of consideration for each other, should be fixed. Apologize to each other, accept that you both acted in haste, and fix it. Artistlost indicated that he already got the NPB strike removed, and now he should be willing to revise his negative feedback that he left for the seller. You both acted within ebay's processes to a degree, so use ebay's processes to revise the neg and move on. Really very simple IMO.
Mike >>
Do a live kiss and make up for everyone here that read this entire thread.
<< <i>I think both buyer and seller acted in haste by their actions. This can still be fixed and out of consideration for each other, should be fixed. Apologize to each other, accept that you both acted in haste, and fix it. Artistlost indicated that he already got the NPB strike removed, and now he should be willing to revise his negative feedback that he left for the seller. You both acted within ebay's processes to a degree, so use ebay's processes to revise the neg and move on. Really very simple IMO. >>
Well said and advice that should be followed.
Jus Sayin
mathew
drugs of choice
NHL hall of fame rookies
Email sent
"Feedback > Understanding the Feedback system > Feedback removal policy
Item number(s):
300312524642
Message: Hello,
After having many talks with the seller I would like to have the feedback I left removed. We both acted too quickly and would like to have this situation end better. If I can provide any further information please let me know and thanks.
mathew hodgins"
As to the card. I was already offered another one from a board member and will be dealing with them.
Even though I have requested the feedback be removed, I still do not appreciate how the seller acted in regards to the transaction or in how they had to air this all here. I have no plans to deal with them again. There will be no hug or kiss
mathew
drugs of choice
NHL hall of fame rookies
a) refund his money and refuse the transaction
b) complain to ebay that I was paid 3 days late
c) get into a back and forth with him over it
d) start a thread about it
As far as I'm concerned who's right and who's wrong in this is immaterial. Not everybody is going to do everything perfectly 100% of the time, so the adult thing to do is give a reasonable amount of leeway in most/all situations, and I think a 3-day window is reasonable.
Is this really how you spend your life? Wow.
chaz.
gawd, i can't believe i just did that.
artist_lost can bid on my auctions anytime.
<< <i>We have community member (who shall remain nameless) who decides after ten days of non-payment (no communication from him) and a NPB filed on him to finally pay for his EBAY auction. Well at that point the card is no longer for sale and his paypal is refunded promptly. Today i notice he has left a negative for me (my first in 10 years).........which is not the end of the world it just really pi$$ed me off! Why should a buyer who has an NPB filed against them be allowed to leave ANY FEEDBACK, much less a negative! I hope he reads this and responds...................ONE vote for DOUCHE BAG.
Thoughts? >>
2 words: FEEBAY SUCKS !!!! chaz
<< <i>I truly wish that I had so little going on in my life where whether a buyer paid for a $16 card within 7 or 10 days card even entered into my conscious mind to the point where I would:
a) refund his money and refuse the transaction
b) complain to ebay that I was paid 3 days late
c) get into a back and forth with him over it
d) start a thread about it
As far as I'm concerned who's right and who's wrong in this is immaterial. Not everybody is going to do everything perfectly 100% of the time, so the adult thing to do is give a reasonable amount of leeway in most/all situations, and I think a 3-day window is reasonable.
Is this really how you spend your life? Wow. >>
If someone didn't pay me for 10 days I'd be pissed. Yes, it's only for $16 but it's the principle. I have people that are late on car loans all the time and they are charged a late fee along with having their credit ruined. It's just common courtesy really.
The buyer said that he was in the wrong and is having the feedback removed, which is the thing to do. I know that people make mistakes or forget things, but how is the op in the wrong for starting a thread about a sportcard sale in a sportscard forum? Is this really how you spend your life by criticizing everyone for things that make no difference to you? WOW.
<< <i>bamajb12 will never see a dime of my money.
artist_lost can bid on my auctions anytime. >>
I got no problem with the OP, he clearly states in his auctions that he expects payment within 5 days so if you dont want to abide by his rules then by all meens dont bid- but to not buy from him because of this thread is silly if you ask me.
As far as artis_lost is concerned it was a simple mistake which he has clearly attempted to make good on so I got no problem with him either.
Both guys are OK in my book.
<< <i>As far as I'm concerned who's right and who's wrong in this is immaterial. Not everybody is going to do everything perfectly 100% of the time, so the adult thing to do is give a reasonable amount of leeway in most/all situations, and I think a 3-day window is reasonable.
>>
i just left NEG feedback for CDsNuts..
pwnt.
<< <i>but it's the principle. >>
Now where have I heard that before? Er, um never mind.
Jeff
Miscut Museum
My Mess
<< <i>but how is the op in the wrong for starting a thread about a sportcard sale in a sportscard forum? >>
The OP starting a thread is one thing, but calling the buyer a "douche bag" in the thread is another. Childish and unprofessional move.
WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
I've had more than one forum user buy from me on eBay and wait quite a while to pay. Wasn't that big a deal. They paid. I shipped.
Years ago, people used to climb over themselves with politeness on ebay. Due to the changes it's become a 3 card monte game in a 3rd world country
And I love the snarks implying that b/c the seller is showing emotion after getting wronged, then somehow HE is the jerk. GFY
No one's saying the OP is "wrong". All I'm saying is that if my life gets to the point where I get truly upset because somebody paid for a $16 card three days late you can come over my house and choke me to death because my quality of life has degenerated to the point where life is not worth living.
<< <i>And I love the snarks implying that b/c the seller is showing emotion after getting wronged, then somehow HE is the jerk. >>
Yeah, the seller got totally ripped off.
WTB: 2001 Leaf Rookies & Stars Longevity: Ryan Jensen #/25
My small collection
Want List:
'61 Topps Roy Campanella in PSA 5-7
Cardinal T206 cards
Adam Wainwright GU Jersey
<< <i>Well said, Craftyvet!
I was speechless for a second
when all caps were used...
and the word douche was used...
but then again I could be way wrong here...
Looking for 1970 MLB Photostamps
- uncut
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thank you very much-taxi