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Will PSA identify 1989 Fleer Variations?
slantycouch
Posts: 1,704 ✭✭✭
Donovan I see you're on so I'll ask now...
If you provide proof and perhaps a copy of the Standard Catalog page that verifies them as variations, will PSA identify on the flip the "lesser" 89F variations (i.e. Guillermo Hernandez spots, Throws Rig vs. Throws Right, Wrong Home Cities, etc?)
Thanks!
If you provide proof and perhaps a copy of the Standard Catalog page that verifies them as variations, will PSA identify on the flip the "lesser" 89F variations (i.e. Guillermo Hernandez spots, Throws Rig vs. Throws Right, Wrong Home Cities, etc?)
Thanks!
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I was so enthralled by the variations, that I ordered 6 more boxes from BBCE.
I just ripped an 8 box cello case from BBCE last night but no Ripkens
Anyone want 14 Griffey rookies though?
Dodgers collection scans | Brett Butler registry | 1978 Dodgers - straight 9s, homie
26 Curt Young
A) Sideways "S" below Pitcher on Front
61 Danny Heep
A) San Antonio
81 Wade Boggs
A) Spot After Position
98 Kevin Romine
A) Batting
121 John Moses
A) Home Phoenix
130 Tom Brookens
A) Mike Heath back
132 Mike Heath
A) Tom Brookens back
135 Guillermo Hernandez
A) Red Spot
173 Jeff Treadway
A) Blue printers "target" above head
250 Neil Allen
A) Home Sarasota
350 Alan Ashby
A) Throws Rig
440 Manny Trillo
A) Throws Rig
534 Ed Vande Berg
A) Throws Lef
614 Joe Orsulack
A) Gray Spot on Cage
Once I learned PSA didn't distinguish the FF versions, I moved on.
I dont have access to the pop report to see either.
I'll guess- No. I assume they didn't label them from the start from lack of knowledge or interest and dont want to change or affect the pop report now. Just like they dont distinguish between the different Black Scribbles.
They do the Randy Johnson versions but only label 3 when there's alot more.
They used to label the White Scribble and Whiteout as the same. I think this has been fixed? At least my buddy said he discussed it with them.
Trillo Throws Right/Rig...
Boggs Spot/No Spot --------------AFTER HIS POSITION ON BACK
Young sideways S/No S ----------UNDER WORD PITCHER ON FRONT. LIGHT BLUE
Ashby Throws Right/Rig
Vandeberg Throws Left/Lef
Parrish handwritten i in Parrish
Orsulack white Spot on cage/no white spot,actually you can see gray
G. Hernandez 4 variations (red spot on armpit,lighter,Whiteout,not visible)
Heep San Antonio/Lake Hills
Treadway Target /no target -----------------LITE BLUE ABOVE HEAD
Allen Syosset/Saratosa
Moses Phoenix/Tempe
Heath/Brookens switched backs
Henderson spelled Hendersor
R Johnson- many different variations of corrections over box. 4+
Also heard of a C-List that lists players positions
EDIT: Didn't see that someone had already posted the variations but these are the ones Donovan sent me
<< <i>Here's some I pulled from another site (or maybe another post... can't remember):
26 Curt Young
A) Sideways "S" below Pitcher on Front
61 Danny Heep
A) San Antonio
81 Wade Boggs
A) Spot After Position
98 Kevin Romine
A) Batting
121 John Moses
A) Home Phoenix
130 Tom Brookens
A) Mike Heath back
132 Mike Heath
A) Tom Brookens back
135 Guillermo Hernandez
A) Red Spot
173 Jeff Treadway
A) Blue printers "target" above head
250 Neil Allen
A) Home Sarasota
350 Alan Ashby
A) Throws Rig
440 Manny Trillo
A) Throws Rig
534 Ed Vande Berg
A) Throws Lef
614 Joe Orsulack
A) Gray Spot on Cage
Randy Johnson-
Marlboro (Clear- heard of, never seen)
Marlboro
Thick line thru word
Red Tint
Green Tint
Box in Ad
Complete Black
These are the Johnson's I have seen. There's some more.
Rumored/Unconfirmed/assumed myth 1989 Fleer versions
Checklist with positions listed
Parrish- Handwritten i Apparently it is a printing flaw but was listed in a guide back in the day. "The Parrish card is a printing flaw if I remember correctly. A "target" or "ring" like object was printed on the i in his name. " Unsure if it was a 1x printing error or multiple copies like the Boggs.
Would still love to see one.
1989 Fleer Checklist that spells HENDERSON correctly.
I don't think a corrected "Hendersor" checklist exists. I pulled the uncorrected version from a factory set, which by my research was the last of the cards to be created. You agree?
<< <i>The pop report only recognizes 4 different variations: FF, black box, whiteout and no FF (whatever that means) >>
I assume the no FF is the Black Scribble. They call it "SCRIBBLE OVER ERROR" on the PSA flip.
Yo PSA, Call me.
The Whiteout and White Scribble are 2 different versions.
That's a price difference of $95 raw according to Beckett.
You could be screwing some buyers who are buying a "WHITED OUT VULGARITY" (what it says on the flip of both a WO and WS) thinking it it a White Out and it is a White Scribble. The airbrushed one.
I know I'd be mad when I later learned.
My buddy (We'll call him Kevin) said he called you (PSA). Kevin also sent a letter to Beckett to explain the differences (He knew but wanted to inform others) They published it 2 months ago. Hopefully the pop report just isnt updated yet. If you need, I'll send you my copy of the magazine.
<< <i>Hmm I didn't know that about the Parrish. So it's supposedly like the tradway with the registration "target"?
I don't think a corrected "Hendersor" checklist exists. I pulled the uncorrected version from a factory set, which by my research was the last of the cards to be created. You agree? >>
I agree. I like to keep the myth alive so I have more motivation to bust unopened, as the "no Bills in the case" kills the fun for me.
A employee in Mgmt. who used to work for Fleer says they didn't outsource printing in 1989. Outlook graphics and a x-employee says they did and another guy said he worked at another company that did, so it's maybe possible one of those locations had a fix?
And I don't disagree that it's possible a corrected checklist MIGHT be out there. From the Johnson and Ripken errors, we know Fleer tackled problems in a whole bunch of different ways. And unless they ran 3-4 different presses/plates at one location, it seems largely possible that they outsourced printing to different places taht didn't communicate well when the problems started.
My Podcast - Now FEATURED on iTunes
<< <i>These are the Johnson's I have seen. >>
Really wish you wouldn't have said that. Now I think differently of you
I wonder if those cropped knob pics are from billripken.com ?
Latest Beckett FF article-
Some other stuff-
Chris
My small collection
Want List:
'61 Topps Roy Campanella in PSA 5-7
Cardinal T206 cards
Adam Wainwright GU Jersey
As for the FF variations I have found about half to of been distributed thru all packs. As time goes on I'll most likely find out more.
Below is an email from Fleer. This is the 1st time I have shared it.
I have removed the email and description of the correction. That is because it can be easily faked. It will be very easily identified. If you stumble across a odd error contact me, provide a pic and I can tell you more.
I have seen two copies of the card. One I own on a cello. It cost me $400 and the pack got slabbed a 9.5. I would never buy a raw copy for any real money nor would most who are aware of it.
I think I remember pulling a checklist that has each player's position listed beside his name in that rack case I recently opened. Is that a rare thing?
<< <i>hey Donovan,
I think I remember pulling a checklist that has each player's position listed beside his name in that rack case I recently opened. Is that a rare thing? >>
Yes !!
Confirmed in E/V guides with some saying 654 is unconfirmed. Many, including myself have never seen it. Same with the Hendersor/Henderson card.
<< <i>
<< <i>hey Donovan,
I think I remember pulling a checklist that has each player's position listed beside his name in that rack case I recently opened. Is that a rare thing? >>
Yes !!
Confirmed in E/V guides with some saying 654 is unconfirmed. Many, including myself have never seen it. Same with the Hendersor/Henderson card. >>
Ok, Im kind of getting excited. Unfortunately Im stuck at work. As soon as I get home, I'll go through and try to find it. I'll send you a PM tongiht either way. Thanks
<< <i>Dont fight it. Quit your job. Tonite is too far away. Thanks. >>
If I wanted to get the best bang for my buck with a case of '89 Fleer what would you recommend? I know it's not an expensive product and I'm not looking to make any money on it. I just want to chase some of the variations and have some fun ripping some packs. I'm leaning toward a rack case, maybe a cello.
Chris
My small collection
Want List:
'61 Topps Roy Campanella in PSA 5-7
Cardinal T206 cards
Adam Wainwright GU Jersey
<< <i>
<< <i>Dont fight it. Quit your job. Tonite is too far away. Thanks. >>
If I wanted to get the best bang for my buck with a case of '89 Fleer what would you recommend? I know it's not an expensive product and I'm not looking to make any money on it. I just want to chase some of the variations and have some fun ripping some packs. I'm leaning toward a rack case, maybe a cello.
Chris >>
Best bang- rack- lowest case price, best condition (no wax stain or tight cello corners). Plus rack has Fleer tape as opposed to cello which had clear tape that could of been removed back in the day, searched and replaced.
Be sure to get pics of both seals. Signs of tampering- Fleer words to be broken, clear tape over the Fleer tape or for wavy edges of the tape.
Higbee- $65- Few reports of cases with no versions (saw cut era) have been found at Higbees. Also recently BBox and Black Scribbles have came from those. They currently have 30. Though cases with no versions is very disappointing it does have the possibility of pulling some saw cuts or my current favorite/want, saw cuts on top of rack.
BBCE- $55 + ship
ebay (sma360) $65 shipped. Have 7 cases. Though they do have 2 rack boxes for sale and a rack pack. Leads me to think they cracked one of their cases. They list the cases as "Ripken error?" but list their wax box as "error box !" So I think the racks wont have the FF. What versions if any it will have I dont know though.
When I had the $ to buy cases I would not buy one that did not show or when requested, show a pic of the side of the case with the inked numbers. I always thought it was them knowing something and hiding it. Could be they were honest didnt want to give anyone a unfair advantage, but "those people" dont really exist anymore, right?
Buying unopened 89 Fleer is a huge risk, searched,cherry picked,no versions. If you do buy a case please LMK the results and please do not open any racks with Ripken versions on top to see if there's more inside. lol I did that 2x back in the day.
<< <i>On a similar note, I came home for lunch and had 6 boxes of 89 Fleer sitting on my porch along with 5 other packages. May be a long lunch break. >>
Sooooo.................
Any results yet?
I've opened two single cello boxes and an 8-box cello case from BBCE. First single cello had a FF, second single cello nothing, and case had nothing. I'm awaiting a Higbees 3-box rack case now...
slanty, let me know how you do on yours.
Lee
<< <i>Buying unopened 89 Fleer is a huge risk, searched,cherry picked,no versions. If you do buy a case please LMK the results and please do not open any racks with Ripken versions on top to see if there's more inside. lol I did that 2x back in the day. >>
The good thing is that it's definitely a risk in terms of the fact that you might not get any Ripkens, but at least monetarily it's not bad. Thank god 89F was mass produced and with the exception of Griff and RJ there's really nothing else in it. I've really enjoyed ripping through packs knowing that, at worst, I'm only out $60-80 for a case. It's a risk I don't mind taking for the fun of it. Plus you can always sell the Griffeys for a few bucks and cut your losses.
<< <i>Ugh, I should've posted here sooner. I busted a cello case from BBCE which had black boxes, and a rack case from Higbees that had no Ripken's. When I asked Mike at Higbees about it, he said he bought them direct from Fleer but he suspected they might have been made for retail stores like K-Mart and it's possible they pulled all the Ripkens. There were still plenty of Griffey's and Randy (black out version), but not a Ripken to be found. It would've bene the black box anyway so it's no real loss. The case tape was legit and secure so there was definitely no tampering.
>>
Thanks Lee - no sweat. It will be interesting to see what I get. I'll definitely post the results here.
<< <i>On a similar note, I came home for lunch and had 6 boxes of 89 Fleer sitting on my porch along with 5 other packages. May be a long lunch break. >>
*taps fingers on desk*
Are you scanning every card?
<< <i>
<< <i>On a similar note, I came home for lunch and had 6 boxes of 89 Fleer sitting on my porch along with 5 other packages. May be a long lunch break. >>
*taps fingers on desk*
Are you scanning every card? >>
Seriously. What the heck am I supposed to do... sit here at work and actually do work?
Can a brother get an update???
<< <i>My bad. Didn't know everyone was waiting. I opened 4 of the boxes and am very pleased. Going to leave the other 2 unopened. Anyway, out of the 4 boxes I got 7 Griffeys (2 in one pack), 4 Ripken FF and 6 Johnsons (2 W/ Marlboro, 2 w/ black box and 2 partially obscure w/ green tint). All the cards were well centered except for 2 of the Johnsons. >>
On the Green-I heard there is green and green with a circle. I can dig up more info on that later if wanted.
Congrats on the pulls. Not bad at all. Apparently the green is one of the rarer ones.
Marlboro- lighter white billboard than your last one or same?
Leaving 2 unopened? How do you do that?
Chris
My small collection
Want List:
'61 Topps Roy Campanella in PSA 5-7
Cardinal T206 cards
Adam Wainwright GU Jersey
<< <i>My bad. Didn't know everyone was waiting. I opened 4 of the boxes and am very pleased. Going to leave the other 2 unopened. Anyway, out of the 4 boxes I got 7 Griffeys (2 in one pack), 4 Ripken FF and 6 Johnsons (2 W/ Marlboro, 2 w/ black box and 2 partially obscure w/ green tint). All the cards were well centered except for 2 of the Johnsons. >>
Congrats!
Love Fleer's (lack of) collation. I had two of those 2-Griffey packs in the case I opened. Definitely a pleasant surprise.
<< <i>On the Green-I heard there is green and green with a circle. >>
Donovan, where are you? Two of the Johnson's had the green tint with a circle. If I can get to my scanner after supper I will post scans of all three variations I pulled.
BTW, I pulled quite a few of the error cards on the list that was posted.
Bob
email bcmiller7@comcast.net
<< <i>and I will be ordering from BBXchange! >>
Please do not order any 89 Fleer as I am now hooked and need his supply. I now feel like a crackhead.
<< <i>
<< <i>On the Green-I heard there is green and green with a circle. >>
Donovan, where are you? Two of the Johnson's had the green tint with a circle. If I can get to my scanner after supper I will post scans of all three variations I pulled.
BTW, I pulled quite a few of the error cards on the list that was posted. >>
I left work. I dont have much free time at home. I'll be back later tonite or tomorrow.
In the meantime check out my FF thread.
Chris
My small collection
Want List:
'61 Topps Roy Campanella in PSA 5-7
Cardinal T206 cards
Adam Wainwright GU Jersey
OK, now I have a new addiction. I have already ordered another wax case
#654 Checklist-
A) positions not listed
C) positions listed, #10 Henderson spelled correctly
"Thank you for contacting PSA Customer Service. Yes we would recognize the varieties. We do have a few graded and in the system already. When you submit the cards for grading make sure to add the varieties on the invoice and you can also put “Attention Susan” on it so she can make sure to add all the varieties.
If you have any further questions please call Customer Service at 1-800-325-1121 or email us."
That was the response I received in reference to my question about the variations.