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Is this a legitimate excuse for not combining shipping?
grabba
Posts: 1,251
I saw an item on eBay at a really good price and noticed the seller actually had ten of them for sale in a BIN auction. Granted, the item
was listed cheap but the shipping was sort of high for regular parcel post. I emailed the seller and asked him about combining shipping because the initial shipping for the first item was $4.25 and each additional item was $3.25. All of the items combined would easily fit into one Priority box and the shipping would be less than $10.00 (I haven't shipped anything lately but the last time I sent something Priority it was around $8.25 and the box was plenty big.) Is it a case of listing cheap and charging high shipping for fee avoidance?
Here are the emails between me and the seller......
If I bought all ten lots you have for sale, could you do any better on
the shipping? As it is, shipping would be over $36 when it would
probably cost less than $10 Priority. Just let me know if you are
interested. Thank you for your time.
His response.......
Sorry i cant do $10.00 shipping because i have to pay ebay and paypal for each item that i sell and i am selling them very cheap thanks for asking
was listed cheap but the shipping was sort of high for regular parcel post. I emailed the seller and asked him about combining shipping because the initial shipping for the first item was $4.25 and each additional item was $3.25. All of the items combined would easily fit into one Priority box and the shipping would be less than $10.00 (I haven't shipped anything lately but the last time I sent something Priority it was around $8.25 and the box was plenty big.) Is it a case of listing cheap and charging high shipping for fee avoidance?
Here are the emails between me and the seller......
If I bought all ten lots you have for sale, could you do any better on
the shipping? As it is, shipping would be over $36 when it would
probably cost less than $10 Priority. Just let me know if you are
interested. Thank you for your time.
His response.......
Sorry i cant do $10.00 shipping because i have to pay ebay and paypal for each item that i sell and i am selling them very cheap thanks for asking
0
Comments
Russ, NCNE
I always combine shipping when asked to do so.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>I understand that margins can be very tight; but with the new 5 star feedback system, shipping is not the area to be real tight on. This poor guy might start getting his shipping charge stars dinged to death. If he drops the stars to far he may lose his discounts and page positioning. >>
Guys who aren't making the numbers anyway will continue to try to charge a reasonable handling fee. His shipping and handling aren't that out of line. If any established retailer charged something like that there would be no complaints. However, his combining rules would be inadequate anywhere. --Jerry
<< <i>Apparently, he also isn't grasping the fact that if he sells all 10 at once, his eBay and PayPal fees are lower than if he sells one at a time.
Russ, NCNE >>
Indeed, especially in the case of PayPal. How about buying them individually, paying for them individually, leaving 10 neg feedbacks when they all come in the same box and then doing a chargeback on the excessive shipping cost via PayPal?
Heh.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>Apparently, he also isn't grasping the fact that if he sells all 10 at once, his eBay and PayPal fees are lower than if he sells one at a time. >>
Not the sharpest crayon in the box.
<< <i>Apparently, he also isn't grasping the fact that if he sells all 10 at once, his eBay and PayPal fees are lower than if he sells one at a time. Russ, NCNE >>
Paypal yes but ebay no. I sold 10 $200 items to one guy in a BIN and looked at my fees. I expected them to charge me one fee at the lower percentage rate that applies to a $2000 sale. They charged me the higher fee on a $200 item 10 times.
--Jerry
<< <i>
<< <i>Apparently, he also isn't grasping the fact that if he sells all 10 at once, his eBay and PayPal fees are lower than if he sells one at a time. Russ, NCNE >>
Paypal yes but ebay no. I sold 10 $200 items to one guy in a BIN and looked at my fees. I expected them to charge me one fee at the lower percentage rate that applies to a $2000 sale. They charged me the higher fee on a $200 item 10 times.
--Jerry >>
Ouch!
The name is LEE!
eBay's policy on overcharging for postage/handling/insurance is moderated by you, the buyer. They are complaint driven. If you do not like this sellers shipping fees, it is incumbent upon you to complain about that auction. Otherwise, eBay truly does not care.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>eBay's policy allows a seller to charge 'handling' and allows the seller to determine that handling.
eBay's policy on overcharging for postage/handling/insurance is moderated by you, the buyer. They are complaint driven. If you do not like this sellers shipping fees, it is incumbent upon you to complain about that auction. Otherwise, eBay truly does not care. >>
But eBay does not allow billing the customer for said fees which is why, as TomB said, the seller should have just said "No." and not explained why.
You are mistaken if you think eBay doesn't care about fee avoidance.
<< <i>But eBay does not allow billing the customer for said fees which is why, as TomB said, the seller should have just said "No." and not explained why.
You are mistaken if you think eBay doesn't care about fee avoidance. >>
Regardless of what eBay thinks about fee avoidance and to what degree they 'care'...well, I don't believe they care to the degree that they take unilateral action.
It is indeed complaint driven. An auction with outrageous fees _will_ go to completion if nobody complains about it.
Although eBay's policy does indicate that they take this 'very seriously' and that they 'care'... eBay's actions are complaint driven. That tells me that it is just a bunch of boilerplate and that we are unpaid extensions of their fraud detection program.
When a companies official statements differ from that companies actions, I tend to keep my eye on the actions of the company.
ANSWERING THE ORIGINAL QUESTION:
In this particular case...this is what I would do:
I would assess the value of the items being sold. After the seller denied the combining of shipping, I would assess whether the BIN price plus the fees is still a decent price, or is an overcharge.
If I feel that this seller is charging way more than the item is worth and deceptively buring that cost in the shipping...that auction would receive a complaint from me.
If I feel that the price is okay, I would consider purchasing or I would consider looking for a better deal, but not complaining about it.
Unfortunately, the OP does not give enough information for me to assess whether the total purchase price is reasonable...or too high and thus deceptive.
<< <i>Not, it isn't a legitimate reason.
Russ, NCNE >>
I totally disagree. It's entirely legitimate. It's a handling cost.
<< <i>
<< <i>Not, it isn't a legitimate reason. Russ, NCNE >>
I totally disagree. It's entirely legitimate. It's a handling cost. >>
Good point. He is combining shipment and part of the handling costs but not all of them. Still, the total seems high. --Jerry
<< <i>It's entirely legitimate. It's a handling cost. >>
A "handling cost" is not meant to offset eBay and Paypal fees. The seller should be reported.
<< <i>I emailed the seller and asked him about combining shipping because the initial shipping for the first item was $4.25 and each additional item was $3.25. >>
I don't know. If he states that this is his policy, I don't think it's appropriate to tell him that he's overcharging and expect him to give you a lower shipping charge. My two Lincolns...
<< <i>
<< <i>It's entirely legitimate. It's a handling cost. >>
A "handling cost" is not meant to offset eBay and Paypal fees. The seller should be reported. >>
Playing devil's advocate: A handling cost is allowed and not in voilation of any rule. What does it matter how the seller thinks of it? Apparently in his mind he considers it important to charge because of the fees. If the fees weren't so high perhaps he could waive the handling fees. But this is irrelevant as to whether a handling fee is allowed or not. --Jerry
<< <i><< Not, it isn't a legitimate reason.
Russ, NCNE >>
I totally disagree. It's entirely legitimate. It's a handling cost. >>
It isn't a handling cost. It's a clear case of a seller listing an item at a lower cost and then attempting to recover the lost profit by jacking up shipping. Read the seller's response.
Russ, NCNE
I would demand 10 individual packages be mailed and inform him appropriate feedback will be left. Handling fee's my
I would show him what true handling fee's are with my PayPal dispute for excessive shipping charges...I mailed a Morgan out this morning
for .51 cents. And the P.O picked it up for me...That is why I have bought from the BST for the last 6 months. I was sick of the charges ebayers
were charging for shipping
remind him of the new ebay
feedback policy and tell him to take his $36 dollar shipping and stick where the good Lord split him...
<< <i>Sorry i cant do $10.00 shipping because i have to pay ebay and paypal for each item that i sell and i am selling them very cheap thanks for asking >>
Why should a dealer have to justify who, what, when, where, or how come they calculate their charges..........Its irrelevant, add up the total cost of the coins+shipping and deternine if its a good deal or not...........
Alan
<< <i>...I mailed a Morgan out this morning for .51 cents. And the P.O picked it up for me...
<< <i>
You're gonna get dinged for inadequate packaging.--Jerry
<< <i>
<< <i>...I mailed a Morgan out this morning for .51 cents. And the P.O picked it up for me...
<< <i>
You're gonna get dinged for inadequate packaging.--Jerry >>
It was a free morgan I was giving to a fellow member..Granted I could have used a bubble envelope and added
a few more cents. It was wrapped very well and the envelope taped on all seams. The point was it doesn't take 5 bucks to mail a coin in a bubble envelope..
If you sell to an idiot buyer nothing will protect you. You just have to believe most people are honest and do the best you can....
<< <i>I would demand 10 individual packages be mailed and inform him appropriate feedback will be left. >>
A better approach would be to just not buy from this seller.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>I would demand 10 individual packages be mailed and inform him appropriate feedback will be left. >>
That's actually how the winning bidder should handle it, if the seller can't combine shipping then he should ship 10 individual packages.
HOWEVER (did you notice the really big "however"?) if he did state in the auction description that he would not combine shipping or he did say each additional items is an extra $3.25, then those were his terms, if you knew that and didn't ask prior to bidding... now your on thin ice.
Yes he is screwing around with the shipping and yes he should combine shipping and yes he is covering the listing/selling fees but, if it was in the description (not hidden amongst thousands of words but plainly noted) then it's a toss up.
You could tell him that you want to mutually cancel the auctions... that might be your best bet... if it came down to a claim, $30 to ship is crazy and I think EBay would side with you on that one. I shipped over 1000 coins, 46 pounds for $44, including the $6.50 extra large box, $2.00 for a large bag of popcorn packing, tracking number, and the insurance to cover it.
Don't forget to ask questions first though next time!
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>It's entirely legitimate. It's a handling cost. >>
A "handling cost" is not meant to offset eBay and Paypal fees. The seller should be reported. >>
Playing devil's advocate: A handling cost is allowed and not in voilation of any rule. What does it matter how the seller thinks of it? Apparently in his mind he considers it important to charge because of the fees. If the fees weren't so high perhaps he could waive the handling fees. But this is irrelevant as to whether a handling fee is allowed or not. --Jerry >>
Shipping and handing cost do not include Paypal and eBay fees. This seller is padding his Shipping and Handling fees so they do. Shipping fees should include a rough estimate of the USPS cost, and the packaging cost. Plain and Simple.
The seller clearly stated the shipping fees and clearly stated in a mail that they are non negotiable. If the fees plus the BIN prices acceptable buy them, if not don't.
Simple as that.
Like others I don't like folks who break rules others get penalized for but that is their choice.
<< <i>eBay's policy on overcharging for postage/handling/insurance is moderated by you, the buyer. They are complaint driven. If you do not like this sellers shipping fees, it is incumbent upon you to complain about that auction. >>
Okay- the combined shipping he's charging is high. At least you know what it is, and can factor that into the price you're going to pay, should you want to make a purchase. The problem is- the time spent by eBay dealing with a complaint about his shipping charge is time not spent dealing with all the Chinese fakes on the site.
What's worse for the hobby/industry- a seller charging more than you think he should for shipping or a seller importing fakes into the country?
<< <i>To each his own.
The seller clearly stated the shipping fees and clearly stated in a mail that they are non negotiable. If the fees plus the BIN prices acceptable buy them, if not don't.
Simple as that.
Like others I don't like folks who break rules others get penalized for but that is their choice. >>
I can't find the link.
Life is not fair and just because you would not do it that way does not mean it is wrong. Do not drop in the ebay is getting ripped on fees routine.
NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!!
working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
RIP "BEAR"
Was the shipping charge, for 1 item, reasonable in your view? If so, then he isn't trying to rip on the shipping charge to cover for fees in the product price.
If that was the exchange, as shown, he didn't say he wouldn't lower the fee more if it was for all 10 at once but he said he wouldn't do the "under $10".
So, it is up to the OP to decide if there is an in-between that is acceptable by both sides. if not, don't buy; move on. If so, do it and be happy with it or don't buy it.
Too many people seem to like to dictate to others what they should sell, how they should sell it, and how much they should charge. I'm in Asia right now, and one can barter for almost anything, particularly at the night markets, but if I don't come to an agreeable price, I don't get angry. I just say "thanks" and move on.
There is a difference between someone selling something for $0.01 and charging $999.99 on the shipping, compared to someone charging $10 and $4.95 (each additional adds $3.95 to shipping charges) for shipping. In the first case, it is clearly breaking conventions and, if there is a problem, shipping fees are rarely refundable. In the 2nd, it isn't, imho, unreasonable.
The same people that seem to like to complain on here about how people sell things on ebay, and want to dictate how it should be, probably don't want people telling them how to do things themselves.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>
<< <i>Not, it isn't a legitimate reason.
Russ, NCNE >>
I totally disagree. It's entirely legitimate. It's a handling cost. >>
I agree.
I offer a shipping discount and I'm surprised he didn't especially since you offered to buy them all.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>...I mailed a Morgan out this morning for .51 cents. And the P.O picked it up for me...
<< <i> You're gonna get dinged for inadequate packaging.--Jerry >>
It was a free morgan I was giving to a fellow member..Granted I could have used a bubble envelope and added a few more cents. It was wrapped very well and the envelope taped on all seams. The point was it doesn't take 5 bucks to mail a coin in a bubble envelope.. If you sell to an idiot buyer nothing will protect you. You just have to believe most people are honest and do the best you can.... >>
Actually, it would cost you about a dollar more. new padded envelopes with barcoded professional looking labels seems to make ebay buyers very happy. You'll be fine shipping to another forum member. Just be careful on ebay if you're trying to get a rebate. No big deal for the low volume seller. --Jerry
<< <i>I always do each additional itam at $1 each; they are overcharging for shippin to try to make up for eBay fees. You should forward thier responce to eBay and see how they feel about that. >>
I basically do the same for each additional item I'm shipping to their address and wait for their response.
encourage low or free shipping.) Ebay is "just a venue" and it is the buyer's right not to bid if they don't
approve of the handling fees, terms, or brand name of the plastic.
People complain about ebay sellers, yet I won a single lot from Christie's and had to pay $50 minimum
S&H. As long as the charge is disclosed, reporting sellers to ebay about S&H is lame.
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>Not, it isn't a legitimate reason.
Russ, NCNE >>
I totally disagree. It's entirely legitimate. It's a handling cost. >>
I agree.
I offer a shipping discount and I'm surprised he didn't especially since you offered to buy them all. >>
Quoting the OP here:
Here are the emails between me and the seller......
If I bought all ten lots you have for sale, could you do any better on
the shipping? As it is, shipping would be over $36 when it would
probably cost less than $10 Priority. Just let me know if you are
interested. Thank you for your time.
His response.......
Sorry i cant do $10.00 shipping because i have to pay ebay and paypal for each item that i sell and i am selling them very cheap thanks for asking
>>
If this is all there was between the OP and the seller, I think the seller interpretted the first as trying to get down to less than $10. Looks like the OP just asked if there could be better done and mentioned the $10 priority.
Given that a seller can't do anything about a problem buyer, it would appear that the seller is reading it as trying to get him down to $10 and may be expecting a problem so isn't going to play any games of prices in-between.
As Tom said, seller should have just said "no" and not given a reason. Seller may have hoped for an understanding buyer and talked too much.
I would have just walked, instead of buying, and wouldn't have bothered posting it here, but that is just me.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
A seller should always be looking for reasonable ways to save a buyer who cares a little money.
I look at sellers who act like this as laughable more than anything else.He is going for the score,a penny ante one to be sure, in the short term and doesn't see the big picture.
Forget about this penny ante seller and move on.
If a picture wasn't going very well I'd put a puppy dog in it, always a mongrel, you know, never one of the full bred puppies. And then I'd put a bandage on its foot... I liked it when I did it, but now I'm sick of it.
Norman Rockwell
his response was at least honest
not the way it is supposed to be, but honest
I have purchased things for a $.01, where I know the shipping is $20
it's part of the game
I do not feel obliged to be ebays watchman on this type of issue
If you don't like the shipping, then perhaps go elsewhere
another reason the seller will do this is
in order to avoid returns
after all the shipping is usually not refundable
so I keep this in mind
<< <i>This forum's rats must be scurrying looking for the auctions in question. >>
You seem to have many problems.....ebay, people on the forum, etc. I wish you the best in finding something happy and joyful in your life. I hope a smile, being foreign to you, don't harm you.
imho, your whining about people on the forum reporting to ebay is just as bad as the whiners themselves.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>Seems some people are still getting wrapped up in "the ebay thing".
Was the shipping charge, for 1 item, reasonable in your view? If so, then he isn't trying to rip on the shipping charge to cover for fees in the product price.
If that was the exchange, as shown, he didn't say he wouldn't lower the fee more if it was for all 10 at once but he said he wouldn't do the "under $10".
So, it is up to the OP to decide if there is an in-between that is acceptable by both sides. if not, don't buy; move on. If so, do it and be happy with it or don't buy it.
Too many people seem to like to dictate to others what they should sell, how they should sell it, and how much they should charge. I'm in Asia right now, and one can barter for almost anything, particularly at the night markets, but if I don't come to an agreeable price, I don't get angry. I just say "thanks" and move on.
There is a difference between someone selling something for $0.01 and charging $999.99 on the shipping, compared to someone charging $10 and $4.95 (each additional adds $3.95 to shipping charges) for shipping. In the first case, it is clearly breaking conventions and, if there is a problem, shipping fees are rarely refundable. In the 2nd, it isn't, imho, unreasonable.
The same people that seem to like to complain on here about how people sell things on ebay, and want to dictate how it should be, probably don't want people telling them how to do things themselves. >>
I did offer to buy all ten of the items he had listed and as it stands right now, he still has all ten.
My opinion is if you are going to list BIN auctions, list the item with a fair market value or a little under and charge fairly for shipping if someone buys multiples of the same item or multiple items you have at auction. I didn't buy his items because of the shipping charges because I feel sure he would have put them all in one box and shipped them.
I have sold plenty on ebay and usually lose money on shipping by the time you figure your own time and supplies into the equation but that is the cost of doing business as far as I am concerned. You can offer free shipping on all of your auctions and you will still not get a perfect score on the shipping star. Just the way it is.
By the way, this guy's feedback is 99.0% and his shipping star is 4.2.
<< <i>. By the way, this guy's feedback is 99.0% and his shipping star is 4.2. >>
So he's never getting a FVF rebate--never ever. So he has almost no incentive to control shippig costs and lives just inside the limits of "excessive shipping and handling charges" as defined by ebay. In this case his only incentive is to get the price adjusted to what he can sell them to you for.
But if he has his pricing set up so that at the sale price he loses money and has all his profit built into handling, shipping/handling will continue to be very high.
In this case you just have to look at the total price. Suppose the price for 10 items comes up $200 plus $50 shipping. Would you be willing to pay $245 and $5 shipping? If so, go for it, if not, pass.
--Jerry