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Registered mail not safe anymore ?
Roadgold
Posts: 81
So to day I go to the Post Office to pick up my registered mail A package of 2- 2008 W rev ER. Lady comes out from the back with a White envelope I could see the slice down the side before she got to the counter. Shur enough only one coin and she acted like she never noticed the slice, She just wanted me to sign the box. Now the Post Master has the other coin and the rest of the package. And is contacting the postal inspector. so now i am out 2 coins and my $810.00 because i paid by check and it was free shipping
Why do you have to 'put your two cents in'... but it's only a 'penny for your thoughts'? Where's that extra penny going to?
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Edit to add that envelopes are allowed I have recieved them.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>I thought you could only send registered mail in boxes, no envelopes? >>
You can use envelopes, but all seams must be taped with brown reinforced tape.
BTW, the insurance pricing is more reasonable than anywhere else IMHO!!!
<< <i>How are you out two coins? I thought one was delivered? >>
Since i refused the package the Post Master kept the other coin.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
<< <i>So to day I go to the Post Office to pick up my registered mail A package of 2- 2008 W rev ER. Lady comes out from the back with a White envelope I could see the slice down the side before she got to the counter. Shur enough only one coin and she acted like she never noticed the slice, She just wanted me to sign the box. Now the Post Master has the other coin and the rest of the package. And is contacting the postal inspector. so now i am out 2 coins and my $810.00 because i paid by check and it was free shipping >>
First off registered mail is normally treated rather gently so I'm surprised that it arrived damaged. What makes you think that you are out the coins? I think once the investigation is completed they will be returned to you. The other one if lost should be locatable. I'd say if you recover them both and the slabs are damaged, scratched or whatever that the seller owes you to reholder if you want and that includes shipping both ways..
Second, I think the rules do require boxes but sometimes envelopes are inadvertantly allowed by clerks who don't know the rules. Hope this doesn't impact the sellers attempt to make an insurance claim. The buyer doen't file the claim.
Third, The new form doesn't seem to have a box to check for insurance so I think registered always goes with insurance. They no longer ask me if I want insurance.
--Jerry
A claim should be filed.
<< <i>First, 99% of sellers are honest and would certainly refund your money from the insurance claim. It seems funny that the assumption is that the seller will just tell you to get lost.
Second, I think the rules do require boxes but sometimes envelopes are inadvertantly allowed by clerks who don't know the rules. Hope this doesn't impact the sellers attempt to make an insurance claim. The buyer doen't file the claim.
Third, The new form doesn't seem to have a box to check for insurance so I think registered always goes with insurance. They no longer ask me if I want insurance.
--Jerry >>
Its ok to use Safe T Mailers inside of letter size envelopes. I always put the brown paper tape on them too.
<< <i>Second, I think the rules do require boxes but sometimes envelopes are inadvertantly allowed by clerks who don't know the rules. >>
The USPS website specifically refers to "envelopes" as well as "packages" when describing how registered mail is to be prepared for shipping.
<< <i>First, 99% of sellers are honest and would certainly refund your money from the insurance claim. It seems funny that the assumption is that the seller will just tell you to get lost.
Second, I think the rules do require boxes but sometimes envelopes are inadvertantly allowed by clerks who don't know the rules. Hope this doesn't impact the sellers attempt to make an insurance claim. The buyer doen't file the claim.
Third, The new form doesn't seem to have a box to check for insurance so I think registered always goes with insurance. They no longer ask me if I want insurance.
--Jerry >>
PCGS always ships single or double slabs in a heavy duty registered envelope. I myself have shipped registered priority mail in only the priority mail cardboard mailers sealed with the postal paper tape. I think the only prereq for registered mail is a container that has been sealed with the paper tape so that all the seals can be date stamped by the initiating PO.
Registered mail is tracked and signed for at each location it is received at so the investigation should go rather smoothly.
Also, Insurance is NOT required for registered mail and I'm surprised that the buyer did not insist on INSURED registered mail especially since a personal check was involved which offers little recourse should things go south. I am not laying blame in any way shape or form but there are ways to protect oneself in $800+ transactions.
The name is LEE!
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<< <i>Second, I think the rules do require boxes but sometimes envelopes are inadvertantly allowed by clerks who don't know the rules. >>
The USPS website specifically refers to "envelopes" as well as "packages" when describing how registered mail is to be prepared for shipping. >>
I may be wrong. I thought someone (Russ?) once posted the actual USPS regulation saying no envelopes but I may be wrong. --Jerry
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<< <i>Second, I think the rules do require boxes but sometimes envelopes are inadvertantly allowed by clerks who don't know the rules. >>
The USPS website specifically refers to "envelopes" as well as "packages" when describing how registered mail is to be prepared for shipping. >>
I may be wrong. I thought someone (Russ?) once posted the actual USPS regulation saying no envelopes but I may be wrong. --Jerry >>
I've gotten 3 coins(one at a time) from Alpine Numis. over the past year or so......each coin was in a #10 envelope with brown tape covering the seams!!!
One was worth over $3500!!!!!!! I must say I was surprised it was packaged that way!!
Dave has been doing this longer than many folks here I must say!!!!!
2.4.6 Sealing
The mailer must securely seal envelopes. Paper or cellulose strips or wax or paper seals must not be placed over the intersections of flaps of letter-size envelopes where the postmark impressions are made. Packages must be sealed with mucilage or glue or with plain paper or cloth tape. Packages containing currency or securities may not be sealed exclusively by paper strips, but must first be sealed securely with mucilage or glue. Large envelopes (flats) that are completely sealed and that also have paper strips or paper tape across the intersections of the flaps may be considered packages for sealing requirements. To be used on Registered Mail, tape must visibly damage the envelope or wrapper if removed and must absorb the ink in a postmark impression.
edited to add... I'm not entirely sure what that bolded sentence means, but it's apparent it's describing how "letter-size envelopes" are to be used.
<< <i>Insurance? The registered mail receipt states that "Domestic Insurance up to $25,000 is included in the fee." They ask you the value of your package.
A claim should be filed. >>
True. Insurance is always included with registered mail. However the sender must declare a value on the sheet. The only way you are screwed is if the sender declared no value to your package. I can't imagine why anyone would send registered and not delcare a value, this is the point of registered. If a value was declared, USPS should award you the value declared. BTW, you can send registered in a paper envelope, no bubble mailer, and all seams must be secured with brown papertape.
I don't know what they call the special tape, but most tapes will not be allowed.
<< <i>Also, Insurance is NOT required for registered mail and I'm surprised that the buyer did not insist on INSURED registered mail especially since a personal check was involved which offers little recourse should things go south. I am not laying blame in any way shape or form but there are ways to protect oneself in $800+ transactions. >>
The insurance option for registered mail seems to be redundant, since the receipt states that a domestic package is insured up to $25,000 as part of the fee. I shipped something out recently and didn't check any insurance box. My receipt states the article value and the same INSURED VALUE.
So I am a bit confused with regard to registered insurance.
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<< <i>Insurance? The registered mail receipt states that "Domestic Insurance up to $25,000 is included in the fee." They ask you the value of your package.
A claim should be filed. >>
True. Insurance is always included with registered mail. However the sender must declare a value on the sheet. The only way you are screwed is if the sender declared no value to your package. I can't imagine why anyone would send registered and not delcare a value, this is the point of registered. If a value was declared, USPS should award you the value declared. BTW, you can send registered in a paper envelope, no bubble mailer, and all seams must be secured with brown papertape. >>
Looks pretty darn clear to me..........
<< <i>I may be wrong. I thought someone (Russ?) once posted the actual USPS regulation saying no envelopes but I may be wrong. --Jerry >>
That applies to bubble mailer envelopes.
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<< <i>Insurance? The registered mail receipt states that "Domestic Insurance up to $25,000 is included in the fee." They ask you the value of your package.
A claim should be filed. >>
True. Insurance is always included with registered mail. However the sender must declare a value on the sheet. The only way you are screwed is if the sender declared no value to your package. I can't imagine why anyone would send registered and not delcare a value, this is the point of registered. If a value was declared, USPS should award you the value declared. BTW, you can send registered in a paper envelope, no bubble mailer, and all seams must be secured with brown papertape. >>
Yes, good point.
You have clarified the insurance policy very well. When I brought my package to the post office, I did declare the full value, and it seems that the insurance value was automatically matched on my receipt. Apparently, I did not need to check an insurance box.
It is telling you it only covers domestic mail and not international.
2.3.1 Full Value
Regardless of any insurance that may cover the article, the mailer must always declare its full value to the USPS when presenting it for registration and mailing (see chart below). The mailer must tell the USPS clerk (or enter on the firm sheet if a firm mailer) the full value of mail matter presented for registration. Private insurance carried on Registered Mail does not modify the requirements for declaring the full value. The accepting USPS employee may ask the mailer to show that the full value of the matter presented is declared, and may refuse to accept the matter as Registered Mail if a satisfactory declaration of value is not provided. Only articles of no value may be mailed as Registered Mail without insurance.
What the front of the Postal form really means to say is...when insurance is requested and the appropriate extra fee is paid, up to $25,000.00 in insurance can be purchased.
I know it is confusing, typical post office language..... but that is what the form means.
<< <i>I don't know where folks are getting the idea that full insurance coverage comes with Registered Mail, it doesn't. Only for an additional insurance fee are items coverered by insurance. >>
ProofRainbowRoosevelt's response above seems to address this issue.
<< <i>What the front of the Postal form really means to say is...when insurance is requested and the appropriate extra fee is paid, up to $25,000.00 in insurance can be purchased. >>
As previously noted...
2.3.1 Full Value
Regardless of any insurance that may cover the article, the mailer must always declare its full value to the USPS when presenting it for registration and mailing (see chart below). The mailer must tell the USPS clerk (or enter on the firm sheet if a firm mailer) the full value of mail matter presented for registration. Private insurance carried on Registered Mail does not modify the requirements for declaring the full value. The accepting USPS employee may ask the mailer to show that the full value of the matter presented is declared, and may refuse to accept the matter as Registered Mail if a satisfactory declaration of value is not provided. Only articles of no value may be mailed as Registered Mail without insurance.
<< <i>Goldbully, read the back of the form, see where it says see reverse.... "Without Postal Insurance: You can also send an article by Registered Mail without purchasing postal Insurance by paying the appropriate fee. No indemnity is paid for unisured articles.
What the front of the Postal form really means to say is...when insurance is requested and the appropriate extra fee is paid, up to $25,000.00 in insurance can be purchased.
I know it is confusing, typical post office language..... but that is what the form means. >>
That's very interesting and alarming.
Now I'm wondering if the package I sent out was really insured!!!!
Registered Mail is available for items paid at Priority Mail and First-Class Mail prices. It may be combined with COD, Delivery Confirmation, restricted delivery, return receipt, or Signature Confirmation. Postal insurance is provided for articles with a declared value up to a maximum of $25,000. Only items with no declared value may use registry service without insurance.
<< <i>Go to the USPS website and use the postage calculator to see what happens when you try to send a package using registered mail. Here's what pops up when you click the "?" mark next to the "Registered Mail" checkbox:
Registered Mail is available for items paid at Priority Mail and First-Class Mail prices. It may be combined with COD, Delivery Confirmation, restricted delivery, return receipt, or Signature Confirmation. Postal insurance is provided for articles with a declared value up to a maximum of $25,000. Only items with no declared value may use registry service without insurance. >>
Go further and it will ask you the amount to insure it for and add a charge on top of the $10 base fee.
<< <i>Goldbully, read the back of the form, see where it says see reverse.... "Without Postal Insurance: You can also send an article by Registered Mail without purchasing postal Insurance by paying the appropriate fee. No indemnity is paid for unisured articles.
What the front of the Postal form really means to say is...when insurance is requested and the appropriate extra fee is paid, up to $25,000.00 in insurance can be purchased.
I know it is confusing, typical post office language..... but that is what the form means. >>
SGI, are you a lawyer???
<< <i>If optional insurance wasn't requested and paid for, the coins were not insured. No claim will be paid by the Post Office. >>
True. Why use registered and not insure? Might as well write STEAL ME!!! all over the package.
Replace the word "provided" with "available" and you'll understand what this really means. It does not say "is included". Hopefully this will help clear this up.
Of course, it's always possible the OPs seller was asked for the value, and he said "$0". Which, in this case, is potentially not a good thing for the OP.
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<< <i>Insurance? The registered mail receipt states that "Domestic Insurance up to $25,000 is included in the fee." They ask you the value of your package.
A claim should be filed. >>
True. Insurance is always included with registered mail. However the sender must declare a value on the sheet. The only way you are screwed is if the sender declared no value to your package. I can't imagine why anyone would send registered and not delcare a value, this is the point of registered. If a value was declared, USPS should award you the value declared. BTW, you can send registered in a paper envelope, no bubble mailer, and all seams must be secured with brown papertape. >>
Looks pretty darn clear to me..........
And your fee WILL VARY depending on how much insurance you want. You must declare value and pay a fee if you want ins otherwise YOU ARE SOL. You conveniently fegitted about the rest of the boxes on the form.
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<< <i>
<< <i>Insurance? The registered mail receipt states that "Domestic Insurance up to $25,000 is included in the fee." They ask you the value of your package. A claim should be filed. >>
True. Insurance is always included with registered mail. However the sender must declare a value on the sheet. The only way you are screwed is if the sender declared no value to your package. I can't imagine why anyone would send registered and not delcare a value, this is the point of registered. If a value was declared, USPS should award you the value declared. BTW, you can send registered in a paper envelope, no bubble mailer, and all seams must be secured with brown papertape. >>
Looks pretty darn clear to me..........
That is the old form. The new one is dated may 2007 and doesn't have the check boxes for insurance. Insurance used to be itemized seperately on your bill and now it isn't. --Jerry
Interesting subject here. I just went through this with my local postmaster. She said registered mail is not insured. I said what!! She said the fee you are paying for registered mail is that it is carefully handled and it JUST DOESN"T GET LOST. They make sure of that. I said, what if it does get lost? She said if you want insurance, it's extra! Why should I send something that's slower and have to buy insurance too? I thought it was insured. I sent it Priority insured and it got to it's destination in 2 days. But it all left me confused about registered mail. So the coins sent back to us from PCGS are not insured? Are we just paying for the registered mail fee? That's how I gather it. But there is a declared value on the package that the post office should cover, if it does get lost or damaged. Since it's registered, everyone who handles the package signs for it, and puts it in a safe at each stop, which makes it very traceable. Correct me if I'm wrong, she left me a bit confused.
Rich
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<< <i>Second, I think the rules do require boxes but sometimes envelopes are inadvertantly allowed by clerks who don't know the rules. >>
The USPS website specifically refers to "envelopes" as well as "packages" when describing how registered mail is to be prepared for shipping. >>
I may be wrong. I thought someone (Russ?) once posted the actual USPS regulation saying no envelopes but I may be wrong. --Jerry >>
You are wrong Jerry. I just got my PCGS order of 2 slabbed coins today in the mail. Heavy duty yellow envelope, registered with brown tape.
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<< <i>If optional insurance wasn't requested and paid for, the coins were not insured. No claim will be paid by the Post Office. >>
True. Why use registered and not insure? Might as well write STEAL ME!!! all over the package. >>
Because you might be willing to gamble that the security of the registered system will prevent the package from being lost; ie the odds are great that it will get delivered. In this case the package was deliverable, but damaged.