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eBay Sellers Cannot Leave Negative, Neutral Feedback for Buyers!
poorguy
Posts: 4,317 ✭
Feedback Changes
The eBay Feedback system was designed to provide a simple, honest, accurate record of member experiences. Focusing on customer service includes doing everything we can to grow customer confidence in our sellers.
Buyers will only be able to receive positive Feedback.
Positive repeat customer Feedback will count (up to 1 Feedback from the same buyer per week.)
Feedback more than 12-months old won't count towards your Feedback percentage.
When a buyer doesn't respond to the Unpaid Item (UPI) process the negative or neutral Feedback they have left for that transaction will be removed.
When a member is suspended, all their negative and neutral Feedback will be removed.
Buyers must wait 3 days before leaving negative or neutral Feedback for sellers with an established track record, to encourage communication.
All Feedback must be left within 60 days (compared to 90 days today) of listing end to encourage timely Feedback and discourage abuse.
Buyers will be held more accountable when sellers report an unpaid item or commit other policy violations.
Man, that was a stupid idea. How on earth are sellers going to know who NOT to sell to? What the hell are they thinking?
The eBay Feedback system was designed to provide a simple, honest, accurate record of member experiences. Focusing on customer service includes doing everything we can to grow customer confidence in our sellers.
Buyers will only be able to receive positive Feedback.
Positive repeat customer Feedback will count (up to 1 Feedback from the same buyer per week.)
Feedback more than 12-months old won't count towards your Feedback percentage.
When a buyer doesn't respond to the Unpaid Item (UPI) process the negative or neutral Feedback they have left for that transaction will be removed.
When a member is suspended, all their negative and neutral Feedback will be removed.
Buyers must wait 3 days before leaving negative or neutral Feedback for sellers with an established track record, to encourage communication.
All Feedback must be left within 60 days (compared to 90 days today) of listing end to encourage timely Feedback and discourage abuse.
Buyers will be held more accountable when sellers report an unpaid item or commit other policy violations.
Man, that was a stupid idea. How on earth are sellers going to know who NOT to sell to? What the hell are they thinking?
Brandon Kelley - ANA - 972.746.9193 - http://www.bestofyesterdaycollectibles.com
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Comments
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<< <i>Too late Brandon, see here
Link >>
Oh. Whooopsie. +1
<< <i>LOL, we've been ranting about this all day! >>
Well, I've been busy. hmph.
I hope you have contacted your rep to make your feelings known. I did, in no uncertain terms.
Russ, NCNE
The name is LEE!
<< <i>Well on the plus side sdoesn't this eliminate retalitory feedback from sellers which we all know can and does occur? >>
Yes, that *does* solve this very real problem, but this is swatting a fly with a sledgehammer. This not only stops the retaliation feedback silmy sellers use to force mutual withdrawal, but it also holds every legitimate seller hostage to a potentially unreasonable buyer.
Most buyers are just fine, but if it becomes easier to screw legitimate sellers, do you think we may see a rise in the number of shady buyers practicing extortion on sellers because they hold ALL the leverage?
the buyer email me and say "ebay" made a mistake on his listing and the delivery charge would be more than I paid. I refused
to pay more than I had "contracted" for and even though we exchanged a few emails on the subject and I thought I had
explained my position rationally and clearly, he just cancelled my purchase arbitrarily. I left him a negative and he in turn
left me one. I hope this new policy by Ebay, is retroactive, because I had no fault in the transaction going south and the
seller should not have been able to get away with it. My efforts to have Ebay remove that feedback has been fruitless to
date. They want me to send them copies of all our emails for review (which I did save) but I don't have the computer
expertise to send them in the form they want them sent (complete headers...blah, blah) ...all they had to do was look at
the listing and what delivery charges were required to complete the purchase to my zip code, see that I paid in full with
Paypal, read the feedbacks that were left (he admits on the feedback that "extra charges" were needed to ship) and that
should have been the end of the story...negative feedback removed from my record! Like I said, hopefully this will be
retroactive and my feedback score will go back up to where buyers won't have to think twice about doing business with me.
So, don't think that the buyers "always" deserve a negative. I think that's where Ebay is at, too many sellers being vindictave
and buyers complaints to Ebay piling up!
The Beatles
<< <i>Most buyers are just fine, but if it becomes easier to screw legitimate sellers, do you think we may see a rise in the number of shady buyers practicing extortion on sellers because they hold ALL the leverage? >>
Yes.
<< <i>So, don't think that the buyers "always" deserve a negative. I think that's where Ebay is at, too many sellers being vindictave
and buyers complaints to Ebay piling up! >>
Nobody thinks that, nor did anybody say that. The problem is that this new policy assumes all sellers are scum, and all buyers are angels. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>why doesn't eBay spend more time/effort in putting the crooked sellers into jail >>
That costs money.
<< <i>
<< <i>So, don't think that the buyers "always" deserve a negative. I think that's where Ebay is at, too many sellers being vindictave
and buyers complaints to Ebay piling up! >>
Nobody thinks that, nor did anybody say that. The problem is that this new policy assumes all sellers are scum, and all buyers are angels. Nothing could be further from the truth.
Russ, NCNE >>
Hmmmm! I wonder where the bay will be without sellers? You suppose they ever considered that?
The name is LEE!
<< <i>If enough sellers got together and boycotted eBay for a short time (like say the first week of February) then they might get the message. I'm in!
me too, the stupid no neg feedback policy has to be thrown out
I DO NOT care what other buyers feedback is, I am not buying from them. I only want to know how a seller treats people. The VERY few deserved negatives on buyers by sellers do not make up for the fact that buyers do not leave deserved negative or neutral feedback on sellers for fear of retalitory feedback. If you are a seller and cannot handle a couple of bad transactions from sellers that you would rather not do business with, you should think about quitting your business and getting into another industry.
BRAVO Ebay!
<< <i>Brandon,
I hope you have contacted your rep to make your feelings known. I did, in no uncertain terms.
Russ, NCNE >>
No dice..there Russ ....Ebay is under pressure to perform..stock down 35 % from last year's high ..their own forecast is for softer revs. this year............ They need every buyer they can lay their hands on..
<< <i>Excellent news! I have been an advocate for this for a long time! Sellers should not be able to leave any feedback, good or bad for a buyer. All allowing that does is to promote feedback extortion and skewed feedback numbers for the people that need to have feedback left for them, the sellers. >>
But that's not the case here. The sellers are still able to leave POSITIVE feedback.
I think it would have been better if the seller could issue NO feedback at all; that way slimy buyers can't extort positive feedback from the seller. Buyers now have the power to hang the sword of Damocles over sellers if they want to be jerks.
Trust me, folks. I've been a buyer and a seller, and there is plenty of opportunities for shenanigans on both sides. The problem is that eBay is only interested in stopping the shenanigans on ONE side of the transaction and creating a hugely uneven playing field.
This should make the "seller should leave feedback first" crowd happy. These buyers now have the leverage they wanted.
<< <i>Excellent news! I have been an advocate for this for a long time! Sellers should not be able to leave any feedback, good or bad for a buyer. >>
I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of sellers just stop leaving feedback altogether. Of course, then buyers will whine because it hurts their self-esteem when they don't get their well-deserved "rewards".
<< <i>
<< <i>Excellent news! I have been an advocate for this for a long time! Sellers should not be able to leave any feedback, good or bad for a buyer. All allowing that does is to promote feedback extortion and skewed feedback numbers for the people that need to have feedback left for them, the sellers. >>
But that's not the case here. The sellers are still able to leave POSITIVE feedback.
I think it would have been better if the seller could issue NO feedback at all; that way slimy buyers can't extort positive feedback from the seller. Buyers now have the power to hang the sword of Damocles over sellers if they want to be jerks.
Trust me, folks. I've been a buyer and a seller, and there is plenty of opportunities for shenanigans on both sides. The problem is that eBay is only interested in stopping the shenanigans on ONE side of the transaction and creating a hugely uneven playing field.
This should make the "seller should leave feedback first" crowd happy. These buyers now have the leverage they wanted. >>
I agree, they should not be able to leave any. Leaving positives still opens the door for feedback extortion.
To me it looks like this is their way to force sellers to only except pay-pal and get more fees out of us.
<< <i>Well on the plus side sdoesn't this eliminate retalitory feedback from sellers which we all know can and does occur? >>
I agree, I received my only negative afer I paid for a few cheap proof sets and the seller did not send. He would not reply to my messages for a week at least so I slammed him with a negative and he gave me one.
It made no sense I paid for an item, never received it, then got a negative.
Since it wasn't big money it wasn't worth going to fight for it, but I really hate it that I'm stuck with ONE negative and 212 Positives.
****LOSER, JERKED ME AROUND FOR DAYS, UNREASONABLE, BLOCK THIS GUY*****
Just a thought.
Joe
<< <i>Can't sellers leave negative comment in the "Positive" feedback:
****LOSER, JERKED ME AROUND FOR DAYS, UNREASONABLE, BLOCK THIS GUY*****
Just a thought. >>
At this rate it's a matter of time before they don't allow sellers to add comments to prevent this. They'd be better off not allowing sellers to leave feedback AT ALL. That still tilts the playing field in favor of the buyer, but not as much as this proposed change would do.
<< <i>
<< <i>Well on the plus side sdoesn't this eliminate retalitory feedback from sellers which we all know can and does occur? >>
I agree, I received my only negative afer I paid for a few cheap proof sets and the seller did not send. He would not reply to my messages for a week at least so I slammed him with a negative and he gave me one.
It made no sense I paid for an item, never received it, then got a negative.
Since it wasn't big money it wasn't worth going to fight for it, but I really hate it that I'm stuck with ONE negative and 212 Positives. >>
Now how is that for double wammy! I hope this descision will cause sellers that hawk substandard, wrongly decribed items to unsuspecting buyers under the thinly veiled guise of a powerseller to choose another venue for their wares and not expect to hold buyers accountable for the merchandise they sell!
I guess Meg summarizes it best; 'eBay is not for everyone'
<< <i> With this change I would expect that an excellent seller will have a positive FB rating in the 90-95% percentile. This will not instill confidence in bidders and will likely lead to fewer sales and lower closing prices and fees that is of concern to eBay now. I would also expect to receive the thinly veiled extortion attempts that are currently prevalent to sellers that leave FB first.
As time progresses it seems that eBay understands less and less about their business model. >>
They absolutely understand their business model. It seems from the responses I've seen here that none of you have worked in a corporate environment. You are actually addressing the arguments made in their statement as though these were their actual justifications. Doing this puts you in danger of overlooking the real insiduous nature of these proposed changes. My argument is that they know exactly what they are doing, and are doing so to maximize their profit. They are in essence moving the entire business model from an auction format into more of a storefront format with the illusion of an auction format and here's why:
1. They are taking actions to maximize the number of bidders/buyers and their willingness to bid and buy. Less fear of retaliation means less fear for sloppy buying habits. Besides, buyers are used to online shopping in this day and age and as such are beginning to expect the same types of services as they would expect from any online vendor. Since eBay doesn't need to worry about offering those services, they are effectively increasing the buying base without adding any cost to their business. In addition, they are reducing insertion fees (while raising final value fees! (something I think you all would have more beef with than the seller feedback issue). So, not only are they increasing the number of buyers coming into the store, they are increasing the amount of product available. And when that product sells, they make more money off of it! How is this not a good business idea for them?
2. Note the major changes on the seller's side of the house. These are designed to consolidate and prioritize selling to high volume vendors rather than more infrequent ones. They have explicitly targeted powersellers and are offerring extended services to them (including final value fee discounts) and are raising the bar for entry for them. They are also changing search algorithms to prioritize high volume dealers (those who are constantly doing business to keep up their feedback and rating status per the new time frames for rating). This means the little guy won't have the same chance to sell a coin as the big guy. The big guy will get priority hits against their auctions. From a business perspective, they are basically consolidating their distribution centers (read powersellers) for a more dependable and stable source of income. And while they're taking away the neg and neutral feedback options for sellers, they offering powersellers far more protection against unpaying buyers and automatic chargebacks. For the little guy...no such thing. Think hard about this, what does eBay care how many little sellers there are. Since they are raising final value fees, they are only concerned with volume, not cross-sectional diversity. Again, how is this not a good business idea for them?
With the prevalence of sniping programs, and the tendency to not bid up an item, but rather to wait to the last minute to enter a bid among buyers, how, I ask you all, is this not becoming more like a storefront rather than an auction house? Why keep the auction format you might ask? Because people have all sorts of emotional weather surronding auctions. The sense of scoring a rip, of competition, of searching for treasure, these are powerful motivations for many buyers. I would expect that many of us who have listed items as either BIN or in eBay stores have watched the same items sell for equal or greater values when in the bidding format.
We should all beware of not the inability to neg a buyer, but of being pushed out of, for many of us, our largest selling venue.
<< <i>I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of sellers just stop leaving feedback altogether. Of course, then buyers will whine because it hurts their self-esteem when they don't get their well-deserved "rewards". >>
<< <i>This should make the "seller should leave feedback first" crowd happy. These buyers now have the leverage they wanted >>
Yup, they will be demanding their feedback from sellers on the spot now, don't see much of a reason for a seller to leave it now - unless they start a star rating for that as well.
<< <i>why doesn't eBay spend more time/effort in putting the crooked sellers into jail >>
And crooked buyers/scammers. We have one now that created a fake silver bar book to show paypal while trying to return our original as the fake.
Coin's for sale/trade.
Tom Pilitowski
US Rare Coin Investments
800-624-1870
<< <i>paypal holding the money until the buyer leaves positive feedback?! >>
Let's not get too whacked out, here. That only applies in very specific circumstances involving high-risk sellers. Most sellers have nothing to be concerned about on this one.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>paypal holding the money until the buyer leaves positive feedback?! >>
Let's not get too whacked out, here. That only applies in very specific circumstances involving high-risk sellers. Most sellers have nothing to be concerned about on this one.
Russ, NCNE >>
According to ebay withheld payments will total up to 5% of all payments on ebay. That's a huge number. Coins will be a high risk category so it will be more than 5% for us. One out of every 15 or 20 payments. Maybe more than that. You'll be forced to offer paypal and put up with this BS since it's it's a high risk category. Coin sellers won't be able to say "no paypal" anymore. Just a single buyer can get you classified as a "bad seller" by giving you a 2 in communications for example. He'll count as a dissatisfied customer. If you had less that 20 buyers in the last month you'll be under the 95% threshold. A bad seller in a high risk category. Get ready to wait 3 weeks for your money.
<< <i><< paypal holding the money until the buyer leaves positive feedback?! >>
Let's not get too whacked out, here. That only applies in very specific circumstances involving high-risk sellers. Most sellers have nothing to be concerned about on this one.
Russ, NCNE >>
According to ebay withheld payments will total up to 5% of all payments on ebay. That's a huge number. Coins will be a high risk category so it will be more than 5% for us. One out of every 15 or 20 payments. Maybe more than that. You'll be forced to offer paypal and put up with this BS since it's it's a high risk category. >>
Coins are not considered a higher risk category. Higher risk categories are: gift certificates, video games, cell phones, computers and consumer electronics.
<< <i>your payments WILL BE NOT HELD if you meet all the following measures:
eBay Tenure: Greater than 6-months
Total Feedback score: More than 100
Dissatisfied Buyers %: Less than 5%
Detailed Seller Rating: Greater than 4.5
Total Detailed Seller Ratings Recieved: More than 20 in the last 12-months >>
As I said, most sellers have nothing to worry about.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>your payments WILL BE NOT HELD if you meet all the following measures:
eBay Tenure: Greater than 6-months
Total Feedback score: More than 100
Dissatisfied Buyers %: Less than 5%
Detailed Seller Rating: Greater than 4.5
Total Detailed Seller Ratings Recieved: More than 20 in the last 12-months >>
As I said, most sellers have nothing to worry about. >>
Okay, I easily qualify on the first three. But I haven't sold enough to meet the last two. Occasional sellers are screwed if this is the case.
<< <i><< your payments WILL BE NOT HELD if you meet all the following measures:
eBay Tenure: Greater than 6-months
Total Feedback score: More than 100
Dissatisfied Buyers %: Less than 5%
Detailed Seller Rating: Greater than 4.5
Total Detailed Seller Ratings Recieved: More than 20 in the last 12-months >>
As I said, most sellers have nothing to worry about. >>
Okay, I easily qualify on the first three. But I haven't sold enough to meet the last two. Occasional sellers are screwed if this is the case. >>
There is another section in the polices that has an "or" between number 3 and number 4. But, as I noted, coins are not one of the higher-risk categories.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>30. What can I do to avoid having eBay item holds?
Your payments WILL BE NOT HELD if you meet all the following requirements:
eBay Tenure: Greater than 6-months
Total Feedback score: More than 100
Dissatisfied Buyers %: Less than 5%
Or if you meet all the following requirements:
Detailed Seller Rating: Greater than 4.5
Total Detailed Seller Ratings Recieved: More than 20 in the last 12-months >>
So, it isn't as stringent. If you're fine in the first three it shouldn't be an issue.
Russ, NCNE
<< <i>
<< <i>Brandon,
I hope you have contacted your rep to make your feelings known. I did, in no uncertain terms.
Russ, NCNE >>
No dice..there Russ ....Ebay is under pressure to perform..stock down 35 % from last year's high ..their own forecast is for softer revs. this year............ They need every buyer they can lay their hands on.. >>
chasing sellers away is not going to help their bottom line. i sell mostly widgets and ebay/paypal makes more than i do already.
i see no problem with the feedback system in place now(the stars r stupid). i`ve been listing less lately and will list even less if these changes go into effect.
I sent mine to them today; have you?
Here's what I wrote:
"Regarding your intended feedback system changes:
I am both an eBay buyer and a seller with 100% positive feedback and am astounded (and frankly, angered) that you are even CONSIDERING allowing sellers to ONLY give "positive" feedback to buyers, no matter how they conduct themselves in their transactions with us honest, fair, and conscientious sellers! My 100% positive feedback is an observable reflection of my integrity regarding how I conduct myself in both my purchases and sales on eBay.
Your proposed feedback change would make trustworthy sellers like myself open targets for less than honorable "buyers" to just arbitrarily zap us with a negative for no justifiable (or even a totally fabricated) reason at their own whim, thereby ruining our feedback score/comments which most potential buyers at least skim through before deciding whether to bid on our item.
Your proposed new policy would also prevent sellers from blocking bidders who have left negative feedbacks for other sellers in the recent past.
If your proposed new "no negatives allowed towards buyers" feedback policy is implemented, many sellers like myself will soon thereafter be jumping off eBay's ship in droves.
PLEASE reconsider this change, for your own profits' benefit, if not for fairness towards us sellers.
Thank you.
Regards,"
******
- Jim
<< <i>I think if enough sellers send an email complaining about this unfair change, it at least might make eBay think twice about it.
I sent mine to them today; have you?
Here's what I wrote:
"Regarding your intended feedback system changes:
I am both an eBay buyer and a seller with 100% positive feedback and am astounded (and frankly, angered) that you are even CONSIDERING allowing sellers to ONLY give "positive" feedback to buyers, no matter how they conduct themselves in their transactions with us honest, fair, and conscientious sellers! My 100% positive feedback is an observable reflection of my integrity regarding how I conduct myself in both my purchases and sales on eBay.
Your proposed feedback change would make trustworthy sellers like myself open targets for less than honorable "buyers" to just arbitrarily zap us with a negative for no justifiable (or even a totally fabricated) reason at their own whim, thereby ruining our feedback score/comments which most potential buyers at least skim through before deciding whether to bid on our item.
Your proposed new policy would also prevent sellers from blocking bidders who have left negative feedbacks for other sellers in the recent past.
If your proposed new "no negatives allowed towards buyers" feedback policy is implemented, many sellers like myself will soon thereafter be jumping off eBay's ship in droves.
PLEASE reconsider this change, for your own profits' benefit, if not for fairness towards us sellers.
Thank you.
Regards,"
****** >>
<< <i>No dice..there Russ ....Ebay is under pressure to perform..stock down 35 % from last year's high ..their own forecast is for softer revs. this year............ They need every buyer they can lay their hands on.. >>
Ebay's customers are SELLERS. Buyers pay nothing to ebay.
<< <i>
<< <i>No dice..there Russ ....Ebay is under pressure to perform..stock down 35 % from last year's high ..their own forecast is for softer revs. this year............ They need every buyer they can lay their hands on.. >>
Ebay's customers are SELLERS. Buyers pay nothing to ebay. >>
who owns paypal?
<< <i>
<< <i>
<< <i>No dice..there Russ ....Ebay is under pressure to perform..stock down 35 % from last year's high ..their own forecast is for softer revs. this year............ They need every buyer they can lay their hands on.. >>
Ebay's customers are SELLERS. Buyers pay nothing to ebay. >>
who owns paypal? >>
Paypal revenues last year over $$ 650 MIL..... those who use paypal from their checking account are all gravy for the pal
Without buyers.... Ebay wouldn't have sellers..
I QUIT!