Should BigE "put his coin to sleep" for a year or two, or sell it at the first opportunity

Longacre · June 14, 2007 11:56AM

Honestly, I was just trying to find an excuse to use the term "put his coin to sleep", which I find hilarious, in the context of Dr. Kagin's recent ANA hearing.

Due to the publicity surrounding BigE's BigScore with his purchase from Stack's, do you think it makes more sense for him to put the coin to sleep for a year or two, or should he try to sell it immediately? How would the selling price be impacted if he sold it immediately versus waiting? Similarly, and I think IGWT made reference to this in another thread, has the power of plastic made irrelevant the rule that you need to wait for some time to sell a recently acquired coin to even attempt to recoup your investment?

dthigpen · June 14, 2007 11:59AM

I hate to say it, but sell it.

roadrunner · June 14, 2007 12:12PM

It's more than coincidence imo that the coin sold for $9200 at auction. Sunnywood gave a good review of the coin. I'd be tempted to sell it as well. The market is big enough that many large retailers would have no clue of the coin's origins. They don't attend auctions and don't review the CU forum.

roadrunner

ziggy29 · June 14, 2007 12:15PM

It depends on his motive for buying the coin. If it was because he loved the coin and wanted to keep it as a cornerstone of the collection, he couldn't sell. If he bought it because he thought he could get a good deal on a raw coin to flip later, then sell it.

Elcontador · June 14, 2007 12:41PM

I'd unload it as soon as possible. I don't know how long it will be before it turns black, and I wouldn't want to own it when / if it does.

FatMan · June 14, 2007 12:46PM

I'm with the sell it now crowd.

"put to sleep" has become an in-vogue term lately.

WTCG · June 14, 2007 12:50PM

Other than trying to sell the coin in question on the BST Forum, the "publicity" from the on-line forums will have miniscule to no factor on the salability of the coin provided that it isn't removed from its current holder or the coin's surfaces do not change in appearance. This forum has only limited exposure to the total number of actively buying collectors and dealers so many potential buyers will not have seen the controversy that has arisen from any message boards. Whether the coin is AT or not, the toning will appear attractive to many people and since the coin is housed in an NGC holder the toning color has claims to legitimacy.

Besides, the date of the coin is a fairly tough one to find in PF66 and higher.

RYK · June 14, 2007 12:59PM

I would sell it, buy a nice proof-65 and use the difference to buy something else cool, like a Chain cent, High Relief Saint, early gold, etc.

dthigpen · June 14, 2007 1:00PM

<< I would sell it, buy a nice proof-65 and use the difference to buy something else cool, like a Chain cent, High Relief Saint, early gold, etc. >>

I'm with Stupid.

coindeuce · June 14, 2007 1:10PM

I would offer the owner 50 cents for a view of the coin in the slab, if he can produce images in the next 5 minutes.

RYK · June 14, 2007 1:13PM

<< I would offer the owner 50 cents for a view of the coin in the slab, if he can produce images in the next 5 minutes. >>

After this score, the owner is lighting cigars with C-notes and you want him to bend over backwards for you for 50 cents?

123cents · June 14, 2007 1:14PM

I would keep it a few years and then unload.

GoldenEyeNumismatics · June 14, 2007 1:42PM

Sell it and run away with your profit.

DUIGUY · June 14, 2007 2:03PM

I'm with the "put it to sleep" crowd . The number of times a collector has to savor "the thrill of victory" are outweighed by the number of times the collector experiences " the agony of defeat".

ColonialCoinUnion · June 14, 2007 2:08PM

He bought it because he liked it - I presume that's still the case.

RYK · June 14, 2007 2:26PM

<< He bought it because he liked it - I presume that's still the case. >>

If I were BigE and bought the coin because I liked it in the photo, and then received two rounds of abuse over it here, I would have enough negative feelings toward the coin that I would want to make it go away--especially when I could presumably use the proceeds to buy something that I wanted in the first place (a gem proof seated dollar) and something else really cool to go with it, assuming the value of the coin is really in the $30k range and BigE can get 85% or so of that number.

ColonialCoinUnion · June 14, 2007 9:30PM

<< If I were BigE and bought the coin because I liked it in the photo, and then received two rounds of abuse over it here, I would have enough negative feelings toward the coin that I would want to make it go away >>

I got the impression that BigE wasn't all that concerned about what anybody else thought - whether it be opinions about the coin itself, the method in which he chose to bid on it, or unsolicited advice about what he should do with it, and when.

RYK · June 14, 2007 9:51PM

<< 

<< If I were BigE and bought the coin because I liked it in the photo, and then received two rounds of abuse over it here, I would have enough negative feelings toward the coin that I would want to make it go away >>

I got the impression that BigE wasn't all that concerned about what anybody else thought - whether it be opinions about the coin itself, the method in which he chose to bid on it, or unsolicited advice about what he should do with it, and when. >>

I never suggested that he should do this--only offered what I would do. He should do what he thinks is best for himself. BigE seems like the independent time. I doubt he would be swayed much by the denizens.

BigE · June 15, 2007 1:06AM

<< I'd unload it as soon as possible. I don't know how long it will be before it turns black, and I wouldn't want to own it when / if it does. >>

Elcontador this statement makes no sense to me

1) You are saying you would pass a bad coin onto another collector instead of taking care of the problem yourself
2) How did you dream up the idea that this coin is going to turn black when you have not even seen it and what is your reason?
3) NGC has seen the coin and said it is one of the finest in existance and has put up 30K to back it up, and you know more?

Please explain

-----------------------------BigE

STONE · June 15, 2007 1:12AM

I say you should keep it. It's an incredibly awesome coin and worth holding onto for as long as you want.

Don't let us all tell you what to do, it's your coin and you figure out what you want to do with it.

Wolf359 · June 15, 2007 1:37AM

I like the flip idea for a 65 proof, and get your investment++ back.

yellowjacket · June 15, 2007 2:45AM

Most of my coins have been "sleeping" for several years. The term "put to sleep" sounds so...permanent.

I thought the term used in the Manley/Kagin story was meant to be to hide the transaction and bury the bar from public knowledge.

Garrow

mgoodm3 · June 15, 2007 2:53AM

I would store it in a box in my garage.

roadrunner · June 15, 2007 12:36PM

3) NGC has seen the coin and said it is one of the finest in existance and has put up 30K to back it up, and you know more?

NGC has put up no $30K on this coin. The chances of them EVER agreeing to downgrade such a coin are miniscule. They give money back for coins that are gross mistakes in holders, not something only a point off.

What NGC really said on this day is that the coin is a 66. Next time in they could grade it a 64 or call it AT.

My real life example: NGC graded a former PCGS MS64 type coin I had as BB and MS66. As MS66 it's the finest graded (pop 1).
Yet as a PCGS MS64 in a newer holder it was one of dozens of specimens. In a Body Bag the coin's value was questionable.
OK. PCGS also BB'd the coin along with NGC. So which one of these 4 grading events defines this coin??

roadrunner

BigE · June 15, 2007 12:57PM

<< 3) NGC has seen the coin and said it is one of the finest in existance and has put up 30K to back it up, and you know more?

NGC has put up no $30K on this coin. The chances of them EVER agreeing to downgrade such a coin are miniscule. They give money back for coins that are gross mistakes in holders, not something only a point off.

What NGC really said on this day is that the coin is a 66. Next time in they could grade it a 64 or call it AT.

My real life example: NGC graded a former PCGS MS64 type coin I had as BB and MS66. As MS66 it's the finest graded (pop 1).
Yet as a PCGS MS64 in a newer holder it was one of dozens of specimens. In a Body Bag the coin's value was questionable.
OK. PCGS also BB'd the coin along with NGC. So which one of these 4 grading events defines this coin??

roadrunner >>

Sorry roadrunner, if this coin ever "turns black", they are giving me my money back, you think they are going to downgrade it a point

I will give you advance warning before you see it in person so as you won't take your Viagra before peeking-------------------BigE

tradedollarnut · June 15, 2007 1:03PM

Sorry roadrunner, if this coin ever "turns black", they are giving me my money back, you think they are going to downgrade it a point

Well, I agree that they would buy the coin back if it turns black, but there are plenty of PF66 Seated Dollars with auction records of only $15-18k. The $30k figure is a pipe dream.

Edited to add: if I was in love with the coin, I'd keep it. BigE has stated the toning doesn't look like the image ... so it could very well be 100% natural and it was just the image that was funky. If I wasn't in love with it but also wasn't inclined to sell any time soon, I'd set a price on it that I'd be happy to receive and market it slowly to full effect.

BigE · June 15, 2007 1:09PM

<< Sorry roadrunner, if this coin ever "turns black", they are giving me my money back, you think they are going to downgrade it a point

Well, I agree that they would buy the coin back if it turns black, but there are plenty of PF66 Seated Dollars with auction records of only $15-18k. The $30k figure is a pipe dream. >>

It wouldn't turn black overnight would it?. Now you experts have me scared, won't it be be worth 30K 20 years from now----------BigE

TAClough · June 15, 2007 1:12PM

<< It wouldn't turn black overnight would it?. Now you experts have me scared, won't it be be worth 30K 20 years from now----------BigE >>

Hopefully the price will go UP over the next twenty years!

tradedollarnut · June 15, 2007 1:12PM

<< 

<< Sorry roadrunner, if this coin ever "turns black", they are giving me my money back, you think they are going to downgrade it a point

Well, I agree that they would buy the coin back if it turns black, but there are plenty of PF66 Seated Dollars with auction records of only $15-18k. The $30k figure is a pipe dream. >>

It wouldn't turn black overnight would it?. Now you experts have me scared, won't it be be worth 30K 20 years from now----------BigE >>

Have a couple of dealers take a look at the coin and get their opinion. I recommend Tony Terranova and Chris Napolitano [since I know you think Laura is biased against it already]. If they think it's funky, I'd trust their opinion. If it's just the image that's funky, then you needn't worry about it turning black.

BigE · June 15, 2007 1:19PM

<< 

<< 

<< Sorry roadrunner, if this coin ever "turns black", they are giving me my money back, you think they are going to downgrade it a point

Well, I agree that they would buy the coin back if it turns black, but there are plenty of PF66 Seated Dollars with auction records of only $15-18k. The $30k figure is a pipe dream. >>

It wouldn't turn black overnight would it?. Now you experts have me scared, won't it be be worth 30K 20 years from now----------BigE >>

Have a couple of dealers take a look at the coin and get their opinion. I recommend Tony Terranova and Chris Napolitano [since I know you think Laura is biased against it already]. If they think it's funky, I'd trust their opinion. If it's just the image that's funky, then you needn't worry about it turning black. >>

I feel comfortable having a black coin in the family 20 years from now, who knows, it might even be market acceptable in Oregon by then------------------------------BigE

MidLifeCrisis · June 15, 2007 1:56PM

<< I would sell it, buy a nice proof-65 and use the difference to buy something else cool, like a Chain cent, High Relief Saint, early gold, etc. >>

I agree...take advantage of the favorable grade and cash in. Then use the proceeds to add to your collection.

Russ · June 16, 2007 3:10AM

Many who have commented in this thread are overlooking the fact that the coin does not look like the images presented by Stack's. From what BigE has described, I'd bet that it won't be turning black. Probably won't change at all over the years.

Russ, NCNE

BECOKA · June 16, 2007 3:33AM

Have to agree with Russ on this one.

It also has to be restated that almost no one here has seen this coin in person. It may actually be a decent coin.

BAJJERFAN · June 16, 2007 3:42AM

<< Many who have commented in this thread are overlooking the fact that the coin does not look like the images presented by Stack's. From what BigE has described, I'd bet that it won't be turning black. Probably won't change at all over the years. >>

Yet another example of the BIG auction houses doing the seller/owner/consignor/themselves a disservice with their horsechit pics that they put out.

fc · June 16, 2007 3:45AM

yawn.

Bear · June 16, 2007 5:58AM

I would stick the coin under my pile of donuts.

Haven't you ever heard of, "Sugar Cured?". At least,

it works for ham.

ANACONDA · June 16, 2007 6:13AM

Sell it. You can take the money and put it to work for you. 12 transactions in a year netting you 5% on each transaction nets you quite a bit of money relative to the value of setting a coin aside.

roadrunner · June 16, 2007 11:44PM

Geez, how did my name get tossed into the "coin turning black" reasoning. I never said it and probably don't agree with it for that matter. And yes, if NGC buys back something they will likely downgrade it. I had an NGC MS66 seated half downgraded to MS65 (it realized MS64 money when last auctioned since that's what it really was).

What I do agree with is that the coin is probably maxed out in its current holder. It won't likely be worth $30,000 10 years from now as the coin market will probably be in a sharp downturn by then.
I doubt it will ever be worth less than what BigE paid though. There would be any number of major buyers who would buy the coin for $15K sight-unseen just based on the Stacks' photo. And let's not kid ourselves. If this coin were in any major dealer's inventory, it would be hyped and it would be offered for beaucoup bucks.

By the way, there are lots of deeply toned (blue-purple) seated proofs out there that are not going to be downgraded by NGC if returned. Those coins were perfectly acceptable in the past. Just because there is a faction of the hobby that is pro-dipped doesn't mean that deep orig toned coins can't be gems. NGC is not gonna back down on toning just because newer hobbyists/investors tend towards conserved DCAM coins.

roadrunner

Longacre · October 28, 2009 10:35PM

I don't know what made me think of this thread this morning, but now that it has been two years since BigE's Obscene Profit, does anyone know if he immediately converted the coin to cash, or did he put the coin to sleep and is now shopping it around?

PS. Looking through this thread, there are some pretty notorious characters who responded the first time.

RYK · October 28, 2009 11:25PM

Someone else recently made reference to this coin and suggested that it might now be residing in a lower grade holder. I do not know if this is fact or fiction.

Coin Finder · October 28, 2009 11:51PM

I missed the whole thing, but if BigE got a great coin at auction and can make money later good for him. He had is roof blow off his house a few years ago, this is the universe paying back!

notwilight · October 28, 2009 11:51PM

anybody got a link?

kryptonitecomics · October 28, 2009 11:56PM

I have no idea what coin we are talking about but I am curious as heck to know

RYK · October 28, 2009 11:59PM

This is a link to a thread about the thread, but I am still looking for the original.

partagas · October 29, 2009 12:04AM

This is from memory. The coin was a seated dollar bought out of stacks for around 9k. BigE submitted it and it graded 65! Huge score for him. It was one of the best of all time on these boards.

RYK · October 29, 2009 12:06AM

<< This is from memory. The coin was a seated dollar bought out of stacks for around 9k. BigE submitted it and it graded 65! Huge score for him. It was one of the best of all time on these boards. >>

Actually, it slabbed at proof 66 at NGC, after quite a few more experienced people with thought it was likely a no-grade.

partagas · October 29, 2009 12:07AM

Here is the coin. link

partagas · October 29, 2009 12:15AM

Actually, it slabbed at proof 66 at NGC, after quite a few more experienced people with thought it was likely a no-grade.

Yes you are correct about the grade. But he put up with alot of crap from people about the coin. And he had the last laugh.

Goldbully · January 4, 2012 9:22AM

A nice Longacre thread with Eric as the Thread topic.

Frankiefanatic · January 4, 2012 10:39AM

<< A nice Longacre thread with Eric as the Thread topic.

>>

Why on earth would you bring this to light?

Is there an unfailing event in your life that tells you to indulge into the demise of those that had fun doing what they enjoyed?

GB- you be a sick individual..

19Lyds · January 4, 2012 10:42AM

<< 

<< A nice Longacre thread with Eric as the Thread topic.

>>

Why on earth would you bring this to light?

Is there an unfailing event in your life that tells you to indulge into the demise of those that had fun doing what they enjoyed?

GB- you be a sick individual.. >>

I'm inclined to agree as I see absolutely no point in resurrecting this thread. Especially given the title!

Should BigE "put his coin to sleep" for a year or two, or sell it at the first opportunity

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Should BigE &quot;put his coin to sleep&quot; for a year or two, or sell it at the first opportunity

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Should BigE "put his coin to sleep" for a year or two, or sell it at the first opportunity