The 1807 Capped Bust Half almost 200 years old, I'm getting this in just in case????
stman
Posts: 11,352 ✭✭✭✭✭
Hi folks, hope I didn’t get carried away here, but this is my year. I’m not a good writer, and besides the number statistics and referring to an Author of a book, what I’ve put here is just from memory. Also, when I mention how I attribute the varieties, there are other diagnostics, but I like to keep things rather simple.
The 1807 Capped Bust Half was the first year of the Capped Bust Half series. Also the first of a two year sub-type. There were only four die-pairings for this year.
Published mintages say around 750,500. In Bust Half Fever 2nd edition, Edgar Souders states by estimate it is more like 375, 250 (about half of the published numbers).
Furthermore, he mentions approximate survivors (all varieties) might be 2,000 with the majority being the “50 over inverted 5” variety.
This year is by far my favorite to collect and much tougher to grade, and to find in any kind of attractive and problem free condition. Known for their weak strikes, sometimes just a bit of wear can make them appear more worn then they actually are. I personally feel this first sub-type (1807-1808) should be a separate type by themselves. They look much different then the rest of the series IMO.
I’m going to show two examples of each die-pairing. And some of my opinions and my research on the four varieties. Opinions that have been my experiences, from ones I own, ones I’ve seen, and seen available. Here is the order I believe they were struck in sequence.
First struck for this year was the Small Stars O-113. I find these to usually be very weakly struck. In fact the weakest for the 1807, but nicer struck ones do come available once in a while. Easily attributed with the stars a bit smaller than the rest struck for the year. The stars are actually set further in, and away from the rim as well. Also, the left bottom serif of the “1” in the date will be missing. These are actually thought to be struck on an over-sized planchet.
Here is the O-113
And here is the O-113a, which has the die-cracks, although my small image some are a bit hard to see..
Next up is the Large stars O-114. I find these to be the very best struck up with the stars and eagles left wing facing to be very nicely struck. Although Liberty’s hair going down the center is usually mushy.
Easily attributed with a couple die-lumps under the “7” of the date. Another one at star eleven close to the rim. If I were just looking for a type coin this is the variety I would seek. They cost more, but even in lower grade they can be found once in a while and are struck nicely.
The nicest struck one I own and have seen…..
Nice strike, but you can see the central hair kind of mushy that I mentioned……
Next is the Large stars 50/inverted 5 O-111. Usually these are better known for the chin to chest die-break, the “Bearded Goddess.” I’ve not seen a prime yet without the break. This also has the 50/inverted 5 reverse and is written that you can see it more clearly on this variety. It also can be attributed with the bottom left serif of the “1” in the date missing, or nearly so.
This is a very early state with the “beard” very light, but can be seen with the naked eye…
And a later state to show the progression somewhat. The break actually goes through the eye very good, and very faint to the headband, and down Liberty. Although my image doesn‘t capture it good……
Next and last of the four die-pairings for the 1807 is the Large stars 50/inverted 5 O-112. This is the more “common” one and this is the variety that will usually be seen available. Still very tough to find attractive and well struck.
A very tough to find nice colorful one….
And a well circulated thick crusty one. Also tough to find and as original as they come IMO.
The 1807 Capped Bust Half was the first year of the Capped Bust Half series. Also the first of a two year sub-type. There were only four die-pairings for this year.
Published mintages say around 750,500. In Bust Half Fever 2nd edition, Edgar Souders states by estimate it is more like 375, 250 (about half of the published numbers).
Furthermore, he mentions approximate survivors (all varieties) might be 2,000 with the majority being the “50 over inverted 5” variety.
This year is by far my favorite to collect and much tougher to grade, and to find in any kind of attractive and problem free condition. Known for their weak strikes, sometimes just a bit of wear can make them appear more worn then they actually are. I personally feel this first sub-type (1807-1808) should be a separate type by themselves. They look much different then the rest of the series IMO.
I’m going to show two examples of each die-pairing. And some of my opinions and my research on the four varieties. Opinions that have been my experiences, from ones I own, ones I’ve seen, and seen available. Here is the order I believe they were struck in sequence.
First struck for this year was the Small Stars O-113. I find these to usually be very weakly struck. In fact the weakest for the 1807, but nicer struck ones do come available once in a while. Easily attributed with the stars a bit smaller than the rest struck for the year. The stars are actually set further in, and away from the rim as well. Also, the left bottom serif of the “1” in the date will be missing. These are actually thought to be struck on an over-sized planchet.
Here is the O-113
And here is the O-113a, which has the die-cracks, although my small image some are a bit hard to see..
Next up is the Large stars O-114. I find these to be the very best struck up with the stars and eagles left wing facing to be very nicely struck. Although Liberty’s hair going down the center is usually mushy.
Easily attributed with a couple die-lumps under the “7” of the date. Another one at star eleven close to the rim. If I were just looking for a type coin this is the variety I would seek. They cost more, but even in lower grade they can be found once in a while and are struck nicely.
The nicest struck one I own and have seen…..
Nice strike, but you can see the central hair kind of mushy that I mentioned……
Next is the Large stars 50/inverted 5 O-111. Usually these are better known for the chin to chest die-break, the “Bearded Goddess.” I’ve not seen a prime yet without the break. This also has the 50/inverted 5 reverse and is written that you can see it more clearly on this variety. It also can be attributed with the bottom left serif of the “1” in the date missing, or nearly so.
This is a very early state with the “beard” very light, but can be seen with the naked eye…
And a later state to show the progression somewhat. The break actually goes through the eye very good, and very faint to the headband, and down Liberty. Although my image doesn‘t capture it good……
Next and last of the four die-pairings for the 1807 is the Large stars 50/inverted 5 O-112. This is the more “common” one and this is the variety that will usually be seen available. Still very tough to find attractive and well struck.
A very tough to find nice colorful one….
And a well circulated thick crusty one. Also tough to find and as original as they come IMO.
Please... Save The Stories, Just Answer My Questions, And Tell Me How Much!!!!!
2
Comments
The bicentennial approaches...
102 capped bust half dollars - 100 die marriages
BHNC #198
I wish I could add to it.
I am going to print it off and save it.
Bill
That was a great post. Most of the things in there I had never know before.
Beautiful "parade" of 1807 halves. Wow. Nice thread!
It's great to see the passion come through.
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myurl
800-596-COIN
<< <i>
Next is the Large stars 50/inverted 5 O-111. Usually these are better known for the chin to chest die-break, the “Bearded Goddess.” I’ve not seen a prime yet without the break. This also has the 50/inverted 5 reverse and is written that you can see it more clearly on this variety. It also can be attributed with the bottom left serif of the “1” in the date missing, or nearly so.
>>
Here is one I cherried from a Heritage auction (unattributed) back in 1987, these pictures were taken by Sheridan Downey in 1988. He asked me to send it to him since he had never seen a prime either. Also included is the auction description when I consigned it to one of his auctions in 1992, I believe it was auctioned again by him in the last few years where it realized around 10k.
Capped Bust Half Series
Capped Bust Half Dime Series
I want to get a decent VF or so 1807 Capped but half one of these days for my transition year type set (so far I only have a cleaned example). Now I know why it's so hard to find one that isn't the 50/50 variety.
Obscurum per obscurius
I thought a while back I had a chance at one, the image was poor, I could see the right diagnostics, or so I thought...... but after studying the image I could make out the left bottom serif of the "1" in the date was indeed there. Of course I didn't want to ask the owner that was auctioning it any questions.
An authorized PCGS dealer, and a contributor to the Red Book.
Lucky, lucky, lucky. Thanks for sharing! Wow.
102 capped bust half dollars - 100 die marriages
BHNC #198
it's old too.......
well
Here is another Small Star 07
Here is a Large Star 50/Inverted 5
<< <i>Hey stman----when the heck did you slip in this 07 thread.......... >>
Ummm, perhaps you might look at the date of the thread?
<< <i>But but but---it's out of order ?????????????????
Here is a Large Star 50/Inverted 5
I never have liked following "Rules." Hey, that's a nice one........ somebody let you steal that one.
Well that is still one heck of an impressive show there stman...
and that prime O-111 is a treasure for sure.
Hey--here is my holey 07
Some diagnostics for 50/inverted 5 1807 O-112 R1:
Obverse: Star 1 points between dentils. Widest date of 1807 CBHs, and a “0” that looks too large.
Reverse: There is a centering dot in the field, not attached to the eagle’s left shoulder. A die dot shows in field below lowest arrowhead. Arrowheads are ribbed, and recut. “I” is under the crossbar of “T” at right end. (Reverse is LDS of O-111.)
Note: The Overton fourth edition lists an O-112a with a cud at top of “U”. This cud has NOT been shown to exist.
My scanner shows detail nicely, but luster simply will not show.
Thanks for the nice comment. I bought the coin eight years ago.
Some diagnostics for Small Star 1807 O-113a R3: (Marriage R2)
Obverse: Star 1 points to upper edge of dentil. Noticeably smaller stars, than on other 1807 varieties, are distant from dentils. Left base serif of “1” is missing. “7” is farthest left under the curl when compared with other 1807 marriages. On this LDS, a crack shows from near end of bust, through all left stars, and ends at front of cap. Another crack from milling goes through “0”, and extends up to drapery.
Reverse: Letters in scroll have cross lines through them. “50” and “C” spacing is much wider than in other 1807 marriages. A centering dot protrudes from the left shoulder, showing as a lumpy shoulder. This LDS shows a crack from “50” to olive leaves, top of “UNITED STA”, down through “TE”, below “S”, and to scroll. Another crack shows at top of “S OF AMER”. Left side of “I” is under right side of “T”.
My OmniCoin Collection
My BankNoteBank Collection
Tom, formerly in Albuquerque, NM.
<< <i>Nice coins there. Did anyone here "HELP" you acquire any of those? Just curious. >>
If you're talking to me. Just good ol' fashion work helped me acquire these. One board member collector offered me one. He named his price, I paid his price. Some of the others when they came available I might have had to sell off something else to help pay for them, work a couple extra jobs etc. When I was younger I never would have been able to acquire such coins. But didn't give up and yes, that someday came.
Signed...... worked two jobs MOST of my life.
<< <i>Nice coins there. Did anyone here "HELP" you aquire any of those? Just curious. >>
Not properly potty trained while growing up.
<< <i>Nice coins there. Did anyone here "HELP" you aquire any of those? Just curious. >>
johngerman,
Welcome to our Capped Bust Half Dollar series. You are contributor number 95.
Most of us old-time collectors had LOTS of help collecting Busties. It goes with collecting the Bust series. I have collected Busties for over thirty years, and met some great CBH collectors. Sadly, a number of them are no longer with us.
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Auldfartte and JRocco,
Thanks for your comments on my O-112.
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AU58WALKERS,
Your 1807 Small Star looks nice to me, even with the nasal drip. My specimen is a much weaker strike, but with strong luster.
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SHOW YOUR BUST HALF DOLLARS IN ALL YEAR THREADS
<< <i>
<< <i>Nice coins there. Did anyone here "HELP" you acquire any of those? Just curious. >>
If you're talking to me. Just good ol' fashion work helped me acquire these. One board member collector offered me one. He named his price, I paid his price. Some of the others when they came available I might have had to sell off something else to help pay for them, work a couple extra jobs etc. When I was younger I never would have been able to acquire such coins. But didn't give up and yes, that someday came.
Signed...... worked two jobs MOST of my life.
Oh Bull....I heard you traded up for all of them starting with a single toothpick.
Some diagnostics for 50/inverted 5 1807 O-112 R1:
Obverse: Star 1 points between dentils. Widest date of 1807 CBHs, and a “0” that looks too large.
Reverse: There is a centering dot in the field, not attached to the eagle’s left shoulder. A die dot shows in field below lowest arrowhead. Arrowheads are ribbed, and recut. “I” is under the crossbar of “T” at right end. (Reverse is LDS of O-111.)
Note: The Overton fourth edition lists an O-112a with a cud at top of “U”. This cud has NOT been shown to exist.
Bearded Goddess marriage die states
Some diagnostics for 50/inverted 5 1807 O-112 R1:
Obverse: Star 1 points between dentils. Widest date of 1807 CBHs, and a “0” that looks too large.
Reverse: There is a centering dot in the field, not attached to the eagle’s left shoulder. A die dot shows in field below lowest arrowhead. Arrowheads are ribbed, and recut. “I” is under the crossbar of “T” at right end. (Reverse is LDS of O-111.)
I am so jealous of your new purchase. That is a gorgeous 1807 Capped Bust Half goldie.
- Jim
Some diagnostics for Large Star 1807 O-114 R3:
Obverse: Star 1 points between dentils. Die defect lumps show under 7, and between star 11 and dentils. Liberty has cross lines in the bottom of letters, and B is unfinished at top.
Reverse: There is a tiny centering dot in the field, attached to the eagle’s left shoulder. 50 has small slender figures. The two lower arrowheads are firmly joined. I is centered below TE.