how do you price a true slider au58 that is an ms62/63 with lustre and slight highponit rub??

michael · August 22, 2006 11:54PM

Cnitas · August 22, 2006 11:59PM

Price it at MS65 money and let the customer talk you down to 64 money.

BillJones · August 23, 2006 12:00AM

I'll pay MS-60 - ish money for somewhat hard to find coins. I'll pay a lot more than that if I really like the coin, and it's really hard to find BUT NOT MS-63 money.

partagas · August 23, 2006 12:33AM

When buying coins (not widgets). Grade has nothing to do with past prices for inferior coins. This is someone elses line, but no truer words have even been spoken.

"Great coins aren't cheap, and cheap coins aren't great!" (This is bestclser1 qoute)

You can find superior examples in a lesser grades. I will always pony up for the better coin. So I say price it at 63 money, and I bet someone will pay it. Assuming it is really a great coin.

ziggy29 · August 23, 2006 12:35AM

Well, if it's a 62/63 with slight rub, I'd say 62 money would be the absolute ceiling. It depends on the series. You can get closer to 62 money for a coin whose price progression from 58 to 62 isn't steep than for, say, an 1884-S or 1896-O Morgan. You would be hard-pressed to get even MS-60 money for the latter examples. A premium over "AU-58 money," yes, but almost certainly not MS money.

segoja · August 23, 2006 1:02AM

What coin is it?

It really depends on the price of the higher grades.

Many AU Morgans exist of rarer dates "O" mints, which have super high prices in BU. The sliders, no matter how nice, will never bring over 60 money.

In other cases where the price doesn't move much, you may get over 60 money as many super sliders look better than MS63 coins.

Coinhog · August 23, 2006 1:26AM

you price it at what the market will bear. I love nice Au-58's, but if it is a true AU-58 with legitimate wear, no matter how slight, it is still a "used" coin. It may command a premium but it is not mint state. A knowlegable buyer that is looking for a nice example will look for a nice Au-58 and want to pay a premium over Au-58 money. A knowlegable buyer looking for an MS coin will look for a nice example of MS63 and will pay a premium of MS63 money for the nice example.

Leiana · August 23, 2006 1:27AM

If it's an AU 58, it's an AU 58.

-Amanda

ziggy29 · August 23, 2006 1:34AM

<< If it's an AU 58, it's an AU 58. >>

MikeInFL · August 23, 2006 1:36AM

Price the coin, not the holder. If it's all there, 62/63 money. If it's not, less...Mike

tradedollarnut · August 23, 2006 1:38AM

This is where the Sheldon scale breaks down. A gem coin with a hint of rub shouldn't be AU58... it should be AU63. To artificially limit a coin with rub to 58 [and thus less than a beat to death 60] is silly.

A gem AU coin can and will command MS money. Here's an example:

This PCGC AU58 blew away the NGC MS61 in the same sale ... and realized almost 30% more!

ziggy29 · August 23, 2006 1:46AM

<< This is where the Sheldon scale breaks down. A gem coin with a hint of rub shouldn't be AU58... it should be AU63. To artificially limit a coin with rub to 58 [and thus less than a beat to death 60] is silly. >>

Agreed completely. I'm not comfortable with "market grading" AU coins as mint state, but unfortunately the Sheldon scale (which originally tried to convey relative worth in the numbers) always forces coins graded technically AU to be "valued" lower than even the doggiest MS coin. Hence TPGs regularly putting supersliders into MS-62 and occasionally even MS-63 holders.

The only changes I'd support for the Sheldon scale is the addition of AU-61, AU-62 and AU-63 grades so we can both (a) more accurately convey market value in the numeric grade and (b) avoid calling AU coins mint state.

CoinRaritiesOnline · August 23, 2006 1:50AM

<< 

<< The only changes I'd support for the Sheldon scale is the addition of AU-61, AU-62 and AU-63 grades so we can both (a) more accurately convey market value in the numeric grade and (b) avoid calling AU coins mint state. >>

That is what we have been doing internally at our company for some time.

"How nice is that coin? REALLY nice -- I'd call it AU-63!"

Everyone seems to know exactly what we are talking about.

Fletcher · August 23, 2006 2:15AM

I have been paying 60 money for such coins and then cracking them out for the Dansco 7070. But they have to be the right 58s with great eye appeal.

rays · August 23, 2006 5:10AM

Since auctions are where a coin's true value will theoretically be realized, take a look at "MS63 coins with nice lustre and a tiny bit of rub", and see what they sell for, whether raw or slabbed. Doesn't matter. I have personally paid MS63 money for both raw and slabbed coins with a tiny bit of rub but were otherwise choice, and so have many others.

roadrunner · August 23, 2006 1:06PM

I've rarely seen an MS64 bust half with no rub. I'd say 75% of them have light high point rub. So if you can an AU58 a true slider, then to me it has full field luster with a hint of rub. And in that case it could grade as high as MS65 imo. All depends on the coin. The typical difference in a real AU58 and a MS64 with rub is the quality of the field luster and how chattered it is.

TDN, that 1794 half has the look of a 62/63. I would suppose
it will end up in either a PCGS 61 holder or a "something higher NGC" holder. Very obvious rub in some spots but other than that,
pretty darn nice. Here's a case where an AU coins "looks" mint state, while most graded MS coins "look AU."

roadrunner

D · August 23, 2006 1:19PM

<< 

<< If it's an AU 58, it's an AU 58. >>

>>

That one isn't fair!

That said.. I've spent MS money for an AU coin that I really liked before.

-Daniel

Elcontador · August 23, 2006 1:20PM

TDN, I'd never be able to afford that coin, but with that huge fingerprint, I wouldn't want it in my collection anyway. However, there are plenty of others who don't think like I do. An AU is an AU, and for a nice AU coin, I'll pay a premium. However, if it's not Unc., I won't pay Unc. money for it.

A coin like that one will eventually be slabbed as MS 62; it might go 3 because it's an open collar coin and many people don't care about the grade of these coins if they have attractive eye appeal. You see this sort of thing all of the time re Capped Bust Halves.

AU58WALKERS · August 23, 2006 1:26PM

I have paid ms money on many occasions in the past and present, I will continue to for the right coin.

AU63/64 is my most favorite grade.

over half of my walkers are au63/64.

most of my bust halves are au63.

lava · August 23, 2006 1:40PM

I agree with TDN. A lot depends on the coin. If it is primo, throw out the au values, as the market will pay more. How much more? A good old fashioned auction will tell you - no shortage of those.

TwoSides2aCoin · August 23, 2006 1:42PM

Michael, it depends on if I am buying or selling

Frankcoins · August 23, 2006 2:11PM

Most will pay more for a beautiful slider than for a banged up MS60, hence
the "market grading" of such coins as MS62 in many series, particularly capped bust
coins.

gyocomgd · August 23, 2006 2:30PM

<< If it's an AU 58, it's an AU 58.
-Amanda >>

Ahem.

Leiana · August 23, 2006 2:34PM

<< 

<< If it's an AU 58, it's an AU 58.
-Amanda >>

Ahem.

>>

Why is this so funny?

-Amanda

gyocomgd · August 23, 2006 2:41PM

<< 

<< 

<< If it's an AU 58, it's an AU 58.
-Amanda >>

Ahem.

>>

Why is this so funny?

-Amanda >>

It gets pretty subjective whether wear is from circulation or from stacking/cabinet friction--sliding around in a drawer for years, something like that. There also is market grading--a coin with obvious bits of wear on the high points that still is so nice in other respects that it pulls MS60-62. It happens often. Do a search for "market grading," there's been some excellent discussions on it.

Leiana · August 23, 2006 2:50PM

<< It gets pretty subjective whether wear is from circulation or from stacking/cabinet friction--sliding around in a drawer for years, something like that. There also is market grading--a coin with obvious bits of wear on the high points that still is so nice in other respects that it pulls MS60-62. It happens often. Do a search for "market grading," there's been some excellent discussions on it. >>

Oh yes. I have read about "market grading" in one of my books. And I disagree with it in some respects. My understanding is that a piece that saw hand to hand circulation has darker lustre breaks and more obvious wear. A piece with cabinet friction (which I have just found out what that really means) or slide marks from an album can grade MS if any marks are not too noticeable. This wear may be less obvious, but it is still there in my opinion.

-Amanda

michael · October 3, 2006 4:34PM

how do you price a true slider au58 that is an ms62/63 with lustre and slight highponit rub??

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