I never knew this-- why do some/many dealers NOT like this forum?

Longacre · December 13, 2005 7:25AM

In another thread, a forum member wrote a comment that a lot of dealers do not like this forum (and indicated that it is probably not a good thing to display your membership on these boards at a large show).

Does anyone agree with this statement? I did not know this, if it is true. I am all for the Power of the People. With some exceptions (justified or not), I think most dealers get a pretty fair shake here. If they don't, it is usually deserved (if you can believe what is written; maybe therein lies the problem). What do you think?

Russ · December 13, 2005 7:26AM

Knowlegeable collectors scare them.

Russ, NCNE

dthigpen · December 13, 2005 7:27AM

Simply Put:

People like me.

Cladiator · December 13, 2005 7:29AM

They can't pull off a big score of a sale to someone that knows what they're doing and this forum produces many collectors that know what they're doing.

Flip side...the forum also produces collectors that know what they're doing and can cherrypick dealers and I'm sure that's got to bother them.

coppercoins · December 13, 2005 7:31AM

I posted my thoughts on the other thread, but will do so here...

I, for one, don't give a rat's derrier if a dealer looks at me out of the corner of their eye because I proudly display that I post here. I believe this forum gives all the honest dealers an advantage, because we educate collectors about coins, help generate interest in the hobby, and give the good dealers a thumbs-up by posting our finds and telling people who we bought them from.

My personal opinion is that if a dealer finds our membership here repulsive enough to affect how they treat us in a deal, they probably aren't worth dealing with in the first place. Most likely they would treat us like that because they have been outed here for doing bad deals, and, well, who wants to deal with a bad dealer anyway?

I'm happy to share what I know with others here, and I enjoy learning from the experience of others here as well. I think this is a very healthy community with a lot of good folks. If a dealer doesn't like that they can kiss my un-sunny side.

relayer · December 13, 2005 7:31AM

Rick Tomaska showed up once and got beaten up over a deal that went down a few years back.

It doesn't scare Laura away though

CalGold · December 13, 2005 7:32AM

<< My personal opinion is that if a dealer finds our membership here repulsive enough to affect how they treat us in a deal, they probably aren't worth dealing with in the first place >>

What about dealers who find us repulsive for other reasons?

CG

tradedollarnut · December 13, 2005 7:35AM

Hmmmm:

1) Because a lot of the members here [myself included] don't know half as much as we sometimes think we do.

2) Because the forum lends itself to a hang em first, ask questions later mentality

3) Because in the real world things work differently than in a chatroom

4) Because the truth is usually between two viewpoints and rarely at either extreme - yet we blather on and on about the extremes

lloydmincy · December 13, 2005 7:36AM

I think it is the negativity, and they don't need these boards anyway. Laura usually shows up here because she is bored, except for her wannabe posts.

ibzman350 · December 13, 2005 7:36AM

<< Knowlegeable collectors scare them.

Russ, NCNE >>

yea , but only the low life dealers, I would think.

Herb

TheNumish · December 13, 2005 7:50AM

I think you guys are reading too much into it. Whatever you do for a living do you really want to do it all day and then go home and talk about it on a message board? I think at the end of the day most dealers just want to do anything but talk about coins. Most dealers I know don't really have an opinion about the boards one way or the other.

BigE · December 13, 2005 7:57AM

There are too many cheapskates and bargain-hunting-cherrypickers here. To me its not that dealers don't like us its just more simple and profitable to sell stuff elsewhere

---------------------------BigE

mgoodm3 · December 13, 2005 7:58AM

Hell, most of the dealers that I work with are fairly regular posters around here anyway.

JJM · December 13, 2005 7:59AM

I think coppercoins nailed it right on the head

DUIGUY · December 13, 2005 8:01AM

<< They can't pull off a big score of a sale to someone that knows what they're doing and this forum produces many collectors that know what they're doing.

Flip side...the forum also produces collectors that know what they're doing and can cherrypick dealers and I'm sure that's got to bother them. >>

coynclecter · December 13, 2005 8:02AM

I agree with TDN. Often too much hostility, juvenile attitudes , unprofessional conduct and as is usual on forums, a total lack of good manners.

Many posters are quick to argue, insult, and let thier hostilities out in a chatroom. They usually show more manners in person or people just walk away from them.

gyocomgd · December 13, 2005 8:02AM

If it's true that many dealers dislike the fact that collectors learn a great deal here, then there's irony in that because a lot of dealers belong here as well. The bottom line is that the best numismatists can learn something here almost daily.

PerryHall · December 13, 2005 8:06AM

I don't think most dealers care one way or the other about this forum. Several dealers post here and seem to enjoy doing so. Most dealers are probably too busy to post here.

DennisH · December 13, 2005 8:12AM

As with most things in life, there is no one-size-fits-all answer to this enormously broad question. IMO, however, a blend of the comments made thus far make a good stab at capsulizing it.

michael · December 13, 2005 8:49AM

promoter's/sellers of extremely available a couple of dollar common coins that go into ga-ga grade holders

lends a stink that makes everyone smell

LucyBop · December 13, 2005 8:50AM

<< promoter's/sellers of extremely available a couple of dollar common coins that go into ga-ga grade holders

lends a stink that makes everyone smell >>

the HepKitty doesn't smell.....

WaterSport · December 13, 2005 8:53AM

C'mon Chuck: Tell us what is really on your mind! LOL

WS

my3cents · December 13, 2005 8:54AM

because we are all know it alls

au58 · December 13, 2005 9:00AM

Knowledge is power. A reputable dealer will agree with this. There is no need to concern yourself with dealers who do not like this forum. As Sy Syms would say, an educated consumer is our best customer.

2bucks · December 13, 2005 9:00AM

They're scared.

They have something to hide.

Knowledge is power and the more you know the less they can manipulate you, period.

BECOKA · December 13, 2005 9:08AM

Most dealers I know don't care. They are all for the education of the collector for the bettering of Numismatics. i.e. most dealers are in the business because at their heart they are just collectors too. Its some of the greedy ones in for a large profit that make life misserable.

FatMan · December 13, 2005 9:16AM

Wow, my comment has really taken on a life of its own. I think TDN's post pretty well sums up why some dealers may not welcome forum members with open arms. There are some great posters on this forum. There are also those that consistently portray dealers as crooks and thieves. Many dealers simply want to keep at arms length from anyone they do not know well who posts on the forum in fear of having their name mentioned, good or bad. Even a positive post can go bad very quickly around here.

Now, I'm not against anyone wearing a CU badge. And CD is being very gracious in making them available to everyone. I am simply giving a warning, especially to new members, that you may get some strange looks and surprising comments from dealers.

BigD5 · December 13, 2005 9:40AM

TDN sort of hit everything on the head with his comments, for me anyway, concerning dealers that actually pop in here.

I think most dealers could care less about this forum, nothing more.

This little "cyberworld" of posters doesn't effect the majority of the dealers and doesn't play into how they conduct business on a day to day basis so I'm not sure if it's a case of them liking or not liking the forum, but more of a case of them not giving a flying hoot about what goes on here. For the most part.

2bucks · December 13, 2005 9:52AM

<< I think most dealers could care less about this forum, nothing more. >>

I would tend to disagree with this statement. I think they watch and listen very closely. If they don't, they are behind the curve.

Russ · December 13, 2005 10:05AM

<< promoter's/sellers of extremely available a couple of dollar common coins that go into ga-ga grade holders

lends a stink that makes everyone smell >>

Russ, NCNE

BigD5 · December 13, 2005 10:12AM

<< 

<< I think most dealers could care less about this forum, nothing more. >>

I would tend to disagree with this statement. I think they watch and listen very closely. If they don't, they are behind the curve. >>

Which curve?

90% of dealers at any given show don't even know this place exists.

Think about the handful of dealers that post here, and picture a major bourse floor. It's a miniscule percentage of dealers that stop by here.

Bear · December 13, 2005 10:13AM

Dealers show up here that:

1. Treat their clients fairly.

2. Have honest merchandise for sale.

3. Have something worthwhile to say.

4. Care about the hobby and the profession.

5. Have a reasonably thick skin.

We are an equal opportunity Form. We jump on xollectors and dealers alike.

Coxe · December 13, 2005 10:26AM

<< Knowlegeable collectors scare them. >>

Depends on the dealer. The really secure ones with a genuine interest in coin collecting often love the knowledgeable collector as a welcomed reassurance of the state of the hobby after dealing with the redbook crowd.

The others don't matter. Sure, they might recognize your nickname from the forum. They will know you (as knowledgeable) anyway in a minute when you start looking at their coins. I know that "Oh Geez" look quite well that I get when I quick flip through stacks of slabs almost robotically louping the PUPs on both sides, dismissing the comon ones and doing an arm's length grade eval on the good VAMs.

cladking · December 13, 2005 10:26AM

<< promoter's/sellers of extremely available a couple of dollar common coins that go into ga-ga grade holders

lends a stink that makes everyone smell >>

Michael;

Unless you define ga-ga grade as something like a Fine indian there are no $2 ga-ga grade coins.

2bucks · December 13, 2005 10:31AM

<< 

<< 

<< I think most dealers could care less about this forum, nothing more. >>

I would tend to disagree with this statement. I think they watch and listen very closely. If they don't, they are behind the curve. >>

Which curve?

90% of dealers at any given show don't even know this place exists.

Think about the handful of dealers that post here, and picture a major bourse floor. It's a miniscule percentage of dealers that stop by here. >>

Maybe I'm the one, but with my observations over the past few years I think you're naive.

Russ · December 13, 2005 10:38AM

<< 90% of dealers at any given show don't even know this place exists.

Think about the handful of dealers that post here, and picture a major bourse floor. It's a miniscule percentage of dealers that stop by here. >>

Maybe I'm the one, but with my observations over the past few years I think you're naive. >>

No, he's correct. The major dealers, (like the ones who setup at shows like Fun), know about these forums, but they are just a tiny minority of the many thousands of dealers across the country. The average local show dealer may, at best, be vaguely aware this place exists.

Russ, NCNE

WTCG · December 13, 2005 10:53AM

<< Hmmmm:

1) Because a lot of the members here [myself included] don't know half as much as we sometimes think we do.

2) Because the forum lends itself to a hang em first, ask questions later mentality

3) Because in the real world things work differently than in a chatroom

4) Because the truth is usually between two viewpoints and rarely at either extreme - yet we blather on and on about the extremes >>

I think TDN stole the words out of my mind. Many dealers hate being flamed by the know-it-all types often found on the internet. Also many coin dealers have a life outside of coins, although it may not seem like it to observers.

DHeath · December 13, 2005 10:54AM

I think Jay has it right. If you talk to customers all day, you probably don't want to spend much spare time doing the same. I expect lots of folks read the boards to stay current, but don't think they'd benefit much from posting.

2bucks · December 13, 2005 11:02AM

<< I think Jay has it right. If you talk to customers all day, you probably don't want to spend much spare time doing the same. I expect lots of folks read the boards to stay current, but don't think they'd benefit much from posting. >>

You stole the words out of my mind

coinguy1 · December 13, 2005 11:04AM

Here is my lengthy analysis.....

I think most dealers don't post here due to a combination of lack of time, interest and incentive.

2bucks · December 13, 2005 11:07AM

.

majorbigtime · December 13, 2005 11:30AM

Ask Jack Beymer how he feels after being ANALyzed on these boards!

poptopsRus · December 13, 2005 11:34AM

Another consideration, not all dealers know how to use a computer.

Myqqy · December 13, 2005 11:47AM

ANALyzed

Lakesammman · December 13, 2005 11:52AM

I know why.

Would you want to spend your free time discussing your profession after work or dispensing professional advice for free??

It surprises me how much dealer participation there IS here.

EVillageProwler · December 13, 2005 11:55AM

It surprises me how much dealer participation there IS here.

Me too. After my brief stint across the table, I've become mostly indifferent to coins...

Russ · December 13, 2005 11:57AM

<< Another consideration, not all dealers know how to use a computer. >>

That's a good point. A couple of my local dealers don't even own one.

Russ, NCNE

RGL · December 13, 2005 12:00PM

Thumbs up to Copper's post ... as to Mark's comment on incentive, incentive = $$$$

Ronyahski · December 13, 2005 12:40PM

<< Wow, my comment has really taken on a life of its own. I think TDN's post pretty well sums up why some dealers may not welcome forum members with open arms. There are some great posters on this forum. There are also those that consistently portray dealers as crooks and thieves. Many dealers simply want to keep at arms length from anyone they do not know well who posts on the forum in fear of having their name mentioned, good or bad. Even a positive post can go bad very quickly around here.

Now, I'm not against anyone wearing a CU badge. And CD is being very gracious in making them available to everyone. I am simply giving a warning, especially to new members, that you may get some strange looks and surprising comments from dealers. >>

This is the sentiment I heard from 3 dealers this past week-end at Baltimore who used to post more often of these boards. Too many folk who can't aim as well as they think they can, shoot anyway, then release the dogs.

morgannut2 · December 13, 2005 12:52PM

<< Another consideration, not all dealers know how to use a computer. >>

Two years ago while on the phone I asked Jack Beymer if he could Email me a coin image--- he didn't know how the computer worked. I figured at least he wasn't an Ebay-Wannabe and bought the coin anyway--

BlindedByEgo · December 13, 2005 1:02PM

<< I agree with TDN. Often too much hostility, juvenile attitudes , unprofessional conduct and as is usual on forums, a total lack of good manners.

Many posters are quick to argue, insult, and let thier hostilities out in a chatroom. They usually show more manners in person or people just walk away from them. >>

You @#$^$%# idjit!!! I do not, do not, do not!!! Im a nice guy an spel good, no putdouns. You jerk!!!

Just kidding

I never knew this-- why do some/many dealers NOT like this forum?

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