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What do you think of NGC graded gold coins?
Longacre
Posts: 16,717 ✭✭✭
I noticed that most of the gold coins that I own are graded by NGC. I was speaking on the phone today with two different dealers, and they both mentioned that NGC is "very, very loose" when it comes to grading gold coins (especially Liberty gold coins). I was quite surprised. I know that the grading services in general have loosened up in the recent past, but it was odd that these two relatively large dealers would have such strong opinons about NGC gold. Does anyone have any specific instances where NGC gold has been habitually loosely graded or whether NGC gold has to be sold at a discount to PCGS gold. [Let's hold off on the "buy the coin and not the holder" for now; I am interested in whether the theory of these dealers is true or not].
Always took candy from strangers
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
Didn't wanna get me no trade
Never want to be like papa
Working for the boss every night and day
--"Happy", by the Rolling Stones (1972)
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Comments
In the old days, PCGS had a tiny edge of NGC when it came to grading gold conservatively. But that knowledge was of little use because you had to know how to grade to pick the right coins. You could not base your selections on brand loyalty.
Today, like I said the standards have been lowered, and so all bets are off. If this continues the bids will not go up as fast as they have in the past. That is the usual market reaction to lowered slab grade standards.
ANACS has some nice holder gold coins for the grade IMO.
I prefer PCGS all day long
Dennis
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<< <i>What do you think of NGC graded gold coins? >>
i think their authentication is excellent, as is the case w/ pcgs, anacs, icg & segs.
K S
<< <i>They suck with gold coins, especially the lower mint state coins (MS60 to MS62)
I prefer PCGS all day long
Dennis >>
I've handled some really attractive gold coins in NGC MS-62 holders. Quite often you had to turn them at one angle to see the hairlines that caused them to go into the MS-62 holder. Otherwise they looked like MS-63+ and 64 coins.
Do you think this coin sucks? It's in an NGC MS-62 holder. Every sin is magnified in the picture. I've seen MS-63 graded coins that were not as nice.
GTS
<< <i> I was speaking on the phone today with two different dealers >>
Typical dealer tactics. Of course they didn't say they weren't interestd, they just needed to drop your expectations a little. If you said they were PCGS you would have gotten a song about how the market has softened lately.
TorinoCobra71
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
<< <i>
<< <i>What do you think of NGC graded gold coins? >>
i think their authentication is excellent, as is the case w/ pcgs, anacs, icg & segs.
K S >>
That's really all that matters to me in a TPG anymore, anyway.
The NGC gold coins seem to sell one heck of a lot slower.
I send some gold coins to NGC and others to PCGS because some coins tend to grade higher at NGC and others tend to grade higher at PCGS.
Whatever the coin, I very rarely have to sell an NGC graded gold coin at a discount to PCGS money.
Edited to add that it is true that PCGS and NGC have very different standards on certain types of gold coins. Of course, I'd be happy to share the details but I don't want to contribute to gradeflation.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Now I have always considered them to be equal, but this might explain things..... If everything is equal I prefer PCGS because I don't like the white holders of NGC..... I might be able to get over that point but that and the fact that they are different size.....
the point is moot for me as i have never thought about it in that way and i really do not care if it is true or not......l
ets assume it is true who cares!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
lets assume it is not true then as usual these dealers are goniffs
6 of one my sweet or half dozen of another
as for me if i would ever consider a gold coin in a pcgs or ngc holder
i would need to see it in hand sight seen
and
if it met the michael quality rating for technical grade and eye appeal i would buy it weather pcgs/ngc
I think this may be a holdover from when so many Northeastern dealers sent coins to NJ to NGC.
For what it's worth I think that NGC LIberty gold (the later Libs) tend to be somewhat scuffier than PCGS gold. I see a more NGC Lib gold than I don't want to buy....especially MS64 and MS65 $5's and $10's.
I've seen so many low end, scuffy and ticked up NGC MS64 $10 Libs that I don't care to see any more....ever. I see several low end NGC's for every one PCGS piece.
I wish I had Andy's sources. For the NGC gold I sell I usually have to discount it a tad when it is not decent for the grade. PCGS gold seems to bring a little more (2-3%).
roadrunner
Here's the link...good old PCGS and their 1990's software that doesn't auto link like everyone else on the web!
<< <i>What do you think of NGC graded gold coins? >>
Show me some coins in NGC holders and I will let you know my thoughts on each one. Just like any TPG, it is a crapshoot so to make a generalized statement would be insane. About the only generalization I will make is that I find many more "improved...processed...dipped...conserved..."(whatever is the correct PC term for it today) in NGC holders than in PCGS or ANACS holders. Of course the fact that they own NCS just might be the reason.
I have been collecting Indian Quarter Eagles since 1996 and I am very picky about the surface preservation which is always a challenge due to the lack of an upset rim to protect the fields. Most of the examples you find look like they have been hit with the business end of a chainsaw!!! After a couple of years of searching I began to notice that fully 90-95% of all coins I found for sale were NGC (and they were almost always ugly).
After nine years of searching I have only found eight of the fifteen coins in the series that met my standard. Seven are truly cream of the crop NGC examples that were found after rejecting hundreds of their brethern. The eighth is head over heels the best; a stunning 1911-D which as you might guess, is a PCGS. And this was from a miniscule sample of PCGS coins that I ever found to examine.
I began to formulate a theory that the PCGS coins were in general far better for the like grade than their NGC counterparts and as a result, were quickly snapped up whenever available and buried in new collections. This left the substandard NGC coins to fill the marketplace. With the dramatic increase in prices the last few years I have seen many more apparently nice PCGS coins appear in the auctions but as internet photos are not good for revealing hairlines, I can't tell for certain. But again, the PCGS' seldom make it to dealer showcases.
Anyhow, if I am right, the strict grading by PCGS compounded by the propensity of this issue to be very surface-impaired has meant that by default NGC coins dominate dealer inventories and PCGS coins dominate collectors' cabinets.
Your thoughts?