Interesting Help Wanted Ad!
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Comments
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Yes, I saw that on LinkedIn yesterday. Maybe an interesting idea?
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@pruebas said:
Yes, I saw that on LinkedIn yesterday. Maybe an interesting idea?I suppose maybe it would be for a well seasoned numismatist recently out of work, but I was thinking the more interesting thing is that CAC may be getting ready to grade world coins.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.5 -
Ron D has said that they are ready about a year ago on the CAC forums.
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If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.1 -
@MrEureka said:
If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
A niche request but I would love them to assign numerical grades to chopmarked world coins that are otherwise deserving of numeric grades. I doubt they would but I did see this one the other day.
Also, CACG continuing to provide excellent customer service, reasonable turnaround times, and fair pricing are all positives as well.
chopmarkedtradedollars.com
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@MrEureka said:
If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
Grade my coins and get them back to me in say 3 months.
If they chose to have a registry, actually have their coins be able to be entered into the sets.
If #2 isn’t working, help customers get the problem solved.
Totally agree with @Lermish on numerically grading chopped material.
Recognize obvious and easily decipherable dates/undertypes on labels of Brazilian 960 Reis.
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They are grading some world coins now. I submitted 19 Canada dollar to them.
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@MrEureka said:
If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
Actually read the submission form (ie: attribute the coins correctly).
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CAC is known almost exclusively in the US and therefore the vast majority of their future potential clients will be US collectors , dealers etc of world coins. Maybe some Canadians too.
But generally, European, Russian, Asian or other world collectors, from outside North America haven't even heard of the company. That's a serious handicap compared to PCGS and NGC, something that reminds me of a quote of (actor) Oliver Platt in the tv series "the bear": "You can't start at f@.ked up!"
To this, add the expansions of PCGS and NGC in Europe and Asia for 15+ years now and the handicap is even bigger. Someone has to crunch the numbers and figure out if the whole effort will be worth it. They will need several graders and like others have mentioned, they have to come up with something different and exciting.
In Greek coins for example, the early 1828-1831 period coins are almost exclusively submitted to NGC, because unlike PCGS they attribute the coins and they add the variety number by Peter Chase, the definitive work on these coins with almost 500 varieties from C to RRRRR, on top of the grading.
I mention them, because others have mentioned chopmarked coins and I'm sure that the Latin American 18th and 19th century coins, so popular here must surely have their own particuliarities on top of a simple numerical grade. Only some kind of very original service and unavailable elsewhere ,would give CAC a real reason to enter the world coin grading, otherwise I really don't see the potential gain here. It is complicated and expensive to create a reliable, knowlegdeable and with a quick turnaround world coin service and you still need experts on some particular fields and countries, like the plethora of names that were printed in the first pages of the good old printed Krause catalogues.
Finally, the way I understand it, CAC started as a grader of the grading services and they did that nicely, so that their name now carries some gravitas, that US collectors understand and pay for. Unless they will be happy grading coins submitted only by US collectors, dealers and auction houses, they have to present themselves with the same good reputation to the rest of the world, instead of simply one more US based grading service. Maybe they should simply start with stickering world coins in the beginning, like they did with US coins.
Or, they can start , stickering and/or grading coins submitted in the US and make themselves known to the rest of the world by the consistency of their work. Still, some novelty, some additional service would work very well for them, if they can find it.
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I hope to see a world where grading companies become specialists. It would be difficult for any company to be the authority in all coins ever made, but, they could find an area where they do reign supreme.
I would love to see a grading company, or at least an arm of one, that focuses entirely on ancient coins from Greece and Rome. Another one that just does Spanish colonial. Another still that does Asian coinage.
Why won’t they do that? Money. Limited areas means limited submissions. JA had such a good thing going with CAC stickering, he was the foremost authority on identifying PQ coinage, not anymore.
Snow did a great job with copper, but I don’t think it went very well with his sticker efforts though. Imagine if Snow just graded American copper, his grading and attributions would be the supreme and end-all authority on the subject.
It won’t happen, but in the world of the medical community with everyone needing to specialize, I’d like to see the same with grading companies. Don’t have a little bit of everything, but be the biggest authority on just a few things. That’s what we need.
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
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@SimonW - interesting thought. more specialized expertise from TPGs would be nice, but I imagine the cost would go way up, and it is already pretty expensive as it is.
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@threefifty yeah, increased cost would be likely, unless it was possible to keep the facility/staff smaller, which is what would make it work. Genuine experts in their field, four or five people.
I'm BACK!!! Used to be Billet7 on the old forum.
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@SimonW said:
I hope to see a world where grading companies become specialists. It would be difficult for any company to be the authority in all coins ever made, but, they could find an area where they do reign supreme.I would love to see a grading company, or at least an arm of one, that focuses entirely on ancient coins from Greece and Rome. Another one that just does Spanish colonial. Another still that does Asian coinage.
Why won’t they do that? Money. Limited areas means limited submissions. JA had such a good thing going with CAC stickering, he was the foremost authority on identifying PQ coinage, not anymore.
Snow did a great job with copper, but I don’t think it went very well with his sticker efforts though. Imagine if Snow just graded American copper, his grading and attributions would be the supreme and end-all authority on the subject.
It won’t happen, but in the world of the medical community with everyone needing to specialize, I’d like to see the same with grading companies. Don’t have a little bit of everything, but be the biggest authority on just a few things. That’s what we need.
I like the idea of specialists attributing my submissions, but you can’t get the same level of convenience, efficiency and consistency if you have to use potentially dozens of grading services. Perhaps a viable compromise might be for outside experts to remotely participate in the attribution process.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.0 -
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
A niche request but I would love them to assign numerical grades to chopmarked world coins that are otherwise deserving of numeric grades. I doubt they would but I did see this one the other day.
I see no reason not to grade lightly or moderately chopmarked coins, assuming they can tell if the chopmarks are authentic. Does anyone at any of the TPGs know chopmarks well enough that you would trust them to authenticate a chopmarked 1875?
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.0 -
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
A niche request but I would love them to assign numerical grades to chopmarked world coins that are otherwise deserving of numeric grades. I doubt they would but I did see this one the other day.
I see no reason not to grade lightly or moderately chopmarked coins, assuming they can tell if the chopmarks are authentic. Does anyone at any of the TPGs know chopmarks well enough that you would trust them to authenticate a chopmarked 1875?
If they paid attention, I'm confident they could develop a good eye pretty quickly. As things currently stand, no.
Among us in the chop world, it's very well known that the chops themselves are not authenticated so it's a buyer beware situation. I don't think that is understood outside of a fairly small circle.
chopmarkedtradedollars.com
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@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
A niche request but I would love them to assign numerical grades to chopmarked world coins that are otherwise deserving of numeric grades. I doubt they would but I did see this one the other day.
I see no reason not to grade lightly or moderately chopmarked coins, assuming they can tell if the chopmarks are authentic. Does anyone at any of the TPGs know chopmarks well enough that you would trust them to authenticate a chopmarked 1875?
If they paid attention, I'm confident they could develop a good eye pretty quickly. As things currently stand, no.
Among us in the chop world, it's very well known that the chops themselves are not authenticated so it's a buyer beware situation. I don't think that is understood outside of a fairly small circle.
Do NGC and PCGS state in their guarantee terms that chopmarks are not guaranteed authentic?
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.0 -
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
A niche request but I would love them to assign numerical grades to chopmarked world coins that are otherwise deserving of numeric grades. I doubt they would but I did see this one the other day.
I see no reason not to grade lightly or moderately chopmarked coins, assuming they can tell if the chopmarks are authentic. Does anyone at any of the TPGs know chopmarks well enough that you would trust them to authenticate a chopmarked 1875?
If they paid attention, I'm confident they could develop a good eye pretty quickly. As things currently stand, no.
Among us in the chop world, it's very well known that the chops themselves are not authenticated so it's a buyer beware situation. I don't think that is understood outside of a fairly small circle.
Do NGC and PCGS state in their guarantee terms that chopmarks are not guaranteed authentic?
I don't recall seeing any sort of verbiage referencing chopmarks or not. It is just one of those things that is "known". Also, seeing inauthentic chops (or just random damage or counterstamps) labelled as Chopmarked is extremely common.
chopmarkedtradedollars.com
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@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
A niche request but I would love them to assign numerical grades to chopmarked world coins that are otherwise deserving of numeric grades. I doubt they would but I did see this one the other day.
I see no reason not to grade lightly or moderately chopmarked coins, assuming they can tell if the chopmarks are authentic. Does anyone at any of the TPGs know chopmarks well enough that you would trust them to authenticate a chopmarked 1875?
If they paid attention, I'm confident they could develop a good eye pretty quickly. As things currently stand, no.
Among us in the chop world, it's very well known that the chops themselves are not authenticated so it's a buyer beware situation. I don't think that is understood outside of a fairly small circle.
Do NGC and PCGS state in their guarantee terms that chopmarks are not guaranteed authentic?
I don't recall seeing any sort of verbiage referencing chopmarks or not. It is just one of those things that is "known". Also, seeing inauthentic chops (or just random damage or counterstamps) labelled as Chopmarked is extremely common.
Per AI:
No. Neither PCGS nor NGC has explicit language in their official Terms & Conditions, grading guidelines, or Guarantees that specifically warrants or guarantees that the chopmarks themselves are genuine historical Chinese merchant (shroff) marks from the period of use.What their guarantees actually coverBoth services guarantee:The host coin is genuine (authentic as described — correct type, date, mint, etc.).
chopmarkedtradedollars.com
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@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
A niche request but I would love them to assign numerical grades to chopmarked world coins that are otherwise deserving of numeric grades. I doubt they would but I did see this one the other day.
I see no reason not to grade lightly or moderately chopmarked coins, assuming they can tell if the chopmarks are authentic. Does anyone at any of the TPGs know chopmarks well enough that you would trust them to authenticate a chopmarked 1875?
If they paid attention, I'm confident they could develop a good eye pretty quickly. As things currently stand, no.
Among us in the chop world, it's very well known that the chops themselves are not authenticated so it's a buyer beware situation. I don't think that is understood outside of a fairly small circle.
Do NGC and PCGS state in their guarantee terms that chopmarks are not guaranteed authentic?
I don't recall seeing any sort of verbiage referencing chopmarks or not. It is just one of those things that is "known". Also, seeing inauthentic chops (or just random damage or counterstamps) labelled as Chopmarked is extremely common.
And you actually care about getting them to grade your coins when they’re not even capable of authenticating them? I don’t even know where to begin…
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.0 -
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
@lermish said:
@MrEureka said:
If they were ready a year ago, wouldn’t they have started grading world coins a year ago? Don’t get me wrong. I’m eager to see them get in the game, and it would appear that they’re getting close to doing so.
On a related note, what would you want CAC or any other grading service to do differently than PCGS and NGC are doing now?
A niche request but I would love them to assign numerical grades to chopmarked world coins that are otherwise deserving of numeric grades. I doubt they would but I did see this one the other day.
I see no reason not to grade lightly or moderately chopmarked coins, assuming they can tell if the chopmarks are authentic. Does anyone at any of the TPGs know chopmarks well enough that you would trust them to authenticate a chopmarked 1875?
If they paid attention, I'm confident they could develop a good eye pretty quickly. As things currently stand, no.
Among us in the chop world, it's very well known that the chops themselves are not authenticated so it's a buyer beware situation. I don't think that is understood outside of a fairly small circle.
Do NGC and PCGS state in their guarantee terms that chopmarks are not guaranteed authentic?
I don't recall seeing any sort of verbiage referencing chopmarks or not. It is just one of those things that is "known". Also, seeing inauthentic chops (or just random damage or counterstamps) labelled as Chopmarked is extremely common.
And you actually care about getting them to grade your coins when they’re not even capable of authenticating them? I don’t even know where to begin…
I definitely have mixed feelings about my relationship with all of the TPGs.
chopmarkedtradedollars.com
2
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