@BillJones said:
What do I do with and under graded coin? I leave it where it is if I’m not selling it.
But the time to sell could come without warning or prior planning.
Tangling the grading services is expensive and often futile.
Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
I don’t have the b@lls to crack out a high dollar coin, especially, in a vintage slab. I wouldn’t worry, unless selling, then everything gets reconsidered and then goes to CAC. I would let the auction company handle that.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
@BillJones said:
What do I do with and under graded coin? I leave it where it is if I’m not selling it.
The problem with that strategy is it might take more than one trip to the grading service for it to upgrade. If you consign your coins to an auction house and have them resubmit your coins regrading for the most part will be a one time event. If your coin is truly undergraded if you don’t upgrade it someone else will eventually.
Nothing. The only way for me to “know” if a coin is under-graded is if it has a gold bean, and if so I know better than to mess with it. If I sell an unstickered coin I rely on GC to decide on whether to send it to CAC. If I had many five or six-figure coins, my response might be different and I might try for some pluses. As it is I have too many coins and my time is worth more to me than to bother trying to squeeze value for my own satisfaction. Lastly, my auction results have been such that the market seems pretty good at valuing the best coins, and that is the route my heirs will follow.
I recognize for a variety of legitimate reasons MANY collectors won't take the steps to maximize the value of their collection. For me, I put a high priority on maximizing value. As @ChrisH821 says above, you never know "when your time is up!"
In my opinion, the heirs of collections may not know (or have the knowledge) to maximize value before they sell it. Hopefully the heirs of the collectors reading this won't just go to the local corner Gold/Silver shop!
Steve
A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!
@winesteven said:
I recognize for a variety of legitimate reasons MANY collectors won't take the steps to maximize the value of their collection. For me, I put a high priority on maximizing value. As @ChrisH821 says above, you never know "when your time is up!"
In my opinion, the heirs of collections may not know (or have the knowledge) to maximize value before they sell it. Hopefully the heirs of the collectors reading this won't just go to the local corner Gold/Silver shop!
Steve
Agree 100%. I’ve left and discussed detailed instructions regarding all assets with my son/executor.
@ProofCollection said:
Depending on the coin, if it's good enough for a gold CAC you can add crazy value over and above the bump to the next grade. Best to just show us.
In my experience a gold sticker is almost impossible to achieve. I got a few by chance in 2020 but none since trying with several coins. Just an illusion most collectors have that their coins will get one. Even coins JA would admit are undergraded don’t get his gold sticker unless he feels they are severely undergraded in his opinion. Usually by more than 1 and a half points. So don’t ever expect a gold sticker as you will usually be disappointed. Not a realistic expectation.
@ProofCollection said:
Depending on the coin, if it's good enough for a gold CAC you can add crazy value over and above the bump to the next grade. Best to just show us.
In my experience a gold sticker is almost impossible to achieve. I got a few by chance in 2020 but none since trying with several coins. Just an illusion most collectors have that their coins will get one. Even coins JA would admit are undergraded don’t get his gold sticker unless he feels they are severely undergraded in his opinion. Usually by more than 1 and a half points. So don’t ever expect a gold sticker as you will usually be disappointed. Not a realistic expectation.
Here’s a coin in I sent in for review for a gold sticker that was denied. Very clean for a 65 and I have little doubt it would easily green sticker as a 66.
@Walkerlover said:
Here’s a coin in I sent in for review for a gold sticker that was denied. Very clean for a 65 and I have little doubt it would easily green sticker as a 66.
Super nice coin! As you mentioned, without it being deemed by JA as at least a 66 A-coin (so, a 66+), it won't get the nod for gold. The coin's true grade needs to be at least 1.5 grading points higher (or more) than the holdered grade to earn a gold bean. Makes sense why it's so dang hard to earn a gold sticker, but clearly not impossible. Just takes an extremely skilled eye and a willingness to spend accordingly.
In a true "no question about it, this should be at least a point higher" scenario it's a toss up to go for a bean (hopefully gold) or crack and regrade. Or maybe both.
I voted crack and regrade as I think that, all else being equal, every holder has a bias to the next grader. It's almost impossible not to have that bias. So a raw coin probably get's looked at in a way that any graded coin wont.
But really, it all depends on the coin, and how solid you are in your knowledge.
What you're doing with it matters too I suppose, but I am a firm believer in getting the coin in the right holder with the right ornaments so that IF something happens to me, they are already ready for their next journey.
.
Real story, last year.
I bought a rarer (r.5) Die Marriage, early-date CBH that is known for weak strikes last May. She was in a very new PCGS holder, and was not attributed on the holder (but was noted in the auction description). No bean either, but I doubt JA had ever seen her.
The coin was graded VF30, which was way undegraded IMO. She had a nice crusty skin and ample luster remaining, with little actual wear and very few marks. Some of my friends thought I was seeing things. I got a lot of "Yeah, maybe it's a 35", but that was it.
For clarity, I didn't talk about before I bought it ... and someone else probably saw some of what I saw because I didn't get a great deal on her in the plastic she was in. In fact, at that grade, especially no bean, I was probably upside down a few bucks.
The coin arrived and I looked at it thrice from Sunday, and I felt even more like I was right.
My choices were similar to yours. If it was a 5.k Unc, I probably would have done the CAC roundtrip first and then reevaluated. A Gold bean there might be (and probably is) worth more than a point.
In my case I decided I needed to set her free and get her graded with the attribution so she would be noticed as such. I felt that would drive everything else. and while I usually don't care for the attribution on the holders (kind of a "whatever, neutral" thing) , in this case I felt it was almost necessary.
And honestly, in retrospect, I do believe that helped. I could be wrong, and also maybe a VF30 Gold CAC is worth more, but I do not think that would have happened, and I'm not sure the value would have been much more even if it did.
I think it's easy to undergrade something with a notoriously weak strike at that grade level, so unless the grader knows that it could very well be a strike issue, it may not get the credit it deserves.
This goes for JA too, because he's not a specialist at everything (although I am told and do believe he has good notes on the CBH DM's - but he needs to know what it is before checking, I'm sure).
So I cracked it and had it graded with the attribution.
She came back as an EF45, which is the correct grade IMO (I always thought it was solid 45, from the first time I studied the images).
And since I like it at that grade and saw no reason it shouldn't CAC, I sent it, and John agreed. Green bean.
.
My point is, sometimes, when it's a "no question about it, this should be at least a point higher" you have to really know what you're looking at and believe in the coin.
Of course we should know the costs and what the value gains might be to make sure it makes sesne. And we need to accept, if we're wrong, for any reason, we're going to eat at least part of our hat for lunch.
That can be a tough decision when cracking out a 4-digit or 5-digit (or really any) coin, but sometimes it really is the only way.
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
@Walkerlover said:
Here’s a coin in I sent in for review for a gold sticker that was denied. Very clean for a 65 and I have little doubt it would easily green sticker as a 66.
Super nice coin! As you mentioned, without it being deemed by JA as at least a 66 A-coin (so, a 66+), it won't get the nod for gold. The coin's true grade needs to be at least 1.5 grading points higher (or more) than the holdered grade to earn a gold bean. Makes sense why it's so dang hard to earn a gold sticker, but clearly not impossible. Just takes an extremely skilled eye and a willingness to spend accordingly.
I got my gold stickers in 2020 by now most coins have been scrutinized by coin dealers for a potential gold sticker and submitted if deemed a good gamble
Comments
Tangling the grading services is expensive and often futile.
I don’t have the b@lls to crack out a high dollar coin, especially, in a vintage slab. I wouldn’t worry, unless selling, then everything gets reconsidered and then goes to CAC. I would let the auction company handle that.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
The problem with that strategy is it might take more than one trip to the grading service for it to upgrade. If you consign your coins to an auction house and have them resubmit your coins regrading for the most part will be a one time event. If your coin is truly undergraded if you don’t upgrade it someone else will eventually.
Nothing. The only way for me to “know” if a coin is under-graded is if it has a gold bean, and if so I know better than to mess with it. If I sell an unstickered coin I rely on GC to decide on whether to send it to CAC. If I had many five or six-figure coins, my response might be different and I might try for some pluses. As it is I have too many coins and my time is worth more to me than to bother trying to squeeze value for my own satisfaction. Lastly, my auction results have been such that the market seems pretty good at valuing the best coins, and that is the route my heirs will follow.
I recognize for a variety of legitimate reasons MANY collectors won't take the steps to maximize the value of their collection. For me, I put a high priority on maximizing value. As @ChrisH821 says above, you never know "when your time is up!"
In my opinion, the heirs of collections may not know (or have the knowledge) to maximize value before they sell it. Hopefully the heirs of the collectors reading this won't just go to the local corner Gold/Silver shop!
Steve
My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
Agree 100%. I’ve left and discussed detailed instructions regarding all assets with my son/executor.
Crack it out then submit it.
Send to CAC:
A Gold Bean is better than a full grade upgrade.
If it gets a Green Bean, I'd keep it like that. I'd take a Green Bean over a +.
If it does not Bean, just keep it "as is" and accept the combined opinion of PCGS and CAC (over your own).
In my experience a gold sticker is almost impossible to achieve. I got a few by chance in 2020 but none since trying with several coins. Just an illusion most collectors have that their coins will get one. Even coins JA would admit are undergraded don’t get his gold sticker unless he feels they are severely undergraded in his opinion. Usually by more than 1 and a half points. So don’t ever expect a gold sticker as you will usually be disappointed. Not a realistic expectation.
Here’s a coin in I sent in for review for a gold sticker that was denied. Very clean for a 65 and I have little doubt it would easily green sticker as a 66.
I voted "Other." What am I doing with the coin? Stashing it away? Registry set? Admiring it for a while as its care-taker?
Unless the grade jump is an order of magnitude or two greater, I'd leave it be.
I don't purchase coins that move the decimal to the right when the grade jumps one point.
If I purchased it at the quoted grade, that typically means I'm happy with it as is.
"Bongo hurtles along the rain soaked highway of life on underinflated bald retread tires."
~Wayne
Super nice coin! As you mentioned, without it being deemed by JA as at least a 66 A-coin (so, a 66+), it won't get the nod for gold. The coin's true grade needs to be at least 1.5 grading points higher (or more) than the holdered grade to earn a gold bean. Makes sense why it's so dang hard to earn a gold sticker, but clearly not impossible. Just takes an extremely skilled eye and a willingness to spend accordingly.
Send it in for regrade.
In a true "no question about it, this should be at least a point higher" scenario it's a toss up to go for a bean (hopefully gold) or crack and regrade. Or maybe both.
I voted crack and regrade as I think that, all else being equal, every holder has a bias to the next grader. It's almost impossible not to have that bias. So a raw coin probably get's looked at in a way that any graded coin wont.
But really, it all depends on the coin, and how solid you are in your knowledge.
What you're doing with it matters too I suppose, but I am a firm believer in getting the coin in the right holder with the right ornaments so that IF something happens to me, they are already ready for their next journey.
.
Real story, last year.
I bought a rarer (r.5) Die Marriage, early-date CBH that is known for weak strikes last May. She was in a very new PCGS holder, and was not attributed on the holder (but was noted in the auction description). No bean either, but I doubt JA had ever seen her.
The coin was graded VF30, which was way undegraded IMO. She had a nice crusty skin and ample luster remaining, with little actual wear and very few marks. Some of my friends thought I was seeing things. I got a lot of "Yeah, maybe it's a 35", but that was it.
For clarity, I didn't talk about before I bought it ... and someone else probably saw some of what I saw because I didn't get a great deal on her in the plastic she was in. In fact, at that grade, especially no bean, I was probably upside down a few bucks.
The coin arrived and I looked at it thrice from Sunday, and I felt even more like I was right.
My choices were similar to yours. If it was a 5.k Unc, I probably would have done the CAC roundtrip first and then reevaluated. A Gold bean there might be (and probably is) worth more than a point.
In my case I decided I needed to set her free and get her graded with the attribution so she would be noticed as such. I felt that would drive everything else. and while I usually don't care for the attribution on the holders (kind of a "whatever, neutral" thing) , in this case I felt it was almost necessary.
And honestly, in retrospect, I do believe that helped. I could be wrong, and also maybe a VF30 Gold CAC is worth more, but I do not think that would have happened, and I'm not sure the value would have been much more even if it did.
I think it's easy to undergrade something with a notoriously weak strike at that grade level, so unless the grader knows that it could very well be a strike issue, it may not get the credit it deserves.
This goes for JA too, because he's not a specialist at everything (although I am told and do believe he has good notes on the CBH DM's - but he needs to know what it is before checking, I'm sure).
So I cracked it and had it graded with the attribution.
She came back as an EF45, which is the correct grade IMO (I always thought it was solid 45, from the first time I studied the images).
And since I like it at that grade and saw no reason it shouldn't CAC, I sent it, and John agreed. Green bean.
.
My point is, sometimes, when it's a "no question about it, this should be at least a point higher" you have to really know what you're looking at and believe in the coin.
Of course we should know the costs and what the value gains might be to make sure it makes sesne. And we need to accept, if we're wrong, for any reason, we're going to eat at least part of our hat for lunch.
That can be a tough decision when cracking out a 4-digit or 5-digit (or really any) coin, but sometimes it really is the only way.
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #242
I got my gold stickers in 2020 by now most coins have been scrutinized by coin dealers for a potential gold sticker and submitted if deemed a good gamble