@engmtic said:
I got mine this week. Both me and my buddy received 2 boxes. Same tracking number and everything. We both only ordered one each. Has this happened to anyone else?
seriously, when the dust has settled, the mint may ask you both to return one
my memory is very cloudy, but the mint has tracked someone on here down to return something - either money or product
I was going over the past posts on this thread because I thought that there was a small discussion regarding laser utilization on current Mint produced coins. Especially the ASE. (afterthought, it may have been the Gold 2025 SAC thread)
I just compared a 2019 S PF70 (NGC) "Ultra Cameo" ASE with the 2025 Army Privy.
I realize that this 25AP coin design has its own unique criteria (although I don't know those details).
What I see quite overtly is that the fine detail on the obverse device (Liberty especially her dress etc.) of the 2019 proof ASE is much more detailed and the so called 'frosty cameo' trait 'texture' is quite different than the Army 25AP.The latter seems a bit 'fuzzier' or maybe 'quasi sand blast' like (bad adjectives) and has less pronounced obverse devise details (for example dress lines, folds, sandals, etc.) The reverse Eagle device has great detail, however.
I don't believe it is just my sample because all the pictures flooding online display my basic descriptions.
Not complaining, but I imagine that I am looking at the surface finish 'texture' of the laser work, or simply a new unique obverse detail presentation ??.
@Heubschgold said:
I was going over the past posts on this thread because I thought that there was a small discussion regarding laser utilization on current Mint produced coins. Especially the ASE. (afterthought, it may have been the Gold 2025 SAC thread)
I just compared a 2019 S PF70 (NGC) "Ultra Cameo" ASE with the 2025 Army Privy.
I realize that this 25AP coin design has its own unique criteria (although I don't know those details).
What I see quite overtly is that the fine detail on the obverse device (Liberty especially her dress etc.) of the 2019 proof ASE is much more detailed and the so called 'frosty cameo' trait 'texture' is quite different than the Army 25AP.The latter seems a bit 'fuzzier' or maybe 'quasi sand blast' like (bad adjectives) and has less pronounced obverse devise details (for example dress lines, folds, sandals, etc.) The reverse Eagle device has great detail, however.
I don't believe it is just my sample because all the pictures flooding online display my basic descriptions.
Not complaining, but I imagine that I am looking at the surface finish 'texture' of the laser work, or simply a new unique obverse detail presentation ??.
Any education out there?
Thanks!
Regarding the detail (2019 vs. 2025), don't forget about the redesign in 2021 (i.e., part of the 35th anniversary).
Thanks metroD,that 2021 redesign point seems to explain the softer detail on Liberty in general. However, perhaps the ' grainier' cameo texture may be a trait of laser tools????
@Heubschgold said:
Thanks metroD,that 2021 redesign point seems to explain the softer detail on Liberty in general. However, perhaps the ' grainier' cameo texture may be a trait of laser tools????
The frost on the proof coins has been applied to the dies by laser for several years now (not sure exactly when they started). That accounts for the grainy portraits and devices.
Personally, I'm not a fan. I'd even rather have the whole coin smooth than have the new frosting.
I think you have zero evidence for this accusation. There is no actual picture of the coin for sale. They are just using the Mint's artwork.
It's suspicious due to the zero feedback and multiple coins. But the suggestion that you know where the reed is missing or the size of the privy is impossible without an actual photo.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
@Goldbully said:
Latest Pop Report.........a hair over 3% have been graded by PCGS.
65.7% PR70DCAM First Strike
Hey, I wanted to send some of this coin for grading. What is the cut off date for getting PCGS First Strike? I have mines sealed and my wife opened hers. Thank for the info!
Hey, I wanted to send some of this coin for grading. What is the cut off date for getting PCGS First Strike? I have mines sealed and my wife opened hers. Thank for the info!
Cutoff date was September 1. The opened box cannot get first strike. As long as your mint box is still sealed with a postmarked date before September 1st, you can get it for that one. You'll have to send in the box u opened.
Throw a coin enough times, and suppose one day it lands on its edge.
Aren’t all of these coins basically struck at the same time? It’s not like they made some, and then as demand or need increased they struck more. What does “first strike” really mean if 100% of the coins could have that same designation?
@jmlanzaf said:
I think you have zero evidence for this accusation. There is no actual picture of the coin for sale. They are just using the Mint's artwork.
hahahahahaha
proof - the missing reed is in the wrong location
plus the reed count is wrong
it is definitely not the mint image
there is a mistake made and it's not mine
as far as future contentions about "zero evidence" "not actual pictures" "low feedback bias" etc. consider yourself ignored
@Gbrick said:
Aren’t all of these coins basically struck at the same time? It’s not like they made some, and then as demand or need increased they struck more. What does “first strike” really mean if 100% of the coins could have that same designation?
Nothing. At the margins, due to the time restrictions involved in getting the designation, it means the coin has not been cracked out and submitted multiple times. Which, on moderns, is honestly a meaningless distinction anyway.
That said, the mass marketers have done a spectacular job marketing it as a so so special subset of a population, and people buy into it. Advance Release is nothing more than First Strike and First Day of Issue on steroids.
For that matter, one could ask why a modern 70 should be worth a multiple of a modern 69. Even if it is more rare, given they are both perfect AND indistinguishable to the naked eye, and given that a trained eye with a magnifier can often find fault with a 70 if it looks long and hard enough.
But people are conditioned to assign premiums to things the marketers want them to assign premiums to. Including First Strike. TPGs just feed the market and take their piece of the action.
@Gbrick said:
Aren’t all of these coins basically struck at the same time? It’s not like they made some, and then as demand or need increased they struck more. What does “first strike” really mean if 100% of the coins could have that same designation?
i think at once upon a past for many issues that they did mint them all.
but to your big question, they don't denote the first sets of coins sold as first struck for reasons you already understand, plus they contracted mint order fulfiller would have to separate the "first stuck" and send them out first.
i'll explain first strike like this. in the actory art world are signed and numbered prints. the lowest numbers resell for more than high. you figure it out
If they really wanted to be meaningful, they'd reset and track first strike every time they changed out the dies. But what an accounting and tracking nightmare that would be.
@jmlanzaf said:
I think you have zero evidence for this accusation. There is no actual picture of the coin for sale. They are just using the Mint's artwork.
hahahahahaha
proof - the missing reed is in the wrong location
plus the reed count is wrong
it is definitely not the mint image
there is a mistake made and it's not mine
as far as future contentions about "zero evidence" "not actual pictures" "low feedback bias" etc. consider yourself ignored
Whether the Mint art or not, it is not a picture of the actual coin. So, we're still at zero evidence, whether you ignore it or not.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
@Gbrick said:
Aren’t all of these coins basically struck at the same time? It’s not like they made some, and then as demand or need increased they struck more. What does “first strike” really mean if 100% of the coins could have that same designation?
i think at once upon a past for many issues that they did mint them all.
but to your big question, they don't denote the first sets of coins sold as first struck for reasons you already understand, plus they contracted mint order fulfiller would have to separate the "first stuck" and send them out first.
i'll explain first strike like this. in the actory art world are signed and numbered prints. the lowest numbers resell for more than high. you figure it out
Except in the "actory" (sic) art world, the prints are numbered in order of production. The early prints will have the crispest image because the plates aren't worn or smeared. In the slab world, the "First Strike" coin could well be the last coin struck from worn out even damaged dies (though unlikely for a Commem)
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
Comments
Here’s my answer
I was going over the past posts on this thread because I thought that there was a small discussion regarding laser utilization on current Mint produced coins. Especially the ASE. (afterthought, it may have been the Gold 2025 SAC thread)
I just compared a 2019 S PF70 (NGC) "Ultra Cameo" ASE with the 2025 Army Privy.
I realize that this 25AP coin design has its own unique criteria (although I don't know those details).
What I see quite overtly is that the fine detail on the obverse device (Liberty especially her dress etc.) of the 2019 proof ASE is much more detailed and the so called 'frosty cameo' trait 'texture' is quite different than the Army 25AP.The latter seems a bit 'fuzzier' or maybe 'quasi sand blast' like (bad adjectives) and has less pronounced obverse devise details (for example dress lines, folds, sandals, etc.) The reverse Eagle device has great detail, however.
I don't believe it is just my sample because all the pictures flooding online display my basic descriptions.
Not complaining, but I imagine that I am looking at the surface finish 'texture' of the laser work, or simply a new unique obverse detail presentation ??.
Any education out there?
Thanks!
Regarding the detail (2019 vs. 2025), don't forget about the redesign in 2021 (i.e., part of the 35th anniversary).
Reference: https://www.coinworld.com/news/us-coins/mint-releases-new-graphics-of-american-eagle-design-changes
i noticed it too. there is something flat about the new ase's
Thanks metroD,that 2021 redesign point seems to explain the softer detail on Liberty in general. However, perhaps the ' grainier' cameo texture may be a trait of laser tools????
The frost on the proof coins has been applied to the dies by laser for several years now (not sure exactly when they started). That accounts for the grainy portraits and devices.
Personally, I'm not a fan. I'd even rather have the whole coin smooth than have the new frosting.
The coin looks much more attractive in hand. What a beauty, I am impressed.
Latest Pop Report..........
73.5% PR70DCAM First Strike
As a famous dealer on this Forum once told me,,,,,,, backs don't matter much.
bins are going off at 225-250
pretty solid. not the $100 face 90% for $100 version of hot, but they have heat
Latest Pop Report.........a hair over 3% have been graded by PCGS.
65.7% PR70DCAM First Strike
66 open auctions
sold about $200 each still
somewhat hot
we have someone offering counterfeits on these already:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/357567743202
proof - the missing reed is in the wrong location & the privy is too big
https://www.usmint.gov/250th-anniversary-united-states-army-american-eagle-one-ounce-silver-proof-coin-25APM.html
I think you have zero evidence for this accusation. There is no actual picture of the coin for sale. They are just using the Mint's artwork.
It's suspicious due to the zero feedback and multiple coins. But the suggestion that you know where the reed is missing or the size of the privy is impossible without an actual photo.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
eBay privy image matches Mint image dead on.
eBay image....
Mint image
The full obverse comparison shows coin on slightly differing angles.
Mint image is turned a bit further clockwise than the eBay image.
Key word: Image
Image: A rendering, a composite, a morph
Neither one is a photo
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
Hey, I wanted to send some of this coin for grading. What is the cut off date for getting PCGS First Strike? I have mines sealed and my wife opened hers. Thank for the info!
Cutoff date was September 1. The opened box cannot get first strike. As long as your mint box is still sealed with a postmarked date before September 1st, you can get it for that one. You'll have to send in the box u opened.
Throw a coin enough times, and suppose one day it lands on its edge.
Aren’t all of these coins basically struck at the same time? It’s not like they made some, and then as demand or need increased they struck more. What does “first strike” really mean if 100% of the coins could have that same designation?
hahahahahaha
plus the reed count is wrong
it is definitely not the mint image
there is a mistake made and it's not mine
as far as future contentions about "zero evidence" "not actual pictures" "low feedback bias" etc. consider yourself ignored
Nothing. At the margins, due to the time restrictions involved in getting the designation, it means the coin has not been cracked out and submitted multiple times. Which, on moderns, is honestly a meaningless distinction anyway.
That said, the mass marketers have done a spectacular job marketing it as a so so special subset of a population, and people buy into it. Advance Release is nothing more than First Strike and First Day of Issue on steroids.
For that matter, one could ask why a modern 70 should be worth a multiple of a modern 69. Even if it is more rare, given they are both perfect AND indistinguishable to the naked eye, and given that a trained eye with a magnifier can often find fault with a 70 if it looks long and hard enough.
But people are conditioned to assign premiums to things the marketers want them to assign premiums to. Including First Strike. TPGs just feed the market and take their piece of the action.
i think at once upon a past for many issues that they did mint them all.
but to your big question, they don't denote the first sets of coins sold as first struck for reasons you already understand, plus they contracted mint order fulfiller would have to separate the "first stuck" and send them out first.
i'll explain first strike like this. in the actory art world are signed and numbered prints. the lowest numbers resell for more than high. you figure it out
If they really wanted to be meaningful, they'd reset and track first strike every time they changed out the dies. But what an accounting and tracking nightmare that would be.
http://ProofCollection.Net
Whether the Mint art or not, it is not a picture of the actual coin. So, we're still at zero evidence, whether you ignore it or not.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
Except in the "actory" (sic) art world, the prints are numbered in order of production. The early prints will have the crispest image because the plates aren't worn or smeared. In the slab world, the "First Strike" coin could well be the last coin struck from worn out even damaged dies (though unlikely for a Commem)
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
That same artist rendering appears in multiple legitimate places:
https://www.bullionmax.com/buy-silver/2025-w-1-oz-proof-250th-anniversary-army-privy-american-silver-eagle-coin/
https://www.pricecharting.com/es/game/coins-american-silver-eagle/2025-w-army-250th-anniversary-privy
I know. You are still ignoring me.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.