Is this PVC? 1927-S PCGS Peace Dollar
ProofCollection
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Looking for opinions if this is PVC, but please indicate how sure you are. I'm still not great at identifying PVC although I think I know what I see. Here's the story.
Bought the coin at a good price and thought it might have PVC or other problems so I sent it to PCGS for restoration. They declined to restore it which made me think what I'm seeing isn't PVC. I sent it to CAC stickering and JA put a sticker on it that says "PVC" which usually means it'll sticker if the PVC gets removed. Also note that in the past, JA has told me coins had PVC that were not fixable. He did not say that this time which implies that it is fixable.
When I get the coin back from CAC, I contact PCGS Customer Service and ask why they didn't remove the PVC. I get the expected push back that they evaluated the coin and it "wouldn't benefit" from restoration which is hard to believe because PVC is a condition that will make the coin worse over time. Further, after declining restoration PCGS reholdered the coin at the same grade. I would argue that if the coin has PVC it should have come back in a Details holder. Clearly they didn't see any PVC.
For reference from the website: https://www.pcgs.com/restoration
$10 Evaluation Fee – If PCGS determines the coin(s) will not benefit from restoration or should not be restored, the coin(s) will still be submitted for grading.
In this case, the coin will benefit because leaving the PVC will lead to future degradation of the coin. I can't see any scenario where it's better to leave on PVC than remove it. I thought coins with PVC should always be restored so they don't get worse.
The page also says:
Surface Contaminants
Restoration will remove contaminants introduced to the coin's surface through improper care or storage. Examples include PVC or Verdigris.
This wording is very clear. Restoration WILL remove contaminants. Not "might" remove. I guess that's unless they think they coin is better off with contaminants.
I trust that JA knows PVC when he sees it, but I'd like to see what the forum says. My last interaction with CS was that I could submit the coin under a Guarantee submission which I guess I'll be doing because they'll either decide to restore it (and hopefully not charge me this time) or replace the coin which I probably wouldn't mind if they found a nice one.
BTW, I think the Trueview photos have gotten better, this one is pretty decent IMO.
Comments
AI answer:
PVC on silver coins appears as a greenish, cloudy, or milky haze or streaks, sometimes forming tiny green blobs.
Don't know if it's PVC or not, PVC I am most accustomed to seeing on Peace Dollars is a hard, milky film.
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Its supposed to be green right?
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I will point you to my thread Please Allow Me To Introduce Myself - I Am PVC. Might help.
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/1077719/please-allow-me-to-introduce-myself-i-am-pvc-update-completed
I tried to take photos showing the various looks of the PVC on these heavily PVC'd coins. At the end I took a global photo of the removed PVC mainly using acetone.
The obverse has those darker areas which are suspect but I don't see the film to go with it. So I don't know there. Could some have been removed?
The reverse at 9 o/c near the outside has some lines looking a little like a finger print in the haze (PVC?) and then the potential PVC haze inside that.
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Well that's certainly what JA's sticker says.
Typical pass the buck reaction; if you had a letter from cac that the MS64 1927-s Peace dollar needs to be dipped to remove the pvc that may be enough?
Not always
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
It's hard to tell from the photos
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
I have no idea if it's PVC. But I gave a similar story. I also have a 27-S peace dollar that has great luster but is subdued by haze on the coin. I thought it was PVC so I sent it in for restoration. Well they didn't restore my coin either but they did upgrade it from 63 - 64. I highly doubt PCGS would upgrade a coin that was deemed not suitable for restoration with existing PVC residue. And now I'm more confused than ever about what is PVC and what isn't. I never sent the coin to CAC because I'm almost positive it would not sticker. I'll attach a picture of my coin before I sent it back. At the end of the day grades and stickers are all just expert opinions.
I think that's a fairly common appearance for Peace dollars, I don't think the haze all over is the PVC. Nor do I think a restoration will remove it. I think in the end I have to trust JA. If anyone knows coin surfaces and coin issues it's him. I have a feeling the restoration staff looked at the coin quickly and thought they couldn't improve the coin without looking at it close enough to see the PVC. That's my theory.
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I sent a Franklin half dollar in a rattler holder for stickering that had some faint beige haze; I had no idea it would fail due to "PVC". I, too, am under the impression that PVC haze has a green tint, and I don't want to crack the coin to restore it until I can confirm that the haze is damaging the surfaces or I am able to remove similar haze on a raw coin.
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That looks like what I call "storage crud".
PVC doesn't always have a green tint, it can sometimes look like an even, slightly cloudy sheen. If you blot some acetone on with a q-tip the residue will appear green.
Maybe I have handled hundreds of silver dollars that looked fine but ended up with a green Qtip when treated with MS before submission. With that I would sell and buy a better one, you will be better off $$$ wise.
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Since I love being pedantic, there is another way to read PCGS's statement. Yes, restoration WILL remove contaminants, but that's what they promise IF they choose to restore the coin. If they disagree that there is a contaminant or decide they won't be able to remove a contaminant, they can opt to not restore the coin and their statement remains true.
Now, if there is a surface contaminant that, if not removed, indicates damage, the coin should be protected under their guarantee. But then it becomes a question of how what you're observing is classified and by whom, which is separate from what PCGS promises regarding restoration and surface contaminants.
I would try and submit it for restoration, its only $10.