Flying Eagle Cents 🦅

Copperindian · July 18, 2024 10:59AM

@gorebels:
Your “oddball” is a pattern - the PT1. It’s distinguished by 4 leaves under the “E” in STATES.

Copperindian · July 18, 2024 11:05AM

@redraider: nice detail! Right now, the two coins have equal billing as 2* varieties in Rick’s book. As long as they’re not in the FS guide, though, PCGS won’t “officially” recognize them. For me, that doesn't matter a lot as I like “meaty” varieties like these two.
Btw, if yours is graded MS64, it’s the finest known. Congrats on a great pickup!

gorebels · July 18, 2024 11:37AM

@rnkmyer1 said:
@gorebels:
Your “oddball” is a pattern - the PT1. It’s distinguished by 4 leaves under the “E” in STATES.

Thanks, I knew it to be an impaired pattern but nothing more.

MtW124 · July 18, 2024 5:15PM

The only one that I have. Lg letters Low leaves FS-901

Copperindian · October 6, 2024 5:14PM

It’s been a long time since I posted here - almost 3 months. The thread was buried in page 24!
Yesterday in “Saturday morning coffee with coins”, I posted a new FE I just acquired. The pics below are ones that I DIDN'T post in that thread:

It’s a PCGS MS64+ & has exceptional eye appeal & beautiful toning! Strike is imperfect with weakness in the upper obv & corresponding lower rev. There’s a very cool clash mark just below the eagle’s beak that makes it appear it bit off a little too much! Also it appears to be carrying a “pin” in one of its wings for additional protection. I think my imagination is a little wild, but these features add to the coin’s coolness factor. I think! Anyway, feels good to revive this thread!

golden · October 6, 2024 5:19PM

I remember the thrill of getting my first Flying Eagle by mail order back in the early 1960's.

Copperindian · November 7, 2024 9:41AM

My favorite thread (found buried on page 10). This is my newest FE:

It completed a trade with a long time collector of the series. Nice deal for both of us!

DMWJR · November 7, 2024 10:06AM

I love that coin! SL proofs were perfection for the series (and the winner of the 12 pc pattern set competition!)

jfriedm56 · November 7, 2024 1:45PM

@Copperindian said:
My favorite thread (found buried on page 10). This is my newest FE:

It completed a trade with a long time collector of the series. Nice deal for both of us!

Wonderful coin Ken!

Twobitcollector · November 8, 2024 3:54AM

Copperindian · December 16, 2024 12:12AM

Under under bidder:

$22k in tonight’s GC auction. Beautiful piece & seldom available at this grade level. I made a strong bid but it was only 3rd best!

WiscKau · December 16, 2024 3:27AM

My one and only. Type set coin. Lg Letters, NGC VF-25

Copperindian · January 12, 2025 6:28AM

From the FUN show:

While it’s not one I “needed”, I found it irresistible! Both stickers, OGH & just a nice, likely undergraded coin in this collectible grade.

Copperindian · January 12, 2025 6:33AM

@POCKETCHANGE: nice to meet you & chat at the show Eric! I owe you big time for creating this thread - FE’s are my fave series!
Ken

P0CKETCHANGE · January 12, 2025 6:43AM

@Copperindian said:
@POCKETCHANGE: nice to meet you & chat at the show Eric! I owe you big time for creating this thread - FE’s are my fave series!
Ken

Great meeting you and thanks for showing me your new acquisitions!

Copperindian · January 22, 2025 2:06PM

Finally! After winning this one in the Blay GC auction some 14-15 months ago, I submitted for the EEPS to pair with the green CAC. And now, it’s double stickered!

Still holds the top spot in the PCGS pop.

jfriedm56 · January 22, 2025 3:02PM

@Copperindian said:
Finally! After winning this one in the Blay GC auction some 14-15 months ago, I submitted for the EEPS to pair with the green CAC. And now, it’s double stickered!

Still holds the top spot in the PCGS pop.

She’s a beauty Ken!

P0CKETCHANGE · January 22, 2025 3:04PM

That’s an absolute stunner. Don’t forget the CMQ sticker.

Copperindian · January 22, 2025 3:08PM

@POCKETCHANGE: I should Eric! I’ll join you as a triple sticker guy. Actually, I could make it 4 - the one below was developed for Stewart:

Copperindian · February 2, 2025 9:49AM

Pleasant surprise - it’s back:

I noticed the old TV above replaced the newer one below:

Incredibly enough, they are the same coin! Good to have the old TV restored - it’s essentially a 100% match to the coin. The “newer” one looked nothing like it.

Copperindian · March 2, 2025 11:34AM

Flyer Frustration:
My partner & I were/are of like mind & submitted this coin for an upgrade to 66+ from 66.

PCGS declined & kept it at 66. The lighter pics we felt supported our decision. There’s a couple marks, nothing serious that should have kept it from a + grade. To be fair to our hosts, it’s certainly not a 67.
But, we did obtain a bean, which had to be a no brainer for CAC:

Essentially, it’s double stickered. Here’s the old TV, which matches the TV above except for ID#. The EEPS has the old #, CAC the new one.

We’re going to wait a couple months & try again. In our opinion, it compares favorably & more to the 66+ that auctioned through GC a couple months ago.

OldIndianNutKase · March 2, 2025 11:41AM

@Copperindian said:
Flyer Frustration:
My partner & I were/are of like mind & submitted this coin for an upgrade to 66+ from 66.

PCGS declined & kept it at 66. The lighter pics we felt supported our decision. There’s a couple marks, nothing serious that should have kept it from a + grade. To be fair to our hosts, it’s certainly not a 67.
But, we did obtain a bean, which had to be a no brainer for CAC:

Obviously it is a very top end 66 and deserving of a +. Good luck with resubmitting. And thank you for sharing your PCGS submittal experience as it is very insightful. I sometimes think they do keep track of the number of times you have resubmitted and eventually award your perservereance.

P0CKETCHANGE · March 2, 2025 11:43AM

@Copperindian I’m a big believer in presenting a coin as well as possible for a Recon attempt. That would have meant sending the coin to CAC prior to the first submission. Now that you have the CAC but lost the EEPS, I’d send it back to Rick before the next attempt at PCGS. I’ll get flamed for this suggestion, but if I really wanted the best chance at the plus, I’d also send it to CMQ. Looks like a fantastic coin.

Copperindian · March 2, 2025 11:45AM

@POCKETCHANGE: you are the original triple sticker guy, so no flaming from here!

P0CKETCHANGE · March 2, 2025 11:47AM

@Copperindian said:
@POCKETCHANGE: you are the original triple sticker guy, so no flaming from here!

I actually just submitted my triple stickered FE for Recon this week. Fingers crossed.

Copperindian · March 2, 2025 11:56AM

@POCKETCHANGE: good luck! Btw, we didn’t submit as a recon, consequently the new ID#. This time around I’m inclined to go recon with both stickers, but I’ll leave it up to my partner as he’s better about navigating these things than I am.

P0CKETCHANGE · March 2, 2025 12:00PM

@Copperindian said:
@POCKETCHANGE: good luck! Btw, we didn’t submit as a recon, consequently the new ID#. This time around I’m inclined to go recon with both stickers, but I’ll leave it up to my partner as he’s better about navigating these things than I am.

Good point, I should have noticed that. Generally if I know the coin isn’t going to make a full point (or I don’t want it to), I think Recon is the better route, especially if stickered. The exception to that would be if coin is already + graded.

Copperindian · March 2, 2025 12:03PM

@POCKETCHANGE: absolutely agree Eric! But we were nearly 100% certain; I was stunned when they kept it at 66.
Ken

P0CKETCHANGE · March 2, 2025 12:10PM

@Copperindian said:
@POCKETCHANGE: absolutely agree Eric! But we were nearly 100% certain; I was stunned when they kept it at 66.
Ken

I could be mistaken, but I don’t think the graders see the current grade on a Regrade, so IMO they’re more likely to default to a whole grade than a plus. @winesteven has had a ton of success getting plus upgrades on Recons too.

winesteven · March 2, 2025 12:39PM

@P0CKETCHANGE said:

@Copperindian said:
@POCKETCHANGE: absolutely agree Eric! But we were nearly 100% certain; I was stunned when they kept it at 66.
Ken

I could be mistaken, but I don’t think the graders see the current grade on a Regrade, so IMO they’re more likely to default to a whole grade than a plus. @winesteven has had a ton of success getting plus upgrades on Recons too.

Correct, in that the graders don't see what the "old" grade was on the coin that PCGS cracked out for a Regrade. Only after the grader and Finalizer determine the grade, do they (or someone else) then compares them, and whichever is higher is the grade that then goes on the new holder. As such, I agree with @pocketchange that with human nature, the graders may be focusing more on a whole grade. That could be good for a 65 or 65+ moving to a 66. but not good for a 65 moving to a 65+ via Regrade. My SENSE is Reconsideration may be the better route than regrade for a 65 to go to a 65+, as the grader would likely pay more thought to if that coin merits a plus. Again, just my sense, with NO data to back that up.

Steve

Copperindian · March 2, 2025 1:11PM

Good advice @POCKETCHANGE & @winesteven. Recon it is (& showing the double stickers this time around). Stay tuned - in a couple months anyway.

OldIndianNutKase · March 2, 2025 9:55PM

@winesteven I find your reconsideration logic to be spot on. I had resubmitted this 1885 IHC PR67BN as a regrade

With no positive (+) results. This coin is 68 quality, but that would make it a POP1/0 . And perhaps the POP is a consideration in the grading process, and it did not quite meet their 68 quality standard. I can only find a few toning spots that would keep it from a 69.....but that grade is way beyond my grading perspective.

OINK

winesteven · March 4, 2025 9:57PM

OINK, thanks for your kind words. Regarding the pop situation potentially being part of the grading process, I’m not sure I agree. Several of my plus upgrades via reconsideration brought those coins to a pop level that the PCGS Price Guide level more than doubled, or almost tripled. Not often, but a few.

One of those is my 1866 Two Cent piece, bought as a MS66RD w/CAC. I bought it in October 2020 from GC. At that time the PCGS Price Guide was at $7,500. I paid up for the coin, paying $8,531 with the bp, as I recognize that coins are not commodities where every 66RD are worth the same as each other. Coins with better eye quality are worth more. Since it was so nice, I sent it back to PCGS for Reconsideration. It then got that little plus. None graded higher, and I don’t recall at that time how many others were at that top 66+RD grade, but today there are four. At that time, the Price Guide for 1866 MS66+RD was $20,000. Today, the PCGS Price Guide is at $25,000. By the way, this coin is still the Coin Facts Plate Coin for 1866 2 cent Red coins!

Steve

WiscKau · March 5, 2025 6:34AM

There is no white dot on the coin.

Copperindian · April 10, 2025 10:51AM

Really TOUGH NEWP:

The last two pics are important. It shows as a S-9, but it’s now confirmed as the ultra rare S-1. Pics 3&4 show the diagnostics. #3 shows the doubling on the “1” & “8”. Pic 4 shows the repunching on the outer E in CENT & on the inner part of the N.
It’s a 62 due to a modest amount of small marks. I concur with the grade. But, it’s also a EDS, which makes it the #2 ranked example known. There have been about 5 examples accounted for. Finally, it has really nice eye appeal with a rich coppery finish.

Update 4/15: it’s official - the S-9 has been properly updated to the correct S-1:

renomedphys · April 10, 2025 6:17PM

This is my S-3 1856, graded PR65+ with an Eagle Eye Photo seal

I had all my coins spread out on a dining room table at my cousin’s house while I was at FUN. He asked for the tour, I gave it to him. At the end, just looking at all the obverses, he said this was the prettiest coin I had in the whole set. I was a little taken aback, and maybe reflexively started defending other coins, but I think he was right. The dang thing is a cameo, at least on the obverse, and might as well be a 67. Were it not for a little alloy impurity on the reverse, it would be a 67, and I wouldn’t get to own it.

Copperindian · April 16, 2025 7:04AM

The End of an Era:

PR62 S-1

PR64 S-2

PR64 S-3

PR63+ S-4

PR65 S-5

PR66 S-9

PR64+ CAM

PR65 SL

PR65 LL

Currently the #1 PCGS Registry Set: “Flying Eagle Cents Complete Variety Set Proof (1856-1858)”. When I retire it, it will rank #3 all time. A few of the coins in this set were also part of the #1 & #2 sets.
Yesterday I shipped the set off to a dealer I selected to handle the sale of the entire set. It was time. There wasn’t much I could do to improve it, plus these are so rare collectively that they have to be marketed properly to sell. While I considered HA, GC & EERC to handle the sale, I chose this particular dealer as 1) I’ve known him for a long time (@ FUN we actually figured I was his first customer); 2) I’ve seen his work & continued to buy nice coins from him over a period of years; & 3) I accepted & enthusiastically agree with his plan as far as going about the sale. I’ll reveal the dealer in a separate thread I’ll start in a couple weeks, once he gets started & progresses through the various stages of the sale. Included in the thread will be separate posts discussing each of the 9 coins individually, including a number of photos in addition to those above.
So, stay tuned. Even if one has little or no interest in flyers and/or flyer proofs, it might be both interesting & fun to follow the developments as they unfold.

Coinbert · April 16, 2025 8:53AM

Really incredible Flying Eagle's Copperindian! I have never owned an 1856. Have an 1858 SL as part of a Proof set. Will follow your sale progress.

Coinbert · April 16, 2025 8:55AM

Proof 66 CAC

Copperindian · April 16, 2025 9:14AM

@Coinbert: she’s a BEAUTY!

jfriedm56 · April 16, 2025 9:32AM

Wow Ken, quite an impressive and near impossible set to assemble. Let us know when you sell to watch the progress. Best of luck with your sale. Zack.

alaura22 · April 16, 2025 6:49PM

@Copperindian
Ken,Stunning.............OMG
If we guess who the dealer is would you confirm?

Copperindian · April 16, 2025 7:58PM

@alaura22: I’m doing a reveal in a couple weeks when he’s made some progress & gets this underway. But Mike, you can always PM me & if you’re right, I’ll let you know. Btw, he verified he received them today; not bad - just sent yesterday.
Ken

DMWJR · April 16, 2025 8:36PM

Ken, wow! Maybe I will get a few friends back. You built an incredible collection!!!

alaura22 · April 16, 2025 8:51PM

@Copperindian said:
@alaura22: I’m doing a reveal in a couple weeks when he’s made some progress & gets this underway. But Mike, you can always PM me & if you’re right, I’ll let you know. Btw, he verified he received them today; not bad - just sent yesterday.
Ken

I'll let you do the big reveal, Can't wait

BillJones · April 17, 2025 11:43AM

A recent purchase which completed an "old time" set, which includes the 1856, 1857, 1858 Small Letter and this one, the 1858 Large Letter. I'll leave the die varieties to the specialists. This is PCGS graded MS-64.

jfriedm56 · April 17, 2025 1:10PM

@BillJones said:
A recent purchase which completed an "old time" set, which includes the 1856, 1857, 1858 Small Letter and this one, the 1858 Large Letter. I'll leave the die varieties to the specialists. This is PCGS graded MS-64.

So glad you found the 1858 LL you’ve been looking for. And she’s a beauty. Congrats!

DMWJR · April 17, 2025 1:11PM

Nice!!!

Coinbert · April 17, 2025 1:25PM

Very nice!

Inlander · April 17, 2025 7:09PM

A recent pick-up in 64...

Flying Eagle Cents 🦅

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