@coinbuf said:
The coin in the op is without question MS66+ in today's market grading world so MS67 is not that much of a stretch. A case where the excellent luster carried the load just as some toning gives a grade bump.
The coin might be MS66+ “without question” to you. But to a number of us, that’s far from the case. The images (which granted, might be highly misleading) make it appear that the coin’s obverse is peppered with conspicuous contact marks. And excellent luster can’t even begin to compensate for that.
I'm sorry but you are not correct, in today's market grading driven grading room luster and color overcome subpar surfaces quite often. I don't agree with greadflation (no that is not a typo) and it shouldn't be that way but it is. I've been collecting Lincolns for decades and have seen many coins like this in 66 or 67 holders, the grade doesn't surprise me in the least even with the subpar images.
It’s good to know that you can be so certain in your assessment and opinion, even though more than 10 other posters (as in nearly everyone else who replied) think the coin deserved a lower grade than you do. You should start a one-man grading service.
I'm not sure what has your panties in such a wad here Mark, is it that your grade guess was far too low.
I never said I agree with the MS67 grade, only that I see both PCGS and NGC over grade coins (of all type and denomination) due to excellent luster and/or color while ignoring or discounting surface presentation. While I came into this thread after the reveal, I would have guessed MS66+ for the grade knowing how PCGS grades and what they value and discount when grading.
In a recent thread about grading a seated half you chastised members of the forum who guessed lower than AU
Maybe you should apply your own words to yourself as your MS63RD grade was far too strict.
No panties in a wad, here, but rather, more than mild surprise at your below comment and attitude, despite the overwhelming disagreement with your assessment. I’m often confident in posting minimum or maximum grade guesses/estimates. But I don’t remember being so to the extent of saying “without question…”. And if nearly everyone disagreed with me, I’d at least question my own assessment and wonder where I might have gone wrong.
“The coin in the op is without question MS66+ in today's market grading so MS67 is not that much of a stretch. A case where the excellent luster carried the load just as some toning gives a grade bump.”
Thankfully I have confidence in my area, Lincolns, not to be shaken by some random guesses on a coin forum from people that have never seen the coin in hand. And my confidence is rewarded as all those guesses; including yours; were way wrong.
@coinbuf said:
The coin in the op is without question MS66+ in today's market grading world so MS67 is not that much of a stretch. A case where the excellent luster carried the load just as some toning gives a grade bump.
The coin might be MS66+ “without question” to you. But to a number of us, that’s far from the case. The images (which granted, might be highly misleading) make it appear that the coin’s obverse is peppered with conspicuous contact marks. And excellent luster can’t even begin to compensate for that.
I'm sorry but you are not correct, in today's market grading driven grading room luster and color overcome subpar surfaces quite often. I don't agree with greadflation (no that is not a typo) and it shouldn't be that way but it is. I've been collecting Lincolns for decades and have seen many coins like this in 66 or 67 holders, the grade doesn't surprise me in the least even with the subpar images.
It’s good to know that you can be so certain in your assessment and opinion, even though more than 10 other posters (as in nearly everyone else who replied) think the coin deserved a lower grade than you do. You should start a one-man grading service.
I'm not sure what has your panties in such a wad here Mark, is it that your grade guess was far too low.
I never said I agree with the MS67 grade, only that I see both PCGS and NGC over grade coins (of all type and denomination) due to excellent luster and/or color while ignoring or discounting surface presentation. While I came into this thread after the reveal, I would have guessed MS66+ for the grade knowing how PCGS grades and what they value and discount when grading.
In a recent thread about grading a seated half you chastised members of the forum who guessed lower than AU
Maybe you should apply your own words to yourself as your MS63RD grade was far too strict.
No panties in a wad, here, but rather, more than mild surprise at your below comment and attitude, despite the overwhelming disagreement with your assessment. I’m often confident in posting minimum or maximum grade guesses/estimates. But I don’t remember being so to the extent of saying “without question…”. And if nearly everyone disagreed with me, I’d at least question my own assessment and wonder where I might have gone wrong.
“The coin in the op is without question MS66+ in today's market grading so MS67 is not that much of a stretch. A case where the excellent luster carried the load just as some toning gives a grade bump.”
Thankfully I have confidence in my area, Lincolns, not to be shaken by some random guesses on a coin forum from people that have never seen the coin in hand. And my confidence is rewarded as all those guesses; including yours; were way wrong.
You’ve been posting as if you guessed the (approximate) grade of the coin before it was posted. Did you, in fact, do that? I looked and didn’t see any such post. I only see your posts trying to justify the assigned grade, after it was revealed.
I’m fine being “way wrong”, along with other random guesses (based on subpar images) - I was in some very good company, even if we might not be nearly as full/sure of ourselves as you sound.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@coinbuf said:
The coin in the op is without question MS66+ in today's market grading world so MS67 is not that much of a stretch. A case where the excellent luster carried the load just as some toning gives a grade bump.
The coin might be MS66+ “without question” to you. But to a number of us, that’s far from the case. The images (which granted, might be highly misleading) make it appear that the coin’s obverse is peppered with conspicuous contact marks. And excellent luster can’t even begin to compensate for that.
I'm sorry but you are not correct, in today's market grading driven grading room luster and color overcome subpar surfaces quite often. I don't agree with greadflation (no that is not a typo) and it shouldn't be that way but it is. I've been collecting Lincolns for decades and have seen many coins like this in 66 or 67 holders, the grade doesn't surprise me in the least even with the subpar images.
It’s good to know that you can be so certain in your assessment and opinion, even though more than 10 other posters (as in nearly everyone else who replied) think the coin deserved a lower grade than you do. You should start a one-man grading service.
I'm not sure what has your panties in such a wad here Mark, is it that your grade guess was far too low.
I never said I agree with the MS67 grade, only that I see both PCGS and NGC over grade coins (of all type and denomination) due to excellent luster and/or color while ignoring or discounting surface presentation. While I came into this thread after the reveal, I would have guessed MS66+ for the grade knowing how PCGS grades and what they value and discount when grading.
In a recent thread about grading a seated half you chastised members of the forum who guessed lower than AU
Maybe you should apply your own words to yourself as your MS63RD grade was far too strict.
No panties in a wad, here, but rather, more than mild surprise at your below comment and attitude, despite the overwhelming disagreement with your assessment. I’m often confident in posting minimum or maximum grade guesses/estimates. But I don’t remember being so to the extent of saying “without question…”. And if nearly everyone disagreed with me, I’d at least question my own assessment and wonder where I might have gone wrong.
“The coin in the op is without question MS66+ in today's market grading so MS67 is not that much of a stretch. A case where the excellent luster carried the load just as some toning gives a grade bump.”
Thankfully I have confidence in my area, Lincolns, not to be shaken by some random guesses on a coin forum from people that have never seen the coin in hand. And my confidence is rewarded as all those guesses; including yours; were way wrong.
You’ve been posting as if you guessed the (approximate) grade of the coin before it was posted. Did you, in fact, do that? I looked and didn’t see any such post. I only see your posts trying to justify the assigned grade, after it was revealed.
I’m fine being “way wrong”, along with other random guesses (based on subpar images) - I was in some very good company, even if we might not be nearly as full/sure of ourselves as you sound.
It seems that you are trying to justify how wrong your guess was Mark, I'm afraid I cannot help you with that, you will have to find a way to deal with it on your own.
@coinbuf said:
The coin in the op is without question MS66+ in today's market grading world so MS67 is not that much of a stretch. A case where the excellent luster carried the load just as some toning gives a grade bump.
The coin might be MS66+ “without question” to you. But to a number of us, that’s far from the case. The images (which granted, might be highly misleading) make it appear that the coin’s obverse is peppered with conspicuous contact marks. And excellent luster can’t even begin to compensate for that.
I'm sorry but you are not correct, in today's market grading driven grading room luster and color overcome subpar surfaces quite often. I don't agree with greadflation (no that is not a typo) and it shouldn't be that way but it is. I've been collecting Lincolns for decades and have seen many coins like this in 66 or 67 holders, the grade doesn't surprise me in the least even with the subpar images.
It’s good to know that you can be so certain in your assessment and opinion, even though more than 10 other posters (as in nearly everyone else who replied) think the coin deserved a lower grade than you do. You should start a one-man grading service.
I'm not sure what has your panties in such a wad here Mark, is it that your grade guess was far too low.
I never said I agree with the MS67 grade, only that I see both PCGS and NGC over grade coins (of all type and denomination) due to excellent luster and/or color while ignoring or discounting surface presentation. While I came into this thread after the reveal, I would have guessed MS66+ for the grade knowing how PCGS grades and what they value and discount when grading.
In a recent thread about grading a seated half you chastised members of the forum who guessed lower than AU
Maybe you should apply your own words to yourself as your MS63RD grade was far too strict.
No panties in a wad, here, but rather, more than mild surprise at your below comment and attitude, despite the overwhelming disagreement with your assessment. I’m often confident in posting minimum or maximum grade guesses/estimates. But I don’t remember being so to the extent of saying “without question…”. And if nearly everyone disagreed with me, I’d at least question my own assessment and wonder where I might have gone wrong.
“The coin in the op is without question MS66+ in today's market grading so MS67 is not that much of a stretch. A case where the excellent luster carried the load just as some toning gives a grade bump.”
Thankfully I have confidence in my area, Lincolns, not to be shaken by some random guesses on a coin forum from people that have never seen the coin in hand. And my confidence is rewarded as all those guesses; including yours; were way wrong.
You’ve been posting as if you guessed the (approximate) grade of the coin before it was posted. Did you, in fact, do that? I looked and didn’t see any such post. I only see your posts trying to justify the assigned grade, after it was revealed.
I’m fine being “way wrong”, along with other random guesses (based on subpar images) - I was in some very good company, even if we might not be nearly as full/sure of ourselves as you sound.
It seems that you are trying to justify how wrong your guess was Mark, I'm afraid I cannot help you with that, you will have to find a way to deal with it on your own.
I take your above post as confirmation that you never did guess the grade before it was posted. But that sure hasn’t stopped you from talking up your own grading abilities. 😉
Please don’t worry too much about me. If I feel that I need help, I’d be looking elsewhere, anyway.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@MFeld said:
No panties in a wad, here, but rather, more than mild surprise at your below comment and attitude, despite the overwhelming disagreement with your assessment.
Not sure there was “overwhelming disagreement”. In fact, the 2nd guess was 66RD, and the third was 65RD (which I hit the “agree” button to immediately). So the first 50-75% of guesses identified the coin as a gem. Consider also that your much lower guess may have swayed those that followed, as people weight your opinion highly.
@coinbuf said:
The coin in the op is without question MS66+ in today's market grading world so MS67 is not that much of a stretch. A case where the excellent luster carried the load just as some toning gives a grade bump.
The coin might be MS66+ “without question” to you. But to a number of us, that’s far from the case. The images (which granted, might be highly misleading) make it appear that the coin’s obverse is peppered with conspicuous contact marks. And excellent luster can’t even begin to compensate for that.
I'm sorry but you are not correct, in today's market grading driven grading room luster and color overcome subpar surfaces quite often. I don't agree with greadflation (no that is not a typo) and it shouldn't be that way but it is. I've been collecting Lincolns for decades and have seen many coins like this in 66 or 67 holders, the grade doesn't surprise me in the least even with the subpar images.
It’s good to know that you can be so certain in your assessment and opinion, even though more than 10 other posters (as in nearly everyone else who replied) think the coin deserved a lower grade than you do. You should start a one-man grading service.
I'm not sure what has your panties in such a wad here Mark, is it that your grade guess was far too low.
I never said I agree with the MS67 grade, only that I see both PCGS and NGC over grade coins (of all type and denomination) due to excellent luster and/or color while ignoring or discounting surface presentation. While I came into this thread after the reveal, I would have guessed MS66+ for the grade knowing how PCGS grades and what they value and discount when grading.
In a recent thread about grading a seated half you chastised members of the forum who guessed lower than AU
Maybe you should apply your own words to yourself as your MS63RD grade was far too strict.
No panties in a wad, here, but rather, more than mild surprise at your below comment and attitude, despite the overwhelming disagreement with your assessment. I’m often confident in posting minimum or maximum grade guesses/estimates. But I don’t remember being so to the extent of saying “without question…”. And if nearly everyone disagreed with me, I’d at least question my own assessment and wonder where I might have gone wrong.
“The coin in the op is without question MS66+ in today's market grading so MS67 is not that much of a stretch. A case where the excellent luster carried the load just as some toning gives a grade bump.”
Thankfully I have confidence in my area, Lincolns, not to be shaken by some random guesses on a coin forum from people that have never seen the coin in hand. And my confidence is rewarded as all those guesses; including yours; were way wrong.
You’ve been posting as if you guessed the (approximate) grade of the coin before it was posted. Did you, in fact, do that? I looked and didn’t see any such post. I only see your posts trying to justify the assigned grade, after it was revealed.
I’m fine being “way wrong”, along with other random guesses (based on subpar images) - I was in some very good company, even if we might not be nearly as full/sure of ourselves as you sound.
It seems that you are trying to justify how wrong your guess was Mark, I'm afraid I cannot help you with that, you will have to find a way to deal with it on your own.
I take your above post as confirmation that you never did guess the grade before it was posted. But that sure hasn’t stopped you from talking up your own grading abilities. 😉
Please don’t worry too much about me. If I feel that I need help, I’d be looking elsewhere, anyway.
No doubt, your way wrong guess shows you would turn away from anyone that has correct information.
@blitzdude said:
So we have a grade reveal. What was the interesting question for us to answer after? RGDS!
Probably something along the lines of, "Ok, now that you've seen how poorly some other "MS67" Lincolns look, who wants to form a line on the left to purchase my stellar untra GEM that I posted here at $499.?!"
@MFeld said:
No panties in a wad, here, but rather, more than mild surprise at your below comment and attitude, despite the overwhelming disagreement with your assessment.
Not sure there was “overwhelming disagreement”. In fact, the 2nd guess was 66RD, and the third was 65RD (which I hit the “agree” button to immediately). So the first 50-75% of guesses identified the coin as a gem. Consider also that your much lower guess may have swayed those that followed, as people weight your opinion highly.
Maybe you’re confusing “overwhelming” with “unanimous”. Because, based on the grade guesses prior to the reveal - see below - and comments posted afterwards, you should be sure that there was “overwhelming disagreement” with an assessment of “without question 66+” for a coin that was graded 67. Grade guesses of 66, 65, “Gem” and below don’t constitute agreement.
Grade guesses:
58
66
65
63
63
64 (“limit”)
63
“not close to a 67”
64
62
After posting of assigned grade before
65
Coinbuf “without question 66+ in today’s market grading world…”
63 or 64
66 (from same poster who guessed 66 before grade was posted, as well)
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@TomB said:
I"m confused with why the ebay listing is being conflated with the coin in the OP. However, I think I might regret asking what the backstory is, so if no one wants to explain it to me then we are all good.
Ike is being Ike and screwing up a discussion??
Funny that you speak of screwing up a discussion when you are replying in sequence to older posts that everyone else in the discussion has already long moved past.
Most people coming late to a discussion would simply read all of the previous posts and get up to speed before commenting, but you do you.
@MFeld said:
No panties in a wad, here, but rather, more than mild surprise at your below comment and attitude, despite the overwhelming disagreement with your assessment.
Not sure there was “overwhelming disagreement”. In fact, the 2nd guess was 66RD, and the third was 65RD (which I hit the “agree” button to immediately). So the first 50-75% of guesses identified the coin as a gem. Consider also that your much lower guess may have swayed those that followed, as people weight your opinion highly.
Maybe you’re confusing “overwhelming” with “unanimous”. Because, based on the grade guesses prior to the reveal - see below - and comments posted afterwards, you should be sure that there was “overwhelming disagreement” with an assessment of “without question 66+” for a coin that was graded 67. Grade guesses of 66, 65, “Gem” and below don’t constitute agreement.
Grade guesses:
58
66
65
63
63
64 (“limit”)
63
“not close to a 67”
64
62
After posting of assigned grade before
65
Coinbuf “without question 66+ in today’s market grading world…”
63 or 64
66 (from same poster who guessed 66 before grade was posted, as well)
Lol. Thank you for the tally. Agreement is relative. There were several guesses that were more in agreement with 66+ than yours. And like I said, your much lower (and much more wrong) guess may have influenced the ones after you. Had you guessed 66, which would have been a much more correct guess, the ones following may have been higher too.
@MFeld said:
No panties in a wad, here, but rather, more than mild surprise at your below comment and attitude, despite the overwhelming disagreement with your assessment.
Not sure there was “overwhelming disagreement”. In fact, the 2nd guess was 66RD, and the third was 65RD (which I hit the “agree” button to immediately). So the first 50-75% of guesses identified the coin as a gem. Consider also that your much lower guess may have swayed those that followed, as people weight your opinion highly.
Maybe you’re confusing “overwhelming” with “unanimous”. Because, based on the grade guesses prior to the reveal - see below - and comments posted afterwards, you should be sure that there was “overwhelming disagreement” with an assessment of “without question 66+” for a coin that was graded 67. Grade guesses of 66, 65, “Gem” and below don’t constitute agreement.
Grade guesses:
58
66
65
63
63
64 (“limit”)
63
“not close to a 67”
64
62
After posting of assigned grade before
65
Coinbuf “without question 66+ in today’s market grading world…”
63 or 64
66 (from same poster who guessed 66 before grade was posted, as well)
Lol. Thank you for the tally. Agreement is relative. There were several guesses that were more in agreement with 66+ than yours. And like I said, your much lower (and much more wrong) guess may have influenced the ones after you. Had you guessed 66, which would have been a much more correct guess, the ones following may have been higher too.
You’re welcome.😉 For the record, I count 10 grade guesses prior to the reveal. One of them was “not close to a 67”, so I’ll omit it, along with mine. Of the remaining 8 guesses, 6 were closer to 63 than to 66+. So I don’t know where you came up with “There were several guesses that were more in agreement with 66+ than yours”.
If you’d like to speculate that my grade guess skewed the results, so be it.
I’m done with this thread, now, as I need to go try to learn how to grade Lincoln cents.😉
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@4Redisin said: @P0CKETCHANGE said:
Lol. Thank you for the tally. Agreement is relative. There were several guesses that were more in agreement with 66+ than yours. And like I said, your much lower (and much more wrong) guess may have influenced the ones after you. Had you guessed 66, which would have been a much more correct guess, the ones following may have been higher too.
And that Ikie is one of the best reasons I don't read the thread first and comment on one post at a time so there is no confusion. I've found that on every forum there are many levels of English comprehension. Why add to it?
No worries there - you definitely didn't add to the comprehension.
Now I understand where the "4" in "4Redisin" comes from...you screw up every discussion in at least 4 different ways!
This thread has gone exactly how it was intended. Bad images, guess the grade, coin for sale same grade that was “better” than this images posted, and being sold by the OP. Anger amongst good forum members was the point.
Now all we see is people sticking up for their opinions, many of which were right with the images given. It was a farce from the get go. OP knows and has acknowledged not to post active coins or coins he does not own for GTG.
Don’t feed into this, the OP loves this kind of disagreement and even when helped he cannot help himself to start threads like this. Let’s all just move on and get along!
New England Rarities...Dealer In Colonial Coinage and Americana
@blitzdude said:
So we have a grade reveal. What was the interesting question for us to answer after? RGDS!
Probably something along the lines of, "Ok, now that you've seen how poorly some other "MS67" Lincolns look, who wants to form a line on the left to purchase my stellar untra GEM that I posted here at $499.?!"
No the whole point was to get objective opinions on the coin without being influenced beforehand with the grade and the CAC approval. And THERE WAS NO TRICKERY INVOLVED WITH MY OWNERSHIP OF THE OTHER MS 67 OBH COIN. IKE T DID INDEED SCREW UP MY THREAD WITH HIS PARANOIA
Coin was listed for only $165 which is somewhat low for that 67 Red CAC penny suggesting that perhaps the owner felt the sticker was somewhat lucky and the eye appeal was maybe subpar. and he wanted to blow it out quickly on the Bay.
Stop being funny. I thought everyone knew that ANACS was independent and started grading coins around 1979 making them the second grading service. PCGS was started in 1986 by coin dealers.
EVERYONE knows that. That's why everyone doesn't constantly ask asinine questions and try to police every thread despite being "new" to the board....wait a sec...
I shouldn't joke, 4Red doesn't like it. So, seriously, how many alts have you had and what were they? Or are you just precociously obstinate?
This thread has gone exactly how it was intended. Bad images, guess the grade, coin for sale same grade that was “better” than this images posted, and being sold by the OP. Anger amongst good forum members was the point.
Now all we see is people sticking up for their opinions, many of which were right with the images given. It was a farce from the get go. OP knows and has acknowledged not to post active coins or coins he does not own for GTG.
Don’t feed into this, the OP loves this kind of disagreement and even when helped he cannot help himself to start threads like this. Let’s all just move on and get along!
This thread has gone exactly how it was intended. Bad images, guess the grade, coin for sale same grade that was “better” than this images posted, and being sold by the OP. Anger amongst good forum members was the point.
Now all we see is people sticking up for their opinions, many of which were right with the images given. It was a farce from the get go. OP knows and has acknowledged not to post active coins or coins he does not own for GTG.
Don’t feed into this, the OP loves this kind of disagreement and even when helped he cannot help himself to start threads like this. Let’s all just move on and get along!
Absolutely False Coin Was already Sold At $159 when I posted and I am tired of being misunderstood here. This was posted as a good faith GTG with absolutely no intention to promote my own coin, till Ike T posted it and ruined my thread. You cannot simply accept that fact but would rather bash an innocent poster. Your problem not mine
i did not think you were promoting your own coin. but sensed there was a comparison coming. though, admittedly, it did not necessarily have to be. in the past there were a number of gtg threads where the reveal was an over/under grade. just don't see the so much because the many of us already know this happens, thus there is nothing "big" for us in the reveal.
Stop being funny. I thought everyone knew that ANACS was independent and started grading coins around 1979 making them the second grading service. PCGS was started in 1986 by coin dealers.
EVERYONE knows that. That's why everyone doesn't constantly ask asinine questions and try to police every thread despite being "new" to the board....wait a sec...
I shouldn't joke, 4Red doesn't like it. So, seriously, how many alts have you had and what were they? Or are you just precociously obstinate?
You are another of my favorite posters. You have made me want to collect Trade dollars! I just don't understand the tag-team you have with your friend who admits to abusing members that don't know much. If you mean I'm policing the threads by standing up for personal bickering and accusations such as in your post, THEN I'm guilty. I truly wish both of you would block me if that exists on this forum. Then, I'll be out of your life.
A block feature does indeed exist and you can feel free to use it however you like.
I wouldn't dare to block you...how else could I learn the customs, norms, and culture of this multi-decade old message board from someone who has been here for almost 2 months?
4Red really most likely is @Realone aka @Married2Coins . Not positive but there are a lot of similarities. Silver lining is that if it is, then 4Red does understand the culture of this forum...the culture of outing him as an alt. It's a time honored tradition.
@MsMorrisine said:
i did not think you were promoting your own coin. but sensed there was a comparison coming. though, admittedly, it did not necessarily have to be. in the past there were a number of gtg threads where the reveal was an over/under grade. just don't see the so much because the many of us already know this happens, thus there is nothing "big" for us in the reveal.
what was your interesting question?
Maybe it wasn’t that interesting. I thought forum members would indeed think the coin was around a 65 grade and the question is how did it get CAC approval as a MS 67 that’s all.
Maybe it wasn’t that interesting. I thought forum members would indeed think the coin was around a 65 grade and the question is how did it get CAC approval as a MS 67 that’s all.
Easy. We on the forum have only suboptimal images to go on. Both PCGS and CAC had multiple graders view the coin in person.
Stop being funny. I thought everyone knew that ANACS was independent and started grading coins around 1979 making them the second grading service. PCGS was started in 1986 by coin dealers.
EVERYONE knows that. That's why everyone doesn't constantly ask asinine questions and try to police every thread despite being "new" to the board....wait a sec...
I shouldn't joke, 4Red doesn't like it. So, seriously, how many alts have you had and what were they? Or are you just precociously obstinate?
You are another of my favorite posters. You have made me want to collect Trade dollars! I just don't understand the tag-team you have with your friend who admits to abusing members that don't know much. If you mean I'm policing the threads by standing up for personal bickering and accusations such as in your post, THEN I'm guilty. I truly wish both of you would block me if that exists on this forum. Then, I'll be out of your life.
A block feature does indeed exist and you can feel free to use it however you like.
I wouldn't dare to block you...how else could I learn the customs, norms, and culture of this multi-decade old message board from someone who has been here for almost 2 months?
4Red really most likely is @Realone aka @Married2Coins . Not positive but there are a lot of similarities. Silver lining is that if it is, then 4Red does understand the culture of this forum...the culture of outing him as an alt. It's a time honored tradition.
FYI, I've been on four other forms for over ten years. I stopped posting across the street a year ago. It's dead and this one is better because of the number of professionals WITH CLASS that post here. I've read this forum for about six years without joining because I'm considered to be an asset on the other forums and didn't have the time for another group. Now that I'm just retired from the military, I have the time. I'm an easy-going guy. Two weeks ago, one member here invited me to join his forum in a PM because none of these personal attacks and accusations go on over there. I told him I already belonged to that forum and had to agree there are some disrespectful members here.
I should not need to remind you and your ilk that this is a coin forum and making unfounded accusations or disrespectful comments that clutter up and redirect a discussion so that I become the "bad guy" and get run off is a cute trick that should not be tolerated. Any more comments about me will be ignored. So have a nice life and post something useful about Trade dollars for the forum.
My ilk and I will often route out alts or people posting in bad faith. Sorry that you have now blocked me and won't see this reply but for all of the others...our suspicions are NOT unfounded. They are well founded indeed.
@coinbuf —Limited expression fails the intention to one-up MFeld. He aspires to more than to parrot facts, he teaches. The winning stroke lies in that he can make a mistake, and that you cannot.
Imagine it as the “razor vs. yo-yo theory”.
Stop being funny. I thought everyone knew that ANACS was independent and started grading coins around 1979 making them the second grading service. PCGS was started in 1986 by coin dealers.
EVERYONE knows that. That's why everyone doesn't constantly ask asinine questions and try to police every thread despite being "new" to the board....wait a sec...
I shouldn't joke, 4Red doesn't like it. So, seriously, how many alts have you had and what were they? Or are you just precociously obstinate?
You are another of my favorite posters. You have made me want to collect Trade dollars! I just don't understand the tag-team you have with your friend who admits to abusing members that don't know much. If you mean I'm policing the threads by standing up for personal bickering and accusations such as in your post, THEN I'm guilty. I truly wish both of you would block me if that exists on this forum. Then, I'll be out of your life.
A block feature does indeed exist and you can feel free to use it however you like.
I wouldn't dare to block you...how else could I learn the customs, norms, and culture of this multi-decade old message board from someone who has been here for almost 2 months?
4Red really most likely is @Realone aka @Married2Coins . Not positive but there are a lot of similarities. Silver lining is that if it is, then 4Red does understand the culture of this forum...the culture of outing him as an alt. It's a time honored tradition.
FYI, I've been on four other forms for over ten years.
4+1=5
So you're a member of 5 coin forums, just like @Married2Coins
@4Redisin said:
I should not need to remind you and your ilk that this is a coin forum and making unfounded accusations or disrespectful comments that clutter up and redirect a discussion so that I become the "bad guy" and get run off is a cute trick that should not be tolerated. Any more comments about me will be ignored. So have a nice life and post something useful about Trade dollars for the forum.
Pretending not to be an alt is a cute trick that should not be tolerated.
@4Redisin said:
Any more comments about me will be ignored.
You're back! Just couldn't resist, eh?
No one else on this Forum has ever called me "Ikie" (or a sloppily misspelled variant thereof), except for one person. Any idea who that might be? You guessed it, it was your banned alt, @Married2Coins !
To be fair, it must be hard for you to keep your different alt personalities straight when you have so many!
Stop being funny. I thought everyone knew that ANACS was independent and started grading coins around 1979 making them the second grading service. PCGS was started in 1986 by coin dealers.
EVERYONE knows that. That's why everyone doesn't constantly ask asinine questions and try to police every thread despite being "new" to the board....wait a sec...
I shouldn't joke, 4Red doesn't like it. So, seriously, how many alts have you had and what were they? Or are you just precociously obstinate?
You are another of my favorite posters. You have made me want to collect Trade dollars! I just don't understand the tag-team you have with your friend who admits to abusing members that don't know much. If you mean I'm policing the threads by standing up for personal bickering and accusations such as in your post, THEN I'm guilty. I truly wish both of you would block me if that exists on this forum. Then, I'll be out of your life.
A block feature does indeed exist and you can feel free to use it however you like.
I wouldn't dare to block you...how else could I learn the customs, norms, and culture of this multi-decade old message board from someone who has been here for almost 2 months?
4Red really most likely is @Realone aka @Married2Coins . Not positive but there are a lot of similarities. Silver lining is that if it is, then 4Red does understand the culture of this forum...the culture of outing him as an alt. It's a time honored tradition.
FYI, I've been on four other forms for over ten years.
4+1=5
So you're a member of 5 coin forums, just like @Married2Coins
@4Redisin said:
I should not need to remind you and your ilk that this is a coin forum and making unfounded accusations or disrespectful comments that clutter up and redirect a discussion so that I become the "bad guy" and get run off is a cute trick that should not be tolerated. Any more comments about me will be ignored. So have a nice life and post something useful about Trade dollars for the forum.
Pretending not to be an alt is a cute trick that should not be tolerated.
@4Redisin said:
Never left. Never blocked anyone. Mike = Mikie and Ike = Ikie. Guess that proves I'm an alt for sure and even which one! Those banned members are living in your head.
@FlyingAl From the posts I've read, I would have thought you were an old, long-time, professional numismatist yet another forum member pointed you out to me at a coin show. You were having a conversation with two men he didn't know or we would have stopped.
I’m afraid I’m almost the opposite of that. Funny how we can make our own assumptions.
To be honest Ikes, I don't know if he's an alt. Service academy grads are well known for making sure you know they're a grad, and Married2Coins never mentioned anything about that...
To be honest Ikes, I don't know if he's an alt. Service academy grads are well known for making sure you know they're a grad, and Married2Coins never mentioned anything about that...
Comments
Still likely a 66RD to me after the reveal. It doesn’t really matter to me what opinions the TPGs or CAC have.
Thankfully I have confidence in my area, Lincolns, not to be shaken by some random guesses on a coin forum from people that have never seen the coin in hand. And my confidence is rewarded as all those guesses; including yours; were way wrong.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
You’ve been posting as if you guessed the (approximate) grade of the coin before it was posted. Did you, in fact, do that? I looked and didn’t see any such post. I only see your posts trying to justify the assigned grade, after it was revealed.
I’m fine being “way wrong”, along with other random guesses (based on subpar images) - I was in some very good company, even if we might not be nearly as full/sure of ourselves as you sound.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
It seems that you are trying to justify how wrong your guess was Mark, I'm afraid I cannot help you with that, you will have to find a way to deal with it on your own.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
I take your above post as confirmation that you never did guess the grade before it was posted. But that sure hasn’t stopped you from talking up your own grading abilities. 😉
Please don’t worry too much about me. If I feel that I need help, I’d be looking elsewhere, anyway.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Not sure there was “overwhelming disagreement”. In fact, the 2nd guess was 66RD, and the third was 65RD (which I hit the “agree” button to immediately). So the first 50-75% of guesses identified the coin as a gem. Consider also that your much lower guess may have swayed those that followed, as people weight your opinion highly.
Nothing is as expensive as free money.
No doubt, your way wrong guess shows you would turn away from anyone that has correct information.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
Probably something along the lines of, "Ok, now that you've seen how poorly some other "MS67" Lincolns look, who wants to form a line on the left to purchase my stellar untra GEM that I posted here at $499.?!"
Crack and submit it to CAC and watch it come back details!
Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value. Zero. Voltaire. Ebay coinbowlllc
Maybe you’re confusing “overwhelming” with “unanimous”. Because, based on the grade guesses prior to the reveal - see below - and comments posted afterwards, you should be sure that there was “overwhelming disagreement” with an assessment of “without question 66+” for a coin that was graded 67. Grade guesses of 66, 65, “Gem” and below don’t constitute agreement.
Grade guesses:
58
66
65
63
63
64 (“limit”)
63
“not close to a 67”
64
62
After posting of assigned grade before
65
Coinbuf “without question 66+ in today’s market grading world…”
63 or 64
66 (from same poster who guessed 66 before grade was posted, as well)
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Funny that you speak of screwing up a discussion when you are replying in sequence to older posts that everyone else in the discussion has already long moved past.
Most people coming late to a discussion would simply read all of the previous posts and get up to speed before commenting, but you do you.
Lol. Thank you for the tally. Agreement is relative. There were several guesses that were more in agreement with 66+ than yours. And like I said, your much lower (and much more wrong) guess may have influenced the ones after you. Had you guessed 66, which would have been a much more correct guess, the ones following may have been higher too.
Nothing is as expensive as free money.
You’re welcome.😉 For the record, I count 10 grade guesses prior to the reveal. One of them was “not close to a 67”, so I’ll omit it, along with mine. Of the remaining 8 guesses, 6 were closer to 63 than to 66+. So I don’t know where you came up with “There were several guesses that were more in agreement with 66+ than yours”.
If you’d like to speculate that my grade guess skewed the results, so be it.
I’m done with this thread, now, as I need to go try to learn how to grade Lincoln cents.😉
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Doing my part to help out a dealer/member in need.
the 60 looks better than a 60
That’s a largely useless and inaccurate guide.
No worries there - you definitely didn't add to the comprehension.
Now I understand where the "4" in "4Redisin" comes from...you screw up every discussion in at least 4 different ways!
Since we’re not in 1985 anymore, it’s largely useless and inaccurate.
anacs was started by dealers?
ikesT early on posted the link to the ebay auction the op photos were from
before that, the op's own listing was posted as 67cac
expecting some catch involving 67cac, i said not close to 67
what influenced me was the 67 grade on the OP's own ebay listing
.
.
.
auction the op photos were from
Everyone,
This thread has gone exactly how it was intended. Bad images, guess the grade, coin for sale same grade that was “better” than this images posted, and being sold by the OP. Anger amongst good forum members was the point.
Now all we see is people sticking up for their opinions, many of which were right with the images given. It was a farce from the get go. OP knows and has acknowledged not to post active coins or coins he does not own for GTG.
Don’t feed into this, the OP loves this kind of disagreement and even when helped he cannot help himself to start threads like this. Let’s all just move on and get along!
It does not look like a 67 or 66
but there's the photos. something on the slab?
so. another interesting question: there's this and one other thread with an "overgraded cac" -- are you going to stop buying cac coins?
No the whole point was to get objective opinions on the coin without being influenced beforehand with the grade and the CAC approval. And THERE WAS NO TRICKERY INVOLVED WITH MY OWNERSHIP OF THE OTHER MS 67 OBH COIN. IKE T DID INDEED SCREW UP MY THREAD WITH HIS PARANOIA
are you looking at other 67cac's on a regular basis?
Coin was listed for only $165 which is somewhat low for that 67 Red CAC penny suggesting that perhaps the owner felt the sticker was somewhat lucky and the eye appeal was maybe subpar. and he wanted to blow it out quickly on the Bay.
Yeah @MsMorrisine ! Or he shall report you, like @IkesT !
EVERYONE knows that. That's why everyone doesn't constantly ask asinine questions and try to police every thread despite being "new" to the board....wait a sec...
I shouldn't joke, 4Red doesn't like it. So, seriously, how many alts have you had and what were they? Or are you just precociously obstinate?
chopmarkedtradedollars.com
Not active was sold at $165
Absolutely False Coin Was already Sold At $159 when I posted and I am tired of being misunderstood here. This was posted as a good faith GTG with absolutely no intention to promote my own coin, till Ike T posted it and ruined my thread. You cannot simply accept that fact but would rather bash an innocent poster. Your problem not mine
The value may go up now that the US Treasury will stop making them.
i did not think you were promoting your own coin. but sensed there was a comparison coming. though, admittedly, it did not necessarily have to be. in the past there were a number of gtg threads where the reveal was an over/under grade. just don't see the so much because the many of us already know this happens, thus there is nothing "big" for us in the reveal.
what was your interesting question?
A block feature does indeed exist and you can feel free to use it however you like.
I wouldn't dare to block you...how else could I learn the customs, norms, and culture of this multi-decade old message board from someone who has been here for almost 2 months?
4Red really most likely is @Realone aka @Married2Coins . Not positive but there are a lot of similarities. Silver lining is that if it is, then 4Red does understand the culture of this forum...the culture of outing him as an alt. It's a time honored tradition.
chopmarkedtradedollars.com
Maybe it wasn’t that interesting. I thought forum members would indeed think the coin was around a 65 grade and the question is how did it get CAC approval as a MS 67 that’s all.
Easy. We on the forum have only suboptimal images to go on. Both PCGS and CAC had multiple graders view the coin in person.
My ilk and I will often route out alts or people posting in bad faith. Sorry that you have now blocked me and won't see this reply but for all of the others...our suspicions are NOT unfounded. They are well founded indeed.
chopmarkedtradedollars.com
@coinbuf —Limited expression fails the intention to one-up MFeld. He aspires to more than to parrot facts, he teaches. The winning stroke lies in that he can make a mistake, and that you cannot.
Imagine it as the “razor vs. yo-yo theory”.
4+1=5
So you're a member of 5 coin forums, just like @Married2Coins
Pretending not to be an alt is a cute trick that should not be tolerated.
You're back! Just couldn't resist, eh?
No one else on this Forum has ever called me "Ikie" (or a sloppily misspelled variant thereof), except for one person. Any idea who that might be? You guessed it, it was your banned alt, @Married2Coins !
To be fair, it must be hard for you to keep your different alt personalities straight when you have so many!
=
Really didn't have you pegged as a ring knocker.
I’m afraid I’m almost the opposite of that. Funny how we can make our own assumptions.
That, and all the other ways that you and your banned alt @Married2Coins post in the same way.
Found another one for you this morning:
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/comment/13871924/#Comment_13871924
To be honest Ikes, I don't know if he's an alt. Service academy grads are well known for making sure you know they're a grad, and Married2Coins never mentioned anything about that...
Neither did @4Redisin , before this thread...