Put on your "dealer" hat and try your luck at pricing a coin
I figured this might be an interesting challenge. If you were the person in charge of selling the toned Morgan below, what would you ask? What would you expect it to sell for? If you want, add some reasons for why you think the price is what you say.
(Note: the coin is not for sale and this is just for fun)
Comments
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I’d ask in the $500 range and expect it to sell close to that. PCGS slab always helps. Scarcer double crescent toning pattern with decent looking color saturation, though perhaps also a tad dark. Satin luster as you’d expect for the date/mint.
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Straight retail is around $250 and I'd ask $325 and hope to get $275-$300. I'd also hope I bought it for $200-$225 or less, but I guess this analysis proves I shouldn't be a dealer. Huh? Interesting challenge!
"Ain't None of Them play like him (Bix Beiderbecke) Yet."
Louis Armstrong2 -
My first thought was $800.
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3X - 5X the price of an untoned example? I would punt to someone who specializes in toners.
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I think the fair value of this coin is somewhere between $800 and $1K so I’d price it at the latter and give myself a bit of room.
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A double crescent obverse Morgan in PC 4……..
$775 I’ll take $750 that’s the price…
The court jester does not play, but gently pulls the strings…
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Nice double crescent, toning progression was almost a winner but not quite. I'd say around $600 going off of the TV colors.
Successful BST transactions- Bfjohnson, Collectorcoins, 1peter223, Shrub68, Byers, Greencopper, Coinlieutenant, Coinhunter4, SurfinxHI, ProfLiz
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As for toner Morgans, I have no idea.... but, if we're wearing a dealer hat, we need to know two numbers. Our buy price and our sell price.
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Not my market, I never pay for toning Per se but do factor it as a layer of eye appeal. That said paying larger premiums for arbitrary aspects better have an establish customer group established or they won’t be a dealer for long
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Colorful, unique, but almost distracting.
What did I pay for the coin?
@jmlanzaf preaches turn and burn...
Assume I paid $300
Ask $600
Take no less than $500Leave some meat on the bone for the next guy/gal.
We need more threads like this...
BST: KindaNewish (3/21/21), WQuarterFreddie (3/30/21), Meltdown (4/6/21), DBSTrader2 (5/5/21) AKA- unclemonkey on Blow Out
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I meditated on the question and channeled @ricko for an answer. What came back was a slight deduction for the color, out the door for and even $100.
"Those who would give up essential Liberty, to purchase a little temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety," --- Benjamin Franklin
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$900
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
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Turnover matters. That said, I would tend to consign it to auction unless you have a costumer base that will pay a premium for toners. The BMs around here don't seem to be able to get significant premiums for color... though one of them tries hard.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
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@jmlanzaf said:
Turnover matters. That said, I would tend to consign it to auction unless you have a costumer base that will pay a premium for toners. The BMs around here don't seem to be able to get significant premiums for color... though one of them tries hard.
Although I posted a suggested ask price of $900, if the coin were mine, I'd consign it to an auction.
In most cases, the chances of an individual seller finding a top (or the top) retail buyer for a wildly toned Morgan dollar aren't very good. So, even with paying a commission to an auction house, there's an excellent chance you'll net more than you would through a private sale. By selling privately, you're likely to miss out on the potential upside of a bidding war and a surprisingly high price realized.
I'd say the same for other coins, such as top or very low pop examples, esoteric items and/or those that haven't sold publicly for long periods of time (and thus, whose value is difficult to determine), premium quality coins, fresh-to-market offerings, etc.
On the other hand, if you have a generic, common coin that trades extremely frequently and whose market value is easy to determine, direct sale might be a better option. It really does depend on the coin.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
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It’s a $105 coin (CPG). As far as finding some toner hobbyist paying more good luck. It is not something I would pay a premium for. I don’t own any much in toners at this time. See below on friend toner subm to CAC.
An NGC 64 recently went for $79 at heritage. I consider it nicer than the op coin. The buyer got a super pickup. My major clients demand material that is PQ with super cartwheel luster. They don’t like tarnished coins.
I would consider a turn at bat run it at marketing the op toner at some premium (thank u posters above noted your toner prices for future ref) open to offer off bourse at my table in event of toner hobbyist. However - Undecided if wb a buyer for more than CDN bid (risks), if I even decided to procure it I just don’t recruit tarnished coins at this time.
Furthermore toners can be risky - A fellow dealer friend sent like a dozen coins or slightly more (toners) to be stickered - non passed. Not a risky market segment want get involved in. My charge is move inventory quickly not wait for some whale.
As far as some of the optimistic prices other posters above would consider them as ref but skittish those optainable in this buyers market.
Recommend if u do buy any toners at premium / moon money be careful.
Investor9 -
I’m not a good person to ask, as I’ll only pay a small premium for toners. That being said, to the right buyer, I could see $500 or more. The fact that the toning is on the obverse and is a double crescent works in its favor.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
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@Cougar1978 said:
It’s a $105 coin (CPG). As far as finding some toner hobbyist paying more good luck. It is not something I would pay a premium for.The amount of buyers out there willing to pay a premium for such a coin requires no luck.
Successful BST transactions- Bfjohnson, Collectorcoins, 1peter223, Shrub68, Byers, Greencopper, Coinlieutenant, Coinhunter4, SurfinxHI, ProfLiz
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$1000 if I were to retail it, my bottom would be $800. Crescent monster toning like that gives it a decent premium IMO.
Collector of Capped Bust Halves, SLQ's, Commems, and random cool stuff! @davidv_numismatics on Instagram
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The color is not good enough for a "auction" sale, nope. Thats a retail coin thats nice and a keeper if it doesn't sell..
The court jester does not play, but gently pulls the strings…
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$1700
Young Numismatist • My Toned Coins
Life is roadblocks. Don't let nothing stop you, 'cause we ain't stopping. - DJ Khaled3 -
All depends on what I paid of course, but this seems like a +/- $140. retail coin, if white
With that color I'd want to net $600. I think, however that happened (auction, sale to customer, etc). If I was putting a price tag on it for a case at a show/shop, that means I'd ask about $720. and have some room to haggle.
“We are only their care-takers,” he posed, “if we take good care of them, then centuries from now they may still be here … ”
Todd - BHNC #2421 -
The amount of buyers out there willing to pay a premium for such a coin requires no luck.
What I have observed at shows is if the toner premium is substantial players expect the piece to be CACG or stickered. Then many will try talk the seller down. Not everybody likes toners either.
Let us know when your able to move the 1887 $ above at $500.
As far as the 12 toners that failed CAC (that guy I discussed) at next show there he sold all or most to some HS kid (toner fan) and that guys mom doled out the Bens. Idk how much he got over regular money but it appeared to be substantial. For all I know perhaps he discounted them. He was a table or 2 over. If strong buyer shows up…..Luck can be random but the right buyer trumps the cards.
Investor0 -
Put it at auction and let it ride
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$500 tops sales price
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Some interesting thoughts so far.
I will add mine. Recently there was a double crescent that sold for 1,269.99 on eBay (copied below) and another one (that I didn’t save) which went for over 1,500 (that was a reverse toner). I have seen several cases of people paying up for double crescents and this one is among the better ones I’ve seen (it’s certainly nicer than the eBay example below). In the more “soft” days of pre-2020, around $500 was the value of this coin. Dealers tended to overprice it though-I saw it at a show for 2,500 at its peak price (very optimistic at that time). Nowadays, I wouldn’t be surprised to see it listed at 2,500 again and this time it could sell for close to that (especially if a few people that are after this pattern were to really want it). A more safe estimate though would be 1K-1.5k. An auction would probably be best to unlock the full potential unless the people that collect this pattern actively check eBay.
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@U1chicago
Nice research, agree the 87 is nicer then the 81S, better toning colors (not as dark and better progression) and that carbon spot on nose and spot on reverse are a bummer. The only negative on the 87 is how the toning on the lower cheek/jaw seems scraped off from the mint bag handling.1 -
What causes the crescent toning?
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@gonzer said:
What causes the crescent toning?I think it's from two coins laying on top of the toned coin near or against the bag.
Need a Barber Half with ANACS photo certificate. If you have one for sale please PM me. Current Ebay auctions6 -
Punt... consign to an auction
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
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How soon does the owner want it sold? If they were not in a hurry, my asking price would be much higher than if they needed it moved this week.
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@Cougar1978 said:
The amount of buyers out there willing to pay a premium for such a coin requires no luck.
What I have observed at shows is if the toner premium is substantial players expect the piece to be CACG or stickered. Then many will try talk the seller down. Not everybody likes toners either.
Let us know when your able to move the 1887 $ above at $500.
As far as the 12 toners that failed CAC (that guy I discussed) at next show there he sold all or most to some HS kid (toner fan) and that guys mom doled out the Bens. Idk how much he got over regular money but it appeared to be substantial. For all I know perhaps he discounted them. He was a table or 2 over. If strong buyer shows up…..Luck can be random but the right buyer trumps the cards.
I waited for Cougar to make his third edit, and hopefully the final one before responding.
Cougar, please don't confuse swapmeets with Coin Shows.
Of course you can't sell rainbow toners certified by PCGS at the tables you set up.
Your BigMac and fries supersized "clients" prefer their silver discs to be spiffy and shined up.For the rest of the dealers who do set up at major coin shows, the OP's toned Morgan would be snatched up within minutes of offered at the price you believe is reasonable and instantly flipped for 3Xs- 5Xs that selling price.
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@Walkerfan said:
I’m not a good person to ask, as I’ll only pay a small premium for toners. That being said, to the right buyer, I could see $500 or more. The fact that the toning is on the obverse and is a double crescent works in its favor.Same here. I wouldn't pay a large premium for the toning, but I know someone will.
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@Atcarroll said:
@Walkerfan said:
I’m not a good person to ask, as I’ll only pay a small premium for toners. That being said, to the right buyer, I could see $500 or more. The fact that the toning is on the obverse and is a double crescent works in its favor.Same here. I wouldn't pay a large premium for the toning, but I know someone will.
But that is the point of the "dealer hat". The valuing of coins is very different as it is no longer what you would pay but what someone else would. I sell very few coins that I would actually want to own. But I need to know the appropriate buy/sell price or i will be capable of neither buying or selling.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
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@jmlanzaf said:
@Atcarroll said:
@Walkerfan said:
I’m not a good person to ask, as I’ll only pay a small premium for toners. That being said, to the right buyer, I could see $500 or more. The fact that the toning is on the obverse and is a double crescent works in its favor.Same here. I wouldn't pay a large premium for the toning, but I know someone will.
But that is the point of the "dealer hat". The valuing of coins is very different as it is no longer what you would pay but what someone else would. I sell very few coins that I would actually want to own. But I need to know the appropriate buy/sell price or i will be capable of neither buying or selling.
Yes the idea of the thread was to throw out your own feelings, maybe look at some recent sales, and come up with a number that would appear reasonable for the market. If someone does not want to do that, there is nothing requiring them-this is all for fun. However, quoting retail on an untoned example and/or saying one does not like color is a wasted comment (but it increases your post count, so there's that!
).3 -
@jmlanzaf said:
@Atcarroll said:
@Walkerfan said:
I’m not a good person to ask, as I’ll only pay a small premium for toners. That being said, to the right buyer, I could see $500 or more. The fact that the toning is on the obverse and is a double crescent works in its favor.Same here. I wouldn't pay a large premium for the toning, but I know someone will.
But that is the point of the "dealer hat". The valuing of coins is very different as it is no longer what you would pay but what someone else would. I sell very few coins that I would actually want to own. But I need to know the appropriate buy/sell price or i will be capable of neither buying or selling.
In that case I'd probably price it optimistically, say around $900 or so.
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@Atcarroll said:
@jmlanzaf said:
@Atcarroll said:
@Walkerfan said:
I’m not a good person to ask, as I’ll only pay a small premium for toners. That being said, to the right buyer, I could see $500 or more. The fact that the toning is on the obverse and is a double crescent works in its favor.Same here. I wouldn't pay a large premium for the toning, but I know someone will.
But that is the point of the "dealer hat". The valuing of coins is very different as it is no longer what you would pay but what someone else would. I sell very few coins that I would actually want to own. But I need to know the appropriate buy/sell price or i will be capable of neither buying or selling.
In that case I'd probably price it optimistically, say around $900 or so.
Careful, now, that was my number too. And the forum’s top notch expert at pricing wildly toned Morgan dollars - @Cougar78 - gave my post a “LOL”. He also wrote in one of his posts that he wouldn’t pay a premium for the coin. I’m not going to laugh at him but I’ll cry for him.😉
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
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@MFeld said:
@Atcarroll said:
@jmlanzaf said:
@Atcarroll said:
@Walkerfan said:
I’m not a good person to ask, as I’ll only pay a small premium for toners. That being said, to the right buyer, I could see $500 or more. The fact that the toning is on the obverse and is a double crescent works in its favor.Same here. I wouldn't pay a large premium for the toning, but I know someone will.
But that is the point of the "dealer hat". The valuing of coins is very different as it is no longer what you would pay but what someone else would. I sell very few coins that I would actually want to own. But I need to know the appropriate buy/sell price or i will be capable of neither buying or selling.
In that case I'd probably price it optimistically, say around $900 or so.
Careful, now, that was my number too. And the forum’s top notch expert at pricing wildly toned Morgan dollars - @Cougar78 - gave my post a “LOL”. He also wrote in one of his posts that he wouldn’t pay a premium for the coin. I’m not going to laugh at him but I’ll cry for him.😉
You have to wear that LOL with pride.
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@U1chicago said:
@MFeld said:
@Atcarroll said:
@jmlanzaf said:
@Atcarroll said:
@Walkerfan said:
I’m not a good person to ask, as I’ll only pay a small premium for toners. That being said, to the right buyer, I could see $500 or more. The fact that the toning is on the obverse and is a double crescent works in its favor.Same here. I wouldn't pay a large premium for the toning, but I know someone will.
But that is the point of the "dealer hat". The valuing of coins is very different as it is no longer what you would pay but what someone else would. I sell very few coins that I would actually want to own. But I need to know the appropriate buy/sell price or i will be capable of neither buying or selling.
In that case I'd probably price it optimistically, say around $900 or so.
Careful, now, that was my number too. And the forum’s top notch expert at pricing wildly toned Morgan dollars - @Cougar78 - gave my post a “LOL”. He also wrote in one of his posts that he wouldn’t pay a premium for the coin. I’m not going to laugh at him but I’ll cry for him.😉
You have to wear that LOL with pride.
Absolutely!😀
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
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Here is the other double crescent sale I referenced before and now found.
The coin brought 788.16 on GC in April 2023 and then 1,484 on eBay in October 2024.
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I would price it at $1,599.99, I want to make sure it gets rounded up.
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Here you go, @MFeld!
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My first instinct was $500 but if they are selling for $1400 all the better.
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99 cent start on Ebay, create several alts on here and post links to the coin until you get banned and let her rip.
Need a Barber Half with ANACS photo certificate. If you have one for sale please PM me. Current Ebay auctions3 -
Double crescent and on obverse and a nice trueview which you can use for retailing.
I would list at 2K and take offers.
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I sold this toner 1885 PCGS MS64 Morgan 2 years ago on GreatCollections. It brought $1856 (somewhere between 15 and 20X gray sheet bid). It was not a good investment, as I had paid Brandon, from Anaconda rare coins, (RIP Adrian) $1400 for it nearly 20 years before at a Long Beach show. Both Brandon and Adrian had their entertaining side when posting here.
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@rays said:
I sold this toner 1885 PCGS MS64 Morgan 2 years ago on GreatCollections. It brought $1856 (somewhere between 15 and 20X gray sheet bid). It was not a good investment, as I had paid Brandon, from Anaconda rare coins, (RIP Adrian) $1400 for it nearly 20 years before at a Long Beach show. Both Brandon and Adrian had their entertaining side when posting here.>
That is a very, very rare coin--a "toned" coin that I find attractive. Mind you, I wouldn't pay a premium for it, but it's a beautiful coin!0 -
ask $300. $250-$300 coin imo.> @U1chicago said:
I figured this might be an interesting challenge. If you were the person in charge of selling the toned Morgan below, what would you ask? What would you expect it to sell for? If you want, add some reasons for why you think the price is what you say.
(Note: the coin is not for sale and this is just for fun)"Two things are infinite: human stupidity and the universe; and I'm not sure about the universe."
-Albert Einstein-Mistakes are natural. But repeated mistakes without reflection are something else. That may be the “stupidity” he was referring to. In research, he admitted uncertainty openly. “If we knew what it was we were doing, it would not be called research, would it?” This shows humility. Even a Nobel laureate accepted doubt. That humility makes the quote less cynical and more observational.
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