Accidentally stumbled on this 1794 dollar today!
Unfortunately not for sale. 😢
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Comments
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May I ask how you stumbled upon it?
Young Numismatist • My Toned Coins
Life is roadblocks. Don't let nothing stop you, 'cause we ain't stopping. - DJ Khaled0 -
I wanted to check out their library and there were a few showcases of coins on display like they were no big deal. And compared to some of the art on the wall, I guess they really are no big deal!
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.1 -
What library? Who's library?
Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )
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Talk about original, I like it as a 53 but I can see it in a 55 holder. It has 58 details but luster looks muted severely. With halo rarities grades who knows though
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I feel like I've seen pictures of that one before, it's one of the best, isn't it?
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@tcollects said:
I feel like I've seen pictures of that one before, it's one of the best, isn't it?It’s a good one but it doesn’t make the top 10 list.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.1 -
@tcollects said:
I feel like I've seen pictures of that one before, it's one of the best, isn't it?Seeing as how it looks like a copper example, it’s got to be one of the best. But it’s also got to be one of the worst.😉 Edited to add: If it’s silver, that’s a different story.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
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They had some great furniture too. Took this pic of my favorite.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.13 -
Again, what library? Who's library?
Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )
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@MFeld said:
@tcollects said:
I feel like I've seen pictures of that one before, it's one of the best, isn't it?Seeing as how it looks like a copper example, it’s got to be one of the best. But it’s also got to be one of the worst.😉
It looks silver to me based on the color of the worn areas.
Young Numismatist • My Toned Coins
Life is roadblocks. Don't let nothing stop you, 'cause we ain't stopping. - DJ Khaled0 -
@hummingbird_coins said:
@MFeld said:
@tcollects said:
I feel like I've seen pictures of that one before, it's one of the best, isn't it?Seeing as how it looks like a copper example, it’s got to be one of the best. But it’s also got to be one of the worst.😉
It looks silver to me based on the color of the worn areas.
Also, there are file marks. I may be corrected, but I don't think copper was filed.
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It’s definitely silver. Very heavily toned silver.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.0 -
Rijks Museum in Amsterdam? Their coin and medal collection is in the library. But from what I remember they have their 1794 dollar on a black background and the coin is darker.
Collector, occasional seller
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@ChrisH821 said:
Rijks Museum in Amsterdam? Their coin and medal collection is in the library. But from what I remember they have their 1794 dollar on a black background and the coin is darker.Ding ding ding! I need to visit them again and look at the rest of the collection!
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.3 -
Heck of a stumble. Love a museum. Thanks for sharing
BST: endeavor1967, synchr, kliao, Outhaul, Donttellthewife, U1Chicago, ajaan, mCarney1173, SurfinHi, MWallace, Sandman70gt, mustanggt, Pittstate03, Lazybones, Walkerguy21D, coinandcurrency242 , thebigeng, Collectorcoins, JimTyler, USMarine6, Elkevvo, Coll3ctor, Yorkshireman, CUKevin, ranshdow, CoinHunter4, bennybravo, Centsearcher, braddick, Windycity, ZoidMeister, mirabela, JJM, RichURich, Bullsitter, jmski52, LukeMarshall, coinsarefun, MichaelDixon, NickPatton, ProfLiz, Twobitcollector,Jesbroken oih82w8, DCW
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@hummingbird_coins said:
@MFeld said:
@tcollects said:
I feel like I've seen pictures of that one before, it's one of the best, isn't it?Seeing as how it looks like a copper example, it’s got to be one of the best. But it’s also got to be one of the worst.😉
It looks silver to me based on the color of the worn areas.
It appears that you were correct 👍, which means I was incorrect.😬
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
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@MrEureka said:
@ChrisH821 said:
Rijks Museum in Amsterdam? Their coin and medal collection is in the library. But from what I remember they have their 1794 dollar on a black background and the coin is darker.Ding ding ding! I need to visit them again and look at the rest of the collection!
Nice! That also has to be the only museum that has a Michelin starred restaurant on site.
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I was at the Rijks Museum several time in early 70's. Do not remember the desk or the coins, but over 50 years ago. I remember the beautiful paintings, huge wall sized paintings.
Especially liked his "Night Watch". Wished I had seen the coins and that desk.
Jim
When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln
Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain1 -
Thanks for showing us that coin.
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Looks retoned. A solid AU 55. Nice to stumble on things like that. I racewalk; when I stumble, I usually trip over something and can fall. I think you're doing better than I am.
"Vou invadir o Nordeste,
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."0 -
Excluding Rarity Points I could probably stretch to an AU-50.
Professional Numismatist, Retired. 55 year member ANA. Former ANA Senior Authenticator. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and ANA Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner of the PNG's 2026 Robert Friedberg Award for "The Enigmatic Lincoln Cents of 1922," Available now from Whitman or Amazon.0 -
Curiously the Rijks Museum also has a small outlet in the Schiphol Airport in Amsterdam. I noticed it and burnt up half an hour in there - they even had some old masters.
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@Elcontador said:
Looks retoned. A solid AU 55. Nice to stumble on things like that. I racewalk; when I stumble, I usually trip over something and can fall. I think you're doing better than I am.I can't claim to know for certain, but to me, the coin looks like it could be about as original as we'll ever see.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
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Do you have a photo of the back of the coin and, if so, can you show us the photo?
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Neat coin. It's too bad that there are so many distracting and unsightly adjustment marks on it. I know the US Mint put these marks on the planchet and it was part of the minting process, but I still don't care for them.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire0 -
@mlittle said:
Do you have a photo of the back of the coin and, if so, can you show us the photo?It was in a museum so I would assume it was laying flat in a display case and it was photographed through the glass cover.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire0 -
Here's a photo I took of the coin back in December 2022 when I was in Amsterdam.
And the library it exists in. The coin display is behind and to the right of this point of view.
Collector, occasional seller
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I received the following e-mail from noted collector Alan Weinberg, who lurks here occasionally. Sharing it with his permission.
"In 1966 when I toured Europe for the summer ( I even visited a museum in East Berlin ) I was no one, just an interested collector.
At the Rijks Museum, I was invited into the curator’s office and shown US coins in the vault. I handled them raw in hand. At the time I specialized, among other things, in Mass colonial silver coins in high grade on full round planchets, rare as hen’s teeth then and now.There I handled the finest OT Noe 1 XII I’d ever seen to this day and I owned a superb specimen auctioned in 2019 by Heritage.
I visited the British Museum and for 5 days , totally unsupervised, I was in the BM vault room going thru tray after tray of American coins, many donated by Sir Jos Banks and his sister Sophie Banks circa 1800. It was there I discovered some coins switched, including an AU 1829 half dime substituted for a 1792 half disme donated by Banks in 1800 per the cardboard tag which almost certainly had been choice Unc. I brought this to their attention and soon after I’m told they set up much stricter security whichI experienced in 1999 when I returned.
At the 1966 viewing / handling of many trays, I saw two choice AU Geo Clinton cents piled on top of each other in a tiny wood square in a larger tray. And two choice VF- EF 1737 Axe Higley 3D on top of each other in the same setup. Being human, momentarily I thought how easy it would be to remove one of each or replace each with a Bolen copy.
In 1963, I had the same experience at JHU Evergreen House where curator Sarah Freeman let me go through tray after tray of Garrett coins, all raw , leaving me all alone at a huge desk for hours. She didn’t know me from a hole in the ground. I walked in off the street and immediately saw Dwight Eisenhower! Nope, it wasn’t the WWII General / ex President. It was Milton Eisenhower, Ike’s younger lookalike brother and then JHU President.
he looked just like Ike during the War.Alan V Weinberg"
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.16 -
@MrEureka, any thoughts on the condition of the 1794 dollar or info on what others have graded it? Any frost visible under the toning or was the lighting good enough to tell?
It looks like at least choice EF or AU detail. Wonder if it would be considered problem free or details from the toning. Almost looks like it has been through a fire.
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.@mlittle said:
Do you have a photo of the back of the coin and, if so, can you show us the photo?It appears the photo in the OP was taken by the museum and I did not find that they had one showing the reverse. Not sure why go to the bother of taking photos without getting both sides. But there may be two sides of a coin as to their reasoning.
"To Be Esteemed Be Useful" - 1792 Birch Cent --- "I personally think we developed language because of our deep need to complain." - Lily Tomlin
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Just noticed that today is the exact 230th anniversary of striking all the 1794 dollars.
If only the mint would issue a medal or coin commemerating this. But, it probably wouldn't get much notice or discussion here.
Interesting that to see that Mint Director David Rittenhouse personally owned all 1,758 of them at one time in partial return for his deposit of silver bullion.
.
.Whose silver was used for 1794 dollar?
https://numismaticnews.net/archive/whose-silver-used-1794-dollar
"To Be Esteemed Be Useful" - 1792 Birch Cent --- "I personally think we developed language because of our deep need to complain." - Lily Tomlin
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Yes i took a photograph of that coin about 5 it 6 years ago Andy. I was looking at all their military medals and voila an amazing orginal 1794 dollar in that case.
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@WinLoseWin said:
@MrEureka, any thoughts on the condition of the 1794 dollar or info on what others have graded it? Any frost visible under the toning or was the lighting good enough to tell?
It looks like at least choice EF or AU detail. Wonder if it would be considered problem free or details from the toning. Almost looks like it has been through a fire.
Hard to grade a coin by the obverse only, especially in bad light, but it looks it would go into a 50 holder. It's definitely too dark, and (based on the toning pattern and lack of luster) it was probably cleaned pretty heavily well over a century ago. It also has what looks like a pin scratch (but could be a struck-through) at the LI of LIBERTY. And the adjustment marks don't help.
Andy Lustig
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.1 -
It is a shame that only 50% of this coin is visible. Few museums are designed for numismatists.
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That “scratch” through “LI” looks like it might have been on the planchet. Couldn’t say for sure without handling the piece.
Professional Numismatist, Retired. 55 year member ANA. Former ANA Senior Authenticator. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and ANA Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner of the PNG's 2026 Robert Friedberg Award for "The Enigmatic Lincoln Cents of 1922," Available now from Whitman or Amazon.0 -
@CaptHenway said:
That “scratch” through “LI” looks like it might have been on the planchet. Couldn’t say for sure without handling the piece.Looks like PMD.
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@jfriedm56 said:
@CaptHenway said:
That “scratch” through “LI” looks like it might have been on the planchet. Couldn’t say for sure without handling the piece.Looks like PMD.
As I say I cannot be sure without seeing the piece, but the line does not seem to "skip" when it drops down from the high part of the letter to the field, as a post-strike pin scratch tends to do. There were certainly plenty of other marks on this planchet prior to the strike.
Professional Numismatist, Retired. 55 year member ANA. Former ANA Senior Authenticator. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and ANA Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner of the PNG's 2026 Robert Friedberg Award for "The Enigmatic Lincoln Cents of 1922," Available now from Whitman or Amazon.0 -
@CaptHenway said:
@jfriedm56 said:
@CaptHenway said:
That “scratch” through “LI” looks like it might have been on the planchet. Couldn’t say for sure without handling the piece.Looks like PMD.
As I say I cannot be sure without seeing the piece, but the line does not seem to "skip" when it drops down from the high part of the letter to the field, as a post-strike pin scratch tends to do. There were certainly plenty of other marks on this planchet prior to the strike.
It does look as though all the parallel lines on the obverse could certainly be adjustment marks, but in referencing the line through the LIB, to me it has a slight upward curve to it. Maybe only in my brain that says to me a scratch. And I’m certainly no expert in this field, especially on a toned 230 year old dollar.
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@CaptHenway said:
@jfriedm56 said:
@CaptHenway said:
That “scratch” through “LI” looks like it might have been on the planchet. Couldn’t say for sure without handling the piece.Looks like PMD.
As I say I cannot be sure without seeing the piece, but the line does not seem to "skip" when it drops down from the high part of the letter to the field, as a post-strike pin scratch tends to do. There were certainly plenty of other marks on this planchet prior to the strike.
Clash possibly?
RIP Mom- 1932-20120 -
I don’t think it’s been heavily cleaned if at all, the layers of age appear to be thick and sporadic. They look like silver that has been consistently exposed and unmolested for a long time to these eyes.
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