@Martin said: @treybenedict
I don’t see much aftermarket with 3k+ price tag. I think they will sell quite a few. Probably more than long term demand. I’m on the fence about one but the price above spot has me not that excited
Martin
Down the line I could see it becoming around the 2023 HR level. Which has also drastically increased in price despite high spot.
It is a possibility.
I need to get more informed on this roll out. I like the idea of the coin in gold.
I know that the medal is a new engraving, but it replicates the design of the original silver dollar, apart from the edge lettering.
Could it be that the privy mark was meant to distinguish the medal from the original dollar? Sort of meant to avoid accusations of counterfeiting their own designs?
@291fifth said:
I see an overpriced poor seller. If they wanted sales they should have made it a one dollar NCLT coin.
The issue is needing Congressional approval. They just don't do that anymore, other than for the commemoratives. They have authority to issue gold coins, so they do. And to issue silver medals. So they do.
Reduced sales are an issue with every silver medal they release. This is what Congress wanted, and what it has. They could have given the Mint the authority to issue silver coins without Congressional approval, as with gold coins.
Congress chose to withhold that authorization. Reduced sales are the result. They apparently do not care.
I was prepared to wait for Hell to freeze over and spending a long time on the ice until you mentioned Congress being involved! Credit Cormac McCarthy for part of that quote.
That's unfortunate, I was mildly optimistic about this product until they ruined it with that ghastly privvy mark. Leave it to the government to be their own worst enemy!
For the naysayers - this could just be a "special" limited offering
"mixed in" with the bulk (minted "without" the privy mark) to get
numismatists excited about quantity purchases and searches
for the "rarity" privy issue. A lot better than a hand-signed COA,
which of course could be another feature to raise coin spirits
to ecstatic numismatic heights !
@sfs2002usa said:
For the naysayers - this could just be a "special" limited offering
"mixed in" with the bulk (minted "without" the privy mark) to get
numismatists excited about quantity purchases and searches
for the "rarity" privy issue. A lot better than a hand-signed COA,
which of course could be another feature to raise coin spirits
to ecstatic numismatic heights !
Total wishful thinking. Seeding an issue with a few certificates is one thing. It would be a very expensive undertaking to actually do that with coins. Err, medals.
They've never done it, and there is no reporting that they are doing it now. Just not happening. You can call me a naysayer, and the privy mark actually does not bother me at all, but it's not happening.
What I would like to know, however, is the mintage. I heard a rumor that it would be 75K, which might make the one ounce of silver at $104 interesting, but I have not seen that confirmed anywhere, including the Mint's website. Which is a little puzzling, given that this has been in the works for a year and is being released in less than a month.
OTOH, the 2023 American Liberty silver medal had a mintage of 75K, was issued at $82, and is still available for $97, so who knows?
@Onastone said:
T-shirts are almost ready. Sign up early for yours!!!
I want this shirt! But, can I get the privy in gold?
Sure, but it'll cost $4,000. Lots of government overhead that must be covered in order to change the color of the ink. 🤣 The good news is that there will only be 10K of them!
@Onastone said:
T-shirts are almost ready. Sign up early for yours!!!
I want this shirt! But, can I get the privy in gold?
Sure, but it'll cost $4,000. Lots of government overhead that must be covered in order to change the color of the ink. 🤣 The good news is that there will only be 10K of them!
That’s not bad! I will order one in gold as long as the shirt is signed by Ventris Gibson. I will never wash it!
@MsMorrisine said:
it's a celebration of the 94, not 95, dollar. the date on the 94 is left aligned with the stars
perhaps the privy on the silver will make a few buyers "not settle" for the silver and pay up for the gold
Yeah -- no way the privy is going to be on one and not the other. The only difference between the two is going to be the metallic composition, fact that one is a coin and one is a medal, and, of course, the price!
@1madman said:
Gold coin household limit has now dropped to 1 from 5
Clearly, they think they have something here. I wish them luck, trying to sell around 10K gold at a $1K premium to $2700 spot.
Same for the silver medal at a $70+ premium to silver spot. If the silver mintage ends up at 75K, they might actually sell that many, but not instantly, so really no need to limit it to one per customer.
Feels a little like they are taking a page out of the VB playbook, and trying to create the illusion of scarcity and demand to stoke actual demand. TBD, but I think they'd do better leaving the limits at 5, and letting them sell out on Day 1 if the demand is there.
As it is, it looks like they are trying to create a virtual waiting room logjam in order to create some excitement. At those prices, with the mintages I think they are going to publish, again, I wish them all the luck in the world.
The 2023 American Liberty silver medal is still available, over a year after release. They did not sell out at $82 upon release, nor at $97 today. OTOH, the gold coins DID sell out with a mintage of 12,500, although not immediately at a price of $2,865.
As I said in another thread, I think the Mint is going to be looking for more than $3,700 for these gold coins. I really don't see 10K+ flying off the shelf at launch at a $1K premium to a record gold price, so I think the reduction of the HHL from 5 to 1 is more marketing hype than a reaction to an actual anticipated slamming of the website. I guess we'll see.
the mint states that, through the vagueness of the law, they can interpret the law for making gold ages to make gold coins of size and denomination of their discretion.
there is no vagueness for the silver coins; however, they are expressly given wide latitude for striking medals.
@Manorcourtman said:
Why is the silver one called a medal and the gold version a coin? I find that interesting.
The mint can pretty much make any gold coins it wants to at their own volition. The same applies to medals of any metallic composition.
Silver and clad coins require approval via the standard federal law process, (signed bill), which this medal does not have. If it was a true coin reproduction it would have the edge lettering showing its denomination, which this medal also does not have. It has no monetary value assigned outside its intrinsic silver value, and is therefore not legal tender.
Having fun while switching things up and focusing on a next level PCGS slabbed 1950+ type set, while still looking for great examples for the 7070.
@Manorcourtman said:
So if it’s considered a coin it would appear in the Redbook, correct? I smell a sleeper here possibly. An expensive one no doubt.
I’m not sure what the publisher’s criteria is and I haven’t owned a red book in 20 years. However, I do believe the Norse medals were in there and they are NOT coins, though (arguably) considered part of the early commemorative coin series. Lines are blurry in this business. But this new piece is clearly, unequivocally, 100% a medal.
Having fun while switching things up and focusing on a next level PCGS slabbed 1950+ type set, while still looking for great examples for the 7070.
@Manorcourtman said:
So if it’s considered a coin it would appear in the Redbook, correct? I smell a sleeper here possibly. An expensive one no doubt.
I’m not sure what the publisher’s criteria is and I haven’t owned a red book in 20 years. However, I do believe the Norse medals were in there and they are NOT coins, though (arguably) considered part of the early commemorative coin series. Lines are blurry in this business. But this new piece is clearly, unequivocally, 100% a medal.
I am speaking strictly of the gold version. I agree it’s a medal but if it’s called a coin by the Mint it would probably be a one year type coin and included in the Redbook. I’m a gold type collector and considering buying it. I’m sure others are considering it also. It’s a tough price to swallow I must admit.
Comments
It is a possibility.
I need to get more informed on this roll out. I like the idea of the coin in gold.
Martin
THE PHOTOS HAVE BEEN UPDATED WITH A "230" PRIVY MARK
Ruins the design which is actually nice.
I was all in for one until the privy mark - now not so much.
Yikes, I was considering one until the privy mark
That mark is repulsive. What a terrible idea. Oh well, not a coin anyways, so: PASS.
Having fun while switching things up and focusing on a next level PCGS slabbed 1950+ type set, while still looking for great examples for the 7070.
I know that the medal is a new engraving, but it replicates the design of the original silver dollar, apart from the edge lettering.
Could it be that the privy mark was meant to distinguish the medal from the original dollar? Sort of meant to avoid accusations of counterfeiting their own designs?
@Casabrown who’s idea was that?
Thanks
Martin
Privy mark ruins it.
Ugh...why was that needed?
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
There is an alternative in 2 oz and sub $75
Any read if the gold will be uncirculated or proof?
The gold will be proof.
The info on the Reverse Proof Morgans now contains photos. Price is set at $215 !
https://catalog.usmint.gov/morgan-peace-dollar-2024-two-coin-reverse-proof-set-24XS.html?cgid=2024-product-schedule
I was prepared to wait for Hell to freeze over and spending a long time on the ice until you mentioned Congress being involved! Credit Cormac McCarthy for part of that quote.
Can you provide the source stating it will be gold?
That's unfortunate, I was mildly optimistic about this product until they ruined it with that ghastly privvy mark. Leave it to the government to be their own worst enemy!
Founder- Peak Rarities
Website
Instagram
Facebook
Source: https://www.usmint.gov/learn/coin-and-medal-programs/230th-anniversary-flowing-hair
Appreciate it!
Thank you @MetroD my phone is challenged at it's best.
I’m considering getting one. I’d love the gold coin, but not at what the Mint will be charging. I just wish the silver were a coin instead of a medal.
For the naysayers - this could just be a "special" limited offering
"mixed in" with the bulk (minted "without" the privy mark) to get
numismatists excited about quantity purchases and searches
for the "rarity" privy issue. A lot better than a hand-signed COA,
which of course could be another feature to raise coin spirits
to ecstatic numismatic heights !
Total wishful thinking. Seeding an issue with a few certificates is one thing. It would be a very expensive undertaking to actually do that with coins. Err, medals.
They've never done it, and there is no reporting that they are doing it now. Just not happening. You can call me a naysayer, and the privy mark actually does not bother me at all, but it's not happening.
What I would like to know, however, is the mintage. I heard a rumor that it would be 75K, which might make the one ounce of silver at $104 interesting, but I have not seen that confirmed anywhere, including the Mint's website. Which is a little puzzling, given that this has been in the works for a year and is being released in less than a month.
OTOH, the 2023 American Liberty silver medal had a mintage of 75K, was issued at $82, and is still available for $97, so who knows?
T-shirts are almost ready. Sign up early for yours!!!
I want this shirt! But, can I get the privy in gold?
Sure, but it'll cost $4,000. Lots of government overhead that must be covered in order to change the color of the ink. 🤣 The good news is that there will only be 10K of them!
That’s not bad! I will order one in gold as long as the shirt is signed by Ventris Gibson. I will never wash it!
So what's up with the Gold coin?
How can they not even know what month, out of three left, they will be putting these up for sale ?
And, I'm pretty sure they had a pic on the website, so I guess they took that down.
Unclear, since they usually release gold and silver together. Don't be shocked if that happens with this as well.
Gold coin presale already:
https://www.ebay.com/itm/166989147330
Is the 10,000 mintage described by this seller correct or just a guess? I hadn’t heard anything
from the mint PR:
Obverse Inscriptions
LIBERTY
2024
Privy Mark: 230*
The artist renditions on the mint website still show "no privy"
but
there is one online seller - lcr coins - showing slab mock-ups with the privy
the privy ruins it
I could be missing something, but it appears that some of the "renditions" on the 'product page' include the privy.
See the two "renditions" to the right.
Source: https://catalog.usmint.gov/230th-anniversary-flowing-hair-silver-medal-24YH.html
thanks
missed those
too bad theyy weren't the only renditions and that the first renditions shown are without the vile thing
What's up with star placement?
Modern silver shows an open space(date is at 6:30), the gold example and the original 1795 FH show equal star spacing.
What will be the final result for the gold?
edited to add: The gold example not from U.S. Mint Website.
it's a celebration of the 94, not 95, dollar. the date on the 94 is left aligned with the stars
perhaps the privy on the silver will make a few buyers "not settle" for the silver and pay up for the gold
Yeah -- no way the privy is going to be on one and not the other. The only difference between the two is going to be the metallic composition, fact that one is a coin and one is a medal, and, of course, the price!
The silver medal household limit has now dropped to 1 from 5
Gold coin now has a release date of Nov 14 (coinciding with the Baltimore show)
Don't know what is more ridiculous.... that.....or this....
Throw a coin enough times, and suppose one day it lands on its edge.
Gold coin household limit has now dropped to 1 from 5
Thanks for informing me, I missed the earlier posts.
Clearly, they think they have something here. I wish them luck, trying to sell around 10K gold at a $1K premium to $2700 spot.
Same for the silver medal at a $70+ premium to silver spot. If the silver mintage ends up at 75K, they might actually sell that many, but not instantly, so really no need to limit it to one per customer.
Feels a little like they are taking a page out of the VB playbook, and trying to create the illusion of scarcity and demand to stoke actual demand. TBD, but I think they'd do better leaving the limits at 5, and letting them sell out on Day 1 if the demand is there.
As it is, it looks like they are trying to create a virtual waiting room logjam in order to create some excitement. At those prices, with the mintages I think they are going to publish, again, I wish them all the luck in the world.
The 2023 American Liberty silver medal is still available, over a year after release. They did not sell out at $82 upon release, nor at $97 today. OTOH, the gold coins DID sell out with a mintage of 12,500, although not immediately at a price of $2,865.
As I said in another thread, I think the Mint is going to be looking for more than $3,700 for these gold coins. I really don't see 10K+ flying off the shelf at launch at a $1K premium to a record gold price, so I think the reduction of the HHL from 5 to 1 is more marketing hype than a reaction to an actual anticipated slamming of the website. I guess we'll see.
Why is the silver one called a medal and the gold version a coin? I find that interesting.
the mint states that, through the vagueness of the law, they can interpret the law for making gold ages to make gold coins of size and denomination of their discretion.
there is no vagueness for the silver coins; however, they are expressly given wide latitude for striking medals.
gold, denominated coin
silver, non-denomination medal
The mint can pretty much make any gold coins it wants to at their own volition. The same applies to medals of any metallic composition.
Silver and clad coins require approval via the standard federal law process, (signed bill), which this medal does not have. If it was a true coin reproduction it would have the edge lettering showing its denomination, which this medal also does not have. It has no monetary value assigned outside its intrinsic silver value, and is therefore not legal tender.
Having fun while switching things up and focusing on a next level PCGS slabbed 1950+ type set, while still looking for great examples for the 7070.
So if it’s considered a coin it would appear in the Redbook, correct? I smell a sleeper here possibly. An expensive one no doubt.
I’m not sure what the publisher’s criteria is and I haven’t owned a red book in 20 years. However, I do believe the Norse medals were in there and they are NOT coins, though (arguably) considered part of the early commemorative coin series. Lines are blurry in this business. But this new piece is clearly, unequivocally, 100% a medal.
Having fun while switching things up and focusing on a next level PCGS slabbed 1950+ type set, while still looking for great examples for the 7070.
I am speaking strictly of the gold version. I agree it’s a medal but if it’s called a coin by the Mint it would probably be a one year type coin and included in the Redbook. I’m a gold type collector and considering buying it. I’m sure others are considering it also. It’s a tough price to swallow I must admit.
The gold is a coin by all definitions. I haven't kept up but isn't it this year's entry in the annual Liberty series?