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Fake St-Gaulden's come back.

I relax on E-Bay Last night and look for St-Gaulden's I find amazing almost half of 1924, 1926, 1927 and 1928 fake. I want you to be aware of. Many are in slabs before 2014. First time I see those was an 1927 somewhere in 2013 end or begin of 2014. The coin was summited to PCGS for reclassification to PL. Some how the coin was questioned and go to Reserve Law Enforcement and come to my Lab. My report was clear FAKE. I give you a small photo and the big line to detect:
1. The back of the design is PL which never was on those coins.
2. The E as per photo. Same was use in 24,26,27 and 28 Strikes

NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

Comments

  • RelaxnRelaxn Posts: 848 ✭✭✭✭

    Why not post full photos of the "fake" coins? With slab and ebay ID?

  • AUandAGAUandAG Posts: 24,515 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Is that the only "tell"?

    bob :)

    Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), bobinvegas1989@yahoo.com
  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭

    I do not take no ID from eBay, not interested to download this scrap. Here the fake coin look are:

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭
    edited June 1, 2023 11:38AM

    AUandAG
    Is that the only "tell"?

    bob :)

    Sorry I can not publish my report, I am not the owner. Maybe PCGS, ANACS or NGC has more material on. Sorry I was do because many peoples go for those and will be an disappointed time to come.

    The relief is lower, rim tool marks everywhere, also the letters have minuscule changes and orientations.

    Silvio

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • commoncents05commoncents05 Posts: 10,077 ✭✭✭

    @silviosi said:
    I do not take no ID from eBay, not interested to download this scrap. Here the fake coin look are:

    There are no coins in PCGS or NGC holders that look like that. That is a poor counterfeit and wouldn't fool the average collector, let alone a grading service.

    -Paul

    Many Quality coins for sale at http://www.CommonCentsRareCoins.com
  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭

    @ Paul

    I do not doubt to day to grading companies are not aware. Not a second, Paul. the big move with those was around 1974 1975. Do not understand me wrong. No TPG will certify those to day. Impossible. What was in time was in time and it is History. The problem is the selling platforms not TPG's LOL.

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • pocketpiececommemspocketpiececommems Posts: 5,723 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Are you saying that the coin in question was submitted to PCGS for reclassification and PCGS sent it to a Reserve Law Enforcement lab and that is where you saw it. Was it in a legitimate PCGS holder to start with?

  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭
    edited June 1, 2023 1:16PM

    I receive Raw. The RLE has the right to broke slabs. The point is at PGCS they was vigilant. Was the slab?? Was the grader? Was Will? I have no idea. I done my analysis.

    What I see last night was slabs with no TV and poor photos. If we do not know what to look for, then big surprise. Also no seller accept returns???? LOL 2.2K no return? keep your coin.

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,614 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @commoncents05 said:

    @silviosi said:
    I do not take no ID from eBay, not interested to download this scrap. Here the fake coin look are:

    There are no coins in PCGS or NGC holders that look like that. That is a poor counterfeit and wouldn't fool the average collector, let alone a grading service.

    -Paul

    It could have been in a fake PCGS slab

  • mark_dakmark_dak Posts: 1,085 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jmlanzaf said:

    @commoncents05 said:

    @silviosi said:
    I do not take no ID from eBay, not interested to download this scrap. Here the fake coin look are:

    There are no coins in PCGS or NGC holders that look like that. That is a poor counterfeit and wouldn't fool the average collector, let alone a grading service.

    -Paul

    It could have been in a fake PCGS slab

    That would have been my guess too

    Mark

  • FullHornFullHorn Posts: 1,124 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I searched "St-Gaulden's" on ebay and one came up!

    "1927 St Gaulden's 999 Fine Silver Round proof like free ship"

    LOL, America! What a country!

  • rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It is good to post all data on fake coins. That information (pick up points (PUP's), descriptions etc.) will help others when they are considering a purchase. Cheers, RickO

  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭

    @ ricko
    It is good to post all data on fake coins. That information (pick up points (PUP's), descriptions etc.) will help others when they are considering a purchase. Cheers, RickO

    Yes it is a good idea. So you push me to wrote a booklet for those coins? I have to finish also the book for Design Varieties of the quarters 1932-1998. I think I can do in PDF first for the classic gold coins and to put 50 or 60 of them as Buyers Guide. Nice idea RICK, many could be help and the fakers and scammers will stand back a little. I will look for what have disclosure and also for high collecting values.

    I do not want someone to buy and send to a TPG and has the surprise to come back FAKE.

    Silvio

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • burfle23burfle23 Posts: 2,177 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @silviosi said:
    I relax on E-Bay Last night and look for St-Gaulden's I find amazing almost half of 1924, 1926, 1927 and 1928 fake. I want you to be aware of. Many are in slabs before 2014. First time I see those was an 1927 somewhere in 2013 end or begin of 2014. The coin was summited to PCGS for reclassification to PL. Some how the coin was questioned and go to Reserve Law Enforcement and come to my Lab. My report was clear FAKE. I give you a small photo and the big line to detect:
    1. The back of the design is PL which never was on those coins.
    2. The E as per photo. Same was use in 24,26,27 and 28 Strikes

    Sorry, you lost me early in your thread and your responses.

  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭

    @ slider23
    The reverse of the counterfeit has an easy tell: note the ray going through the O in of. I could not find any other dates with the ray going through the O. The rays below the eagle are crude on the counterfeit.

    Yes you are wright.

    Guys please if you see an counterfeit, complete this form. We has to fight against.

    http://numismaticcrimes.org/report-form/

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • ElmerFusterpuckElmerFusterpuck Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭✭✭

    "I find amazing almost half of 1924, 1926, 1927 and 1928 fake. I want you to be aware of. Many are in slabs before 2014."

    Any photos or data to back this up? Especially ones in slabs - betting those slabs were fake too. What you showed us so far wouldn't have fooled the grading services back when they started in the mid 1980's.

  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭
    edited June 7, 2023 7:27PM

    @ ElmerFusterpuck
    Any photos or data to back this up? Especially ones in slabs - betting those slabs were fake too. What you showed us so far wouldn't have fooled the grading services back when they started in the mid 1980's.

    Mr./MS Elmer, I do not know you. So to be clear:

    I post just to tell to be aware those fake coins come back on the market. I was very clear that was discovered by PCGS. Me I am no police, nor investigator. In time I work for coins analyzes when I was ask to analyze some coins and give my report as I find. I put you here the TV photo of the coin I have in my hands and also from other sources (legitims one) if fit with others years.

    If you believe or not, is your way. I states that never analyze the slabs of those coins; so I can not state on. So please when you wrote be polite and not pejorative. I put because I do want peoples to be aware, And do not be afraid; the TPG's know all the fake before you will know,

    RICK ask me to made more public and I will do. I have a list of 60 gold valuable coins (classics) which I will explain in short time.

    In conclusion: I have no obligation to teach you about coins or artifacts detection of replicas.

    Silvio.

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭
    edited June 7, 2023 8:03PM

    ElmerFusterpuck
    Any photos or data to back this up? Especially ones in slabs - betting those slabs were fake too. What you showed us so far wouldn't have fooled the grading services back when they started in the mid 1980's.

    Elmer, I do not know you but you has to understand that I post because I see are in sale. You ask about the slabs? Correct, legitim, but me I look at the coin. Also if you read well, I clear state that those coins was discovered by PCGS. Me on request I just analyze the coins and made report for not the slabs.

    If you do not believe me just buy what you want, your choice. Please do not answer me as you do by mistake pejorative.

    As per request of RICK I push out 60 gold classic coins to present, many maybe will be a surprise; an I want to mention that the TPG's know those before others knows.

    Silvio

    PS: This it is the second answer, first was not post?????

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • burfle23burfle23 Posts: 2,177 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This post needs to end for the good of the forum...

  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭
    edited June 7, 2023 8:33PM

    I agree, who believe believe who no OK. I will post informative others coins for knowledge.

    Silvio

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • DeplorableDanDeplorableDan Posts: 2,485 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @silviosi- please don't take this the wrong way as I am just trying to be helpful, but your english is very, very broken. I think it would benefit both you and the members of the forum if you were to use google translate for your posts. You would input your sentences in your native language (Italian?), and google will convert to English, at which point you would paste the converted dialogue here. Its very difficult to understand the points you're trying to make, and your threads end up being confusing.

    @silviosi said:
    I do not take no ID from eBay, not interested to download this scrap. Here the fake coin look are:

    Its clear that the coin is a poorly counterfeit, but the reason you were asked if you took screenshots is for posterity and education. Had you saved the pictures and the Ebay users info, there are other forum members here such as @burfle23 who would likely document his findings and keep an eye on that sellers future posts.

    You were only asked to back up your findings with pictures and data because that is the standard procedure when someone stumbles across a group of counterfeits and wants to make the community aware. There are many forum members here who are willing to dedicate some of their time to help put a stop to it, but they NEED the data in order to effectively take any action. Its not that no one believes you, but the language barrier and lack of data renders the thread useless when no one can understand what you're saying. 🙂

  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭
    edited June 7, 2023 9:17PM

    @ DAN

    Thanks for input. I really appreciate you take the time to explain me some visions. Also appreciate well your clarity and the strait line you talk about.

    Sorry, for this coin, I didn't take the E-bay post. In the future I will do. For me is to tell to community to be aware. This coin is no doubt clear poor counterfeit. I put the original TV of counterfeit in order to can be analyze and also any posts of selling. I am sorry I do not police or be a seller (just occasionally)

    All my best, Dan
    Silvio

    PS: For broken sentences, YES I use, 26 years in the medical interventions rush we use broken sentences and become unconditional reflex. I am sorry.

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • steve76020steve76020 Posts: 367 ✭✭✭

    did you do an analysis of the gold and what was the grade of the gold content

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 45,301 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @steve76020 said:
    did you do an analysis of the gold and what was the grade of the gold content

    Most counterfeit gold coins contain the full weight and fineness of gold and meet all mint specifications. The profit is made on the numismatic premium.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.

  • silviosisilviosi Posts: 454 ✭✭✭

    @steve76020 said:
    did you do an analysis of the gold and what was the grade of the gold content

    Was amazing 925 Au.

    NEVER ARGUE WITH AN IDIOT.FIRST THEY WILL DRAG YOU DOWN TO THEIR LEVEL.THEN, THEY WILL BEAT YOU WITH EXPERIENCE. MARK TWAIN

  • AUandAGAUandAG Posts: 24,515 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Look at Liberty's left (your right) elbow bend and compare to:

    Registry: CC lowballs (boblindstrom), bobinvegas1989@yahoo.com
  • HillbillyCollectorHillbillyCollector Posts: 502 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @AUandAG said:
    Look at Liberty's left (your right) elbow bend and compare to:

    Actually, to me the forearm below the elbow stands out the most. The fake one looks huge, like steroids and pumping iron would cause. I hadn’t noticed this before you pointed it out.

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