Variety or Error or.....

lilolme · January 11, 2023 3:54PM

Having read multiple discussion or single posts on a variety (or varieties) and similarly on an error or not, I though I would try to post a couple sources that define these.

First from error-ref :
https://www.error-ref.com/error_and_variety_check_list/

This is the summary list page for the categories / sub-categories in this reference source.

Second from varietyvista :
http://varietyvista.com/25 What Are Die Varieties/definitions.htm

This is the variety / error definition page in this reference source.

Next, I am just attempting to point out a few things in them as some items are clear as to what they are or thought of, and others maybe not as much so (which is more of the focus). Might be good to take a scan through the summary list page.

The error-ref has Part I and II as Die sub-types and varieties with sub-categories including things like die doubling, defective punch, messed up or omitted letters / numbers and other.

The error-ref then has Part III for Die installation errors. However, Part IV Die Errors is where there are some of the not so clearly understood as error errors. Part IV has sub-categories including rusted dies, die retouching, Die damage including dents, chips and die polishing (intentional die abrasion). Included in this is the loss of design detail and includes 2 feather and 3 or 3 1/2 leg buffaloes. Also included is clashed dies, die deterioration, die breaks and die cracks.

Part V is Planchet error but Part VI Die Striking has a couple more to perhaps mention and includes Machine and ejection doubling and in the struck though is the Filled die (single element and multiple element). The page closes out with some post strike and non-errors.

From varietyvista page perhaps the easiest summary is just a copy of a paragraph but maybe go read the entire page.
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So when reading this stuff I think - well errors are one of the more common coins out there. In fact many are not even recognized as such. Additionally they have no extra value. However, they are technically defined as errors per the above sources.

Also some technical errors are used to define varieties. Example might be a bust half with a die crack. This might be more applicable to the die state of a variety like 101 to 101a. I am sure others can think of many more examples.

For me - Now this is does not appear to be technically correct but I kind of think of this as two circles. One circle for varieties and another for errors. Then the two circles are push together where they overlap some. In the area of the overlap are the errors that are varieties so to say. Correct - appears not. But it kind of works out (for me).

ricko · January 12, 2023 8:53AM

The distinction between varieties and errors has long been an item of contention here. Thanks for the links and the commentary - this should be valuable for many of our members. Cheers, RickO

gumby1234 · January 12, 2023 1:12PM

Do you think any of the people with the ridiculous coin posts are going to actually use these sites?

Good sites and good info for those actually willing to learn or figure out what they may have.

LindseyD · August 29, 2025 11:40AM

@gumby1234 said:
Do you think any of the people with the ridiculous coin posts are going to actually use these sites?

Good sites and good info for those actually willing to learn or figure out what they may have.

I hope you don't consider me one of those people. I did, actually, read through much of the list from the first site and the entire page from the second link. I came here to learn about my coins because I'm not an expert, but nobody starts as an expert. I'm grateful for all of the information from everyone so far. I'm learning.

gumby1234 · August 29, 2025 11:42AM

@LindseyD glad to hear that you are learning.

LindseyD · August 29, 2025 11:51AM

@lilolme said:
Having read multiple discussion or single posts on a variety (or varieties) and similarly on an error or not, I though I would try to post a couple sources that define these.

First from error-ref :
https://www.error-ref.com/error_and_variety_check_list/

This is the summary list page for the categories / sub-categories in this reference source.

Second from varietyvista :
http://varietyvista.com/25 What Are Die Varieties/definitions.htm

This is the variety / error definition page in this reference source.

Next, I am just attempting to point out a few things in them as some items are clear as to what they are or thought of, and others maybe not as much so (which is more of the focus). Might be good to take a scan through the summary list page.

The error-ref has Part I and II as Die sub-types and varieties with sub-categories including things like die doubling, defective punch, messed up or omitted letters / numbers and other.

The error-ref then has Part III for Die installation errors. However, Part IV Die Errors is where there are some of the not so clearly understood as error errors. Part IV has sub-categories including rusted dies, die retouching, Die damage including dents, chips and die polishing (intentional die abrasion). Included in this is the loss of design detail and includes 2 feather and 3 or 3 1/2 leg buffaloes. Also included is clashed dies, die deterioration, die breaks and die cracks.

Part V is Planchet error but Part VI Die Striking has a couple more to perhaps mention and includes Machine and ejection doubling and in the struck though is the Filled die (single element and multiple element). The page closes out with some post strike and non-errors.

From varietyvista page perhaps the easiest summary is just a copy of a paragraph but maybe go read the entire page.
.

.
.
So when reading this stuff I think - well errors are one of the more common coins out there. In fact many are not even recognized as such. Additionally they have no extra value. However, they are technically defined as errors per the above sources.

Also some technical errors are used to define varieties. Example might be a bust half with a die crack. This might be more applicable to the die state of a variety like 101 to 101a. I am sure others can think of many more examples.

For me - Now this is does not appear to be technically correct but I kind of think of this as two circles. One circle for varieties and another for errors. Then the two circles are push together where they overlap some. In the area of the overlap are the errors that are varieties so to say. Correct - appears not. But it kind of works out (for me).

This was a fantastic resource!! I was able to locate the orange peel effect that someone mentioned previously. I also thought the die deterioration section could apply, specifically the disappearing details.

So I do have an error by some standards and a variety by others... maybe I'll pop my coins onto eBay and just see if anybody is at all interested in a nickel with a touch of variety😅 I mean I've got 8 of them, so I may as well

Aspie_Rocco · August 29, 2025 11:51AM

I feel like a lot of confusion could be avoided by defining errors as an error happening in the striking process or an error in the planchet quality. Varieties defined by a unique die or unique design change among dies, or simply adding the word “die” before the word variety.
Something like that.

Morgan White · August 29, 2025 12:33PM

@LindseyD said:

@lilolme said:
Having read multiple discussion or single posts on a variety (or varieties) and similarly on an error or not, I though I would try to post a couple sources that define these.

First from error-ref :
https://www.error-ref.com/error_and_variety_check_list/

This is the summary list page for the categories / sub-categories in this reference source.

Second from varietyvista :
http://varietyvista.com/25 What Are Die Varieties/definitions.htm

This is the variety / error definition page in this reference source.

Next, I am just attempting to point out a few things in them as some items are clear as to what they are or thought of, and others maybe not as much so (which is more of the focus). Might be good to take a scan through the summary list page.

The error-ref has Part I and II as Die sub-types and varieties with sub-categories including things like die doubling, defective punch, messed up or omitted letters / numbers and other.

The error-ref then has Part III for Die installation errors. However, Part IV Die Errors is where there are some of the not so clearly understood as error errors. Part IV has sub-categories including rusted dies, die retouching, Die damage including dents, chips and die polishing (intentional die abrasion). Included in this is the loss of design detail and includes 2 feather and 3 or 3 1/2 leg buffaloes. Also included is clashed dies, die deterioration, die breaks and die cracks.

Part V is Planchet error but Part VI Die Striking has a couple more to perhaps mention and includes Machine and ejection doubling and in the struck though is the Filled die (single element and multiple element). The page closes out with some post strike and non-errors.

From varietyvista page perhaps the easiest summary is just a copy of a paragraph but maybe go read the entire page.
.

.
.
So when reading this stuff I think - well errors are one of the more common coins out there. In fact many are not even recognized as such. Additionally they have no extra value. However, they are technically defined as errors per the above sources.

Also some technical errors are used to define varieties. Example might be a bust half with a die crack. This might be more applicable to the die state of a variety like 101 to 101a. I am sure others can think of many more examples.

For me - Now this is does not appear to be technically correct but I kind of think of this as two circles. One circle for varieties and another for errors. Then the two circles are push together where they overlap some. In the area of the overlap are the errors that are varieties so to say. Correct - appears not. But it kind of works out (for me).

This was a fantastic resource!! I was able to locate the orange peel effect that someone mentioned previously. I also thought the die deterioration section could apply, specifically the disappearing details.

So I do have an error by some standards and a variety by others... maybe I'll pop my coins onto eBay and just see if anybody is at all interested in a nickel with a touch of variety😅 I mean I've got 8 of them, so I may as well

Aspie_Rocco · August 29, 2025 1:04PM

@LindseyD said:

So I do have an error by some standards and a variety by others... maybe I'll pop my coins onto eBay and just see if anybody is at all interested in a nickel with a touch of variety😅 I mean I've got 8 of them, so I may as well

You do not have an error on your nickels. You do not have a variety on your nickels. You have late die stage examples. Die deterioration is not an error or variety, it is a natural stage encountered on worn out dies that have been used a LOT.

LindseyD · August 29, 2025 2:58PM

@Aspie_Rocco said:

@LindseyD said:

So I do have an error by some standards and a variety by others... maybe I'll pop my coins onto eBay and just see if anybody is at all interested in a nickel with a touch of variety😅 I mean I've got 8 of them, so I may as well

You do not have an error on your nickels. You do not have a variety on your nickels. You have late die stage examples. Die deterioration is not an error or variety, it is a natural stage encountered on worn out dies that have been used a LOT.

I was basing that off the list of errors that lilolme linked above. If I misinterpreted that, I guess this is another learning moment, but that was definitely what I understood from the website and lilolme's post

coinbuf · August 29, 2025 3:12PM

@LindseyD said:
I was basing that off the list of errors that lilolme linked above. If I misinterpreted that, I guess this is another learning moment, but that was definitely what I understood from the website and lilolme's post

Assuming that Aspie is correct and your coins are showing just die deterioration, then yes you very much misunderstood. Die deterioration is not an error, and nowhere in any post do I see where anyone is trying to make that connection except you.

Variety or Error or.....

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