Wheel Mark Details...

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  • Coll3ctor
    Coll3ctor Posts: 3,388 ✭✭✭
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    @coinbuf said:
    Here is a good link that explains wheel marks

    https://ngccoin.com/news/article/4412/Wheel-Marks/

    Thanx!

  • spyglassdesign
    spyglassdesign Posts: 1,634 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @coinbuf said:
    Here is a good link that explains wheel marks

    https://ngccoin.com/news/article/4412/Wheel-Marks/

    Learn something every day! I figured it has something to do with carriage wheels running over a coin 😅

    https://www.the4thcoin.com
    https://www.ebay.com/str/thefourthcoin

  • LanceNewmanOCC
    LanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    interesting, i thought wheel marks were limited to the concentric circular marks from the coin roll wrapping machines. didn't know the same process could put PLS onto the high points. neat-o

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  • ricko
    ricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Good information - one of the great benefits of this forum is the information provided that explains many of the phenomena noted on coins. Pictures provided are extremely helpful as well. Cheers, RickO

  • Jimnight
    Jimnight Posts: 10,846 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Thanks @coinbuf for that link.

  • Coll3ctor
    Coll3ctor Posts: 3,388 ✭✭✭
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    @Jimnight said:
    Thanks @coinbuf for that link.

    What about me? I'm the one who asked the question :D

  • logger7
    logger7 Posts: 9,870 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    They can be hard to see and can turn a coin you thought was near gem into a loser.

  • MWallace
    MWallace Posts: 4,683 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I have a few coins detail graded as having wheel marks and I swear, no matter how much I look, at different angles and different magnifications, I just don't see most of them. Obviously I don't know what to look for. I have read the link to the description above. When I get them back from grading, I usually sell them.

  • jesbroken
    jesbroken Posts: 11,253 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Here is a 1945 S Jefferson Nickel that PCGS labeled as damage by wheelmarks.
    Jim



    When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln

    Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
  • Jimnight
    Jimnight Posts: 10,846 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Coll3ctor said:

    @Jimnight said:
    Thanks @coinbuf for that link.

    What about me? I'm the one who asked the question :D

    Thank you for posting an interesting thread. :)

  • goodmoney4badmoney
    goodmoney4badmoney Posts: 1,328 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2, 2023 3:56PM
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    If you collect modern errors you learn about wheel-marks pretty quickly, and NGC really hates them.

  • OAKSTAR
    OAKSTAR Posts: 8,770 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I have a question.

    So this coin apparently went through a counting machine? What, back in 1908?... If they had them back then, I'd love to see what one looked like. Or a modern coin counting machine??.. Which leads me to my next question; would a 1908 half dollar ever go thru a modern counting machine?

    Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )

  • hummingbird_coins
    hummingbird_coins Posts: 1,671 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 2, 2023 9:53PM
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    @coinbuf said:
    Here is a good link that explains wheel marks

    https://ngccoin.com/news/article/4412/Wheel-Marks/


    Here is a coin of mine that got a Details grade for a wheel mark (UNITED). I always thought this was the only type of wheel mark, but I guess I learned something new.

    Edited to add: I suppose this one got damaged from a coin wrapping machine, and not a coin counter. I wonder if there are any coins that were unlucky enough to get damaged in both the counting and wrapping processes.

    Young Numismatist • My Toned Coins
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  • PerryHall
    PerryHall Posts: 47,760 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @hummingbird_coins said:

    @coinbuf said:
    Here is a good link that explains wheel marks

    https://ngccoin.com/news/article/4412/Wheel-Marks/


    Here is a coin of mine that got a Details grade for a wheel mark (UNITED). I always thought this was the only type of wheel mark, but I guess I learned something new.

    Edited to add: I suppose this one got damaged from a coin wrapping machine, and not a coin counter. I wonder if there are any coins that were unlucky enough to get damaged in both the counting and wrapping processes.

    Based on the location of that scrape just inside the edge of the coin, that looks like a mark from the crimping machine for the end of a shotgun roll rather than the typical patch of hairline scratches from the hard rubber roller in a coin counting machine. They are two different things but they are both PMD-Post Mintage Damage.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • MS66
    MS66 Posts: 235 ✭✭✭
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    When I struggle to see wheel marks, even with 10x and multiple lighting angles, it can become a coin I'll buy for the Details discount. Presuming I like it otherwise.

    Same with cleaning details: if I can't see it, it doesn't bother me what the TPG says. Obviously the market nicks it but presumably you get it cheaper in the first place.

    And yes, I know this is blasphemy to many.

  • MarkKelley
    MarkKelley Posts: 2,101 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @OAKSTAR said:
    I have a question.

    So this coin apparently went through a counting machine? What, back in 1908?... If they had them back then, I'd love to see what one looked like. Or a modern coin counting machine??.. Which leads me to my next question; would a 1908 half dollar ever go thru a modern counting machine?

    Absolutely! I've found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes.

  • OAKSTAR
    OAKSTAR Posts: 8,770 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @MarkKelley said:

    @OAKSTAR said:
    I have a question.

    So this coin apparently went through a counting machine? What, back in 1908?... If they had them back then, I'd love to see what one looked like. Or a modern coin counting machine??.. Which leads me to my next question; would a 1908 half dollar ever go thru a modern counting machine?

    >

    Absolutely! I've found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes.

    You have found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes....really? When?.. back in 1909? What do Barber halves in boxes have to do with wheel marks?

    Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )

  • [Deleted User]
    [Deleted User] Posts: 0 ✭
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    @OAKSTAR said:

    @MarkKelley said:

    @OAKSTAR said:
    I have a question.

    So this coin apparently went through a counting machine? What, back in 1908?... If they had them back then, I'd love to see what one looked like. Or a modern coin counting machine??.. Which leads me to my next question; would a 1908 half dollar ever go thru a modern counting machine?

    >

    Absolutely! I've found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes.

    You have found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes....really? When?.. back in 1909? What do Barber halves in boxes have to do with wheel marks?

    Finding them in bank boxes means there are still some going through counting machines.

  • OAKSTAR
    OAKSTAR Posts: 8,770 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 3, 2023 2:42PM
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    @Atcarroll said:

    @OAKSTAR said:

    @MarkKelley said:

    @OAKSTAR said:
    I have a question.

    So this coin apparently went through a counting machine? What, back in 1908?... If they had them back then, I'd love to see what one looked like. Or a modern coin counting machine??.. Which leads me to my next question; would a 1908 half dollar ever go thru a modern counting machine?

    >

    Absolutely! I've found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes.

    You have found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes....really? When?.. back in 1909? What do Barber halves in boxes have to do with wheel marks?

    Finding them in bank boxes means there are still some going through counting machines.

    Really. Okay. So people are still finding Barber halves in boxes today that have gone thru counting machines?...I guess it can happen.

    I'm just having a hard time understanding the process and visualizing this happening today with a 1908 half. We all know what modern wheel marks look like on coins from counting machines today.

    Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )

  • MarkKelley
    MarkKelley Posts: 2,101 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @OAKSTAR said:

    @Atcarroll said:

    @OAKSTAR said:

    @MarkKelley said:

    @OAKSTAR said:
    I have a question.

    So this coin apparently went through a counting machine? What, back in 1908?... If they had them back then, I'd love to see what one looked like. Or a modern coin counting machine??.. Which leads me to my next question; would a 1908 half dollar ever go thru a modern counting machine?

    >

    Absolutely! I've found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes.

    You have found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes....really? When?.. back in 1909? What do Barber halves in boxes have to do with wheel marks?

    Finding them in bank boxes means there are still some going through counting machines.

    Really. Okay. So people are still finding Barber halves in boxes today that have gone thru counting machines?...I guess it can happen.

    I'm just have a hard time understanding the process and visualizing this happening today with a 1908 half. We all know what modern wheel marks look like on coins from counting machines today.

    It's happened in the last couple months. These coins are inherited, stolen or found while going through a deceased relatives'
    belongings and then dumped at a bank or Coinstar by people who have no idea of the value. If this didn't happen with some frequency, there would be no point in coin roll hunting!

  • OAKSTAR
    OAKSTAR Posts: 8,770 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @MarkKelley said:

    @OAKSTAR said:

    @Atcarroll said:

    @OAKSTAR said:

    @MarkKelley said:

    @OAKSTAR said:
    I have a question.

    So this coin apparently went through a counting machine? What, back in 1908?... If they had them back then, I'd love to see what one looked like. Or a modern coin counting machine??.. Which leads me to my next question; would a 1908 half dollar ever go thru a modern counting machine?

    >

    Absolutely! I've found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes.

    You have found multiple Barber halves while looking through bank boxes....really? When?.. back in 1909? What do Barber halves in boxes have to do with wheel marks?

    Finding them in bank boxes means there are still some going through counting machines.

    Really. Okay. So people are still finding Barber halves in boxes today that have gone thru counting machines?...I guess it can happen.

    I'm just have a hard time understanding the process and visualizing this happening today with a 1908 half. We all know what modern wheel marks look like on coins from counting machines today.

    It's happened in the last couple months. These coins are inherited, stolen or found while going through a deceased relatives'
    belongings and then dumped at a bank or Coinstar by people who have no idea of the value. If this didn't happen with some frequency, there would be no point in coin roll hunting!

    Now that works for me. Thanks!

    Disclaimer: I'm not a dealer, trader, grader, investor or professional numismatist. I'm just a hobbyist. (To protect me but mostly you! 🤣 )

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