Are $5 gold commems hitting refineries?

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kiyote
kiyote Posts: 5,633 ✭✭✭✭✭
in Precious Metals

I wonder what happens to these things. They don’t seem to be fetching any sort of premium at all. Are these getting melted down in any serious numbers?

"I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.

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  • topstuf
    topstuf Posts: 14,803 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I've never bought one over melt.

  • ricko
    ricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I do not know if they are being melted or not. However, they are not a big focus of collectors, so sitting in dealers inventory, when the price of gold is moving up significantly, could well promote melting. Cheers, RickO

  • derryb
    derryb Posts: 38,608 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    They, along with spouses and the American Arts series gold coins are cheap bullion plays.

    By the way, the American Arts five year series was the US Mint's bullion offering before the American eagles arrived in 1986.

    Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else. - Bastiat

  • coinpalice
    coinpalice Posts: 2,469 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    i would rather have the gold coin rather then a gold bar

  • ballistic_kennedy
    ballistic_kennedy Posts: 70 ✭✭✭
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    The gold commemoratives are a part of my inventory, hate to hear they are getting melted.

    Excellent transaction with: ffcoins, Proofmorgan, fivecents, MorganMan94

  • kiyote
    kiyote Posts: 5,633 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @derryb said:
    They, along with spouses and the American Arts series gold coins are cheap bullion plays.

    By the way, the American Arts five year series was the US Mint's bullion offering before the American eagles arrived in 1986.

    I always really liked the Willa Cather reverse.

    "I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.
  • MilesWaits
    MilesWaits Posts: 5,597 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Every gold bullion piece I sell to my dealer, including eagles and Buffalo’s, go to the refiner, that is his prerogative.
    C’est la vie. That’s why it’s called bullion. If you are a paying Mint premiums, you’re already starting in the hole. With few exceptions.
    Like 2006-2008, for example. The salad years.
    I don’t pay numismatic premiums on Bullion coins unless I plan on keeping them.
    Like the Palladium Eagles.

    Now riding the swell in PM's and surf.
  • MsMorrisine
    MsMorrisine Posts: 40,043 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    ?? does the dealer do no retail at all?

    Current maintainer of Stone's Master List of Favorite Websites // My BST transactions
  • MilesWaits
    MilesWaits Posts: 5,597 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Correct. No retail at all. Not worth it to him.
    He doesn’t play in the purely numismatic sandbox. Neither do I.

    Now riding the swell in PM's and surf.
  • MilesWaits
    MilesWaits Posts: 5,597 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    If I was looking for over spot I would look at the BST, first. That is assuming they are worth over spot. I always consider real market value versus sentimentality.
    Otherwise, they would end up going to melt.

    Now riding the swell in PM's and surf.
  • kiyote
    kiyote Posts: 5,633 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    A complete set would be impressive at this point. 37 coins!

    "I'll split the atom! I am the fifth dimension! I am the eighth wonder of the world!" -Gef the talking mongoose.
  • OnlyGoldIsMoney
    OnlyGoldIsMoney Posts: 3,576 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I have hundreds of the $5 and $10 commems plus dozens of American Arts Medals - all purchased from 2009 to 2018. Some of the commems that came in PCGS holders I posted as a "Bought for Spot" registry set. Otherwise I viewed them when purchased as an economical means of stacking gold. Using various rebate programs and ebay bucks meant that I purchased most below spot.When I sell I don't expect them to sell for spot.....unless I decide to set up as a seller at local coin shows.

    NO END IN SIGHT Liberty Head $2 1/2 Gold Basic Set, Circulation Strikes (1840-1907)
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907/publishedset/15628

    March of Time - 27 Centuries in Gold
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  • derryb
    derryb Posts: 38,608 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Shame the true surviving number of these coins will never be known. Especially in 70 years when collecting "second generation" gold US comms will be the cool thing.

    Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else. - Bastiat

  • MilesWaits
    MilesWaits Posts: 5,597 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Sadly, but realistically, a lot, a lot sold will start going towards the refinery, now.

    Now riding the swell in PM's and surf.
  • OPA
    OPA Posts: 17,166 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @MilesWaits said:
    Sadly, but realistically, a lot, a lot sold will start going towards the refinery, now.

    2011 -2012 all over again. Cycles have a habit of repeating.

    "Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
  • air4mdc
    air4mdc Posts: 956 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I wish I could visit a melting to witness first hand. I just find it hard to believe gold coins are being melted that someday could be worth more than a melt value. It dealt appear there are any shortages of gold coins either. Could there be a back door at the refinery?

  • topstuf
    topstuf Posts: 14,803 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    The back door isn't big enough.

  • coinnerd
    coinnerd Posts: 492 ✭✭✭
    edited July 23, 2020 8:08AM
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    When premiums drop anything will get melted. Smelters actually get more for a melted group of 90% gold than they do for the coins. I've seen a local melt thousands of the $5 commems and even sovereigns when the premium drop to 0.
    This stopped a few months back when the run up started because they could get a premium for any gold from retail buyers

  • OPA
    OPA Posts: 17,166 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Yup....as the saying goes: "Money talks b.s. walks."

    "Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
  • jdimmick
    jdimmick Posts: 9,992 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    They have been going, along with first spouse.

  • metalmeister
    metalmeister Posts: 4,633 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I stopped buying them about 10 years ago. Sold the low mintage ones. Saving the rest as 1/4 ounce (almost) Gold pieces with interesting designs.

    email: ccacollectibles@yahoo.com

    100% Positive BST transactions
  • DeutscherGeist
    DeutscherGeist Posts: 2,998 ✭✭✭✭
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    I do not see the point of melting unless the coins are damaged. There is a person mentioned on these boards that has a 100 oz gold bar and wants smaller denomination coins to trade. Coins are more liquid and easier to sell to a broader audience I would think.
    Anyway, to each his own. There may be a purpose I am not aware of.

    "So many of our DREAMS at first seem impossible, then they seem improbable, and then, when we SUMMON THE WILL they soon become INEVITABLE "- Christopher Reeve

    BST: Tennessebanker, Downtown1974, LarkinCollector, nendee
  • Baley
    Baley Posts: 22,663 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 25, 2020 1:17PM
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    One must recognize the Cost in terms of time and effort to 'someday' eke out an additional percentage or two... versus shipping a bunch at once to a refiner and being done with it.

    do the math on time, money, and Work that goes to storage, insurance, advertising, transactions fees to sales venues, the buy sell spread, market risk, risk of fraud, delays, and public buyer random headaches, the list goes on..

    Before we even come to opportunity cost of tying up the capital in a non-productive asset.

    A hoard of modern commem gold may not be the last place I'd park money, but it's down there

    Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry

  • tincup
    tincup Posts: 5,481 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @DeutscherGeist said:
    I do not see the point of melting unless the coins are damaged. There is a person mentioned on these boards that has a 100 oz gold bar and wants smaller denomination coins to trade. Coins are more liquid and easier to sell to a broader audience I would think.
    Anyway, to each his own. There may be a purpose I am not aware of.

    Reminds me...
    A few years back... there was a poster on this forum who would intentionally deface gold coins such as the $5 commems when he sent them off as bullion... guess he wanted to make darn sure the recipient could not use them for any numismatic premium, and wanted to make sure they were melted. Not a practice that I could make any sense out of, but to each their own.

    ----- kj
  • MilesWaits
    MilesWaits Posts: 5,597 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Baley said:
    One must recognize the Cost in terms of time and effort to 'someday' eke out an additional percentage or two... versus shipping a bunch at once to a refiner and being done with it.

    do the math on time, money, and Work that goes to storage, insurance, advertising, transactions fees to sales venues, the buy sell spread, market risk, risk of fraud, delays, and public buyer random headaches, the list goes on..

    Before we even come to opportunity cost of tying up the capital in a non-productive asset.

    A hoard of modern commem gold may not be the last place I'd park money, but it's down there

    That is the absolute mission statement for my dealer. It’s not worth it to him to deal with the customers, market and stress versus sending it off to melt.
    Granted, he used to, but not no more.

    Now riding the swell in PM's and surf.

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