Bechtler Gold Dollar - Opinions?

asheland · October 28, 2019 8:15AM

This is one I’m likely going to get in about a week. A friend of mine owns it. It’ll be my first Bechtler!

I was curious about what you guys think of it’s surfaces. I’m not too knowledgeable about territorial gold and wondered what you guys thought...

It’s a PCGS AU53:

CaptHenway · October 28, 2019 9:08AM

I LIKE that coin! It has a lot of character.
TD

jwitten · October 28, 2019 9:30AM

Looks great to me! Congrats!

Smudge · October 28, 2019 9:31AM

Just get it.

Insider2 · October 28, 2019 9:32AM

First, I'd like to read what you think about its surfaces and WHY? What do you see?

Aethelred · October 28, 2019 9:54AM

Bargain box junk, better to avoid this ugly coin!

Smudge · October 28, 2019 10:16AM

@Aethelred said:
Bargain box junk, better to avoid this ugly coin!

So sell it to me for melt.

crazyhounddog · October 28, 2019 10:28AM

The surfaces scream original to me. I’m not sure why you ask but I sure don’t see any problems if that’s what you’re hinting at. For a 53 I think it’s gorgeous. Yes that would be a VERY welcome addition to my collection I can tell you that.
Very, very nice.
Congratulations, Joe

jonruns · October 28, 2019 10:34AM

CoinFacts provides a good summary written by Ron Guth:

"Kagin 24 is a $1 gold coin, produced by Augustus Bechtler, weighed 27 grains and contained gold of 21 Carat gold purity (87.5% pure). The design is simple but efficient, consisting solely of letters and numerals. This variety is fairly common in general but, like most Bechtler gold colns, it is very rare in Mint State. Many of the examples seen today have been stripped of their original surfaces, so those with crusty, reddish-gold color should be worth a premium.

It appears that the dies for this coin were used over an extended period of time. Early states show strong details and denticles on both sides. In later states, the denticles fade (ground off?), the dies become heavily rusted, the obverse (A. Bechtler side) becomes cracked, and the reverse details begin to disappear (see the 1 of 21C for a great example)."

DW once told me that there are probably only 3 guys alive who can accurately grade territorials and unfortunately none of them work for the grading services...and probably none of them are on this forum either...

To me the surfaces look original...personally I would send it in to CAC for their opinion...a great pick up if you can get it!!! IMHO JA likes that kind of toning on territorials...

Here are two that I've owned that passed at CAC...I've sold the $5 but still own the $1...

asheland · October 28, 2019 11:45AM

@Insider2 said:
First, I'd like to read what you think about its surfaces and WHY? What do you see?

I believe it's original and nice for the grade, but I've seen very few in person and wondered what you guys thought. I figured the response would be positive. I've looked at quite a few this morning on Heritage. From what I see, it's pretty original, lots of crust!

It looks like I'll be picking it up this evening! My friend was able to get to his bank on his lunch break to get it.

I'll post slab shots tonight!

Broadstruck · October 28, 2019 1:02PM

Raw it's XF with surfaces that have been cleaned up a bit.

MFeld · October 28, 2019 2:03PM

If the images are accurate, the coin looks far more wholesome than most of the ones I have seen.

skier07 · October 28, 2019 3:09PM

That looks like a very nice Bechtler to me with “original” surfaces. Keep in mind that they were crudely minted and most were poorly struck and they’re very difficult to grade. Checkout the archives on Doug Winters or Kagin’s website for better looking examples.

Weiss · October 28, 2019 3:17PM

That's the bomb coin, @asheland. I've thought long and hard about getting one.

Cameonut · October 28, 2019 3:51PM

Being a NC resident, I am always looking for nice Bechtler pieces. Yours is definitely a keeper!

amwldcoin · October 28, 2019 4:50PM

Looks like a nice wholesome piece to me. Makes me wish I hadn't been so hasty selling the 1 I found in World poundage! If this is a 53 the 1 I found was a 58 or better.

Boosibri · October 28, 2019 5:19PM

Very wholesome! I like it a lot!

asheland · October 28, 2019 5:28PM

Thanks everybody!
Here are fresh pictures that are very accurate as to the in hand look:

asheland · October 28, 2019 5:32PM

My friend who I bought it from wrote a very interesting article about this coin in the current South Carolina Numismatic Association “The Scanner” he included the letter with the coin:

jonruns · October 28, 2019 5:38PM

I can't really read the letter but it's a cool piece of history.

The coin looks nice congratulations!. As background on the Bechtler mint I highly recommend the one hour video "Gold Fever and the Bechtler Mint" which was produced a few years ago by a local NC public TV station and can be watched on Hulu...

kaz · October 28, 2019 6:12PM

I'm envious! Maybe,when you have time, you could post a full picture of the letter? Or a transcription?

ricko · October 29, 2019 5:54AM

Wow...Very nice... Congratulations on a great acquisition.....I love gold coins, and when they also have that kind of history, it is a double winner....Cheers, RickO

Cameonut · October 29, 2019 6:20AM

@asheland said:
My friend who I bought it from wrote a very interesting article about this coin in the current South Carolina Numismatic Association “The Scanner” he included the letter with the coin:

Here is a link to the SCNA article on this piece which starts on page 39. The article before it is about Christopher Bechtler, starting on page 35.
sc-na.org/documents/Scanner47v3.pdf

Edited to add: The text of the handwritten letter is also shown in the article.

messydesk · October 29, 2019 6:26AM

Nice, wholesome coin, cool letter!

asheland · October 29, 2019 11:29AM

@Cameonut Thank you for posting that link!

asheland · October 29, 2019 11:29AM

Thanks everybody for the kind words.

tommy44 · October 29, 2019 12:53PM

Nice piece of historic southern gold, congratulations. If only it could talk.

jonruns · October 29, 2019 2:19PM

Thanks for sharing the details of your acquisition and especially the back story...for me the availability of nice old gold for sale has been kind of depressing of late...glad to see one quality piece surfacing...

Congrats on your NEWP!!

Jon

JJSingleton · October 29, 2019 5:48PM

I like it a bunch. Congrats and the letter is cool too.

CharlotteDude · October 29, 2019 6:40PM

I really like the look of that coin... certainly worthy of two thumbs up.

asheland · October 30, 2019 7:23AM

Thanks!

divecchia · October 30, 2019 9:35AM

Congrats on picking up an awesome looking piece. I was not familiar with this piece before now. Thanks for sharing it and the history behind it.

Donato

Cameonut · October 30, 2019 11:04AM

By total coincidence, I was able to procure a copy of a 1980 book on the Bechtler pieces entitled "The Bechtlers and Their Coinage" by Rodney Barfield and Keith Strawn 65 pages. Been looking for one for a while. If interested, expect to pony up about $150 if you can find one. My copy arrived an hour ago.

Much of the book is written history of the Bechtlers with lots of pics. A couple of tidbits on the OP's piece. There is a photo of the die used for the obverse - apparently it is owned by the ANA. Also, the one dollar piece is described as having a plain edge and a comment that "the majority of this issue examined by museum curators (about 100 coins) are dished; concave on the obverse and convex on the reverse". In this case the obverse is the side with "A Bechtler" on it. I find this quite interesting and wonder if some pieces did not holder due to this dished/bent effect.

The rest of the book is a listing of all the coins the Bechtler's produced over the years.

Photo of book cover.

amwldcoin · October 30, 2019 11:20AM

Wow! Guess I got lucky. Seems I paid $10 or $20 for my copy a few years back.

@Cameonut said:
By total coincidence, I was able to procure a copy of a 1980 book on the Bechtler pieces entitled "The Bechtlers and Their Coinage" by Rodney Barfield and Keith Strawn 65 pages. Been looking for one for a while. If interested, expect to pony up about $150 if you can find one. My copy arrived an hour ago.

Much of the book is written history of the Bechtlers with lots of pics. A couple of tidbits on the OP's piece. There is a photo of the die used for the obverse - apparently it is owned by the ANA. Also, the one dollar piece is described as having a plain edge and a comment that "the majority of this issue examined by museum curators (about 100 coins) are dished; concave on the obverse and convex on the reverse". In this case the obverse is the side with "A Bechtler" on it. I find this quite interesting and wonder if some pieces did not holder due to this dished/bent effect.

The rest of the book is a listing of all the coins the Bechtler's produced over the years.

Photo of book cover.

asheland · October 30, 2019 11:54AM

I’ll have to look for a copy. It looks interesting and you can never have too many books!

My coin has that curved edge and I find it interesting indeed, I rather like the look, It has character.

Bechtler Gold Dollar - Opinions?

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