@PTVETTER said:
I understand how keets feels
What sometimes happens is kinda funny.
“I want to speak with the manager” customer request
Guess who owned the shop?
I just look and do nothing, minutes later it finally hits them.
They walk out, oh well!
Shop name
Pat and BJ Coins
I’m Pat!
@PTVETTER said:
I understand how keets feels
What sometimes happens is kinda funny.
“I want to speak with the manager” customer request
Guess who owned the shop?
I just look and do nothing, minutes later it finally hits them.
They walk out, oh well!
Shop name
Pat and BJ Coins
I’m Pat!
Owner or not, why would you just look and do nothing when a customer says that he/she wants to speak with the manager?
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@PTVETTER said:
I understand how keets feels
What sometimes happens is kinda funny.
“I want to speak with the manager” customer request
Guess who owned the shop?
I just look and do nothing, minutes later it finally hits them.
They walk out, oh well!
Shop name
Pat and BJ Coins
I’m Pat!
Owner or not, why would you just look and do nothing when a customer says that he/she wants to speak with the manager?
Because old coin guys are more curmudgeonly than the general population?
People can be a pain. But it is a little ironic that on this thread where so many are complaining about the rudeness of cell phone usage, others are advocating for greeting rudeness with rudeness.
"I am the manager" or "I am the owner" would be easier to say and less rude than staring down the customer who is guaranteed to never return.
True story: there are two large B&M's in town. One of them pays more than the other for bullion and scrap, by a lot. The one that pays more has two abrasive, rude people who work the counter. I can't even tell you how many people I've seen selling bullion at the other shop complain that they arrived there because of rude behavior at the first shop.
There is no point in ever being rude to a customer or even a non-customer. The same guy who shows up with a steel cent looking to make a million might never buy anything from you. But when their buddy at work inherits grandpa's coin collection, he's going to tell him to NOT go to your shop.
Sometimes you can't win. Sometimes they are going to hate you no matter how kind you are. But they will DEFINITELY dislike you and badmouth you if you are intentionally rude or passive-aggressively insulting.
@PTVETTER said:
I understand how keets feels
What sometimes happens is kinda funny.
“I want to speak with the manager” customer request
Guess who owned the shop?
I just look and do nothing, minutes later it finally hits them.
They walk out, oh well!
Shop name
Pat and BJ Coins
I’m Pat!
Owner or not, why would you just look and do nothing when a customer says that he/she wants to speak with the manager?
Because old coin guys are more curmudgeonly than the general population?
People can be a pain. But it is a little ironic that on this thread where so many are complaining about the rudeness of cell phone usage, others are advocating for greeting rudeness with rudeness.
"I am the manager" or "I am the owner" would be easier to say and less rude than staring down the customer who is guaranteed to never return.
True story: there are two large B&M's in town. One of them pays more than the other for bullion and scrap, by a lot. The one that pays more has two abrasive, rude people who work the counter. I can't even tell you how many people I've seen selling bullion at the other shop complain that they arrived there because of rude behavior at the other shop.
There is no point in ever being rude to a customer or even a non-customer. The same guy who shows up with a steel cent looking to make a million might never buy anything from you. But when there buddy at work inherits grandpa's coin collection, he's going to tell him to NOT go to your shop.
Sometimes you can't win. Sometimes they are going to hate you no matter how kind you are. But they will DEFINITELY dislike you and badmouth you if you are intentionally rude or passive-aggressively insulting.
Agreed. One need not put up with rudeness. But that doesn’t mean one should be rude, in return.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I agree you don’t have to be rude but when you see the level of stupidity over and over it’s hard not to shake your head. Can’t tell you how many times customers want to return parts that didn’t fix their problem when I told them up front that’s not their problem. Then get mad because they can’t. SMH again.
W.C.Fields "I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
Working retail... in almost any business, is where one meets a true cross section of humanity. Yes, the events listed above (and in 'why coin dealers drink') are interesting and sometimes humorous. That being said, they are by no means the majority of customers. Analysis will show the typical bell curve experienced when researching most human behaviors. The outliers are the memorable ones....Cheers, RickO
I can't even tell you how many people I've seen selling bullion at the other shop complain that they arrived there because of rude behavior at the first shop.
there's really no point in trying to justify anything with a tit-for-tat running commentary. I understand that you're talking about another store but your tenor throughout the thread has been that in OUR STORE we treat people rudely, all based on what I presume is a sign on the door. please go back, reread my posts and tell me where I have explained my rude behavior to customers. it just ain't there.
here's the truth of the matter: we don't physically threaten customers, we don't curse at customers, we don't steal from customers, we don't attempt to knowingly sell customers stolen goods, we don't knowingly try to sell customers counterfeit or otherwise fake items. customers routinely do these things and more to us. we have a very large database of customers, most of them repeat and regular. it's interesting that almost 100% of the "problems" are with Pawn customers or people I have never seen before.
our store's actions are governed by State Laws while the actions of these problem customers tends to be governed by some sort of Wild West mentality where anything goes and they see themselves above rules and common decency.
here's another salient point. most people are able to understand only what their experience teaches them. if they lead a respectful, courteous life it can be hard to understand that people act rudely, even when they are told of such behavior. there just has to be an excuse for it. absent the experience of working a retail counter in the Coin/Jewelry/Pawn business I wouldn't have believed the things I experience routinely do in fact happen, and often. when dealing with desperate people, thieves, drug addicts and alcoholics, the absurd becomes the normal.
@keets said: I can't even tell you how many people I've seen selling bullion at the other shop complain that they arrived there because of rude behavior at the first shop.
there's really no point in trying to justify anything with a tit-for-tat running commentary. I understand that you're talking about another store but your tenor throughout the thread has been that in OUR STORE we treat people rudely, all based on what I presume is a sign on the door. please go back, reread my posts and tell me where I have explained my rude behavior to customers. it just ain't there.
here's the truth of the matter: we don't physically threaten customers, we don't curse at customers, we don't steal from customers, we don't attempt to knowingly sell customers stolen goods, we don't knowingly try to sell customers counterfeit or otherwise fake items. customers routinely do these things and more to us. we have a very large database of customers, most of them repeat and regular. it's interesting that almost 100% of the "problems" are with Pawn customers or people I have never seen before.
our store's actions are governed by State Laws while the actions of these problem customers tends to be governed by some sort of Wild West mentality where anything goes and they see themselves above rules and common decency.
here's another salient point. most people are able to understand only what their experience teaches them. if they lead a respectful, courteous life it can be hard to understand that people act rudely, even when they are told of such behavior. there just has to be an excuse for it. absent the experience of working a retail counter in the Coin/Jewelry?Pawn business I wouldn't have believed the things I experience routinely do in fact happen, and often. when dealing with desperate people, thieves, drug addicts and alcoholics, the absurd becomes the normal.
I experienced a lot of weird behavior in a coin shop. I can't even imagine the level of craziness in a pawn shop.
Numismatist Ordinaire See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
@keets said:
... here's another salient point. most people are able to understand only what their experience teaches them. if they lead a respectful, courteous life it can be hard to understand that people act rudely, even when they are told of such behavior. there just has to be an excuse for it. absent the experience of working a retail counter in the Coin/Jewelry/Pawn business I wouldn't have believed the things I experience routinely do in fact happen, and often. when dealing with desperate people, thieves, drug addicts and alcoholics, the absurd becomes the normal.
I concur! My experiences in the retail cell phone business for the last 8 years has been very entertaining.
@keets said: I can't even tell you how many people I've seen selling bullion at the other shop complain that they arrived there because of rude behavior at the first shop.
there's really no point in trying to justify anything with a tit-for-tat running commentary. I understand that you're talking about another store but your tenor throughout the thread has been that in OUR STORE we treat people rudely, all based on what I presume is a sign on the door. please go back, reread my posts and tell me where I have explained my rude behavior to customers. it just ain't there.
This was a response to the other shop owner who stared down a customer who asked to speak to the manager. It had nothing to do with you.
Speaking of phones, one of the most annoying things (to me at least) is the counter person who answers the phone and lets the customer who is in the store wait for assistance. Gotta answer that phone by gawd.
Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
I get a taste of what shop owners experience while doing shows: Brokesters, Ignorance, low ball buyers, sellers coming to my table wanting retail for trash, and then of course the Know it all who isn’t going to buy anything anyway. Deer - these are players like a deer in the headlights when it comes to understanding pricing. People w kids - a 100 pct raw coin dealer setup next to me w world coin junk box (six for a dollar) did booming business with them. Many looking thru his binders of pages of 2x2’s (don’t know if they buying).
At last show the only slabbed coin offered at my table was a guy offering me was a 1964 PCGS Kennedy 50c in pr66 he wanted $35 for. I told him CDN bid is $16 (not making an offer) he replied he would keep it.
These like cosmic background radiation are just part of the experience. In current market - Coins priced near melt do well - others well I have reduced my buying considerably.
I usually only read these posts but could not help but reply to this one. I have been in the coin business since 1980 and the consumer walking into the store/office just seems to be getting worse. You are right, they come in knowing all of the answers, so why come in for my opinion? I cringe when the first words that come out of their mouth is "I have done my research." Well that's wonderful but if you don't know what you have or what you are looking for how can you do accurate research?
I find that it seems to be human nature that people want to believe that what they have is the most valuable item there is so no matter what you tell them you are a liar. Most of these consumers with all of the answers fall into two separate categories.
First, after I have spent a considerable amount of time with them appraising their coin/collection and I get a "well the internet says...." It usually ends with, well, call the website where you got the information and sell it to them. I explain how the information cost them nothing and that is what it is worth, nothing. They usually then realize how ridiculous they sound.
Second is even better. It starts with the person who comes in with a corroded Indian cent or 1964-D 1c and when I tell them it is worth 2c or 50c they tell me that the internet, as if the internet is now a person, says it is worth $20,000. This is so outlandish that I tell them to show me where on the internet it says this. Inevitably it is Etsy. I then explain what Etsy is and who the people are on there trying to sell these coins and then offer to sell them a corroded Indian cent for 50c. They usually get it at that point.
Before the days of cell phones I used to tell know-it-all callers to hold their coin up real close to the phone so that I could get a real good look at it. Occasionally I would hear the coin clicking against the mouthpiece.
Have a drink!
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
Sounds like some ol’ codgers need to get into something else, retire, or stay retired.
that is exactly my thought, some of these wannabe collectors and kranky old people that stroll in should try some other Hobby. it's nice to see we're in agreement on that, even on a drive-by. hey stman, shoot lower, I'm ridin' shetland.
Definitely having patience with very rude people is hard to maintain unless they are high rollers with deep pockets, but those people usually have decent etiquette. I was in a coin shop yesterday where someone wanted an appraisal of "gold" plated trash in tiny tubes the worker spent way too much time on that snafu.
I work part time on the weekends at a big box store where people rudely call dozens of yards away with their hands raised for someone to come rushing to their side to hold their hands and help. Lots and lots of people who don't want to do their own DD. This "civilization" seems to be sliding downhill quickly or maybe there are too many of the rude types in a bumper crop.
Never would have figured some to be a troll. Ain’t got time for childish games. Got too many good things happening. Get a life. Heh good to see you too mr. coin dealer at the pawn shop.
Please... Save The Stories, Just Answer My Questions, And Tell Me How Much!!!!!
wow, where's all this coming from?? haven't interacted with you in years and you come out swinging with an agenda. it's nice to see you have the support of lanzaf. stay safe and I'll talk with you in 2025.
Maybe dress up to get respect? Either designer shirt, tie and jacket with clean shave; or mafia style pinstripes suit, stuff cotton in mouth cheeks and with concealed prop pistols on either hip....
@keets said:
wow, where's all this coming from?? haven't interacted with you in years and you come out swinging with an agenda. it's nice to see you have the support of lanzaf. stay safe and I'll talk with you in 2025.
If that was aimed at me, I literally meant random click. When I'm scrolling on my screen, I'm always issuing random clicks. Before they removed the "disagree" button, I had issued all kinds of unfortunate disagrees.
@stman said:
Sounds like some ol’ codgers need to get into something else, retire, or stay retired.
Thank you for sharing!
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
We get calls daily at the ANA on 1943 cents, $2 notes, you name it. We try to explain that while something may not be valuable, that doesn't mean that it's not neat. Lately, we have had a bunch of people calling about a dollar coin from 1776 with a bald guy on it. We call that coin the Nostradamus dollar.
@Dreamcrusher said:
We get calls daily at the ANA on 1943 cents, $2 notes, you name it. We try to explain that while something may not be valuable, that doesn't mean that it's not neat. Lately, we have had a bunch of people calling about a dollar coin from 1776 with a bald guy on it. We call that coin the Nostradamus dollar.
lmao.
Odd that they ignore the second date on the coin.
And you have to worry about their understanding of history.
I was in industrial sales for over 30 years, and it comes in phases. Initially, I thought that I had to know everything. Marginal results.
Then, I started learning humility and began to appreciate what I didn't know. I began to learn from every customer. I became more and more knowledgeable.
Finally, it hit me - I became an "expert" much to my surprise. I relished helping my customers become knowledgeable while still learning from them. It's a joint exercise.
I think that working retail would be even more challenging, but wildidea's and Weiss's posts seem on target, to me.
Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally
as wildidea suggested, I am who my boss brought in to take the heat off of him. somewhere and somehow, anytime I post about what happens in the shop it is ass-u-me d that I am a dealer and the owner of the shop. members read things that just aren't there, but I digress.
actually, reading this thread can be very instructive. it is almost a microcosm of the type of personality that comes into the business. there are those who are present and seem to understand what's going on, those who think they know what's going on, don't, but can be reasoned with, those who are only present to cause problems, probably bored. it is interesting to observe, much like a day at work.
@bidask said:
What does working at a retail coin shop
teach you about what you pay for coins
offered you ?
I’m curious about what you pay for coins that are scarce or rare
( date or grade ) to persons who do not know what they have .
Do you rip them ?
If not please describe what Is a fair offer for such coins .
Have you ever walked into a shop pretending you have no knowlege about a valuable coin that you want to sell.
I've thought about trying it but I don't trust myself not to get angry.
I think there was a "undercover mechanic" episode about that years ago and you dealers did not do well.
Like, very-very not well
Great thread Al, I have had a few chuckles here....You should see what I experience at the shooting range... Well... actually, it is the same thing, just a different product/process....Cheers, RickO
@mr1874 said:
Speaking of phones, one of the most annoying things (to me at least) is the counter person who answers the phone and lets the customer who is in the store wait for assistance. Gotta answer that phone by gawd.
I never understood this either until it was explained to me by my service writer.
The goal of any retail business is to get customers in the door. The person in the store is already there so you need to answer the phone to potentially get that customer in the door.
Usually the person in the store is not going to leave because of a short phone call as long as you acknowledge them and are not too long on the phone. If the phone call seems like it will be dragged out you can always put them on hold to help the customer standing in front of you.
@ReadyFireAim said:
Have you ever walked into a shop pretending you have no knowlege about a valuable coin that you want to sell.
I've thought about trying it but I don't trust myself not to get angry.
Yes. A few years ago I moved to a new area and took a few pcgs and ngc pieces worth about $7000 greysheet bid into an LCS, claimed they were left to me. Was offered $1400. To be fair he seemed to be a lower-end dealer, but still.
@ReadyFireAim said:
Have you ever walked into a shop pretending you have no knowlege about a valuable coin that you want to sell.
I've thought about trying it but I don't trust myself not to get angry.
Yes. A few years ago I moved to a new area and took a few pcgs and ngc pieces worth about $7000 greysheet bid into an LCS, claimed they were left to me. Was offered $1400. To be fair he seemed to be a lower-end dealer, but still.
My belief is that if, for whatever reason, a potential buyer can’t or isn’t willing to offer a fair price, it’s better to just let the seller know that.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@ReadyFireAim said:
Have you ever walked into a shop pretending you have no knowlege about a valuable coin that you want to sell.
I've thought about trying it but I don't trust myself not to get angry.
Yes. A few years ago I moved to a new area and took a few pcgs and ngc pieces worth about $7000 greysheet bid into an LCS, claimed they were left to me. Was offered $1400. To be fair he seemed to be a lower-end dealer, but still.
My belief is that if, for whatever reason, a potential buyer can’t or isn’t willing to offer a fair price, it’s better to just let the seller know that.
There is no uniform dealer response to such an offer. Some pawn/cash-for-gold type operations will offer you melt on just about anything. Some coin dealers try to goose the margin if they think they can. Some coin dealers (believe it or not) actually try to educate the customer.
100% TRUE STORY:
About a dozen years ago, a customer walked into a local B&M with a silver-centered cent. The family was descended from the Wolcott family and this coin had been in the family for over 200 years. It wasn't part of a coin collection, just a family heirloom.
The shop owner told them what they had. Told them it looked real but needed authentication. It was about a month before the ANA summer show, so they recommended driving down (it was about 6 hours away that year) and having it looked at.
The coin went to the ANA was authenticated and consigned, realized $300k plus. The dealer never realized a single cent from the transaction. [We can discuss in a separate thread how the dealer might have been able to make a little and still do right by the customer, but that's a separate issue.]
Not every dealer is a crook trying to rip everyone off. Not every "dealer" is honest and trying to do right by the customer. And, frankly, not every dealer even knows as much as some of their customers.
Another TRUE STORY:
There's a local pawn operation that dabbles in coins. They can't even be bothered to buy a Greysheet. If anything that isn't bullion comes in, they text me a photo and ask for a price/offer.
Couple weeks ago, they text me the most God awful looking "proof 1885 Liberty nickel". It was one of those novelty things. The date and design were square and not even close to the real thing. I got a text photo and the question: is it real?
If you brought the silver-center cent to this place, you'd be lucky to get a $20 offer and not because they were trying to rip you off. They just don't know anything about coins. They just think they could make some money on coins by adding them to the list of things they buy/sell.
My belief is that if, for whatever reason, a potential buyer can’t or isn’t willing to offer a fair price, it’s better to just let the seller know that.
Mark, this is interesting because as soon as many members understand that I work in a shop that does "Pawn" business the attitude typically goes south based on personal experiences or anecdotal evidence about how many such businesses operate.
it is hard to get around that.
to your point, it seems common for customers to come in with something valuable, not only unaware that it is special but having no idea of value. it would be simple to offer them a pittance: we don't. on many occasions we will accept an item on "Memo" and try to either ascertain a realistic value or if it is genuine. sometimes customers don't want to wait for something like that and we will make an offer somewhere between what we'd expect the value to be and what we can afford to be wrong on, but only if we think strongly that an item is genuine. it is better to let something walk away than to be wrong and lose.
another thing we will do is send metal/bullion type items out for assay but that can be tricky. customers don't want to pay for that service and if there's nothing up front they often will stick us with the fee when an item returns as no good. most often that is Silver and Industrial Platinum.
in the not too distant future, when most everyone is connected to the internet, I expect that the number of walk-ins who have no idea of their item's value will fall dramatically. currently, there are way too many people with no internet or no ability to find the value of items before they try to sell.
I can't speak for other "Pawn" shops that buy coins, but we have far more customers trying to deceive us than vice-a-versa.
@keets said: My belief is that if, for whatever reason, a potential buyer can’t or isn’t willing to offer a fair price, it’s better to just let the seller know that.
Mark, this is interesting because as soon as many members understand that I work in a shop that does "Pawn" business the attitude typically goes south based on personal experiences or anecdotal evidence about how many such businesses operate.
it is hard to get around that.
to your point, it seems common for customers to come in with something valuable, not only unaware that it is special but having no idea of value. it would be simple to offer them a pittance: we don't. on many occasions we will accept an item on "Memo" and try to either ascertain a realistic value or if it is genuine. sometimes customers don't want to wait for something like that and we will make an offer somewhere between what we'd expect the value to be and what we can afford to be wrong on, but only if we think strongly that an item is genuine. it is better to let something walk away than to be wrong and lose.
another thing we will do is send metal/bullion type items out for assay but that can be tricky. customers don't want to pay for that service and if there's nothing up front they often will stick us with the fee when an item returns as no good. most often that is Silver and Industrial Platinum.
in the not too distant future, when most everyone is connected to the internet, I expect that the number of walk-ins who have no idea of their item's value will fall dramatically. currently, there are way too many people with no internet or no ability to find the value of items before they try to sell.
I can't speak for other "Pawn" shops that buy coins, but we have far more customers trying to deceive us than vice-a-versa.
I’m sure, like in other businesses, there are stand up pawn shop owners and sleaze-ball owners. I had gathered from your various posts, that the one you work for is one of the former.
Edited to add: One especially difficult scenario occurs when a seller has a valuable ungraded coin, which will have a large value spread, depending upon the assigned grade. And the seller doesn’t want to pay to have the coin graded. If you, as a buyer, are convinced that it will grade either X (making it worth $2000) or X+1 (making it worth $5000), how much do you offer? I think the fairest thing to do is offer roughly $1900 and make an agreement with the seller that If the coin grades x+1 or higher, you will pay extra. But what if the coin grades less than x?😮 Often, it’s not easy to come up with a “fair” offer, no matter how much you want to do so.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I have a very good friend who has been a long-time dealer in Iowa. He has a reputation for taking time with people, explaining what they have and offering a fair price. He had customers from almost every state last year due to word of mouth. Taking time with customers and offering a square deal goes a very long way. Of course not everyone walks away happy but his biggest complaint is that people have to be patient to see him. He always tells me that he is busier than a one armed paper hanger with a sore hand.
Question is as a customer what can I expect a honest dealer to pay. Say I have a pcgs coin valued at $100.00 in their price guide. What is a reasonable amount I should receive for that coin
@Larrob37 said:
Question is as a customer what can I expect a honest dealer to pay. Say I have a pcgs coin valued at $100.00 in their price guide. What is a reasonable amount I should receive for that coin
Part of the answer will be based upon the level at what such coins are actually trading. If they are trading at $100, I think a fair offer would be in the $80-$85 range. Others might disagree.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@MFeld said:
If you, as a buyer, are convinced that it will grade either X (making it worth $2000) or X+1 (making it worth $5000), how much do you offer? I think the fairest thing to do is offer roughly $1900 and make an agreement with the seller that If the coin grades x+1 or higher, you will pay extra.
After grading fees and shipping, that would mean paying $1950 or so for a coin that retails for $2000 if it grades X. Aside from bullion, are there any buyers who work on that sort of margin?
@MFeld said:
If you, as a buyer, are convinced that it will grade either X (making it worth $2000) or X+1 (making it worth $5000), how much do you offer? I think the fairest thing to do is offer roughly $1900 and make an agreement with the seller that If the coin grades x+1 or higher, you will pay extra.
After grading fees and shipping, that would mean paying $1950 or so for a coin that retails for $2000 if it grades X. Aside from bullion, are there any buyers who work on that sort of margin?
Usually, not on purpose. 😉 But in my example, the coin could have graded out to be worth $5000. When there is considerable upside, I’m Ok with essentially breaking even in the event that the upside isn’t realized.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
@2dueces said:
I agree you don’t have to be rude but when you see the level of stupidity over and over it’s hard not to shake your head. Can’t tell you how many times customers want to return parts that didn’t fix their problem when I told them up front that’s not their problem. Then get mad because they can’t. SMH again.
But on the flip side of this 95% of my customers listen intensely to what I have to say. I offer free advice to anyone willing to listen. Most thank me for my service and tell their buddy’s where to go when they need service. Knowing I’ve been in the business 22 years and that I’m fair albeit not cheap. I’ve never ripped off a customer and sleep well at night.
W.C.Fields "I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
Comments
Well let me talk to BJ then,,,,,
Owner or not, why would you just look and do nothing when a customer says that he/she wants to speak with the manager?
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
Because old coin guys are more curmudgeonly than the general population?
People can be a pain. But it is a little ironic that on this thread where so many are complaining about the rudeness of cell phone usage, others are advocating for greeting rudeness with rudeness.
"I am the manager" or "I am the owner" would be easier to say and less rude than staring down the customer who is guaranteed to never return.
True story: there are two large B&M's in town. One of them pays more than the other for bullion and scrap, by a lot. The one that pays more has two abrasive, rude people who work the counter. I can't even tell you how many people I've seen selling bullion at the other shop complain that they arrived there because of rude behavior at the first shop.
There is no point in ever being rude to a customer or even a non-customer. The same guy who shows up with a steel cent looking to make a million might never buy anything from you. But when their buddy at work inherits grandpa's coin collection, he's going to tell him to NOT go to your shop.
Sometimes you can't win. Sometimes they are going to hate you no matter how kind you are. But they will DEFINITELY dislike you and badmouth you if you are intentionally rude or passive-aggressively insulting.
Agreed. One need not put up with rudeness. But that doesn’t mean one should be rude, in return.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I agree you don’t have to be rude but when you see the level of stupidity over and over it’s hard not to shake your head. Can’t tell you how many times customers want to return parts that didn’t fix their problem when I told them up front that’s not their problem. Then get mad because they can’t. SMH again.
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
Working retail... in almost any business, is where one meets a true cross section of humanity. Yes, the events listed above (and in 'why coin dealers drink') are interesting and sometimes humorous. That being said, they are by no means the majority of customers. Analysis will show the typical bell curve experienced when researching most human behaviors. The outliers are the memorable ones....Cheers, RickO
I can't even tell you how many people I've seen selling bullion at the other shop complain that they arrived there because of rude behavior at the first shop.
there's really no point in trying to justify anything with a tit-for-tat running commentary. I understand that you're talking about another store but your tenor throughout the thread has been that in OUR STORE we treat people rudely, all based on what I presume is a sign on the door. please go back, reread my posts and tell me where I have explained my rude behavior to customers. it just ain't there.
here's the truth of the matter: we don't physically threaten customers, we don't curse at customers, we don't steal from customers, we don't attempt to knowingly sell customers stolen goods, we don't knowingly try to sell customers counterfeit or otherwise fake items. customers routinely do these things and more to us. we have a very large database of customers, most of them repeat and regular. it's interesting that almost 100% of the "problems" are with Pawn customers or people I have never seen before.
our store's actions are governed by State Laws while the actions of these problem customers tends to be governed by some sort of Wild West mentality where anything goes and they see themselves above rules and common decency.
here's another salient point. most people are able to understand only what their experience teaches them. if they lead a respectful, courteous life it can be hard to understand that people act rudely, even when they are told of such behavior. there just has to be an excuse for it. absent the experience of working a retail counter in the Coin/Jewelry/Pawn business I wouldn't have believed the things I experience routinely do in fact happen, and often. when dealing with desperate people, thieves, drug addicts and alcoholics, the absurd becomes the normal.
I experienced a lot of weird behavior in a coin shop. I can't even imagine the level of craziness in a pawn shop.
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
I concur! My experiences in the retail cell phone business for the last 8 years has been very entertaining.
This was a response to the other shop owner who stared down a customer who asked to speak to the manager. It had nothing to do with you.
What does working at a retail coin shop
teach you about what you pay for coins
offered you ?
I’m curious about what you pay for coins that are scarce or rare
( date or grade ) to persons who do not know what they have .
Do you rip them ?
If not please describe what Is a fair offer for such coins .
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
Speaking of phones, one of the most annoying things (to me at least) is the counter person who answers the phone and lets the customer who is in the store wait for assistance. Gotta answer that phone by gawd.
Whoever is careless with the truth in small matters cannot be trusted with important matters.
I get a taste of what shop owners experience while doing shows: Brokesters, Ignorance, low ball buyers, sellers coming to my table wanting retail for trash, and then of course the Know it all who isn’t going to buy anything anyway. Deer - these are players like a deer in the headlights when it comes to understanding pricing. People w kids - a 100 pct raw coin dealer setup next to me w world coin junk box (six for a dollar) did booming business with them. Many looking thru his binders of pages of 2x2’s (don’t know if they buying).
At last show the only slabbed coin offered at my table was a guy offering me was a 1964 PCGS Kennedy 50c in pr66 he wanted $35 for. I told him CDN bid is $16 (not making an offer) he replied he would keep it.
These like cosmic background radiation are just part of the experience. In current market - Coins priced near melt do well - others well I have reduced my buying considerably.
I usually only read these posts but could not help but reply to this one. I have been in the coin business since 1980 and the consumer walking into the store/office just seems to be getting worse. You are right, they come in knowing all of the answers, so why come in for my opinion? I cringe when the first words that come out of their mouth is "I have done my research." Well that's wonderful but if you don't know what you have or what you are looking for how can you do accurate research?
I find that it seems to be human nature that people want to believe that what they have is the most valuable item there is so no matter what you tell them you are a liar. Most of these consumers with all of the answers fall into two separate categories.
First, after I have spent a considerable amount of time with them appraising their coin/collection and I get a "well the internet says...." It usually ends with, well, call the website where you got the information and sell it to them. I explain how the information cost them nothing and that is what it is worth, nothing. They usually then realize how ridiculous they sound.
Second is even better. It starts with the person who comes in with a corroded Indian cent or 1964-D 1c and when I tell them it is worth 2c or 50c they tell me that the internet, as if the internet is now a person, says it is worth $20,000. This is so outlandish that I tell them to show me where on the internet it says this. Inevitably it is Etsy. I then explain what Etsy is and who the people are on there trying to sell these coins and then offer to sell them a corroded Indian cent for 50c. They usually get it at that point.
Been there. Done that.
Before the days of cell phones I used to tell know-it-all callers to hold their coin up real close to the phone so that I could get a real good look at it. Occasionally I would hear the coin clicking against the mouthpiece.
Have a drink!
Sounds like some ol’ codgers need to get into something else, retire, or stay retired.
Hang a hat on the wall that says
MANAGEMENT, Grab the hat and turn back to the customer
Ask customer to go out and read the names on the sign and ask for either one when they return
Wow a little ageism now?
Sounds like some ol’ codgers need to get into something else, retire, or stay retired.
that is exactly my thought, some of these wannabe collectors and kranky old people that stroll in should try some other Hobby. it's nice to see we're in agreement on that, even on a drive-by.
hey stman, shoot lower, I'm ridin' shetland. 
Definitely having patience with very rude people is hard to maintain unless they are high rollers with deep pockets, but those people usually have decent etiquette. I was in a coin shop yesterday where someone wanted an appraisal of "gold" plated trash in tiny tubes the worker spent way too much time on that snafu.
I work part time on the weekends at a big box store where people rudely call dozens of yards away with their hands raised for someone to come rushing to their side to hold their hands and help. Lots and lots of people who don't want to do their own DD. This "civilization" seems to be sliding downhill quickly or maybe there are too many of the rude types in a bumper crop.
Never would have figured some to be a troll. Ain’t got time for childish games. Got too many good things happening. Get a life. Heh good to see you too mr. coin dealer at the pawn shop.
wow, where's all this coming from?? haven't interacted with you in years and you come out swinging with an agenda. it's nice to see you have the support of lanzaf. stay safe and I'll talk with you in 2025.
Are pawn shop guys who deal in coins looked down upon by other coin dealers?
Maybe dress up to get respect? Either designer shirt, tie and jacket with clean shave; or mafia style pinstripes suit, stuff cotton in mouth cheeks and with concealed prop pistols on either hip....
yes, but only to the extent that coin shop guys who deal in pawns are looked up to by other coin dealers.
less support than a random click
Honestly it depends on whether they are coin dealers who happen to pawn or pawns who decide to deal in coins...
but still predictable.
If that was aimed at me, I literally meant random click. When I'm scrolling on my screen, I'm always issuing random clicks. Before they removed the "disagree" button, I had issued all kinds of unfortunate disagrees.
The only thing conditional is staying afloat making positive yardage whether coin shop, pawn player, or Online / Show Dual Operator.
Things got a LOT better in my store once I hired
BritTani Mckenzee to work with the problem customers, once she gets off her phone.
Thank you for sharing!
We get calls daily at the ANA on 1943 cents, $2 notes, you name it. We try to explain that while something may not be valuable, that doesn't mean that it's not neat. Lately, we have had a bunch of people calling about a dollar coin from 1776 with a bald guy on it. We call that coin the Nostradamus dollar.
lmao.
Odd that they ignore the second date on the coin.
And you have to worry about their understanding of history.
I was in industrial sales for over 30 years, and it comes in phases. Initially, I thought that I had to know everything. Marginal results.
Then, I started learning humility and began to appreciate what I didn't know. I began to learn from every customer. I became more and more knowledgeable.
Finally, it hit me - I became an "expert" much to my surprise. I relished helping my customers become knowledgeable while still learning from them. It's a joint exercise.
I think that working retail would be even more challenging, but wildidea's and Weiss's posts seem on target, to me.
I knew it would happen.
wildidea's and Weiss's posts seem on target.
as wildidea suggested, I am who my boss brought in to take the heat off of him. somewhere and somehow, anytime I post about what happens in the shop it is ass-u-me d that I am a dealer and the owner of the shop. members read things that just aren't there, but I digress.
actually, reading this thread can be very instructive. it is almost a microcosm of the type of personality that comes into the business. there are those who are present and seem to understand what's going on, those who think they know what's going on, don't, but can be reasoned with, those who are only present to cause problems, probably bored. it is interesting to observe, much like a day at work.
Have you ever walked into a shop pretending you have no knowlege about a valuable coin that you want to sell.
I've thought about trying it but I don't trust myself not to get angry.
I think there was a "undercover mechanic" episode about that years ago and you dealers did not do well.
Like, very-very not well
My Saint Set
Great thread Al, I have had a few chuckles here....You should see what I experience at the shooting range...
Well... actually, it is the same thing, just a different product/process....Cheers, RickO
I never understood this either until it was explained to me by my service writer.
The goal of any retail business is to get customers in the door. The person in the store is already there so you need to answer the phone to potentially get that customer in the door.
Usually the person in the store is not going to leave because of a short phone call as long as you acknowledge them and are not too long on the phone. If the phone call seems like it will be dragged out you can always put them on hold to help the customer standing in front of you.
My Ebay Store
Yes. A few years ago I moved to a new area and took a few pcgs and ngc pieces worth about $7000 greysheet bid into an LCS, claimed they were left to me. Was offered $1400. To be fair he seemed to be a lower-end dealer, but still.
My belief is that if, for whatever reason, a potential buyer can’t or isn’t willing to offer a fair price, it’s better to just let the seller know that.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
There is no uniform dealer response to such an offer. Some pawn/cash-for-gold type operations will offer you melt on just about anything. Some coin dealers try to goose the margin if they think they can. Some coin dealers (believe it or not) actually try to educate the customer.
100% TRUE STORY:
About a dozen years ago, a customer walked into a local B&M with a silver-centered cent. The family was descended from the Wolcott family and this coin had been in the family for over 200 years. It wasn't part of a coin collection, just a family heirloom.
The shop owner told them what they had. Told them it looked real but needed authentication. It was about a month before the ANA summer show, so they recommended driving down (it was about 6 hours away that year) and having it looked at.
The coin went to the ANA was authenticated and consigned, realized $300k plus. The dealer never realized a single cent from the transaction. [We can discuss in a separate thread how the dealer might have been able to make a little and still do right by the customer, but that's a separate issue.]
Not every dealer is a crook trying to rip everyone off. Not every "dealer" is honest and trying to do right by the customer. And, frankly, not every dealer even knows as much as some of their customers.
Another TRUE STORY:
There's a local pawn operation that dabbles in coins. They can't even be bothered to buy a Greysheet. If anything that isn't bullion comes in, they text me a photo and ask for a price/offer.
Couple weeks ago, they text me the most God awful looking "proof 1885 Liberty nickel". It was one of those novelty things. The date and design were square and not even close to the real thing. I got a text photo and the question: is it real?
If you brought the silver-center cent to this place, you'd be lucky to get a $20 offer and not because they were trying to rip you off. They just don't know anything about coins. They just think they could make some money on coins by adding them to the list of things they buy/sell.
My belief is that if, for whatever reason, a potential buyer can’t or isn’t willing to offer a fair price, it’s better to just let the seller know that.
Mark, this is interesting because as soon as many members understand that I work in a shop that does "Pawn" business the attitude typically goes south based on personal experiences or anecdotal evidence about how many such businesses operate.
it is hard to get around that.
to your point, it seems common for customers to come in with something valuable, not only unaware that it is special but having no idea of value. it would be simple to offer them a pittance: we don't. on many occasions we will accept an item on "Memo" and try to either ascertain a realistic value or if it is genuine. sometimes customers don't want to wait for something like that and we will make an offer somewhere between what we'd expect the value to be and what we can afford to be wrong on, but only if we think strongly that an item is genuine. it is better to let something walk away than to be wrong and lose.
another thing we will do is send metal/bullion type items out for assay but that can be tricky. customers don't want to pay for that service and if there's nothing up front they often will stick us with the fee when an item returns as no good. most often that is Silver and Industrial Platinum.
in the not too distant future, when most everyone is connected to the internet, I expect that the number of walk-ins who have no idea of their item's value will fall dramatically. currently, there are way too many people with no internet or no ability to find the value of items before they try to sell.
I can't speak for other "Pawn" shops that buy coins, but we have far more customers trying to deceive us than vice-a-versa.
I’m sure, like in other businesses, there are stand up pawn shop owners and sleaze-ball owners. I had gathered from your various posts, that the one you work for is one of the former.
Edited to add: One especially difficult scenario occurs when a seller has a valuable ungraded coin, which will have a large value spread, depending upon the assigned grade. And the seller doesn’t want to pay to have the coin graded. If you, as a buyer, are convinced that it will grade either X (making it worth $2000) or X+1 (making it worth $5000), how much do you offer? I think the fairest thing to do is offer roughly $1900 and make an agreement with the seller that If the coin grades x+1 or higher, you will pay extra. But what if the coin grades less than x?😮 Often, it’s not easy to come up with a “fair” offer, no matter how much you want to do so.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
I have a very good friend who has been a long-time dealer in Iowa. He has a reputation for taking time with people, explaining what they have and offering a fair price. He had customers from almost every state last year due to word of mouth. Taking time with customers and offering a square deal goes a very long way. Of course not everyone walks away happy but his biggest complaint is that people have to be patient to see him. He always tells me that he is busier than a one armed paper hanger with a sore hand.
Question is as a customer what can I expect a honest dealer to pay. Say I have a pcgs coin valued at $100.00 in their price guide. What is a reasonable amount I should receive for that coin
Part of the answer will be based upon the level at what such coins are actually trading. If they are trading at $100, I think a fair offer would be in the $80-$85 range. Others might disagree.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
After grading fees and shipping, that would mean paying $1950 or so for a coin that retails for $2000 if it grades X. Aside from bullion, are there any buyers who work on that sort of margin?
Usually, not on purpose. 😉 But in my example, the coin could have graded out to be worth $5000. When there is considerable upside, I’m Ok with essentially breaking even in the event that the upside isn’t realized.
Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.
But on the flip side of this 95% of my customers listen intensely to what I have to say. I offer free advice to anyone willing to listen. Most thank me for my service and tell their buddy’s where to go when they need service. Knowing I’ve been in the business 22 years and that I’m fair albeit not cheap. I’ve never ripped off a customer and sleep well at night.
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.