2011 Gold Buffalo not .9999?

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Viet_Vet
Viet_Vet Posts: 7 ✭
in U.S. Coin Forum

Hello,
I'm new here and looked around for a similar posting but found none. I bought some 2011 Gold Buffalos and in examining them found this spot. It looks like a foreign material in a coin that's supposed to be pure gold? The coin is still in the US Mint vacuumed package, and the material is definitely not on the outside of the plastic. Does anyone have an opinion as to what this foreign substance is?

Here is a close-up:

Answers

  • coinpalice
    coinpalice Posts: 2,469 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    looks like a copper spot

  • Viet_Vet
    Viet_Vet Posts: 7 ✭
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    Should there be that much copper showing in .9999 gold?

  • BillDugan1959
    BillDugan1959 Posts: 3,821 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Red is typically a grease spot, grease from the minting machinery. Presumably most of that would wipe off if you could get to it. Occasionally seen on gold coins. Not especially a bad sign.

  • Hemispherical
    Hemispherical Posts: 9,370 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Hmmm... fine gold 99.99%.

    1/10th of 1% for impurities.

    That is a pretty big spot.

    The melting of the gold may not have been .9999 or it might be a surface contaminant.

  • Viet_Vet
    Viet_Vet Posts: 7 ✭
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    Thanks Bill,
    Is this common? I've never seen it on any other of our gold coins.

  • BillDugan1959
    BillDugan1959 Posts: 3,821 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I have occasionally seen it on better condition older gold coins. I know that I am weird, but I consider it a good sign (in terms of authenticity). It does not seem as common on moderns.

    I am hoping some other folks chime in on this subject.

  • Relaxn
    Relaxn Posts: 1,265 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    That's one of the worst I have ever seen! Red dots are fairly common but this... Interesting.

  • crazyhounddog
    crazyhounddog Posts: 14,250 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Copper spot and a big one for the purity of the gold.

    The bitterness of "Poor Quality" is remembered long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
  • Insider2
    Insider2 Posts: 14,452 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @BillDugan1959 said:
    Red is typically a grease spot, grease from the minting machinery. Presumably most of that would wipe off if you could get to it. Occasionally seen on gold coins. Not especially a bad sign.

    Disagree. This is simply a reaction ring of color around an impurity (tiny black speck at center) struck into the coin.

    @BillDugan1959 said:
    I have occasionally seen it on better condition older gold coins. I know that I am weird, but I consider it a good sign (in terms of authenticity). It does not seem as common on moderns.

    I am hoping some other folks chime in on this subject.

    Copper spots on gold WAS and mostly still is a sign of authenticity on gold BUT it is no longer 100% reliable. :(

  • BillDugan1959
    BillDugan1959 Posts: 3,821 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Insider2 It had occurred to me that counterfeiters also needed to lubricate their machinery, just the same as legitimate minters. But the red is still a good sign in my book.

  • jdimmick
    jdimmick Posts: 9,992 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Ive seen one that big before in same type of package, sigma said it was okay, and so did the refinery

  • RogerB
    RogerB Posts: 8,852 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Typical spot caused by minute metal particles in the air where the coin was made or packaged. Careful examination at several world mint show that the most common contaminate is silver. At museums, similar spotting can come from trace elements in dust.

    This pattern is specific to particulates, not liquids.

    The token is almost certainly 0.9999.

  • mapleman
    mapleman Posts: 1,052 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I returned a 2014 Kennedy gold half with a number of spots in blue plus a similar one to the one shown. It was a 69 in our hosts plastic. I didn't bother to test it, just returned for A pristine slabbed 69.

  • crazyhounddog
    crazyhounddog Posts: 14,250 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    It’s a copper spot as it is the most common cause for spots such as this on gold. I’d rule anything else out.

    The bitterness of "Poor Quality" is remembered long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
  • Viet_Vet
    Viet_Vet Posts: 7 ✭
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    Polite courteous responses! Thanks folks!
    I appreciate the interaction as I have never seen anything like it before.
    I'm glad I joined this site.

  • ricko
    ricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I would say (and agree with some of the above) it is a metallic impurity, likely embedded during the coining process...could be silver or some other metallic piece from the process....Cheers, RickO

  • ronctx
    ronctx Posts: 106 ✭✭✭
    edited July 1, 2019 11:57AM
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    Bought in 2014, last year found these spots. For some reason red spots can happen. Still sealed from mint.

  • JBK
    JBK Posts: 17,860 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    If it would only spread to the entire coin you would have one heck of a toner!

  • Insider2
    Insider2 Posts: 14,452 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @BillDugan1959 said:
    @Insider2 It had occurred to me that counterfeiters also needed to lubricate their machinery, just the same as legitimate minters. But the red is still a good sign in my book.

    The grease or whatever the U.S. mint used (cosmoline?) that is commonly found stuck on vintage coins is like a clear, soft, glue-like paste that scrapes right off or dissolves away with chemicals. Often it accumulates tiny metal flakes and turns gray and then darker with included particles. I made some photos just last week from an original roll of nickels and was going to post them eventually. I've got several original rolls of Franklins to conserve this evening with the same clear residue. The underlying .900 fine silver is unaffected!

    I have NEVER seen grease of any kind discolor gold but if you have....

  • jwitten
    jwitten Posts: 5,417 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I've seen this before on US mint .999 coins. Usually hurts the value unfortunately.

  • jmski52
    jmski52 Posts: 24,011 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Definitely a copper spot. I've had several similar spots on some Daniel Carr gold and on a 2008 gold Buffalo as well.

    Q: Are You Printing Money? Bernanke: Not Literally

    I knew it would happen.
  • MilesWaits
    MilesWaits Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Yes indeedy spotted Buff but still worth spot.

    Now riding the swell in PM's and surf.
  • PerryHall
    PerryHall Posts: 47,748 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Insider2 said:
    Disagree. This is simply a reaction ring of color around an impurity (tiny black speck at center) struck into the coin.

    I can see a reaction ring forming on a silver or alloyed gold coin but how would it form on pure gold which should be non-reactive?

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • derryb
    derryb Posts: 38,604 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 1, 2019 5:10PM
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    @Viet_Vet said:
    Thanks Bill,
    Is this common? I've never seen it on any other of our gold coins.

    Not rare. happens to gold buffs occasionally. Strictly a cosmetic issue.

    Consider it the .0001 part of the coin.

    Government is the great fiction through which everybody endeavors to live at the expense of everybody else. - Bastiat

  • TeamDennis
    TeamDennis Posts: 108 ✭✭✭
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    Very common on Chinese Panda's.

  • PerryHall
    PerryHall Posts: 47,748 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Do the Canadian gold coins that are five 9's fine (.99999) have this problem? Anyone know?

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • MilesWaits
    MilesWaits Posts: 5,596 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    None of my Canadian Cinco .9’s have the problem.

    Now riding the swell in PM's and surf.

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