Do you think this coin is gradeable?
CommemKing
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Obviously PCGS says so, but dang that's a big scratch. I don't think it warrants a grade, let alone MS66. Blow the picture up larger by clicking on it. What do you think?
4
Comments
It’s beautiful.
The scratch is in a good place if it had to not be distracting.
But 63 would be fair.
I was told that a coin I sent in got a 65 because of a hit on the reverse half the size of the one between the dates on that Arkansas. I've seen way smaller scratches than that full coin gouge cause a details grade.
Dare I say, "Buy the coin, not..........nah.
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Well, I agree the scratch is in a good location. If it’s as prominent in-hand as in the photo I wouldn’t buy it.
Not so bad and I like the look. 66 seems a tad high, but the eye appeal is there Imo.
I would be very upset buying that sight unseen.
Apparently they figured it was ok for the grade, but I'll admit in the picture it does look a bit large!
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Perhaps a mitigating factor could be its lack of rarity.
Nope. I’ve seen lesser scratched coins in details holders. This had to have been a mistake.
Roll eyes and head smack!
I think this is the type of post that does not need to be posted. The answer to your question is OBVIOUS: "Any coin can be graded! The rest is subjective. IMO, posting a coin graded MS-66 (if you say so as I have a discussion about the grade appearing in the image) with a long deep scratch is NOT HELPFUL to anyone!
The original surfaces have carried this coin a long way ... too far in my opinion given the size of that scratch and a coupld of others on her cap. My grade would be maxed out MS-63, maybe as low as MS-62, if you really hate the scratch.
I think that the coin does deserve a grade, however, not a "details" grade.
I would not be happy with that one as a 66. I had a really nice gold coin with a light scratch, but it was AU58. The scratch was not as bad as the trueviews made it look... but at least it was not graded 66.
Here is the thing that a grader needs to do: Make a decision in line with the policy of the TPGS where he/she works.
The coin is wildly attractive to me, yet if I offered it for sale to a major dealer.... what is the second thing he would notice? ** How would this coin be described in an auction catalogue?** IMO, that would make a much more informative and FUN discussion; but I don't wish to highjack the OP's discussion.
I would not want it as a 66.
Yeah, I don't like that..
I have mixed feelings about scratches like this.
On one hand I can see how it detracts from the coin’s appeal, it is technically damaged, yet the rest of the coin itself is in exceptional condition. It seems wasteful to give it a details grade for one, albeit large, imperfection like this scratch.
I am not looking to reinvent the wheel, but I think a number grade with “scratch” notation would be fair for coins like this. A details grade seems like it would be overkill. My 2¢
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That's technical grading which is not practiced any more. We never had anything higher than MS-65 (70 was never considered although it existed) back then (MS-65 was called "Choice Uncirculated) so in the 1970's this would have been graded Choice Uncirculated, toned & scratched. Let the dealers price it.
If a modern "technical" system existed today, probably MS-66, obverse scratch. Too many bag marks and black specks to make 67; and bump from 65 for attractive color.
I would say no with that scratch, jmo ( wait for a better one) jmo as well
I would not even buy it if it was AU58.
Wow that's a scratch all right.
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Is it better than a fingerprint?
The remains of a print appear to be the tiny black spots on the reverse.
MS63, and I don't like the marks on the cheek either. I also think the toning looks odd where it sits atop the word "centennial"
I have a VT with a similar pin scratch (behind head of Ira Allen) that grades 64 in an OGH and I am ok with that.
Commems and Early Type
Other than that big honkin' scratch, it's a nice coin... I wouldn't be paying 66 money for it though. In fact, I would likely pass at 63 money too. Classic Commems have really taken a hit in general these days. I'd wait for an unscathed example to come in...
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Someone should have watched that staple more carefully when taking it out of a 2 x 2.
The scratch may be an issue... however, for me, I would pass just on the tarnish... looks ugly. Cheers, RickO
That’s like saying other than being a serial killer, John Wayne Gacey was a nice guy.
I'd rather have that coin than one the same, but white without toning or scratch.
The color more than makes up for the mark on an otherwise common coin.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
That scratch was not made by a staple.
it is old too as the toning covers it.
Staples have been around a long time, could not it have been scratched 75 - 100 yrs ago?
I think the scratch is new and the toning was applied to cover it.
Arks tend to tone splotchy brown, just like Bridgeports, in their boxes of issue.
Some have picked up some edge toning from storage for 50-60 years in Wayte Raymond albums.
Evan Gale once told me that ARKs with pretty color were very rare but just twenty years later there are thousands apparently.
In my opinion, many of the rainbow-toned rings on Arks are about as natural as those on all the Buffalo nickels cooked up in Chicago
Commems and Early Type
agreed, it shouldn't have graded.
Post liquid lunch slab?
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Woof... But maybe they thought is was a strike-trough?
Crack it out and see what happens. My guess no grade.
Yeah, it was one of those huge, wide, industrial staples that we all had around our house in former decades.
@CommemDude said: "I think the scratch is new and the toning was applied to cover it. Arks tend to tone splotchy brown, just like Bridgeports, in their boxes of issue. Some have picked up some edge toning from storage for 50-60 years in Wayte Raymond albums. Evan Gale once told me that ARKs with pretty color were very rare but just twenty years later there are thousands apparently. In my opinion, many of the rainbow-toned rings on Arks are about as natural as those on all the Buffalo nickels cooked up in Chicago."
So you are claiming that a TPGS slabbed an artificially toned coin with a fresh scratch, right?
What we can agree on in your post is that all of these coins with pretty color were much rarer in the past than they are now.
Yes. I hope you are not claiming that God doesn't let these things happen.
Commems and Early Type
Assuming you are correct about the "market acceptable" toning - anything is possible; It would be very helpful if you would educate us with the characteristics you see in the image that backs up your opinion that it is artificial and was done to cover a new scratch.. Thanks in advance.
Looks like NT but the scratch should keep it from grading.
"The beauty of the original patina on the surfaces of this coin is only accentuated by the contrasting presence of a linear flaw on the obverse"
I had to
Collector, occasional seller
If that coin was uncertified, dealers wanting to buy it would have a field day running it down as "scratched" and a problem coin, many times knowing that the coin is still quite nice and marketable.
From what one grader told me, the ANA in their grading guide does not have a definition of "scratch" and what would be too much for a numerical grade.
Nice original color, but shoot, that scratch is way too large to overlook. Bummer.
Dave
That coin should not have graded in my opinion.
At what Grade (or price Equivalent, translated to grade) would the Nay sayers be Happy to receive it sight unseen? AU? VF?
Good?
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Try this: Adjust the size the picture on your phone to Actual Coin Size and try to see the scratch.
That's not a worthless coin imo.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
I believe the eye appeal carried this one-very attractive Arky-much more so than most others even in the 66 grade range. I would have had to negotiate on the price however, as others are around to pick from, and the fact that commem market is not exactly on fire. I don't see this coin being sent back in for reconsideration!
I would guess the 'f' Word may have been uttered, along with an oath to remove all staples from then on!
Just goes to show that the graders are not perfect.
that one should have been bagged!!
Just ask yourself this, if you had been looking for this coin for your collection would you have bought this piece after noting the big ole scratch?
Most would probably not.
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I had a rough time finding the scratch till I magnified it.
Pete
If I needed one of those for a customer and had to order a PCGS MS66 sight unseen, I wouldn't be happy with that and I'm sure just about all of my customers wouldn't be happy with that either. Probably needs to go back to PCGS.
I could see many collectors happy with the coin though as some can live with issues like that. Would look fine in an album of commems, but not as a problem-free graded PCGS MS66.
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