1875-CC 20c BF-1 cherrypicked off of DLRC tonight
KindaNewish
Posts: 827 ✭✭✭✭✭
I have to share this with someone, my kids just shrugged.
https://www.davidlawrence.com/rare-coin/1595202
I just won this at DLCR tonight, R-6.
7
Comments
Why is it an R-6.....the distance between the c's?
http://www.doubledimes.com/1875CC-BF1.html
The location of the C's is unique to this die.
Wow, nice, congratulations !!!
Congratulations! That's a difficult die marriage to find!
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Is this common in 1875 CC twenty cent pieces?
Not really common. In the summer 2017 Gobrecht Journal, John Frost reported 13 known pieces.
Congratulations .... nice coin... and it is a CC...
Cheers, RickO
There are four different reverse dies used in 1875 at Carson City. One of those, Reverse C (Wide CC), was also used to strike the rare 1876-CC double dime the following year.
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
You do realize that some members of that family (and personnel from that company) read here regularly? They post occasionally too.
A big part of the successful "Cherrypicker" M.O. is being discreet.
On the other hand- this is also good advertising for DLRC that we should all look through their coins as they dont cherrypick themselves
Is this the same reverse?
I think i would have waited until getting the coin before posting on a public forum.
I recently purchased a 75CC. I guess i should check it.
I think so, yours looks like an early die state, I cant see the diagnostic cracks.
Anyway, I didn't mean to imply that I "bested" DL in any way, just proud of my pickup. I paid a fair price for it at an auction with a reserve, its not like I got some super deal. And I think DL would like to have their customers show off their purchases and link to their site.
Now if there was only more than a handful of people who collect 20c by die variety, sellers would bother attributing them. But as it seems to stand now, the 15 or so known of the BF-1 seem more than enough to supply the existing demand. This is my third, I have never paid any premium yet for any attributed die variety. And the few places (Heritage, Stack's) which do regularly use the Brunner/Frost attributions do not seem to ever seek noticeable premiums for the rare ones.
Nice pick. That's a credit to the numismatists. And a dealer ought not mind. If he/they missed it, that's okay to leave some meat on the bone, in my opinion.
Do I hear a sucking sound ?
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
How about this one? Where are the die breaks? Thanks.
Knowing what to look for, can reap rewards. Congratulations!
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I think it is a neat die marriage. I think it is a wholesome looking naturally toned and original example. But I put absolutely no weight into what one expert says re the number known but thats my opinion. I have learned the hard way not to rely on that nonsense.
But I put absolutely no weight into what one expert says re the number known but thats my opinion. I have learned the hard way not to rely on that nonsense.
I think John Frost isn't just "some expert". After this die was identified in 2013, he asked all LSCC members to check all their 75-CC 20c to check for it and has kept a registry since then. He is the Education Director of LSCC, not just a dealer trying to hype his stuff. If you've seen his displays, especially the recent one at the ANA regarding the Barber family, you would not doubt his integrity in any way.
There were 12 known when I started collecting double dimes. I found #13, #14 and this, #15. @topstuff above may be #16.
@holedandcreative, yours is a BF-2
This is far more common that most think. They are out there everywhere. I've owned many and have never even had one graded let alone put a variety on them. Not enough double dime collectors to make a difference in prices. Selling raw is just as easy as selling graded. No advantage either way. Shame, too as the double dimes are such a short series and fun to do.
Still a nice pick up and won't be long until you have a roll of them!
bob
I dunno, I've looked at every 75-cc for sale online, at all the major auction houses, twice a year at Baltimore for the last few years, the ANA and many smaller shows and every B & M that I could stop by for the last few years. The book puts an estimate of BF-1 at about 1% of the estimated 4,000-5,000 remaining 1875-CC 20c. So there could be another dozen or more out there, but this is the first I've seen in the last two years.
Anyway, how many fit in a roll?
It's a BF-2.
If you find time maybe you could look at mine. I know nothing about a BF-1. Thanks for your time.
That's a beautiful BF-2. AU-53?
Congratulations upon finding a die variety that has been rated as "rare," but before I would take that to the bank, I'd wait a few years. Despite the fact that the Twenty Cent Piece die variety book has been out for several years, the concept of die varieties is still in its infancy. As more and more collectors look more closely at their coins, additional examples are bound to be discovered. Here is a classic example.
In 1958 Walter Breen published his “United States Half Dimes: A Supplement.” I loved reading this work as a young collector because I have been very interested in the early (1792 to 1805) since I was in high school.
For the 1796 half dimes he listed two varieties, an overdate and a regular coin, which still what the available information tells us today. For the overdate, he wrote, “Ex. Rare, certainly R-7. Of the possibly six examples known, at least five are in EF to Unc. condition, a situation matched by only the 1876-CC 20₡ and 1822 25/50 quarter so far as I know.” The trouble was Breen based this rarity estimate on the coins he had seen in the major New York City auctions, probably the New Netherlands auctions since that’s where he worked.
Today we know that there are probably as many 50 examples the 1796/5. I own the poorest one graded, at least the last time I checked. Unlike some overdates, the date on this coin is not spectacular. In fact the best diagnostic is on the reverse where a berry is under the “E” in “UNITED” not the “E.” The new coins were discovered after collectors really looked at their holdings.
My point it takes time for these things to shake out, and it’s often premature to claim that something very rare until others have had a chance to check more coins in the surviving population.
I couldn't agree more. In addition to my 3 75-CC BF-1's, I've found one new variety not in the book (1875 BF-3)(actually, I just own it, John identified it), one that was unknown but speculated (1876 BF-4 proof) and a few others noted as extremely scarce.
There may be more die varieties out there. I scan the internet daily for a 1875-S BF-17.
This is the part of the hobby of numismatics that really bothers me, the rarity #'s especially when one so-called self proclaimed expert ,not calling anyone out in particular, proclaims how many are known by him. It really is a ridiculous statement when you start to realize how much is out there undiscovered or discovered but not reported.
Getting back to your sweet example, if you have been looking for them for a while and this is your first, congrats, all I know is that it is very appealing in both eye appeal and variety so you done good , maybe not as good as you originally dreamed.
Thank you.