@HighRelief said:
Good example of why we say grading a coin is just someone's somewhat opinion. I would give is a solid AU53, that is my opinion and I am hoping to see you receive a gold bean on it.
This coin is ONLY a good example of how grading has changed over the decades. When this was graded decades ago it was probably a typical XF-40 that was "net" graded to VF so it would not be returned ungraded in a "body bag!" As I wrote before in another thread, every coin I purchased during the 1980's in NGC or PCGS slabs would now grade higher. The Franklin Proofs as much as three grades as back then nothing was getting graded 67 or 68.
Nice catch there, JW. That is not a VF coin by any stretch. Given the relatively small spread between the common mid-circulated to low mint state coins in that series, it would have a lot more value with a gold sticker in that NGC fatty than in a new, properly -graded holder.
Some how I have to believe that this was some sort of a mechanical error. Grading might have this conservative back in the '30s, well before I was born, but certainly not at any time since I have been a collector. In fact over grading was around in the 50s. I remember an older collector showing me a Twenty Cent Piece he bought from B. Max Mehl in the early 1950s that was still in the original envelope. It was called "Choice Unc." but the coin was only a dipped AU.
Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
Is it possible they saw something they didn't like such as marks in a prime focal area or hairlines and they silently net graded this coin? I see a scratch on the Indian's face that I'm sure the graders also saw it and they may have decided it's worth VF30 money. I've seen net grading on other coins and I'm not really sure if I agree with this practice or not.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
@logger7 said:
NNC or other similar overgrading company that coin would be pushing a gem grade.
Very true. LOL. And if it were raw some coin dealers would call it Choice Gem BU 67+++.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
When the major grading services first started in the late 1980's, a coin either got a straight grade or it came back in a body bag. I'm guessing that this coin was too nice to body bag but because of the scratch across the Indian's face they downgraded it to reflect the coin's actual value. At that time it was thought that a coin's grade should reflect the coin's actual value. If that scratch wasn't there it probably would have graded AU55 or 58.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
So, the coin did not CAC! They felt the scratch was slightly too much to be straight graded They agreed it was severely undergraded without taking the scratch into account though. I have seen other golds straight graded with similar scratches, so I guess it just depends on how the graders are feeling that day. It was a no reserve auction with terrible pictures, so I mainly bought it for the holder. I was shocked when I opened the package and saw the coin. I would have put it at LEAST mid to upper AU, if not low MS without the scratch.
Goes to show...In this market it is important to be able to differentiate coins that will CAC at a lower grade vs coins which will not CAC at any grade
Comments
That's horribly misgraded.
I
it @jwitten but who knows about me...I 
them all 
OK on the serious note MS61
This coin is ONLY a good example of how grading has changed over the decades. When this was graded decades ago it was probably a typical XF-40 that was "net" graded to VF so it would not be returned ungraded in a "body bag!" As I wrote before in another thread, every coin I purchased during the 1980's in NGC or PCGS slabs would now grade higher. The Franklin Proofs as much as three grades as back then nothing was getting graded 67 or 68.
I'm stumped as to why it graded so low !!!
Nice catch there, JW. That is not a VF coin by any stretch. Given the relatively small spread between the common mid-circulated to low mint state coins in that series, it would have a lot more value with a gold sticker in that NGC fatty than in a new, properly -graded holder.
Some how I have to believe that this was some sort of a mechanical error. Grading might have this conservative back in the '30s, well before I was born, but certainly not at any time since I have been a collector. In fact over grading was around in the 50s. I remember an older collector showing me a Twenty Cent Piece he bought from B. Max Mehl in the early 1950s that was still in the original envelope. It was called "Choice Unc." but the coin was only a dipped AU.
Know I'm late to the party but that coin is AU at least.
IMO NGC has ALWAYS been WAY more strict when grading pre33 gold but they missed that one by 25 points or more.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
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Wooooha! Did someone just say it's officially "TACO™" Tuesday????
Is it possible they saw something they didn't like such as marks in a prime focal area or hairlines and they silently net graded this coin? I see a scratch on the Indian's face that I'm sure the graders also saw it and they may have decided it's worth VF30 money. I've seen net grading on other coins and I'm not really sure if I agree with this practice or not.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
NNC or other similar overgrading company that coin would be pushing a gem grade.
Very true. LOL. And if it were raw some coin dealers would call it Choice Gem BU 67+++.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
Jwitten---Did the seller sell it for VF30 money or did they put a premium on it for being undergraded?
When the major grading services first started in the late 1980's, a coin either got a straight grade or it came back in a body bag. I'm guessing that this coin was too nice to body bag but because of the scratch across the Indian's face they downgraded it to reflect the coin's actual value. At that time it was thought that a coin's grade should reflect the coin's actual value. If that scratch wasn't there it probably would have graded AU55 or 58.
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
So, the coin did not CAC! They felt the scratch was slightly too much to be straight graded
They agreed it was severely undergraded without taking the scratch into account though. I have seen other golds straight graded with similar scratches, so I guess it just depends on how the graders are feeling that day. It was a no reserve auction with terrible pictures, so I mainly bought it for the holder. I was shocked when I opened the package and saw the coin. I would have put it at LEAST mid to upper AU, if not low MS without the scratch.
Now that's a head scratcher.
An honest EF. The "grade" on the holder pictured is clearly a mistake.
Looks 62 to be honest. I love that holder!
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AU 58 Wow your correct on that. Great find
Best place to buy !
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Goes to show...In this market it is important to be able to differentiate coins that will CAC at a lower grade vs coins which will not CAC at any grade
Latin American Collection