Central States Show Report
Wabbit2313
Posts: 7,268 ✭✭✭✭✭
(I decided to make this extra long for @ricko )
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I was there Thursday and below are my experiences and observations:
Highlights:
-The first highlight was spending a bit of time with Mark. ( @Justacommeman ) He is as nice and down to earth as he seems on here by the way! Thanks Mark!
-The second highlight was spending a bit of time with Laura. ( @specialist ) It is so cool to listen to someone who totally understands any coin you show her or mention. I sold her a coin, hassle free, and she paid aggressively for it. I will also be listing a few coins in the Legend auction this summer. Thanks Laura!
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Show observations:
-No PCGS onsite grading will be the kiss of death for this show. (In my opinion) I am not at all alone in that thinking either. Dealers mentioned it. We all missed that and I for one will skip next year, if they are not onsite.
-Traffic on Thursday was really light. I was the only one who registered over at least a 15 minute period. I know this because I was hanging around there while Mark and I traded text messages. The floor seemed the same, not seeing much foot traffic. A dealer I sold to mentioned he only sold one single coin by late Thursday. While I can't speak for everyone of course, that was alarming. He has some nice coins and prices. I really hope it picked up after Thursday!
-Not sure what was up with the empty tables here and there?
-The location could not be any easier to get to. You park for free and 5 minutes later, you can be on the floor. The 5 bucks fee everyone is crying about makes me laugh. If you can't afford the 5 bucks, no dealer wants you in there anyway!
-I stopped and looked at the 1913 nickel. What a sweet coin. I can't believe Bruce used to own that baby! @tradedollarnut
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Buying:
-I found a Redfield I never thought I ever would. The 1890-CC in the Red 65 holder. It is only the second one I have ever seen in 20 years, and I own hundreds of Redfield's. Got lucky since it was purchased and displayed moments before I happened to see it. That is how those things work.
-Not much else caught my eye. I did buy a coin from a very rude dealer and will post the result from my having it graded, once it comes back. (Maybe)
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Selling, I sold to the following dealers:
-Legend. Awesome people!
-Howards. Awesome people!
-Harbor Coin. Awesome people!
-Larry Shapiro. Awesome guy!
-David Lawrence. Gary is always friendly and fair!
-Angel Dee's. Easy sale and fair price.
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Dealer buying prices and coins that brought the most interest:
-Of the 6 dealers I sold to, only one used the Greysheet first. He then went to auction results. The rest were pulling up auction prices and making offers based on (always lower) than those. I did have mostly CAC coins and no one was interested in looking at the CAC Greysheet pricing either. At the end of Thursday, I had a couple of wins and a couple that will leave a nasty bruise. I had my asking prices on the back of each coin, knowing I would be chiseled down. I wasn't born yesterday.
-Blast white coins are what they all want. (Unless it is a bright-crazy-neon coin.)
Conclusion:
-I had fun, met up with some great folks, and sold the coins I wanted to. The Redfield made the trip worthwhile all by itself. That said, I see these same people at FUN or other places. My next show will only be where PCGS is onsite grading. I didn't think I would miss that as much as I did.
Cheers!
Comments
@Wabbit2313...Thank you for a great and detailed report. Glad you found a coin that really pleased you. You met with some really great people as well. Did you notice how bullion was moving? Cheers, RickO
I was there on Thursday also and can attest to the low turn out. I would not blame it on the lack of on site grading by PCGS. I think it has more to do with the attitude of some dealers to what they consider retail sales. I was looking for a common date type 3 gold dollar of which there were many available. The prices I was quoted were all at least 20% higher than I could have paid on the Heritage auction after fees. When I mentioned that the price was quite high I was told multiple times that they could get that number on ebay and would not go lower. This is not the first time I have had this happen at a show.
The comradery and education experiences at a show are great but it looks like it is no longer a place to buy coins for a reasonable price.
So they're saying eBay is 20% over HA on 3 dollar gold? Yay, the slump is over!
@Wabbit2313 the pleasure was all mine and thanks again! Can’t believe you scored a Redfield. Congrats!
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Great report!
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Has absolutely nothing to do with being able to afford $5. It's a principle thing, why on earth should anyone have to pay any amount of money for the privilege of entering an event where they plan to shop and spend money? Not happening, their loss.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
Wooooha! Did someone just say it's officially "TACO™" Tuesday????
I was there yesterday. Too bad we all couldn't connect
Latin American Collection
I took a look at it as well, but the really cool coin was in a case to the left of it. There was an 1839 British Una and the Lion £5 gold in PR63 that is being sold as part of a complete 1839 proof set. Yeah, the 1913 Liberty nickel has it beat for dollar value, but not for overall coolness factor.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
I thought the crowd was slightly bigger than last year........hummm.
I only attended on Thursday and there was what I thought a bigger gathering than last year when the doors opened at 10:00 AM.
I can’t believe I missed you. The Hamilton medal at Stacks was off the hook as well
m
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
What dealer had the 1913 nickel?
I still think they need to move the show around a little bit. I couldn't go this year but would like to see some other locations but that's just me.
Kudos to CSNS for turning this show into Venezuela
Rude, and yet you bought it ROFLMAO I feel your pain
Thanks for the nice report.
I was there Thursday and Friday and like the show a lot. The no on site grading is a "no issue" to me. I can't see paying the extra money.
I met Mark (justcommeman) also....great guy. I wish I could have met Boosbri and Wabbit. I did also see Golden at James Sego's table. Also saw Bigdawgie.
Most of the dealers said the show was good some said great...even though the crowd looked small to me.
The $5 fee was irritating, but not a show stopper for me.
The biggest thing about no on-site grading for me was that it meant I wasn't going to be taking home a trunk full of discarded blue boxes at the end of the show.
Bummer. I agree with your assessment of the Hamilton medal.
Keeper of the VAM Catalog • Professional Coin Imaging • Prime Number Set • World Coins in Early America • British Trade Dollars • Variety Attribution
Thursday was a very productive show day for me and I gladly paid the $5. First of all, $5 is nothing. Secondly, I’m hoping that all or part of it goes to the CSNS folks and I always like supporting pro-hobby organaizations.
I was able to sell ancients to Jonathan Kern, exonumia to Paul Cunningham, currency to Stacks and a $50 Kellog re-strike to David Lawrence which offered $350 more than another prominent national dealer known for marketing such coins.
I had a nice lunch break with ANA President, Gary Adkins before perusing the educational exhibits. An exhibit that featured unique Michigan national bank notes and their histories was one of the most memorable for me.
Several dealers said that Wednesday was dead for retail sales due to a later non-early bird bourse opening but those same dealers mentioned it was better on Thursday. I thought the retail traffic was light. The consensus however, was that buying was strong.
While there was no onsite grading, I was happy to have saved postage by dropping submissions at PCGS and PMG.
The only thing I left with from the show was a new edition Patriotic Civil War Token book which appears to be a nice update of my old Fuld books.
I’d travel for this show and have in the past but I believe at least the next three will be back in the same spot. That’s fine with me. It’s a reasonable drive and as Wabbit saiid, parking is free and close (and I’ll add safe).
Im not sure why people would complain about $5. Comic Con in San Diego charges over $60 per day. Over 130,000 will attend and btw they completely sold out in 1 hour 15 minutes
Thanks nice report.
Stacks
m
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I find that people who complain about the small stuff complain about everything.
m
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Nice report - thanks for the write up.
Thanks for the interesting and insightful report.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
You make it sound like the guys who run the coin show are the same guys who sit behind the bourse tables. They're not. CSNS runs the coin show, has huge expenses, and collects bourse fees, admission fees, etc. CSNS does not sell coins. Of course, you're entitled to be upset that you have to pay an entry fee for whatever reasons you like. Just let's not pretend that you have any sort of right to a free ride.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Like I said in one of my previous posts " If the CSNS was still held in Rosemont the parking would be at least $20"
The Stevens clan are a bunch of crooks in my book, look them up if you don't believe me.
Do you have a Costco or Sam's Club membership?
Would be intersting to see a breakdown of income/expenses for a major show. Guess even as non profits they dont have or do they have to disclose them to general membership.Do even small coin club shows maybe just need to know only.
Believe the ANA discloses.
That along with attendence totals?
Who are the "Stevens" person in charge of show
The Stevens "family" are the people that are the ruling force in the village of Rosemont where the CSNS use to be held.
They are all about nepotism and money, it's the Chicago way to do business.
The 1913 Liberty Nickel is not a real coin in my book so.....BLAH!
Great report thanks!
What auction sites were dealers using to price coins to buy?
_Would be intersting to see a breakdown of income/expenses for a major show. Guess even as non profits they dont have or do they have to disclose them to general membership.Do even small coin club shows maybe just need to know only. _
As the Treasurer of the South Carolina Numismatic Association, I can tell you that all financial statements regarding our
annual convention in October and other annual income and expenses are readily available to the membership. Also, if you look on page 74 of the Spring 2018 issue of FUN Topics, you'll see an annual Financial Report for the FUN organization. So, to answer your question, the answer is yes.
Member ANA, SPMC, SCNA, FUN, CONECA
Not upset about anything, I'll just take my business elsewhere. Like I said their loss. Do I have to pay a fee enter my grocery store? Local hardware store? Guess since I walk in there to shop without paying an entry fee I'm getting a free ride? Unbelievable.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
Wooooha! Did someone just say it's officially "TACO™" Tuesday????
I'm in the sticks brother. Don't think there's probably a Costco or Sams within a hundred miles of here. Local Amish folk are my Costco. They don't charge any fees to shop.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
Wooooha! Did someone just say it's officially "TACO™" Tuesday????
Blast white coins are what they all want
I wonder if this means things have changed and some/many toned coins will again start to be dipped white. lots of dealers in the past have said this is what typically happens, we go in cycles.
the admission fee is always a sticking point that doesn't make sense, it's a "cut off your nose to spite your face" attitude. think about it, you boycott a show to save a $5 admission fee and lose the opportunity to purchase something you have been searching for and may not otherwise find. add to that the social aspect of it and the "principal" victory seems rather silly.
Great report.
Very informative and thanks for taking the time.
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress
Agree 100% with this also. Thanks for writing, sorry not trying to derail regarding admission fees.
The whole worlds off its rocker, buy Gold™.
BOOMIN!™
Wooooha! Did someone just say it's officially "TACO™" Tuesday????
Great show report !
I'm an amateur radio operator. Our equivalent of a coin show is called a "ham-fest". It's an electronic flea-market of sorts, offering radio equipment, electronic stuff, computers, parts etc....There are also educational seminars going on, testing sessions, stuff like that. Admission is often a nominal fee (helping the sponsor club cover expenses), frequently 2 dollars. You can't imagine how often I've overheard the 'ticket-takers' getting lambasted by someone upset over that deuce.
I've never understood it.
Wonder those that complain.... can easily drop 8 bucks for a coffee ....sometimes you pay an entrance fee .. or maybe fee built into the price you pay for food , drink concessions ..or perhaps added price charged by dealer
Was at a MLB game .. 9 dollar beers... nearly 8 dollar hotdogs, sandwiches that are triple of what is paid at offsite stores .....LOL
Nice report Wabbit, I appreciate you posting it.
I paid the $5 fee... never gave it another thought.
Latin American Collection
Keeps out the riff-raff?
I kinda thought the "bad old days" of crooked Rosemont were long dead, and the family patriarch now long dead too. I'm certain that Rosemont is still a money machine, but do the people/family who controlled it forty years ago still control it? Or are you invoking ghosts?
At any rate, the furries probably bring much more money to Rosemont than the coin people.
Rosemont isn't cheap, but it's damn convenient.
Great report. Sounds like a good time.
Feel free to show us the Redfield
Liked your show report. $5 more than reasonable especially if easy get too, free parking. That is half of what the average door fee is at most Houston area gentleman’s clubs lol unless of course your VIP then it’s free.
People prefer blazers / blast white coins not something spotted / looks like run over by truck. So do I. The lack of traffic reflects current market conditions, decreasing pop of collectors. Agree Ebay retail picking up which is great. My online store sales fantastic retail this year. Market may be starting wake up.
Because show TPG fees higher never been participant in that so a non factor in whether I go to show or not.
Thanks for the report @Wabbit interesting to hear about low attendance and about blast white coins.
Would be interested in seeing a picture of that redfield you snagged and your overall grading results!
No one is getting rich on a $5 fee to get in, I would pay it and not think twice....
Perhaps the $5 fee is more about making sure attendees are actually coin collectors, rather than just random passers-by which is also an inexpensive security measure. I don't see how the $5 fee is useful to the show promoter from a revenue standpoint. Just thinking out loud...
Whitman Brands: President/CEO (www.greysheet.com; www.whitman.com)
PNG: Executive Director (www.pngdealers.org)
Guess the CSNSis going the route of the ANA where admission was FREE and now charges.
If a coin show decides to charge throw them a bone lol and make it good alldays of a show Sure the botton line would be less ,but dealers might get additional sales and more floor activity on each day.
People debating whether to go back might decide to go back a second or third day.
Could never understand why thr ANAdaily admission fee and have to use the coupon to get the downloade coupon rate $6 or $8 without if i tecall
Last day should be **FREE****.
Shows should state in ads etc that dealer participation that on last day dealers may be limited. Casual collectors and general public do not know the floor is less than full expected. on showing up last day.
I have seen Long Beach show display it beloe times of show not aware of others.
That disclosure should be mandatory since that is a common occurance