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Raw Gobrecht Dollar on Ebay - Closed at $9k Yikes!
Connecticoin
Posts: 13,275 ✭✭✭✭✭
I am no Gobrecht Dollar expert, but this one looks like a pot-metal counterfeit to me.
However, two of the seller's other auctions, an 1832 Large Cent and 1912-S Liberty Nickel look genuine at first blush. But take a look at completed auctions - an 1854 "Red" Large Cent - looks like a cast counterfeit.
What says the Peanut Gallery?? 
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Looks like a fake to me.... not an expert by any means....but polished to remove cast pits... most of them anyway.... Cheers, RickO
Given the recent revelations about the counterfeit 1836 Gobrecht that was made from a repaired piece that is genuine, I would not have anything to do with this sale under any circumstances. Like many items of this ilk, the surfaces have been drastically cleaned which provides the purveyors of this stuff with an ample opportunity to scrape off any of the offending marks that authenticators have used to verify that such pieces are counterfeits.
The coin market is supposed to be on the ropes with few buyers and falling prices, and yet there have been 19 bids for this questionable item, which has no certification whatsoever. Perhaps some of those bids are shills, and yet this seems to indicate that there people out there who are willing pay substantial sums of money for low quality, problem material.
What is going through their minds? Are they really that interested in the hobby, or do they think that something like this is “a bargain?” I simply can’t understand how people can bid like this.
Certainly looks like a cast fake. But even if it were real, it is certainly NOT XF/AU.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
I believe it's got a bit of (salt water) corrosion- yet is genuine. They do look like this with issues. It is rare to see these on eBay so I can understand the conclusion it is fake yet for this one, I don't think so.
Really hard to tell from the photos. It could be pitted from corrosion and polished. It bears a closer look by someone familiar with die markers.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, even when irrefutably accurate.
The trouble is when the surfaces have altered as much they have on this piece, how can you really tell if it is genuine from a picture? We have seen several times that alter surface counterfeits have gotten past the TPGs.
The relief on this piece looks "fatty." that means the letters and design look thicker than expected. Buffing a genuine coin can cause this.
I don't think it is a good idea to purchase a coin like this without certification. The TPGS's guarantee their opinions of authenticity.
Why would anyone trust a seller with only 11 feedbacks on a coin of this nature? Whether it's real or not, I wouldn't be shelling out that kind of coin to someone with such a short track record...
mbogoman
https://pcgs.com/setregistry/collectors-showcase/classic-issues-colonials-through-1964/zambezi-collection-trade-dollars/7345Asesabi Lutho
I'm guessing some reasons are because it's shipping from Madison, Mississippi, United States and the seller has good feedback, including a $9,450.00 sale of a 1797 Draped Bust Dollar 9x7 Stars, Small Letters AU:
https://feedback.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewFeedback2&userid=gr8m00d
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If it's real, it is certainly harshly Whizzed!
Agreed, if real, the surfaces are terrible! No appeal to me at all.
My YouTube Channel
"For auction is an 1836 Original Gobrecht Dollar in XF/AU condition. These popular Gobrecht dollars keep getting bought up by collectors, and have become extremely expensive in Uncirculated. Selling my collection to get rid of some debt so will be listing more coins soon. All my coins are guaranteed genuine. Please ask questions if you have any. Thank you!"
VF details, harshly cleaned, whizzed. Check auction results and reduce by a sizable percentage. Inspect with great cynicism and suspicion.
I ran across this the other day and reviewed the seller's other coins as well. I even put one on "watch." Even though he only has a feedback of 11, some of the feedback is for big coins. I concluded that these coins were likely genuine but most looked seriously messed with. This one looked real funky, but the others looked real enough to me. The 1809 cent has what looks like a late stage die crack or bulge at star 11 that I don't recall ever seeing before but I did not investigate further as the remainder of the coin looked real enough for me as a non-bidder. Still, I have no intention of bidding. But check out the 1832 large cent. it looks pretty nice.
Tom
If the coins are genuine, makes me wonder if the coins were stolen and cracked from TPG holders. Of course they could be from grandpa's SDB as well
Hopefully they are not some of 'Gronks' stolen coins
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb, Ricko
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
That coin would have never been seen in a TPG holder. But authentication is mandatory here.
with the fake large cents being posted recently that were graded by the services I am afraid of these. I have actually backed away significantly from collecting over the past year and sold most of my coins. I just can't be sure any more. A few years ago I would have said real, now I don't have a clue. would not buy any of them
There's another with more original skin for a little more. Mindboggling why anyone would opt for a harshly cleaned coin? More detail? hmmm
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
A coin like that should have already have paid a visit to a tpgs, and may have. Any way to check that?
There was a good though impaired one of these in a Vermont auction a couple years ago. Again, it was not certified. Why? The only excuse I can come up with for the auctioneers is they are too lazy/cheap or fearful of really bad news. No excuse not to pay the fee, which with impaired coins would probably be accepted on the $30 tier, as value is a lot lower than with a numerically graded example.
It ends in a few hours.
Free shipping!! Methinks it may be a gold brick dollar from the Ming dynasty.
Sadly, I too have decided the risk/reward for collecting expensive rare coins is just too negative these days. I have no idea how advanced China and maybe North Korea counterfeiting has become, but I am afraid they might get so good we may not know.
Wow, scary !!!
Really scary that they are counterfeiting TPGS holders too.
Closed at $9,100.09 with 25 bids from 5 bidders. Bidder 3 bid a high of $110.50 so it was just 2 bidders over that.
The top two bidders don't exactly look like shills based on % bids with seller but the underbidder did have 2 retractions in the last month. The bidding pattern also looks a bit strange to me.
Does anything look wrong to you about these two coins?
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1866-Indian-Cent-Gem-BU-Red-/152914558938?nma=true&si=c10nZkmW66%2Fg41BKdxDCAZLp2mQ%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
https://www.ebay.com/itm/1854-Braided-Hair-Large-Cent-Gem-BU-Red-/152900446454?nma=true&si=c10nZkmW66%2Fg41BKdxDCAZLp2mQ%3D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc&_trksid=p2047675.l2557
Well, for one thing I've never seen a coin graded 'Butt Red'.
That large cent looks like a cast counterfeit. But, as I mentioned previously, the 1912-S Liberty Nickel and 1832 Large Cents looked real. Seems unusual to have such a mix - they usually all look counterfeit or genuine. Perhaps some of the counterfeits are better than others.