Lookie what I did at the FUN Show!
BigDowgie
Posts: 1,780 ✭✭✭✭
Ok, while not a Jefferson Variety of the Week, this is one of those Jeffersons that deserves a shout out!
Let me know what you think! I'll work up some nice pictures.
6
Comments
I love it, Big Dog! You're the MAN! Now, help me out. PCGS Coinfacts has the MS-64 in FS listed at $13,000. They do not show ANY in 63. What gives? Am I wrong? Either way CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!! Price?
I will withhold comment until I see the reverse and the step detail. the way PCGS "defines" the designation in their book and the way they actually "grade" the series caused me to abandon it 10+ years ago.
Dog,
Is this a coin you submitted at the show?
Congratulations!!!!!
K e e t s, I agree with everything you say.
I'm looking forward to the reverse image...
President, Racine Numismatic Society 2013-2014; Variety Resource Dimes; See 6/8/12 CDN for my article on Winged Liberty Dimes; Ebay
Full steps!
Looks like a proof to me...I have been wrong before.
BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
from Denver?
BHNC #203
Working on pictures. I changed computer and Dino-lite set-up and don't have it right yet. This is not a proof. It's a nice well struck 1961-D. Hope to get some more pics posted later today.
Yes...it still looks like a proof to me...albeit from Denver...the surfaces appear mighty reflective. Ok I will succumb to "proof-like".
BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
Nice Jefferson and you seem extremely happy with it... that is what coin collecting is all about. Cheers, RickO
Congrats BD that's the toughie, and ya lets see the back
Steve
Congrats!! What do the steps look like?
Ok, best I can do right now, so take it easy on me! There is that normal soft area under the second pillar with streps 3 and 4. I just can't get the lighting right to catch lines a little bit to the right of soft area. These steps are nicer that a couple of the higher graded ones that I have seen. I love that strong bottom step, it's solid.
Again, take it easy on me, as I am very sensitive!
Looks like a winner! Congratulations on the purchase.
WTG! You are the BIG Dog of the Jefferson's!
I t was good to see you again and have FUN.
where did the coin come from??
to the step detail: based on the picture I would say no. the area under pillars two and three should immediately disqualify it, that is step one, and step four looks incomplete though that may be the picture. steps two, three and five are hammered.
Ow.. my butt hurts because this post just knocked me on my tush! Congrats!
Wow! That's a great find. I had heard that 61-D was one of the hardest to find with FS, but in just looking it up was blown away by the fact that this is only the fourth one PCGS graded in all grades. Congrats!
Big bucks on that coin, multi thousands....http://www.pcgscoinfacts.com/Coin/Detail/84070
What an AMAZING pick up my coin brother!!
Congratulations Big Dog!!
very nice
Nice coin.
I knew keets wouldn't hold back! The coin came from another Forum member a long, long time ago. I've had it stashed away and pull it out for a shot every couple of years.
Is some ambiguous step detail really more import than the actual grade? How much would a choice MS66 go for?
11.5$ Southern Dollars, The little “Big Easy” set
it is capsules like this which tell me I did the right thing!!
It all depends on your collecting interests. Some go for full steps an grade is secondary, some go for clean fully struck examples and steps are not important. A nice fully struck MS66 non-FS can run $200-$400. That MS65FS example, which is pretty nice, would fetch $20K+. It's all about what makes your boat float, right!
In a word, yes. Collectors will pay multiples of a higher grade for the full step, full head, or full bands designation.
Congrats Dowgie!
Congrats!
My YouTube Channel
Looks all there to me
agreed.
BHNC #203
The slab photo looks like a proof but the closeup does not.
I have never seen a 61-D with steps like that, which are more full than many full step nickels I have seen in the tougher-to-find-in-full-step dates. I'm no expert but it looks like it makes the grade to me.
Tom
Awesome
I don't wish to rain on the OP's parade, but I wonder, do you really believe this coin is a true Full Step Jefferson Nickel?? since you "pull it out for a shot every couple of years" PCGS has told you on multiple occasions that the coin is not a Full Step Jefferson Nickel. we constantly discuss the topic of grade-flation. how does that figure into things???
I find it strange that members routinely rail against PCGS for that reason, yet now appear willing to celebrate the same thing. I applaud your persistent faith, I only wonder what you had/have faith IN. is it that the coin is a true Full Step Jefferson Nickel or that eventually, given the odds and the nature of coin grading, that if submitted enough times the graders would err on the side of Full Steps??
perhaps PCGS should protect themselves from liability and the Hobby from the way in which grade-flation is encouraged and pushed forward. stories have been put forth here of crack-out resubmissions being repeated until the submitter receives the grade they are hoping for. the technology now exists to prevent that: scan every coin prior to grading. currently it is an option. should it be a requirement??
for those who are confused or angry about what I have posted, please look at this link from about 10-12 years ago.
https://forums.collectors.com/discussion/457953/how-i-bought-the-100-000-1960-d-jefferson-nickel-for-9-750-plus-the-juice
to sum things up, this is the sort of thing which caused me to dump my Full Step collection in PCGS holders. I have seen way to many coins which fail to meet the criteria outlined by PCGS in their own "Grading and Counterfeit" publication.
Woof....Woof.
Nice! The photos need better lighting, on a coin like this you should have sprung the extra $10 for imaging. I will withhold any debate of FS or not since the pics probably don't do it justice.
Collector, occasional seller
Grab a handful of 61's or even a bucket full and see how many steps you see...very difficult to come up with something as such. Congrats man!
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
Now there is the keets I know and love, even though I have never met him, I do listen to what he has to say.
I will begin with saying, no, this is not a true full step coin by my normal tough definition. Most full step coins in the 1960's don't meet my definition of a full stepper. Let's get back to this coin. I think we can agree there will never (or at least at this point in time) be a 1961-D with steps like this 1941-D.
If this were a 1941-D, I would rather stick it on a railroad track than in my pocket. I'm not making excuses, but with that being said, what should be the full step grading standard for tougher dates that may not even have the full step details engraved in the dies? I find this soft spot under the second pillar between steps 3 and 4 to be a dominant characteristic for most of the 1960's coins. When we find an example like this where there is a solid 5th step line and no hits in the steps, this soft spot should not disqualify the full step designation.
This leads to your other comment about multiple submissions for the same coin. All I can say is our host doesn't get it right all the time and deserving (and rare) coins warrant a few shots until they get it right. Though, through all this discussion it really comes down to the collector and their criteria as to what goes into their sets. You probably would opt out, but others wouldn't.
counting steps on the OP coin I get 4-3-4-5 based on what the picture shows. should the coin be awarded what amounts to 5-5-5-5??? perhaps others will weigh in with a count.
if you have collected Full Step Jefferson Nickels and looked at enough coins you know that from 1953-1971 the coins very, very seldom come fully struck. the dies were tinkered with a little prior to 1971 when they made new master dies and the step detail finally emerged again.
I am not a proponent of PCGS designating coins as "Full Steps" because, well, "none actually have that detail for that year so we're going to designate the ones that are close."
I can see the label now!!
Keets and others...how about this one? And if you do not consider it FS, what FS breakdown do you give it? Keets, I agree with you on most fronts, I just think it is the best struck 61-D I have personally seen. And I also agree that the standards should not change based upon the date. I think that might mean that there are no true FS 61-Ds, but I don't know the high end coins of that date. Those that do may recognize this pic.
Tom
TPRC, "well struck" and "full steps" are two different aspects, correct? While this is a well struck 1961-D example with super detail, the steps (from the picture) are not even close for consideration to be full steps. A few quick notes: the bottom step does not even exist except to the far right and left, there are 2 deep hits under pillar 3 and plenty of spots where it looks like no steps lines are present. Just my opinion.
Not a Jeff collector, but reading this thread convinced me we are all nerds.
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
If it were my coin I would be proud of it and not drinking out of the toilet like BigDowgie. Cac does not review those.
I love that strong bottom step, it's solid.
Me thinks that strong bottom step put the rest of the weaker steps, like #4, over the threshold.
"Keep your malarkey filter in good operating order" -Walter Breen
and many of us have some level of OCD
Congrats! About 10 years ago I searched an original bag (2000 coins) of 61-D and there were 1 or 2 as I recall that were similar to this one. Did I sell you this one?