MS68 Rattler, 1864 25c
Lakesammman
Posts: 17,462 ✭✭✭✭✭
Sure would like to see this one in hand - I assume the label is supposed to be green?? Currently on ebay from DLRC at a hefty price.
Anyone working on a registry set?? 
"My friends who see my collection sometimes ask what something costs. I tell them and they are in awe at my stupidity." (Baccaruda, 12/03).I find it hard to believe that he (Trump) rushed to some hotel to meet girls of loose morals, although ours are undoubtedly the best in the world. (Putin 1/17) Gone but not forgotten. IGWT, Speedy, Bear, BigE, HokieFore, John Burns, Russ, TahoeDale, Dahlonega, Astrorat, Stewart Blay, Oldhoopster, Broadstruck, Ricko, Big Moose, Cardinal.
18
Comments
Dangggg!
Yikes!
I would also like to see it in person ... what a treat!
See http://www.doubledimes.com for a free online reference for US twenty-cent pieces
Appeals to all...The coin collector, the registry participant, and the slab enthusiast. It even has a sticker.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
No, it's actually a rattler just checked on their site.
Andrew Blinkiewicz-Heritage
Very appealing, probably none graded higher, CAC'd, in a rattler and a Civil War date to boot. I would say it has a lot going for it.
Looks like it sold for $26,738 in 2009. That's a hefty price from DLRC, even though it has all the bells and whistles.
Too bad their pix don't show it at it's best.
Has the price really QUADRUPLED since 2009?? Doubtful.........especially in the current market.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
id love to see that in hand as well. wow
Wow! That's some coin. The Gene Gardner Collection example was an MS67 PCGS CAC piece, one of three such with this MS68 finer. Gardner wrote of his MS67 in the Heritage catalog, "It is hard to believe PCGS has found a coin technically superior to this piece. As they say, this coin is "all there." The surfaces are brilliant, showing just a touch of light toning on the reverse, well-struck throughout with booming luster. The fields are smooth and unmarked. There is a noticeable die chip on Liberty's right thigh and a light die crack on the obverse from Liberty's toe to the rim. The reverse is lightly clashed. I am not skilled enough a grader to know how all this counts against the coin, but to the naked eye it seems close to perfect."
His coin, a lightly rim-toned example, sold for $35,250 in Gardner III (May 2015): ha.com/1228*98351
Kind regards,
George
That is truly spectacular. And what a provenance.
Here's a warning parable for coin collectors...
I am wondering what was this coin price in 1989 before crash?
Can you imagine the upgrade you'd get when that coin is dipped??
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
Top shelf!
100% Positive BST transactions
I wouldn't kick her out of bed for eating crackers.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
That thought hurts......
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
I may be crazy, but I'd rather have a couple hundred or so Seated Quarters in 64. That said, I'm sure the luster is absolutely blinding.
Early American Copper, Bust and Seated.
xactly
oh the luster
"Inspiration exists, but it has to find you working" Pablo Picasso
I assume it’s “on sale” for Del.
I know who’d want it - at about a third of the asking price
The coin: WOW!, The Price: What?
Latin American Collection
Wow! I wonder what it would grade today (although it should obviously stay in the rattler).
Anyone have a non cartoon photo to see what this really looks like?
DLRC the year 2002 just called and it wants it's flatbed scanner back
It's listed as an OBO - maybe I'll make an offer?
it looks beautiful ! Just not worth anything close to the asking price.
Great coin at a Mount Everest asking price.
PCGS' Price Guide value of $49.5k sounds realistic for this one.
What is the provenance before the 2009 Scotsman sale?
Kind regards,
George
That is a spectacular coin..... yes, even with the tarnish.... Cheers, RickO
Gorgeous gem. Just silly that a 150 yo coin can be so close to perfect.
Surprised RR has not chimed in on this thread. This is his lane, and I enjoy the "numistories".
That's insane!!!
My YouTube Channel
Oh the humanity!
BHNC #203
You even get $100 in ebay Bucks!
Don't quote me on that.
Where is RR? I'm sure he's seen this piece in hand and knows the ins and outs of it.
Now there is a coin!
Could you just imagine being in the grading room when this came through? The conversations, oh to have been a fly on the wall...
Yah - like ....... "It looks like a 69 but we can't afford the liability if it turns, so it's a 68".
Lets see the reverse..
Jeez - I told you where it was...... gosh.......where's that spoon......
I like the obverse side better!!
Funny, was just offered a lot more by a good friend of yours
President of David Lawrence Rare Coins www.davidlawrence.com
email: John@davidlawrence.com
2022 ANA Dealer of the Year, Past Chair of NCBA (formerly ICTA), PNG Treasurer, Instructor at Witter Coin University, former Instructor/YN Chaperone ANA Summer Seminar, Coin World Most Influential, Curator of the D.L. Hansen Collection
I’m sure - we both probably thought of the same guy. But he’s a cheapass. Lol
Can't say I know the older history of this coin as tracking post-1852 seated quarter Philly coins in super gem was never of great interest to me, even for Civil War dates. I do recall a super-gem 1864 quarter that was making the rounds as early as the late 1970's/1980. You can possibly find this coin listed in several of the 1979-1990 Apostrophe Auction sales....and stark white by my recollections (and likely in the Paramount sections as Dave Akers had a special liking to monster, better date seated coins). There are some pretty good photos in those old cats so it should be fairly easy matching it up if it did appear. This coin would be something Dave Akers, Mark Emory, Gene Edwards, Rob Rose, Maurice Rosen, or others could have handled along the way.
I certainly wouldn't dip this out again as it looks to have 30 yrs of secondary toning it (ie probably dipped in the 1980's). For quite some time (pre-1990) that one 1864 was considered to be the finest mint state NM quarter out there. This one slabbing out MS68 in 1986-1990 would have been incredible....considering that essentially flawless seated quarters were getting 66/67 grades at that time.
PCGS Price Guide is irrelevant on a coin with a Pop of ONE.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, evn when irrefutably accurate.
With a bit more sleuthing, the 1864 25c I was thinking of was lot 1159 Auction '85 in the Paramount section ($8250). The same coin brought $19,000 in Auction '80 (ex-Sherwood collection at $21,000). The Auction '85 photos are not large enough. The 1980 photo is half a page, but not conclusive. But based on a distinctive "paw print" in the upper reverse field (under the "E" in STATES), this may not be coin DLRC now has. Then again, that spot could have been removed later on. In 1985 Akers did mention that their coin was probably the finest of the date/type they'd ever seen.
The coin was starting to tone by its 1980/1985 appearances, so maybe dipped in the 1970's before it's first auction appearance? Don't let the almost 3-1 price drop from 1980 to 1985 sway you, most coins of this caliber did the same thing. I recall a number of killer better date seated quarters that sold for $30-$45K in 1980...and then $9K to $13K by 1986. Based on what this coin brought in 1985, I'd figure it at $75K tops today....maybe $40K-$60K range. The $26.7K from 2009 was in a panic market. A lot of neat seated coins brought 30-40% discounts at that time. They could easily be 40-50% higher today.
With a myriad of tiny tics on the DLRC coin, I'm sort of surprised it graded MS68 pre-1990. The luster could be the factor. It doesn't look under-graded as MS68 today either. Other than hoarded 1879-1890 seated quarters, it's quite hard to find them devoid of tiny tics.
When checking out the 1864 quarter via enlarged photos on the DLRC site I ran across this old timer 1890 25c from the mid-1990's. It appeared in several Teletrade auctions. At the time an NGC MS68. It was returned twice to them (or failed to reach some "reserve") so I figured I'd take a shot at it for $5K on the 3rd auction. Upon first sight that right field "tic" seemed like a crater to me. I ended up returning it because I felt it was no better than a strong PCGS 66 at that time. In any case, it's MS68 CAC today. And a good lesson on how our perception of things can change. In this view of the coin, I wonder what I saw back then while applying 1989 standards? Then again, I know I put 10X to 16X magnification on that coin since it was a 68. That coin went through 2-3 more auctions at Teletrade before it went away.
https://www.davidlawrence.com/rare-coin/1353717#
It sold for $27k a few years ago.
I know. But the price guide is still irrelevant on an essentially one of a kind item. May not be worth $100k. May not even be worth $25k. But the PCGS price guide is of no help.
All comments reflect the opinion of the author, evn when irrefutably accurate.
The PCGS price guide may be of some help. One could do a number of cross checks between various dates/mints in the 67/68 to see where this 1864 should fall in. It may be a lot of work, but probably worth while. A starting point would be this MS67 CAC that brought $35K in 2015. Interesting that this coin (and maybe others in high grade) are from the same set of obv/rev dies (raised lump on Liberty's thigh and field polishing under the E and O reverse lettering).
https://coins.ha.com/itm/seated-quarters/1864-25c-ms67-pcgs-cac-briggs-1-a/a/1228-98351.s?hdnJumpToLot=1x=0&y=0
Of importance is that CAC has only stickered 2 of this type in MS68 and 23 in MS67. Compare that to the WM type of 133/13. The NM MS68 is basically unobtainable and potentially worth 3X-5X the price of a MS 67 NM type coin. The fact that there are 2-3 MS67's for the 1864 sort of robs it of much of its "better date" status in 68 grade.