TPGers provide an opinion for a fee...Code 97 was thier opinion on this piece. Here is what PCGS says about COde 97 Environmental Damage.
97 Environmental Damage. Coins that are damaged because of improper storage may be rejected. Corrosion is caused by storage in areas of high humidity, sea salvage coins, and coins found in the ground. Toning that is excessively dark or heavy, or which burns into the surface of the coin, may be rejected.
@jwitten, as you posted: "Well, one man's POS is another man's treasure."
Of course I AGREE! IMO, I thought I made that clear while explaining that both pieces of discolored gold (which I know you and others love/collect/and sell) are ED. From what I've seen, up until fairly recently, a majority of collectors send stuff like this to the conservation services to restore them to a gold color in seconds.
With the renewed interest and education regarding cleaning and unusually "bright" coins, IMO, there is a swing back to making coins look dirty and old by various methods. Unfortunately one has been mentioned in this thread.
PS I'll NEVER tell anyone what to collet (unless I'm asked - LOL). And if I ever got a hold of that $5...
I would love to see someone perform an actual experiment with a gold coin and iodine. I hear it mentioned often, but have never seen an actual known example.
@oih82w8 said:
TPGers provide an opinion for a fee...Code 97 was thier opinion on this piece. Here is what PCGS says about COde 97 Environmental Damage.
97 Environmental Damage. Coins that are damaged because of improper storage may be rejected. Corrosion is caused by storage in areas of high humidity, sea salvage coins, and coins found in the ground. Toning that is excessively dark or heavy, or which burns into the surface of the coin, may be rejected.
Interesting. Thanks for providing that info. So my guess is, they thought the toning was too dark, or too deep? But natural? Because artificial tone would be labeled Questionable color I think.
@spacehayduke said: "I am wondering if you should try again in a few months after it is out of the graders minds?"
@jwitten Trust me on this, the $5 is like a bad nightmare. Once you've had it, you'll never forget it. Ten years form now, if someone were to post something about your $5, I'll see it in my mind. The professional graders are just as sensitive to folks trying to put one over. However, I've heard that if you send the same coin back several times ...
My unsolicited advice: Save your money for another toner. OR...send it to a different TPGS and you may get lucky.
I wouldn't spend the money to submit it again. It's a common date and it's not uncirculated even if it straight graded. It may have been treated with iodine, hence environmental damage. That mottled purple finish just does not look right to me.
Good news is it is gold and since some or all of the purchase price was paid with eBay bucks you may be able to get your investment out of it and move on. As long as you keep it you will be disappointed every time you look at the slab. Once it's gone, no more regrets.
it's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide
@tommy44 said:
I wouldn't spend the money to submit it again. It's a common date and it's not uncirculated even if it straight graded. It may have been treated with iodine, hence environmental damage. That mottled purple finish just does not look right to me.
Good news is it is gold and since some or all of the purchase price was paid with eBay bucks you may be able to get your investment out of it and move on. As long as you keep it you will be disappointed every time you look at the slab. Once it's gone, no more regrets.
Lol, I collect gold toners, and this is one of my favorites, so no, I will never be disappointed with this coin. I will try again to get it straight graded, but even if it remains in a details holder, I will love it. And artificial coins are not labeled as environmental damage.
My first thought was leather pouch toning, but in the video the fields looks unnaturally shiny. Not sure what has happened to this coin, but I can see why a TPG might not want to commit themselves on it.
Edited to add: Any chance the coin is lacquered, or otherwise coated with something translucent?
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
@CaptHenway said:
My first thought was leather pouch toning, but in the video the fields looks unnaturally shiny. Not sure what has happened to this coin, but I can see why a TPG might not want to commit themselves on it.
Edited to add: Any chance the coin is lacquered, or otherwise coated with something translucent?
No, it has really nice luster (in my opinion). When the toning shows best in the video, the lighting hides that.
I've seen lighter versions of those colors on PanPac gold that I knew had been stored in a leather coin pouch for decades. My coin straight graded, but the purple was not nearly as deep.
PCGS seems to be saying they think the colors were not intentionally put there (that would be QC), but they don't want that look in a straight graded holder.
@Kove said:
I've seen lighter versions of those colors on PanPac gold that I knew had been stored in a leather coin pouch for decades. My coin straight graded, but the purple was not nearly as deep.
PCGS seems to be saying they think the colors were not intentionally put there (that would be QC), but they don't want that look in a straight graded holder.
Hopefully I can get it in a straight holder one day, with pcgs or ngc. Here are a few graded examples with similar colors I've seen:
I imagine that the graders didn't like how dark the color of the coin is which to them might have indicated being in a fire or some other form of long-term storage in a harsh environmental condition.
The toning pattern of dark fields and light halos around the stars is a natural toning pattern. Here are a few extreme example which came from a time capsule from the cornerstone of a church in the south (or so the legend has it).
The copper impurities in the gold oxidizes, resulting in the toning spots. Not sure if any chemicals were introduced to this OP coin. I think this coin would look a lot nicer in an album to enjoy, rather than waste more $$$ on regrading. But anyways... A very kool & different gold coin you got there.
Comments
TPGers provide an opinion for a fee...Code 97 was thier opinion on this piece. Here is what PCGS says about COde 97 Environmental Damage.
97 Environmental Damage. Coins that are damaged because of improper storage may be rejected. Corrosion is caused by storage in areas of high humidity, sea salvage coins, and coins found in the ground. Toning that is excessively dark or heavy, or which burns into the surface of the coin, may be rejected.
https://www.pcgs.com/nogradesdescription
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I would love to see someone perform an actual experiment with a gold coin and iodine. I hear it mentioned often, but have never seen an actual known example.
Interesting. Thanks for providing that info. So my guess is, they thought the toning was too dark, or too deep? But natural? Because artificial tone would be labeled Questionable color I think.
@spacehayduke said: "I am wondering if you should try again in a few months after it is out of the graders minds?"
@jwitten Trust me on this, the $5 is like a bad nightmare. Once you've had it, you'll never forget it. Ten years form now, if someone were to post something about your $5, I'll see it in my mind. The professional graders are just as sensitive to folks trying to put one over. However, I've heard that if you send the same coin back several times ...
My unsolicited advice: Save your money for another toner. OR...send it to a different TPGS and you may get lucky.
I wouldn't spend the money to submit it again. It's a common date and it's not uncirculated even if it straight graded. It may have been treated with iodine, hence environmental damage. That mottled purple finish just does not look right to me.
Good news is it is gold and since some or all of the purchase price was paid with eBay bucks you may be able to get your investment out of it and move on. As long as you keep it you will be disappointed every time you look at the slab. Once it's gone, no more regrets.
it's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide
Lol, I collect gold toners, and this is one of my favorites, so no, I will never be disappointed with this coin. I will try again to get it straight graded, but even if it remains in a details holder, I will love it. And artificial coins are not labeled as environmental damage.
My first thought was leather pouch toning, but in the video the fields looks unnaturally shiny. Not sure what has happened to this coin, but I can see why a TPG might not want to commit themselves on it.
Edited to add: Any chance the coin is lacquered, or otherwise coated with something translucent?
No, it has really nice luster (in my opinion). When the toning shows best in the video, the lighting hides that.
When you look at it under magnification, are any of the colored areas pitted?
I've seen lighter versions of those colors on PanPac gold that I knew had been stored in a leather coin pouch for decades. My coin straight graded, but the purple was not nearly as deep.
PCGS seems to be saying they think the colors were not intentionally put there (that would be QC), but they don't want that look in a straight graded holder.
It looks like fire damage or some other accelerated oxidation. That's probably what they are referring to as "environmental damage".
Hopefully I can get it in a straight holder one day, with pcgs or ngc. Here are a few graded examples with similar colors I've seen:
OMG! It's almost midnight here and remember what I said about certain "night dreams!" Well, thanks for posting.
Either way, QC or ED, they didn't like the coin.
I like some of your pickups, but not this one.
I imagine that the graders didn't like how dark the color of the coin is which to them might have indicated being in a fire or some other form of long-term storage in a harsh environmental condition.
The toning pattern of dark fields and light halos around the stars is a natural toning pattern. Here are a few extreme example which came from a time capsule from the cornerstone of a church in the south (or so the legend has it).
Latin American Collection
My experience with PCGS is that they do not like colors that lay like that on the coins surface....
You are correct, sir.
The copper impurities in the gold oxidizes, resulting in the toning spots. Not sure if any chemicals were introduced to this OP coin. I think this coin would look a lot nicer in an album to enjoy, rather than waste more $$$ on regrading. But anyways... A very kool & different gold coin you got there.