So why are 3 cent silvers so darn ugly? (spotty and dirty)

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WingedLiberty1957
WingedLiberty1957 Posts: 3,014 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited July 6, 2017 5:18AM in U.S. Coin Forum

Even pcgs graded ones tend to be spotted and chewed up. Generally ugly to look at.

Is it that the size was so small and it was thin. Why are they so horrible looking in general?

I've been looking for a nice eye appealing (toned if possible, but ok if not) PCGS AU or low MS for the past 7 years and I've found squat!

Here is a PCGS AU50 ...
Can a coin get any less appealing?
Most look like they were dug up from underground.

My Coin Blog
My Toned Lincoln Registry Set

Comments

  • amwldcoin
    amwldcoin Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    To each his own but I happen to love the look of that 1867!

  • keets
    keets Posts: 25,351 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I think it is because of the small diameter of the coins, it takes a lot less time for tone to come from the rims and cover the entire coin. I suppose that also is the cause of darker colors as the tone reaches terminal black. an even bigger problem that I am sure you have encountered is 3CS's that are bent. imagine having them in a pocket or change purse with other heavier coins.

    this causes me to be in amazement that there are as many survivors as there are. I have a few, so good luck with your search. try reaching out to a specialist who will find what you want.

  • BillDugan1959
    BillDugan1959 Posts: 3,821 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    For the three cent silver, the silver fineness was only .750 for the years 1851-1853. The more copper, the more reactive to the environment. They improved the fineness to .900 from 1854, but of course 85% of all three cent silvers ever struck were made in the first three years at the lower level of fineness.

  • oih82w8
    oih82w8 Posts: 13,206 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    That Type III has a really nice look to it!

    oih82w8 = Oh I Hate To Wait _defectus patientia_aka...Dr. Defecto - Curator of RMO's

    BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
  • sellitstore
    sellitstore Posts: 3,086 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I agree with the lower silver fineness theory.

    Low silver content worldwide coins have the same look-often dirty, spotted and rarely with colorful toning characteristics of higher grade silver.

    Collector and dealer in obsolete currency. Always buying all obsolete bank notes and scrip.
  • WingedLiberty1957
    WingedLiberty1957 Posts: 3,014 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Maybe it's like old silver settings (teapots and stuff) that tarnish over time?

    My Coin Blog
    My Toned Lincoln Registry Set

  • WingedLiberty1957
    WingedLiberty1957 Posts: 3,014 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    My Coin Blog
    My Toned Lincoln Registry Set

  • Walkerguy21D
    Walkerguy21D Posts: 12,164 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Clashed die, possibly AT, but not ugly, at least to me....oops, I still can't post images from PB, even using the Direct link and entering into the Attach Image URL box!

    Successful BST transactions with 177 members. breakdown, scotty1419, mattniss, bigjpst, onlyroosies, Manorcourtman, guitarwes, Ebeneezer, Tonedeaf, Shane6596, Piano1, Ikenefic, RG, PCGSPhoto, stman, Don'tTelltheWife, Boosibri, Ron1968, snowequities, VTchaser, jrt103, SurfinxHI, 78saen, bp777, FHC, RYK, JTHawaii, Opportunity, Kliao, bigtime36, skanderbeg, split37, thebigeng, acloco, Toninginthblood, OKCC, braddick, Coinflip, robcool, fastfreddie, tightbudget, DBSTrader2, nickelsciolist, relaxn, Eagle eye, soldi, silverman68, ElKevvo, sawyerjosh, Schmitz7, talkingwalnut2, konsole, sharkman987, sniocsu, comma, jesbroken, David1234, biosolar, Sullykerry, Moldnut, erwindoc, MichaelDixon, GotTheBug
  • BillJones
    BillJones Posts: 35,933 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    You can find nice looking Type II and Type III trimes. They were made of the 90% silver, 10% copper alloy that was used the other silver coins. The Type I trimes were only 75% silver and 25 % copper. I have seen many of those pieces with spots and unattractive toning.

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
  • slider23
    slider23 Posts: 681 ✭✭✭✭
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    I picked up this one XF45, and sent it to CAC and it did not sticker. Maybe the scratch or old cleaning held it back from a green bean. I thought it was going to be a slam dunk for a green bean.


  • 291fifth
    291fifth Posts: 25,218 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @slider23 said:
    I picked up this one XF45, and sent it to CAC and it did not sticker. Maybe the scratch or old cleaning held it back from a green bean. I thought it was going to be a slam dunk for a green bean.


    I'm sure the scratch was enough to prevent it from getting a sticker.

    All glory is fleeting.
  • oih82w8
    oih82w8 Posts: 13,206 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @WingedLiberty1957 said:

    Looks like a RPD on the lower portion of the "1"...or a hunk o' crud.

    oih82w8 = Oh I Hate To Wait _defectus patientia_aka...Dr. Defecto - Curator of RMO's

    BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
  • AmazonX
    AmazonX Posts: 681 ✭✭✭✭
    edited July 6, 2017 1:45PM
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    MS63 PL

    And if you want ugly... (edit: it's a contemporary counterfeit)


  • ScarsdaleCoin
    ScarsdaleCoin Posts: 5,445 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Not a new observation in my research there were several arrivals that I came upon dating 1850's where society ladies of the day objected to the grime and squalor of those fishy scales

    But beauty is in the eye of the beholder and I truly believe it is the small size rather than darkness that holds their popularaity back

    Then again what do I know bout em

    Jon Lerner - Scarsdale Coin - www.CoinHelp.com
  • lkenefic
    lkenefic Posts: 9,518 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I also believe that trimes were used heavily in commerce. Specifically, US postage... "In 1851 a new series of stamps was introduced to accommodate lower postal rates. Domestic deliveries of up to 3,000 miles were now charged only 3 cents per half-ounce..." This is one of the appeals to me for collecting coins... the history involved!

    ref: http://values.hobbizine.com/stamps/us-1847-57.html

    Collecting: Dansco 7070; Middle Date Large Cents (VF-AU); Box of 20;

    Successful BST transactions with: SilverEagles92; Ahrensdad; Smitty; GregHansen; Lablade; Mercury10c; copperflopper; whatsup; KISHU1; scrapman1077, crispy, canadanz, smallchange, robkool, Mission16, ranshdow, ibzman350, Fallguy, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, jwitten, Walkerguy21D, dsessom.
  • logger7
    logger7 Posts: 9,858 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I have no idea. I have had above average certified Unc.s grade as problem coins the second time around and then get back into 63-64 holders. They must be tough to grade.

  • oih82w8
    oih82w8 Posts: 13,206 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 6, 2017 11:43AM
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    That 1858 3CS details look so distorted, it looks like a replica/copy/fake, especially the shield.

    oih82w8 = Oh I Hate To Wait _defectus patientia_aka...Dr. Defecto - Curator of RMO's

    BST transactions: dbldie55, jayPem, 78saen, UltraHighRelief, nibanny, liefgold, FallGuy, lkeigwin, mbogoman, Sandman70gt, keets, joeykoins, ianrussell (@GC), EagleEye, ThePennyLady, GRANDAM, Ilikecolor, Gluggo, okiedude, Voyageur, LJenkins11, fastfreddie, ms70, pursuitofliberty, ZoidMeister,Coin Finder, GotTheBug, edwardjulio, Coinnmore, Nickpatton, Namvet69,...
  • AmazonX
    AmazonX Posts: 681 ✭✭✭✭
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    @oih82w8 said:

    That 1858 3CS details look so distorted, it looks like a replica/copy/fake, especially the shield.

    @oih82w8 Yup it's a contemporary counterfeit.

  • Treashunt
    Treashunt Posts: 6,748 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    @Walkerguy21D said:
    Clashed die, possibly AT, but not ugly, at least to me....oops, I still can't post images from PB, even using the Direct link and entering into the Attach Image URL box!

    perhaps if you delete a few (dozen?) you are at 100%.

    Try to clear some space then try posting

    Frank

    BHNC #203

  • Yorkshireman
    Yorkshireman Posts: 4,616 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I think toned three cent silvers can be among the prettiest coins of all.
    They are just too small for my taste (and eye sight)!

    Yorkshireman,Obsessed collector of round, metallic pieces of history.Hunting for Latin American colonial portraits plus cool US & British coins.
  • BustDMs
    BustDMs Posts: 1,706 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Bill Dugan beat me to it.

    The fineness, or lack thereof, causes them to tone differently than other silver coins of the era.

    Q: When does a collector become a numismatist?



    A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.



    A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
  • basetsb
    basetsb Posts: 508 ✭✭✭✭
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    Here's one that I used to own. Unfortunately it was cleaned.


    @basetsb_coins on Instagram

  • ricko
    ricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I have never collected these... the tiny size just does not attract me.... much like tenth oz. gold, I have a couple, but only because they came with other acquisitions. Cheers, RickO

  • BStrauss3
    BStrauss3 Posts: 3,905 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I love them and collect them in XF. But I'll be happy to take that '67 off your hands and give it a good home in my set.

    -----Burton
    ANA 50+ year/Life Member (now "Emeritus")
    Author: 3rd Edition of the SampleSlabs book, https://sampleslabs.info/
  • 1630Boston
    1630Boston Posts: 14,157 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    Here's one that is not too bad :smile:

    Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb, Ricko

    Bad transactions with : nobody to date

  • ShadyDave
    ShadyDave Posts: 2,218 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I only own one in AU, but I love it!

  • basetsb
    basetsb Posts: 508 ✭✭✭✭
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    @ShadyDave said:
    I only own one in AU, but I love it!

    Extremely nice example you have there. Congrats. Let me know if its ever for sale.

    @basetsb_coins on Instagram

  • keyman64
    keyman64 Posts: 15,650 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I'm guessing that their metal composition is what has lead to many unattractive examples when it comes to toning. There are certainly some very nice examples out there, some in this thread, but they are much harder to find. I certainly wouldn't mind finding a couple of attractive examples one day. I do know that it will be a tough hunt.

    "If it's not fun, it's not worth it." - KeyMan64
    Not really looking for much these days but if I were, it might be a toner. :smile:
  • PTVETTER
    PTVETTER Posts: 6,133 ✭✭✭✭✭
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    I have one in MS68 that is very sharp with attractive toning.
    NGC holder, older one.

    Pat Vetter,Mercury Dime registry set,1938 Proof set registry,Pat & BJ Coins:724-325-7211


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