At what point do dealers lose thier cool?
sparky64
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I give full credit for how much I've seen a couple of them put up with lately at a few shows.
The more pricey coins some customers have to sell, the more bold and rude it seems.
Last show, a guy had a list of gold coins and was asking for a buy price and the dealer simply said he needed to see them first.
The guy reluctantly pulls out about 7 slabs and tosses them, one by one like Frisbees on top of the glass case.
Dealer then asked what he was looking to get for them and customer just kept getting more rude by the minute.
Saying if this dealer didn't step up soon, someone in the room will easily give him $7K....blah, blah, blah.....
I had to walk away because I wanted to punch the guy but the dealer stayed as cool as a cucumber.
Not sure if the deal happened but I was impressed with the patience. Good business I suppose.
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
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Comments
He kept his cool because in his mind he already knew he was going to subtract the 20% AH Fee on his offer
Steve
Never
This happens more often than you think.
Almost every show in fact.
Over time you learn to just smile and laugh inside at the jerk on the other side of the table.
My response to some one like this is to politely tell them that if I can not see the coins first before quoting a price then I do not need them. The attitude usually changes at that point after I explain why.
Make a thread about Hunter Smith and everybody loses it.
I doubt if I could be polite if a jerk like that was dealing with me.
I would likely throw the coins back at him and tell him to step away from my table.
my experience has placed me on both sides of the table and given me a perspective that many don't like --- when it comes to being rude and crude things seem to have been spread around quite well, to both buyers and sellers. I know my share of rude, ill mannered dealers that I simply ignore. I am presently working on that side of the counter so I have more contact with customers who need to see Judith Martin for a good scolding.
my favorite "dealer acting like an a-hole" story was about 10-15 years ago. I was looking through some Proof Sets and the dealer grabbed them out of my hands and told me I was done!! I looked at him, laughed, mumbled something under my breath and walked away. I now make it a point to visit their table whenever I see them to say hello and walk on. that is my black-list tactic: say hello and move on.
There is one specific forum favorite dealer that treated me so rudely with no justification that whenever I see them I actually cross the aisle to avoid them. I will admit, though, that in the big picture customers are Super Bowl Champs in comparison.
I saw my dealer friend lose it at FUN a couple years ago....an early 20-something and his friend with an I-phone kept trying to chisel him down on a foreign gold coin that he already had priced very reasonably. He offered them a 'best price' discount but they still weren't happy. The last straw was when they said they had an auction record of one that sold for X, if he priced his 10% lower, they would buy his.
I looked and said that price was for a marginal coin in an NGC holder, his coin is much nicer and in a PCGS holder....my friend asked for the coin back, told them "it's not for you", put it back in his case, locked it, and walked away. They asked to see it one more time, maybe they could work something out, etc - he said 'no, I'm done with you, please leave my table'.
Yep, I agree with that as a buyer. Amazing what dealers say / do at shows.
I have seen anal apertures on both sides of the tables.... I, personally, have not had a dealer 'lose it' with me, nor have I 'lost it' with a dealer. I have walked away and after, at other shows, I would stop, look the dealer in the eye... and walk away without looking at his coins. I have seen bad behavior though, as I said, from both customers and dealers... shouting and red faced..... Stupid... Cheers, RickO
This hobby/business has changed so much in the last 30 years. There is so much quick, available information ready at our finger tips. Auction results with pictures of the coin in high detail, many pricing "guides" lots of informed buyers, sellers and dealers. I hope that all this knowledge would lead to more civil discourse of the bourse or over the counter. Perhaps this has propelled the ever expanding intent market.
What I see most often is dealers losing their cool with other dealers. I saw this at Long Beach a few years ago. A dealer threw a slabbed coin at another dealer and stormed off...Apparently they had agreed on a price and one changed their mind at the last minute....
Good stories.
It seems that as I get older my tolerance for rude behavior has run out.
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress
The only time I've seen someone "lose it" in earnest on a bourse floor was a dealer yelling at another dealer for being a deadbeat.
I've seen it 3 or 4 times through the years with different yellers, but always the same yellee.
Coin Rarities Online
A dealer got a little nasty with me, once, b/c I asked him to see the same coin more than once, as I was debating over whether or not to purchase it and at what price. He was mad at having to keep pulling it from his case and made a snide remark at me, which I thought was ridiculous....maybe he was concerned about theft, as he didn't know me? I dunno...still no excuse for that behavior, regardless, imho.
In the end, I bought the coin but I paid less than I would have had he been more accommodating.
Sometimes, it’s better to be LUCKY than good. 🍀 🍺👍
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I remember a dealer losing their cool with me a few years back. When I first started out, I was working on a 20th cent. type set and I was looking to fill holes. A dealer had stacks of the type needed, so I walked up and stated my intentions
My x-ray vision was not working that day, so I asked to look at a group at a time. After the third or fourth group of five, the dealer more or less asked "how long are you gonna look at my coins?".
After I picked the best example of the date in my hand, I handed the dealer the money for the only coin I'll buy from them. Way to make ONE sale
lol
I don't know how others would have handled the situation. Now I just walk by their often dead table at shows.
I've found most dealers to be really nice and sociable. One dealer at the richmond show yesterday didn't want me looking through a pcgs box of coins because I was just wanted to see if there was anything that caught my eye. His comment was "there are expensive coins in there, you can't look"
My girlfriend was with me and she got a lot more attention from the dealers than I did!
When their BS starts its time for them to leave
For the times I've set up at local shows only once did a collector exceed my patience. This guy was a known tire kicker who would ask to look at numerous coins at every show, get prices, never buy anything, and never offered up a price that he would actually buy an item at. At one show, I was quoting the guy sub-wholesale prices to see if he would bite. He didn't. On a subsequent show he picked out a $1 gold coin and was given a price. He came back an hour later to look at it again. This time asking the price yet again. I gave him the same number. He immediately got all incensed and told me I was trying to "cheat" him by quoting a higher price than before. He added the word "liar" to the insults. At that point I gave this professional tire-kicker a tongue lashing to ensure he would never forget. The dealer I was set up was quite familiar with this guy's tactics and even told him the price quoted in each instance was the same.
The "best" confrontation I ever witnessed was during a Stack's auction around 1988(?). Two top level dealers almost came to fists on the floor over who actually won the lot at a particular price. That was real strange.
Good and bad eggs on both sides of the table here - nobody has a monopoly on bad behavior.
I've been told that by a dealer who, at the time, I had done probably 5k in business with. Just because there is a box in their case, doesn't mean that it's for perusing by anyone. It's one thing to let someone sift through a box of <$20 coins. It's another if they are 4+ figure coins. Shows can be busy and unless the dealer knows you well, he likely isn't going to hand you more than one 1k+ coin at a time to look at.
20% AH Fee
Your too kind
So what's the best response when you want to sell a coin and the dealer asks what are you looking for?
You could either quote him a price, or tell him you are looking for offers. But do not be surprised if some dealers do not want to make an offer.
Coin Rarities Online
It's really easy keeping my cool and letting rude people prove why they're in a class of their own.
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I don't take much. I usually put a stop to it really quickly.
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An example of "Extreme Self Control" I witnessed:
I came to the table after the initial negotiation, apparently, but a buyer was standing in front of the table with a coin in hand.
Wanna-be dealer: "I can go $xx."
Dealer: "I gave you my best price, and it's still $xx."
Wanna-be, (holding the coin like it was his): "But I can't make a profit on that...Can't you come down a little?"
Dealer: "I'm not in the business of making you money." (Then looking at me with an honestly cheerful face): "Can I help you with anything?"
Wanna-be: "We aren't done yet!"
Dealer: "I was done when I gave you my price. I'm just waiting for you to pass on it." (To me): "Sorry about that. Once he moves, you'll have more room to look."
Wanna-be, (handing the coin back reluctantly): "You're screwing up this sale."
Dealer: "Have a nice day!"
It was like he intentionally placed himself into a completely different conversation. I was rather impressed.
There once was actually a fist fight at a big name auction between two dealers over a coin.
Once, I personally was read the riot act by a dealer when I saw a coin I liked in his case, saw the price on the coin (I was not quoted a best price, or "I can give it to you for $X) and politely asked him for a 9% discount, explaining I had references and could write him a check so he wouldn't be hit for the 3% credit card fee. I understand from others that this isn't the first time he has done this sort of thing.
That said, the above incident was a one and done. There have been a handful of times when a dealer made like he was doing me a favor by offering me a coin 40% over what it was worth.
With very few exceptions, I have found that if you're polite to someone, regardless of the circumstances, he / she will return the favor.
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"Sou Mangueira......."
Amen!
Memo to self...don't take wife onto the bourse floor.
Then again, a distraction may work in my favor.
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I honestly feel bad for him or anyone having to go through this process.
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See, that's just WRONG. At last years summer ANA, I visited the coin four or five times. In fact, the dealer laughed on the third day and asked if I wanted to see "my coin again?"
No high pressure, no guilt, just pleasant. And yes, it did come home with me.
ANA 50 year/Life Member (now "Emeritus")
Think I lost it Sun when a fellow was trying to sell me about 20 low grade cents in 2x2 during dealer set up. He started handing them to me one at a time and I just said let me look at the pile and see if there is anything worthwhile and he replied that he didn't do that because he has been ripped off. At that point I said I'm not at all interested since you don't trust me. How he snuck in b4 show was opened I still don't know
I once reached into a dealer's open case at one of the big national shows like FUN, to pick up and examine a coin. The lid to the showcase was propped open and the dealer was standing right in front of me, so we had made eye contact and exchanged a word or two. I believe we had talked very briefly about the coin in question.
My mistake, however, was failing to clearly ask, "hey, do you mind if I take this coin out of the case to look at it?"
He flipped out and almost slammed the case down on my hand, as though I was trying to snatch the coin and run.
I stepped back quickly with a "whoa, easy there, fella!" reaction.
It was a gross overreaction on his part, but in retrospect, I suppose it is understandable. I thought we had exchanged enough (nonverbal) communication that consent for me to pick up the coin was implied, but I was incorrect.
I think coin show etiquette would side with him on this (though he certainly could've corrected my faux pas more tactfully).
A good many of my little frictions with dealers have been over seemingly petty things like this. Sometimes it was because I unknowingly breached etiquette, as in the example just mentioned. Other times the dealer has just been a plain jerk and inexcusably rude. (I suppose the dealer I just mentioned in this story was a jerk, but within his rights, and excusably rude.)
The moment a customer acts as if they think I'm out to steal from them the discussion is over. I don't put up with that whatsoever!
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The other day, I flipped a guy for being rude , instead of a coin.
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I could deal with the very quickly, just tell tjem you dont want to do business woth them and walk away. what makes me lose my cool is people opening my case without permission.
HAPPY COLLECTING
Perception of wealth can be rather humbling or in this case quite obnoxious.....
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How bout this, I don't care
I am probably not what most people would expect in a coin collector, I'm a bigger guy who usually looks more at home in a biker bar than in a coin show and I have felt some dealers feel uneasy about me looking around... I'm always polite and ask to look at anything before I touch it, and I generally tell them specifically what i'm looking for it if's not easily found upon first glance and I still get the feeling some think i'm some type of criminal.
Generally when this is the case I buy the smallest thing you have that is coin supply related (under $1.00) and pay with a $100 just to watch them look the bill over, and once i get my change I congratulate them on the only dime they will ever get from me .
Successful trades.... MichaelDixon,
When dealer says what do you want to get out of it? ....dealer already knows his buy price .... fishing for a low ball price .. that is where some collectors lose their cool .. open cases at a show . ?
I can agree with this to a point, some dealers may be that way, however I ask because I am looking to see if that person wanting to sell an item is going to be unreasonable with what they have. It does happen every now and again.
Well.......today rivaled Mount St. Helens here. And the following may explain to some a dealers reluctance to trust someone they don't know extremely well.
I caught a long time customer stealing 90% out of my bin. He was a regular and I had donated items to a fundraiser for his granddaughter that had died from a rare disease. He proceeded to tell me it was the first time he had done anything like this, yea right! He then confessed to doing it a "few times" begging me to not call the police. I had enough of the betrayal and lies and called the police for his shoplifting. While we were waiting for the police to arrive he continued to rationalize his behavior make excuses and lie making me furious. After the police arrived he got a "get out of jail free card" as I had not let him get to the parking lot before confronting him. Concealing the coins without the intent to pay isn't enough in the eyes if the law. After finding out that he was not going to be charged or embarrassed by having to admit to his family he is a thief he became smug knowing he was going to get to keep everything he had been stealing from me over the last couple of years. Oh how I wish I lived in a country that would have severed his thieving hand from his arm.
So, next time a dealer wants to keep an eagle eye on his merchandise realize that we have ALL had similar experiences numerous times during our careers that make it hard to trust everyone.
A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.
A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
Sounds like your in California
Www.killermarbles.com
Www.suncitycoin.com
Definitely reads like he's in America.
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Trying to understand your philosophy. How would ANY....and I do mean ANY person at the register, see a HUNDRED DOLLAR BILL being used to pay for something of less than a dollar?
I don't care what they are dressed or presented as in my eyes.......... You hand me a large bill for a dollar item....I am going to look at the bill a couple times AND use the marker on it.
Not sure if you are just trying to bait somebody into the "don't judge the book by the cover" or what.............
In the case of this topic, are you not adding to the problem = originate from the customer side of the table as well???
He's about 2,000 miles from California
My point is to let them know I was there to spend money.. I will let them know that if they had been more friendly they might have gotten that hundred and probably several more... You can judge any book any way you want to judge it but if you you can't be respectful and friendly to me than you will never get another dime from me..
Successful trades.... MichaelDixon,
Got it.
....and I am going out on a limb here, there is some other body language that you pick up on that was not included in your original response??
I fully agree some ground work needs to be set.
I have, had some offer coin well below their value and let them know it is worth more.
This is called cherry picking, yes? Have you ever a dealer more than he quoted?
On the other hand some think their 1943 steel cent is worth $85,000.00.
Its their coin they are trying to sell just as my coin are for sale.
At shows do you ask the dealer how much they want for their coin?
If that is the case why can't a dealer ask how much they want for their coin?