Any Chance this goes higher?

DollarAfterDollar · April 13, 2017 5:49PM

I bought this 1880 P Morgan and shipped it to CAC. They liked it enough to give it a green bean. I'm tempted to crack it because I think it goes MS 65. I know pictures are not the best grading tool but I value your opinions.

Have at it.

Wabbit2313 · April 13, 2017 5:52PM

Nope. Solid 64 to me.

morgandollar1878 · April 13, 2017 5:53PM

Looks about right to me. Some contact what looks to be on the high points, and the toning keep it from going any higher IMO. Can't really say much else about contact marks because the toning is likely hiding most of them.

Coinstartled · April 13, 2017 6:36PM

At the least you are fighting the eye appeal battle.

(though I really like the look....the market favors blast white).

Kccoin · April 13, 2017 6:54PM

I can't say it will go higher. I will say its gorgeous, IMO.

ShadyDave · April 13, 2017 6:56PM

I think there would be a shot at 65 at NGC, but PCGS would cap it at 64 with the mottled toning and hits on cheek and hair.

DollarAfterDollar · April 13, 2017 7:18PM

Thanks for the opinions guys. It helps.

U1chicago · April 13, 2017 7:56PM

It looks similar to 65's that I have seen. As long as the toning isn't covering any serious marks, it could have a chance (I don't know if I would attempt the crack and regrade game, but it could work out).

3keepSECRETif2rDEAD · April 13, 2017 7:59PM

Awesome coin! At 64 with a bean the white plastic shouldn't be a problem...I say let her rest where she is for a bit and enjoy her

abcde12345 · April 13, 2017 8:23PM

Should easily go MS65 by anyones standards. This date is more valuable in ms65 VS ms64 too boot.

DollarAfterDollar · April 14, 2017 5:54AM

Huge upgrade in value, that's why I ask.

BillJones · April 14, 2017 5:58AM

I see two finger prints on the obverse and minor abrasions on the cheek. That coin will not upgrade in my opinion. Leave it where it is.

lusterlover · April 14, 2017 8:53AM

@BillJones said:
I see two finger prints on the obverse and minor abrasions on the cheek. That coin will not upgrade in my opinion. Leave it where it is.

This. Everything else must look killer in hand for it to even get a bean as JA doesn't typically like prints.

messydesk · April 14, 2017 10:29AM

I don't see an upgrade in its future. Of course, I'd have to see the coin in hand to assess the luster and surfaces better, but you have non-positive eye appeal from the toning.

LindeDad · April 14, 2017 10:37AM

Agree with Bill it's overgraded where it is you crack and may get a AU back.

AMRC · April 14, 2017 10:41AM

The toning has mottled a few of the abrasions that keep it in a 64. While anything is possible, I would not crack it.

CAC stickered it because it was right for the grade AND because of the original surfaces. They do not care about fingerprints, but unfortunately, the retail market does also keep in mind, if they thought it was a 65, it would have a Gold Bean on it.

Shortgapbob · April 14, 2017 11:10AM

I'd give it a whirl. No downside other than a grading fee.....it's going to 64 or 65.

Shortgapbob · April 14, 2017 11:18AM

@AMRC said:
The toning has mottled a few of the abrasions that keep it in a 64. While anything is possible, I would not crack it.

CAC stickered it because it was right for the grade AND because of the original surfaces. They do not care about fingerprints, but unfortunately, the retail market does also keep in mind, if they thought it was a 65, it would have a Gold Bean on it.

They Gold Bean coins are usually coins that they see as "obvious upgrade" where the grading service was ultra conservative in their grade.

Most Gold CAC coins will upgrade 2 points.

There are plenty of one point upgrades that are just green beaned.

In fact, I have the funny story of a Barber Half in NGC MS-64 that didn't CAC, didn't cross to PCGS. It was cracked, graded 62 at PCGS after being cracked, green CAC'd as a 62, then was cracked again, graded 64 at PCGS and green CACd as a 64......hehe.

KellenCoin · April 14, 2017 11:35AM

Don't crack it.

coinkat · April 14, 2017 12:36PM

I like the coin...especially for the date. I do not see a 65. I don't think cracking it out and spending grading fees will be productive.

roadrunner · April 14, 2017 2:09PM

@DollarAfterDollar said:
Huge upgrade in value, that's why I ask.

Which is why dates like 1880, 1890 and others that tend to come sort of "cruddy" all the time seem to cap out around MS64. The TPG's want everything right before they hand over the MS65 on one of these. This one is just too subdued with thick toning imo. It would probably need to have MS66 surfaces/marks to get a PCGS 65 grade with that deep toning.

abcde12345 · April 14, 2017 8:20PM

@KellenCoin said:
Don't crack it.

I agree with just the opposite. DO crack and resubmit! Watch it come back solid MS65 every week of the month and with a good chance of MS66. Don't boot it!

rainbowroosie · April 14, 2017 9:37PM

Looks 65 but the toning and fingerprint limit it.

johnny9434 · April 15, 2017 7:16AM

it does not seem it to me. just saying

ricko · April 15, 2017 7:23AM

I see a solid 64.... and with an excess of unattractive tarnish...not telling what that may be hiding.... better leave it in the slab as is. Cheers, RickO

AMRC · April 15, 2017 1:06PM

@Shortgapbob said:

@AMRC said:
The toning has mottled a few of the abrasions that keep it in a 64. While anything is possible, I would not crack it.

CAC stickered it because it was right for the grade AND because of the original surfaces. They do not care about fingerprints, but unfortunately, the retail market does also keep in mind, if they thought it was a 65, it would have a Gold Bean on it.

They Gold Bean coins are usually coins that they see as "obvious upgrade" where the grading service was ultra conservative in their grade.

Most Gold CAC coins will upgrade 2 points.

There are plenty of one point upgrades that are just green beaned.

In fact, I have the funny story of a Barber Half in NGC MS-64 that didn't CAC, didn't cross to PCGS. It was cracked, graded 62 at PCGS after being cracked, green CAC'd as a 62, then was cracked again, graded 64 at PCGS and green CACd as a 64......hehe.

I sure would like to see that evidence. I have never cracked out a Gold Bean, nor do I know anyone who has.

Shortgapbob · April 17, 2017 2:33PM

Lots of gold beans get cracked out. I just cracked out a Grant Star Commem Gold Dollar in MS-65 Gold CAC recently.

Just depends on the upside with the particular coin vs. the premium of the Gold CAC.

DancingFire · April 17, 2017 10:34PM

@abcde12345 said:

@KellenCoin said:
Don't crack it.

I agree with just the opposite. DO crack and resubmit! Watch it come back solid MS65 every week of the month and with a good chance of MS66. Don't boot it!

Will you pay for the damage if it came back lower?

abcde12345 · April 18, 2017 6:59AM

@DancingFire said:

@abcde12345 said:

@KellenCoin said:
Don't crack it.

I agree with just the opposite. DO crack and resubmit! Watch it come back solid MS65 every week of the month and with a good chance of MS66. Don't boot it!

Will you pay for the damage if it came back lower?

Probably not, but maybe. message me (email) the particulars.

DoubleEagle59 · April 18, 2017 7:25AM

Perhaps a technical 65, but without the luster the US TPGs must have (get the dip jar handy) you won't get a 65.

I've sent in Morgans that technically were flawless (at least a 66) but had toning and a muted luster and they were graded only a 64.

Any Chance this goes higher?

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