Wow - never expected so many replies. I expected what I posted to be controversial, and knew I would get flamed, but honestly am actually surprised that so many supported my actions. I also received some very thoughtful messages.
Please read to the end as there is a monkey wrench here that I want to add to the discussion.
So many of the replies described similar experiences. That - plus 100 replies - means I struck a chord. Back in my early twenties, I went to a coin show and saw dealer after dealer mistreat some kids that were there looking for coins to fill holes in their Whitman folders. It was really bad - a room full of jerks. I left numismatics for almost 20 years because of it. Things are much better today and the great majority of dealers are wonderful to kids. But that experience came back to me when this happened. It pushed a big pet peeve button on an older, wiser, more experienced and outspoken version of me.
But what everyone said was great food for thought. Yes there are two sides of the story. I will stick by my decision to keep the dealer anonymous for the same reasons I stated. Plus it avoids a public pissing match here. And prevents strangers from trolling him (and why shouldn't I have all the fun?!)
Hindsight is 20/20, and after all of this input I might have done things differently. Under the circumstances though, being unexpectedly ambushed, I still think I managed well. There were many things happening at once, and I was caught off-guard and mostly concerned about the bad treatment to my son and to me in front of my son. And we just got there, excited (as we all are when we enter a coin show) and this was the first thing that happened only a minute or two later. I brought my son intentionally so he could enjoy the show, my focus was not on buying or me, but only on his experiencing a coin show. And it was absolutely off to a really bad start. I was balancing a lot of things as well as my impulses since my son was there.
There was nothing about my clothes to get that reaction - I was not wearing a sports coat, but I had on a "dressy" t-shirt and nice jeans. I wear a wedding ring and a Breitling watch. I wear reading glasses and had a loupe in my hand. I am certain I didn't look like someone who lives on the streets. It is a local show where everyone wears a t-shirt. I truly do not know if it was "racial" especially now that I have heard so many possibilities, including the fact that I could have been judged because there was a kid with me. But again, I felt it was racial, and two others thought the same independently. I can't read his mind. Bad behavior is bad whatever the motivation.
In terms of whining to the Show Manager, I probably would have done that regardless - especially because I was there with my son, and as far as I am concerned the dealer - every dealer - has an obligation to promote the hobby to sustain the future of coin collecting - and his bad behavior was directed to both me and an 8 year old kid who walked up to his table at a public show. The hobby rewards the dealer with profits - that is why he has a table there. it is his and every dealer's duty to support the future of numismatics. I am too much of an advocate now to let any dealer mistreat a kid and not complain. Especially my own kid. No apologies for that.
Now the monkey wrench. This dealer is also the manager/promoter/partner in two larger regional shows. His public face of numismatics is much greater than that one table. For me personally, I should have the right to go to any public show without being refused access or harassed for no reason. Everyone does. I can really let my imagination run wild over the kind of treatment he would allow, or even dish out at his own shows. Or to me personally He knows who I am, so could he refuse me entry into his shows? I am not stupid enough to bring my son, but then again, why should I need to make any adjustments to my fair access to a pubic event just because of my experience from the dealer/promoter's "profiling". Everyone "profiles", indeed, but a public event should not have that luxury - plus it hurts their clients, the dealers, by scaring away collectors.
Any thoughts about the fact that he is a show manager, and what, if anything I should do about it?
For now, I am going to go to his next show, no kid in tow, ignore him, go about my business, and not go to his table. Fortunately I will also arrive there this time with advice and insight from all of you.
It is many months away. I will report what happens then here.
And I do realize that in the big scheme of things like war and poverty, this doesn't really amount to a hill of beans. Still I am a numismatist/coin nerd, and indeed we are all a little "different" than regular folk. After 100 posts, no doubt the subject is still an important one to us.
I was at the same show... saw that same dealer... and saw the same case of medals referred to by the OP.
I arrived to the show right at the opening of the show so I was one of the first in the door of the folks who did not have tables. When I saw that dealer's case w/ the medals, there was a very clear sign in the case right next to those medals saying they were for display only. That part seems to be missing from the OP's story. I guess it's possible the dealer only put that sign in the case after this alleged interaction w/ the OP, but all of this would have then had to have happened within the first 3-5 minutes of the show.
Even with that sign in the case, the medals were cool enough for me to ask him to confirm if the sign meant all of the medals in the case and the dealer politely confirmed that was the case. Even so, the dealer still offered to show them to me anyways and let me check them out in hand.
I was at the same show... saw that same dealer... and saw the same case of medals referred to by the OP.
I arrived to the show right at the opening of the show so I was one of the first in the door of the folks who did not have tables. When I saw that dealer's case w/ the medals, there was a very clear sign in the case right next to those medals saying they were for display only. That part seems to be missing from the OP's story. I guess it's possible the dealer only put that sign in the case after this alleged interaction w/ the OP, but all of this would have then had to have happened within the first 3-5 minutes of the show.
Even with that sign in the case, the medals were cool enough for me to ask him to confirm if the sign meant all of the medals in the case and the dealer politely confirmed that was the case. Even so, the dealer still offered to show them to me anyways and let me check them out in hand.
Yes there apparently was a sign. Never saw it. I wear reading glasses. I walked up and looked at the center medal closely then my son made his comments, then I was bombarded by the dealer. There could have been 30 medals in the case, and 10 signs. I looked at one medal, was insulted and attacked by the dealer, gave him a few words, and left. The sign is not part of my experience because the dealer did not want me there , so I didn't really have more than 3 seconds to look at the contents of the case. I was told about the sign by my friend, but he noticed it only after looking at the medals and asking the price and being told they were not for sale.
Yes I do know tbere were two medals in there I could identify. Because I am well familiar with them and they are the same medal one in silver the other in bronze. And the medals are large and easy to identify by the large legend. Right? Even within that short period. The answer to his question was as easy as reading the legend. That is how I knew he was being a jerk. And of course his harsh nasty get away from my table tone to me and my son. Looking through the offerings in his case was not something he would allow. There was nothing subtle about it. The existence of a sign does not have anything to do with what happened and the dealer's actions. After that I was looking at the dealer, not checking out his excting case. Did you see the incident? It was early in the show but probably an hour after opening.
I have a couple of books of Far Side comics, and I haven't seen that one.
Fits in perfectly with the OP's story.
I too am not sure you were racially profiled. But whether you were or were not, there is no excuse for that dealer's rudeness.
Dave Wnuck. Redbook contributor; long time PNG Member; listed on the PCGS Board of Experts. PM me with your email address to receive my e-newsletter, and visit DaveWcoins.com Find me on eBay at davewcoins
It certainly is unfortunate that certain people still "profile" others in this day and age. However, I agree with Andy that the most effective response would have been for the OP to make is clear to the dealer that he was an expert in those medals, which may have made the dealer think twice about such "profiling".
Can see the similarities, and that thread reinforces my decision to keep the offending dealer anonymous. In 2005 when that thread took place there was no social media. Today is a much different world.
I have to admit being impressed with the OPs follow up post. Something happened, he was pissed, vented, cooled off, and is keeping an open mind instead of doxxing someone and potentially harming their business over what might have just been a one-off moment. Not bad. Plenty of folks would have just said "XYZ dealer sucks and here's why boo hoo boo hoo."
Not bad, not bad at all.
But still, what were these medals? It sounds like these were 'stop traffic' kinds of medals, and I'd really like to know what they are. If that can be done without revealing an identity please tell us.
I arrived to the show right at the opening of the show so I was one of the first in the door of the folks who did not have tables. When I saw that dealer's case w/ the medals, there was a very clear sign in the case right next to those medals saying they were for display only. That part seems to be missing from the OP's story.
there are always details left out and another side that never gets told so it isn't good to rush to judgment.
When my 10 year old grand nephew came to a local coin show where I had set up, the dealers showered him with numerous coins at almost no cost. Those were nice gestures. But, I wonder if his mother (my niece) who was a stunning 33 yr old beauty at that time accompanying him made any difference?
Sadly, his interest only lasted a couple years at most. He then got caught up in numerous other issues that took over his life, and for the better. You can only try to help.
Now the monkey wrench. This dealer is also the manager/promoter/partner in two larger regional shows. His public face of numismatics is much greater than that one table. For me personally, I should have the right to go to any public show without being refused access or harassed for no reason. Everyone does. I can really let my imagination run wild over the kind of treatment he would allow, or even dish out at his own shows. Or to me personally He knows who I am, so could he refuse me entry into his shows?
Is it really a possibility that he would refuse you entrance to the next show or harass you? I wouldn't think so but there are collectors on here that have more knowledge about this than me.
Back in my early twenties, I went to a coin show and saw dealer after dealer mistreat some kids that were there looking for coins to fill holes in their Whitman folders. It was really bad - a room full of jerks. I left numismatics for almost 20 years because of it.
That is so unfortunate to read. When I went to shows as a kid (30-40 years ago) I remember being treated quite well. I don't recall many dealers spending time talking to me, but they were always willing to let me sit and go through album after album of lightly circulated wheat pennies and buffalo nickels which was all I could afford. Thank goodness I wasn't exposed to any jerks that would have no doubt soured my love for numismatics.
I suppose that dealer/show promoter would have a different take on all of this over a beer and a couple of shots. There's his side. There's your side. Then, there's the truth.
Originally posted by: braddick I suppose that dealer/show promoter would have a different take on all of this over a beer and a couple of shots. There's his side. There's your side. Then, there's the truth.
Showed this thread to my dealer friend .. who also worked with some of the bigger shows in Chicago area .. he stated the situation should have been remedied immediately at the show after fact BS hot air .... show dealers are independent business people .. some of whom spend weeks on the road making a living .. He counted at one show he alone, had over 300 personal contacts just from public show goers .. meaning don't expect a fresh face just because you a collector
Originally posted by: Connecticoin It certainly is unfortunate that certain people still "profile" others in this day and age. However, I agree with Andy that the most effective response would have been for the OP to make is clear to the dealer that he was an expert in those medals, which may have made the dealer think twice about such "profiling".
Who was at the 2014 ANA Kennedy gold Show ?....the one where who knows what was bussed to show to grab Gold Kennedy from Mint.. you say profiling ???...some of those people on floor... made dealers very nervous
It certainly is unfortunate that certain people still "profile" others in this day and age. However, I agree with Andy that the most effective response would have been for the OP to make is clear to the dealer that he was an expert in those medals, which may have made the dealer think twice about such "profiling".
Who was at the 2014 ANA Kennedy gold Show ?....the one where who knows what was bussed to show to grab Gold Kennedy from Mint.. you say profiling ???...some of those people on floor... made dealers very nervous
That was a bit different. Those folks were non collectors willing to camp overnight for a few hundred dollars and were hired to come to the ANA show by a Beverly Hills dealer who paid them just to get the "First Day" designation. They were not coin collectors - and there was almost a riot in the middle of the night, and they left all of their garbage all over the streets. Then the next day they were let into the show after all of that bad behavior.
And you think that is just like me, showing up at a regional show with my son, loupe in hand, looking at medals... because ???
A dealer repeats a phrase a few times and he is a profiling racists? Wow. Stunning over reaction. And the replies! a microcosm of snowflake twitter mob keyboard outrage. We have no idea what the dealer would say. God forbid if he was wearing a "Make America Great Again" hat while he repeated those vile , racist phrases! 1st world, comfy coin show BS. Grow the h*ll up.
To satisfy some of the curiosity, it was the medal pictured below. A Royal Hawaiian Agricultural Society medal. Just like it says right there on the medal. (Julian AM-24) And displayed with this side facing forward.
Maybe he was checking my literacy?
Let me add that his example was not pristine like the image. His precious medal was darkly and unpleasantly tarnished and toned - this is why I needed reading glasses and needed to look closely to identify the medal. There were also numerous serious rim bumps, bad enough that I spotted them in the 3 seconds he let me look at it in the case. During those same 3 seconds, before I realized I was being verbally abused by the dealer and went into fight or flight mode, some of my numismatic brain cells had already concluded that the condition of the medal was substandard and far below the criteria for my collection.
There are versions of this medal dated 1850 and 1882. I did not have time to figure out which one either.
I am not being arrogant in this judgment. 80-90 % of the examples are in excellent condition as they were generally kept in felt lined boxes or stored away and not circulated like coins. His example was obviously dropped on some hard surface a few times and stored improperly so it was exposed to the elements to where it became darkly and harshly tarnished. His is an inferior example, possibly the worst example known.
Originally posted by: carew4me A dealer repeats a phrase a few times and he is a profiling racists? Wow. Stunning over reaction. And the replies! a microcosm of snowflake twitter mob keyboard outrage. We have no idea what the dealer would say. God forbid if he was wearing a "Make America Great Again" hat while he repeated those vile , racist phrases! 1st world, comfy coin show BS. Grow the h*ll up.
Originally posted by: Connecticoin It certainly is unfortunate that certain people still "profile" others in this day and age. However, I agree with Andy that the most effective response would have been for the OP to make is clear to the dealer that he was an expert in those medals, which may have made the dealer think twice about such "profiling".
Who was at the 2014 ANA Kennedy gold Show ?....the one where who knows what was bussed to show to grab Gold Kennedy from Mint.. you say profiling ???...some of those people on floor... made dealers very nervous
That was a bit different. Those folks were non collectors willing to camp overnight for a few hundred dollars and were hired to come to the ANA show by a Beverly Hills dealer who paid them just to get the "First Day" designation. They were not coin collectors - and there was almost a riot in the middle of the night, and they left all of their garbage all over the streets. Then the next day they were let into the show after all of that bad behavior.
And you think that is just like me, showing up at a regional show with my son, loupe in hand, looking at medals... because ???
Some people take things too seriously.. especially when even at leisure .. however a slight may occur .. Need to just move on .. say thanks to any dealers who you think were not nice ..leave it at that....If you are easily offended .. stay away from Coin Shows... This dealer event described was mild , to what I have seen at Coin shows .. Dealer owes no one his time ,attention ,if He doesn't want to ..Having a loupe ,GreySheet , whatever, No Matter .. If this event had escalated .. you could have easily been arrested .. not nice with kid in tow ..
I was profiled in 1985 at the Chevrolet house, I wanted to test drive a new corvette, no one would give me the time of day. I left and bought one across town. I think my intrest rate was 14 percent. This thread is not even that interesting to have over 100 replies but the other recent threads are not much better.
You can put in the group that does not buy the op's story 100 percent. It did not take me long to figure out the world is not always fair, some things are rigged, you do not have to deal with people you don't want to....
To me it is not worth arguing with a lowly coin dealer
The original poster has since said it was dinged up and beat up and below his standards so why waste time on it or the dealer and you missed the sign to top it off.
I would be interested in what you thought whinning to the show promoter was going to do for you? You want your money back? The dealer kicked out? A sign placed around his neck? What was the goal in doing that?
Mark NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!! working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
I was profiled in 1985 at the Chevrolet house, I wanted to test drive a new corvette, no one would give me the time of day. I left and bought one across town. I think my intrest rate was 14 percent. This thread is not even that interesting to have over 100 replies but the other recent threads are not much better.
You can put in the group that does not buy the op's story 100 percent. It did not take me long to figure out the world is not always fair, some things are rigged, you do not have to deal with people you don't want to....
To me it is not worth arguing with a lowly coin dealer
The original poster has since said it was dinged up and beat up and below his standards so why waste time on it or the dealer and you missed the sign to top it off.
I would be interested in what you thought whinning to the show promoter was going to do for you? You want your money back? The dealer kicked out? A sign placed around his neck? What was the goal in doing that?
Mark NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!! working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
Comments
Please read to the end as there is a monkey wrench here that I want to add to the discussion.
So many of the replies described similar experiences. That - plus 100 replies - means I struck a chord. Back in my early twenties, I went to a coin show and saw dealer after dealer mistreat some kids that were there looking for coins to fill holes in their Whitman folders. It was really bad - a room full of jerks. I left numismatics for almost 20 years because of it. Things are much better today and the great majority of dealers are wonderful to kids. But that experience came back to me when this happened. It pushed a big pet peeve button on an older, wiser, more experienced and outspoken version of me.
But what everyone said was great food for thought. Yes there are two sides of the story. I will stick by my decision to keep the dealer anonymous for the same reasons I stated. Plus it avoids a public pissing match here. And prevents strangers from trolling him (and why shouldn't I have all the fun?!)
Hindsight is 20/20, and after all of this input I might have done things differently. Under the circumstances though, being unexpectedly ambushed, I still think I managed well. There were many things happening at once, and I was caught off-guard and mostly concerned about the bad treatment to my son and to me in front of my son. And we just got there, excited (as we all are when we enter a coin show) and this was the first thing that happened only a minute or two later. I brought my son intentionally so he could enjoy the show, my focus was not on buying or me, but only on his experiencing a coin show. And it was absolutely off to a really bad start. I was balancing a lot of things as well as my impulses since my son was there.
There was nothing about my clothes to get that reaction - I was not wearing a sports coat, but I had on a "dressy" t-shirt and nice jeans. I wear a wedding ring and a Breitling watch. I wear reading glasses and had a loupe in my hand. I am certain I didn't look like someone who lives on the streets. It is a local show where everyone wears a t-shirt. I truly do not know if it was "racial" especially now that I have heard so many possibilities, including the fact that I could have been judged because there was a kid with me. But again, I felt it was racial, and two others thought the same independently. I can't read his mind. Bad behavior is bad whatever the motivation.
In terms of whining to the Show Manager, I probably would have done that regardless - especially because I was there with my son, and as far as I am concerned the dealer - every dealer - has an obligation to promote the hobby to sustain the future of coin collecting - and his bad behavior was directed to both me and an 8 year old kid who walked up to his table at a public show. The hobby rewards the dealer with profits - that is why he has a table there. it is his and every dealer's duty to support the future of numismatics. I am too much of an advocate now to let any dealer mistreat a kid and not complain. Especially my own kid. No apologies for that.
Now the monkey wrench. This dealer is also the manager/promoter/partner in two larger regional shows. His public face of numismatics is much greater than that one table. For me personally, I should have the right to go to any public show without being refused access or harassed for no reason. Everyone does. I can really let my imagination run wild over the kind of treatment he would allow, or even dish out at his own shows. Or to me personally He knows who I am, so could he refuse me entry into his shows? I am not stupid enough to bring my son, but then again, why should I need to make any adjustments to my fair access to a pubic event just because of my experience from the dealer/promoter's "profiling". Everyone "profiles", indeed, but a public event should not have that luxury - plus it hurts their clients, the dealers, by scaring away collectors.
Any thoughts about the fact that he is a show manager, and what, if anything I should do about it?
For now, I am going to go to his next show, no kid in tow, ignore him, go about my business, and not go to his table. Fortunately I will also arrive there this time with advice and insight from all of you.
It is many months away. I will report what happens then here.
And I do realize that in the big scheme of things like war and poverty, this doesn't really amount to a hill of beans. Still I am a numismatist/coin nerd, and indeed we are all a little "different" than regular folk. After 100 posts, no doubt the subject is still an important one to us.
I arrived to the show right at the opening of the show so I was one of the first in the door of the folks who did not have tables. When I saw that dealer's case w/ the medals, there was a very clear sign in the case right next to those medals saying they were for display only. That part seems to be missing from the OP's story. I guess it's possible the dealer only put that sign in the case after this alleged interaction w/ the OP, but all of this would have then had to have happened within the first 3-5 minutes of the show.
Even with that sign in the case, the medals were cool enough for me to ask him to confirm if the sign meant all of the medals in the case and the dealer politely confirmed that was the case. Even so, the dealer still offered to show them to me anyways and let me check them out in hand.
Michael Kittle Rare Coins --- 1908-S Indian Head Cent Grading Set --- No. 1 1909 Mint Set --- Kittlecoins on Facebook --- Long Beach Table 448
I was at the same show... saw that same dealer... and saw the same case of medals referred to by the OP.
I arrived to the show right at the opening of the show so I was one of the first in the door of the folks who did not have tables. When I saw that dealer's case w/ the medals, there was a very clear sign in the case right next to those medals saying they were for display only. That part seems to be missing from the OP's story. I guess it's possible the dealer only put that sign in the case after this alleged interaction w/ the OP, but all of this would have then had to have happened within the first 3-5 minutes of the show.
Even with that sign in the case, the medals were cool enough for me to ask him to confirm if the sign meant all of the medals in the case and the dealer politely confirmed that was the case. Even so, the dealer still offered to show them to me anyways and let me check them out in hand.
Yes there apparently was a sign. Never saw it. I wear reading glasses. I walked up and looked at the center medal closely then my son made his comments, then I was bombarded by the dealer. There could have been 30 medals in the case, and 10 signs. I looked at one medal, was insulted and attacked by the dealer, gave him a few words, and left. The sign is not part of my experience because the dealer did not want me there , so I didn't really have more than 3 seconds to look at the contents of the case. I was told about the sign by my friend, but he noticed it only after looking at the medals and asking the price and being told they were not for sale.
Yes I do know tbere were two medals in there I could identify. Because I am well familiar with them and they are the same medal one in silver the other in bronze. And the medals are large and easy to identify by the large legend. Right? Even within that short period. The answer to his question was as easy as reading the legend. That is how I knew he was being a jerk. And of course his harsh nasty get away from my table tone to me and my son. Looking through the offerings in his case was not something he would allow. There was nothing subtle about it. The existence of a sign does not have anything to do with what happened and the dealer's actions. After that I was looking at the dealer, not checking out his excting case. Did you see the incident? It was early in the show but probably an hour after opening.
Man, that is hilarious!!!
+1
I have a couple of books of Far Side comics, and I haven't seen that one.
Fits in perfectly with the OP's story.
I too am not sure you were racially profiled. But whether you were or were not, there is no excuse for that dealer's rudeness.
It is unfortunate that he didn't like you for whatever reason. That is his right, even if we think it is wrong.
Now let us know who it is, so we can either:
1- Ignore him ourselves.
2- Contact him and let him give his side.
3- Realize we don't know who it is, or even care at this point.
Man, that is hilarious!!!
+1
I have a couple of books of Far Side comics, and I haven't seen that one.
Fits in perfectly with the OP's story.
I too am not sure you were racially profiled. But whether you were or were not, there is no excuse for that dealer's rudeness.
I thought that I had every Far Side book. The Far Side was ingenious. Don't know how I missed that one but I love it.
Sorry about what happened to the O.P. Jerks. The world is full of them.
Link
Not bad, not bad at all.
But still, what were these medals? It sounds like these were 'stop traffic' kinds of medals, and I'd really like to know what they are. If that can be done without revealing an identity please tell us.
there are always details left out and another side that never gets told so it isn't good to rush to judgment.
Sadly, his interest only lasted a couple years at most. He then got caught up in numerous other issues that took over his life, and for the better. You can only try to help.
Now the monkey wrench. This dealer is also the manager/promoter/partner in two larger regional shows. His public face of numismatics is much greater than that one table. For me personally, I should have the right to go to any public show without being refused access or harassed for no reason. Everyone does. I can really let my imagination run wild over the kind of treatment he would allow, or even dish out at his own shows. Or to me personally He knows who I am, so could he refuse me entry into his shows?
Is it really a possibility that he would refuse you entrance to the next show or harass you? I wouldn't think so but there are collectors on here that have more knowledge about this than me.
Back in my early twenties, I went to a coin show and saw dealer after dealer mistreat some kids that were there looking for coins to fill holes in their Whitman folders. It was really bad - a room full of jerks. I left numismatics for almost 20 years because of it.
That is so unfortunate to read. When I went to shows as a kid (30-40 years ago) I remember being treated quite well. I don't recall many dealers spending time talking to me, but they were always willing to let me sit and go through album after album of lightly circulated wheat pennies and buffalo nickels which was all I could afford. Thank goodness I wasn't exposed to any jerks that would have no doubt soured my love for numismatics.
There's his side. There's your side. Then, there's the truth.
peacockcoins
I suppose that dealer/show promoter would have a different take on all of this over a beer and a couple of shots.
There's his side. There's your side. Then, there's the truth.
Showed this thread to my dealer friend .. who also worked with some of the bigger shows in Chicago area .. he stated the situation should have been remedied immediately at the show after fact BS hot air .... show dealers are independent business people .. some of whom spend weeks on the road making a living .. He counted at one show he alone, had over 300 personal contacts just from public show goers .. meaning don't expect a fresh face just because you a collector
It certainly is unfortunate that certain people still "profile" others in this day and age. However, I agree with Andy that the most effective response would have been for the OP to make is clear to the dealer that he was an expert in those medals, which may have made the dealer think twice about such "profiling".
Who was at the 2014 ANA Kennedy gold Show ?....the one where who knows what was bussed to show to grab Gold Kennedy from Mint.. you say profiling ???...some of those people on floor... made dealers very nervous
It certainly is unfortunate that certain people still "profile" others in this day and age. However, I agree with Andy that the most effective response would have been for the OP to make is clear to the dealer that he was an expert in those medals, which may have made the dealer think twice about such "profiling".
Who was at the 2014 ANA Kennedy gold Show ?....the one where who knows what was bussed to show to grab Gold Kennedy from Mint.. you say profiling ???...some of those people on floor... made dealers very nervous
That was a bit different. Those folks were non collectors willing to camp overnight for a few hundred dollars and were hired to come to the ANA show by a Beverly Hills dealer who paid them just to get the "First Day" designation. They were not coin collectors - and there was almost a riot in the middle of the night, and they left all of their garbage all over the streets. Then the next day they were let into the show after all of that bad behavior.
And you think that is just like me, showing up at a regional show with my son, loupe in hand, looking at medals... because ???
We have no idea what the dealer would say. God forbid if he was wearing a "Make America Great Again" hat while he repeated those vile , racist phrases!
1st world, comfy coin show BS. Grow the h*ll up.
Loves me some shiny!
Maybe he was checking my literacy?
Let me add that his example was not pristine like the image. His precious medal was darkly and unpleasantly tarnished and toned - this is why I needed reading glasses and needed to look closely to identify the medal. There were also numerous serious rim bumps, bad enough that I spotted them in the 3 seconds he let me look at it in the case. During those same 3 seconds, before I realized I was being verbally abused by the dealer and went into fight or flight mode, some of my numismatic brain cells had already concluded that the condition of the medal was substandard and far below the criteria for my collection.
There are versions of this medal dated 1850 and 1882. I did not have time to figure out which one either.
I am not being arrogant in this judgment. 80-90 % of the examples are in excellent condition as they were generally kept in felt lined boxes or stored away and not circulated like coins. His example was obviously dropped on some hard surface a few times and stored improperly so it was exposed to the elements to where it became darkly and harshly tarnished. His is an inferior example, possibly the worst example known.
At times over the years I've wished for a "rolled eyes" emoticon.
A dealer repeats a phrase a few times and he is a profiling racists? Wow. Stunning over reaction. And the replies! a microcosm of snowflake twitter mob keyboard outrage.
We have no idea what the dealer would say. God forbid if he was wearing a "Make America Great Again" hat while he repeated those vile , racist phrases!
1st world, comfy coin show BS. Grow the h*ll up.
Amen
It certainly is unfortunate that certain people still "profile" others in this day and age. However, I agree with Andy that the most effective response would have been for the OP to make is clear to the dealer that he was an expert in those medals, which may have made the dealer think twice about such "profiling".
Who was at the 2014 ANA Kennedy gold Show ?....the one where who knows what was bussed to show to grab Gold Kennedy from Mint.. you say profiling ???...some of those people on floor... made dealers very nervous
That was a bit different. Those folks were non collectors willing to camp overnight for a few hundred dollars and were hired to come to the ANA show by a Beverly Hills dealer who paid them just to get the "First Day" designation. They were not coin collectors - and there was almost a riot in the middle of the night, and they left all of their garbage all over the streets. Then the next day they were let into the show after all of that bad behavior.
And you think that is just like me, showing up at a regional show with my son, loupe in hand, looking at medals... because ???
Some people take things too seriously.. especially when even at leisure .. however a slight may occur .. Need to just move on .. say thanks to any dealers who you think were not nice ..leave it at that....If you are easily offended .. stay away from Coin Shows... This dealer event described was mild , to what I have seen at Coin shows .. Dealer owes no one his time ,attention ,if He doesn't want to ..Having a loupe ,GreySheet , whatever, No Matter .. If this event had escalated .. you could have easily been arrested .. not nice with kid in tow ..
You can put in the group that does not buy the op's story 100 percent. It did not take me long to figure out the world is not always fair, some things are rigged, you do not have to deal with people you don't want to....
To me it is not worth arguing with a lowly coin dealer
The original poster has since said it was dinged up and beat up and below his standards so why waste time on it or the dealer and you missed the sign to top it off.
I would be interested in what you thought whinning to the show promoter was going to do for you? You want your money back? The dealer kicked out? A sign placed around his neck? What was the goal in doing that?
NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!!
working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
RIP "BEAR"
You can put in the group that does not buy the op's story 100 percent. It did not take me long to figure out the world is not always fair, some things are rigged, you do not have to deal with people you don't want to....
To me it is not worth arguing with a lowly coin dealer
The original poster has since said it was dinged up and beat up and below his standards so why waste time on it or the dealer and you missed the sign to top it off.
I would be interested in what you thought whinning to the show promoter was going to do for you? You want your money back? The dealer kicked out? A sign placed around his neck? What was the goal in doing that?
NGC registry V-Nickel proof #6!!!!
working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
RIP "BEAR"