1909-s IHC You vs. PCGS

johnny54321 · July 16, 2014 12:14PM

PCGS certified. It is a beautiful coin and I plan to crack out for my album, and everything looks legit but I have not seen(or at least paid attention to) an IHC that is solid toned on the obverse side and has a woodgrain planchet texture on the reverse. You just hear stories about coins with mintmarks being spliced with a half of another obverse with the right date. I don't see evidence of any foul play, just want to make sure that it is not something to be concerned with. It is really a lovely coin in hand and a perfect fit for my album.

DMWJR · July 16, 2014 12:32PM

Don't see an obvious issue. Why do you question it?

acloco · July 16, 2014 12:35PM

I like this at AU55/58.

Couple of clicks on the obverse and a slight flattening on the reverse on the high devices.

VERY nice coin though.

crypto79 · July 16, 2014 12:43PM

nice AU53 but what is that at 8 on the Obv denticals? Their is a thin line between 53/45

ArizonaJack · July 16, 2014 12:46PM

Genuine

MsMorrisine · July 16, 2014 12:47PM

if you crack it and it is a splice job, then that'd seemingly justify a return even if cracked.

johnny54321 · July 16, 2014 12:49PM

The only reason I question it is because I don't recall seeing an IHC with 2 very different "textures" if you will to the planchet. It probably isn't an issue, and I probably have seen it and just not paid attention before. Also, the reverse is chalk full of cartwheel luster, while the obverse does not have noticeable luster, just a very even dark brown tone. The obverse and reverse just kind of look like different coins....both attractive but different.

Shamika · July 16, 2014 12:57PM

<< <i>The only reason I question it is because I don't recall seeing an IHC with 2 very different "textures" if you will to the planchet. It probably isn't an issue, and I probably have seen it and just not paid attention before. Also, the reverse is chalk full of cartwheel luster, while the obverse does not have noticeable luster, just a very even dark brown tone. The obverse and reverse just kind of look like different coins....both attractive but different. >>

The coin was probably in a coin board (see my signature line) or maybe a coin folder. These displays expose the obverse while protecting the reverse which may be why the reverse has luster and the obverse does not. I've seen this sort of obverse/reverse difference in coins that have resided in coin boards for decades.

crypto79 · July 16, 2014 12:57PM

<< <i>The only reason I question it is because I don't recall seeing an IHC with 2 very different "textures" if you will to the planchet. It probably isn't an issue, and I probably have seen it and just not paid attention before. Also, the reverse is chalk full of cartwheel luster, while the obverse does not have noticeable luster, just a very even dark brown tone. The obverse and reverse just kind of look like different coins....both attractive but different. >>

Open face albums have been known to have a two tone effect. Sheltered back with an exposed face but who knows

illini420 · July 16, 2014 1:07PM

Definitely an AU coin, but has a few minor issues which should keep it from getting AU58. I'd guess they gave it AU53/55. Not too bad.

ArizonaJack · July 16, 2014 1:35PM

Was curious as to your opinion, Michael. My thoughts went immediately onto rim damage , otherwise an obvious 55ish coin.

410a · July 16, 2014 1:42PM

Nice AU 55 coin and 08S ssss come with that woodgrain look. It's just the way it is. I got a book on this somewhere here. Anyway, Nice legit AU coin I'd buy it and put it in an album no problem.. I know it is an 09s. I know I said 08s which is typical.

DennisH · July 16, 2014 1:43PM

AU58

grote15 · July 16, 2014 1:45PM

I would grade it AU53. Reverse looks real nice, some hits on the obverse. The contrast does look odd between surfaces on both sides. Personally, I'd search for an example that looked more uniform.

Tookybandit · July 16, 2014 1:46PM

I'm bad at this ...but I'll go with AU53

Really nice one!

Bochiman · July 16, 2014 2:25PM

<< <i>if you crack it and it is a splice job, then that'd seemingly justify a return even if cracked. >>

The catch to that is, if you were the seller, how do you know that what someone is presenting you is the same coin that was in the holder, if cracked out?
Too many shady people would only be too willing to take advantage of a seller in that way, I believe; sadly.
You would have to be a seller who had top photos and key PUPs to tell that was the same coin and not someone trying to pull a fast one.

OldIndianNutKase · July 16, 2014 2:44PM

AU55. The small dings on the face will negate the coin's nice strike. You have the right idea to buy a certified coin and then crack it out for your album. This assures that with a scarce date it is not a fake and it will look way better in an album than in a slab.

OINK

tightbudget · July 16, 2014 2:48PM

I'm going to go with AU55.

I wouldn't worry a bit about this being one of those "spliced" coins. The mintmark seems right for an 09-S and I have seen Indians before with single-sided woodgrain toning so I'm not concerned there.

DMWJR · July 16, 2014 3:03PM

Me: 55
PCGS: 53

Elcontador · July 16, 2014 3:31PM

Need to see the coin. It's almost as if blue ribbon was put only on the obverse, which will keep a brown unc. an even glistening tone. Don't have a clue re the coin's eye appeal from the image. Also can't tell whether there is wear on the first three feather tips, or whether it's an incomplete strike.

CoinJunkie · July 16, 2014 3:53PM

When I joined this board roughly six years ago, I remember every other thread was about people
buying PCGS coins and cracking them out to put into their 7070s. This made zero sense to me
then, and makes even less sense to me now. But hey, it's your money.

Treashunt · July 16, 2014 7:23PM

so, what did it grade?

halfhunter · July 16, 2014 7:34PM

Anyone know what caused all the little "pimples" on the obverse . . . Rusted die, or?

HH

darktone · July 16, 2014 8:42PM

In the old days I would have called this XF45. It looks like there are little bubbles on obverse,

Walkerguy21D · July 16, 2014 9:43PM

AU55....I guess hypothetically it's possible someone spliced an 08S rev to pair with an 09P obv, but your talking about $200
in raw coins, plus time & labor, and figuring out how to hide the seam, then slabbing fees, to make a $600 coin.....the old trick was to put two coins into a Capitol plastics holder (that was thick enough to handle two coins) - much easier than splicing.

As an aside, I have an Unc 09P in my 7070 that has the same color on both sides as your reverse, save for a bright cherry red area on the
reverse. Someone told me they had a problem with planchet alloys in 1909, so you will see variations like that.

ambro51 · July 16, 2014 9:50PM

For some odd reason it's a coin which needs to be "explained" and I'm not sure I like that.

DMWJR · July 16, 2014 9:59PM

I think we are just answering his questions. The coin does not have to be explained if you collect IHC's. Look at my first post in this thread.

SamByrd · July 17, 2014 1:45AM

The coin is a textbook AU I think 55 , the look is great and a coin that is very much at home is a higher grade set.

SAM5969 · July 17, 2014 2:08AM

You have to remember:

A. The camera lens / closeup shot makes those marks look far worse that they are in hand
B. We are all expert graders from images .. right?

F117ASR · July 17, 2014 3:56AM

Nice coin. Don't know the series grades too well but looks like XF-45 to me. I always wanted one.

BillJones · July 17, 2014 4:00AM

It looks like a nice AU coin to me. I'd be concerned if the reverse was bright with the wood grain toning, but as it is, I don't see a problem. The sides look to be quite compatible.

UtahCoin · July 17, 2014 4:41AM

Looks AU55'ish to me.

WaterSport · July 17, 2014 7:51AM

Don't be fooled by the woodgrain. It can hide stuff and even make the coin look UNC. I see nicks on the rev just like the OBV.

WS

originalisbest · July 17, 2014 8:00AM

It's a nice coin. I think the style of photo with exaggerated sharpness emphasizes specks of dust and dings on the obv that they appear to be bubbles -- not really the case. Anyway, given the obvious rounded cheek and hair curl, with minimal wear, any Indians like this offered as XF-anything are quite the bargain!

Wabbit2313 · July 17, 2014 9:17AM

So the question is, are 2 halfs of 2 different coins joined together and PCGS graded it just fine? I laugh just reading that.

AMRC · July 17, 2014 12:13PM

<< <i>So the question is, are 2 halfs of 2 different coins joined together and PCGS graded it just fine? I laugh just reading that. >>

fivecents · July 17, 2014 12:31PM

XF45 mainly due to the obverse.

coppercoins · July 18, 2014 1:58AM

Not sure it means anything, but I have seen a number of Early Lincoln cents with strong planchet striations on one side and a normal brown appearance on the other side. I wouldn't let differing surface appearances allow me to believe the coin was anything but genuine.

johnny54321 · July 18, 2014 3:52AM

thanks guys. I realize it was unlikely that any funny business was going on with the coin....but with fake slabs out there, it doesnt hurt to ask just to be sure. PCGS graded it AU58. The marks are very minimal in hand, and the reverse has a ton of luster that I didnt capture too well.

originalisbest · July 18, 2014 4:21AM

Seems right as an AU58 to me. As to why people would crack out coins to put in an album -- for the fun of completing the album! Der.

It's not like doing so means you can't get them reslabbed in the future. The relative "risk" in doing this, depends on the coin, and grade in question.

johnny54321 · July 18, 2014 4:22AM

Yeah, the difference in value on the AU spectrum of this coin is very minimal. I dont plan to upgrade, as the coin has all the eye appeal I would need for a circ set like this.

1909-s IHC You vs. PCGS

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