I agree with Bochiman.... certainly should not be categorized with the major double dies.... it is different, in a very minor way - and for those who enjoy this facet of numismatics that is fine. It certainly should have a different term assigned - perhaps something technical to identify it with the process anomaly that caused it. Cheers, RickO
I like it...I believe you could find one with the naked eye under good lighting. My favorite part is the distortion of the 0 resulting in points on the inside circle at 8 and 2.
I normally don't do Die Varieties; I can see the difference in this 2014, but the first thought that pops in my head when I see the close-ups is:
"Thick as a Brick"
(by Jethro Tull)
Retired Collector & Dealer in Major Mint Error Coins & Currency since the 1960's.Co-Author of Whitman's "100 Greatest U.S. Mint Error Coins", and the Error Coin Encyclopedia, Vols., III & IV. Retired Authenticator for Major Mint Errors for PCGS. A 50+ Year PNG Member.A full-time numismatist since 1972, retired in 2022.
<< <i>ALL you Antiquerians, dare I say Republicans
LET IT GO........... THERE WON'T BE ANYMORE '55s, 69's, 72's or 95's >>
Do you still believe you can keep your doctor as well? You can't. No matter how much you try to pump what you want, and convince others, at the end of the day, the truth comes out. Not only are you not able to keep your doctor but this is NOT a MAJOR DDO.
I guess, for those that want to believe anything to help further their desires, then they will continue to believe anything. For those that appreciate truth and the real thing, then this isn't it. Single hubbing be damned....it is what it is, but it sure isn't major.
This really is a tough crowd. The OP has really been roasted here, and for what? Trying to introduce something "new?" Daring to call something like this "MAJOR?" Boy, isn't everyone entitled to an opinion anymore? He didn't discover this variety, and as far as I know, he doesn't OWN one either. So, how did he get accused of "pumping it up" and promoting it? At the very least, it is interesting, right guys? After the mint changed to single squeeze die production in 1996 (soon after the famous 1995 doubled die was produced) it was thought that doubled dies were impossible going forward. However, some very interesting varieties have cropped up, most notably in the Lincoln cent series: the 1997 doubled ear, 2004 doubled die reverse, 2006 doubled ear and doubled die obverse (which is similar in distortion to this variety) and the 2011 doubled die, which again shows very nice distortion on the entire date and motto. Last year, I discovered a nice one on the reverse of the 2013 shield cents, which shows the incuse design "cut away" and distorted, as well as the designer initials offset. If you care to look it up, Wexler has assigned it as 2013 WDDR-002, but WARNING! It's nothing major. Sure, none of these varieties compare to the 1955 doubled die. That is the king, and as a wise man once said,"It's good to be the king." Nothing that dramatic is escaping the mint. Even in 1955, the mistake was caught, and the shift manager simply let them go into circulation instead of melting them down. Most people commenting in this thread don't care about the error/variety area of the hobby, and that's ok. It's a small niche. But let me assure you that among our small circle of cent searchers (SCCS), that this is indeed a very nice doubled die. I don't own one, and it is not my auction linked in this thread. But, I expect it to bring a decent premium. Another thing to note, is how we perceive varieties in general. A short while back, members were tripping over each other to celebrate another member's find of the "Scarface" Morgan dollar that was cherrypicked and auctioned off for upwards of $10,000. I, too joined in congratulating the member on a fine cherrypick. But, in the end this is a die crack, no? So why is it MAJOR? Because of its age? Because it has a sexy name and it is a part of the coveted Morgan dollar series which carries a VAM number? The price tag? More likely than not, it's because you can SEE IT AT ARM'S LENGTH! However, if you blew up this tiny cent to the size of a Morgan dollar, trust me you would have a similar wow factor. All things considered, we are comparing grapes to grapefruits.
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
All collectors have different focus. It's not like the biggest doubled dies from before "single squeeze" but still, it's very thick and distorted. I'd get excited if I found one of this variety even if my friends yawned when I showed it.
<< <i>The OP has really been roasted here, and for what? Trying to introduce something "new?" Daring to call something like this "MAJOR?" >>
I can't speak for anybody else, but my posts were not directed at the OP for trying or daring anything.
<< <i>Boy, isn't everyone entitled to an opinion anymore? >>
Sure they are. Even those who disagree with the OP as to what constitutes a major error, I presume?
<< <i>He didn't discover this variety, and as far as I know, he doesn't OWN one either. So, how did he get accused of "pumping it up" and promoting it? >>
This might have something to do with that: "You CAN'T further the hobby by staying in the past." I can see where "furthering the hobby" could be interpreted as promotion.
<< <i>At the very least, it is interesting, right guys? >>
"At the very least"? What do you mean? Are you saying it's not major?
<< <i>This really is a tough crowd. The OP has really been roasted here, and for what? Trying to introduce something "new?" Daring to call something like this "MAJOR?" >>
<< <i> But let me assure you that among our small circle of cent searchers (SCCS), that this is indeed a very nice doubled die. >>
Thank you DWC. It's not my article or my listing
<< <i>to be honest I just don't see it. >>
Are you blind?.............or you just don't wanna see it because the article said "MAJOR"?
I think it is a cool find and it should be listed in the Cherrypicker's Guide as well as given a PCGS listing. It is a "Major find", but not a Major doubled die variety, if you catch the difference.
<< <i>For those saying this is nerdy, how is this different than variety collecting in general, say VAMs? >>
Or "Small & Large Dates"? >>
Or die states?
Nerdy is a relative thing. Fact is, anyone who is passionate about something not in the main stream is nerdy. Additional fact, any member of this forum is a nerd.
Can you post a picture of the two dates that were not taken with an electron microscope? More seriously, I was attracted to collecting by the 1960 small date cent. I could easily see the difference between a large data and a small date with my unaided eyes. I really doubt I'd be able to see the difference in the two dates for this coin with my (glasses-aided) eyes unless I magnified the dates with a reasonably strong glass. That fact severely lessens--indeed, totally eliminates--any interest I might otherwise have.
<< <i>I think it is a cool find and it should be listed in the Cherrypicker's Guide as well as given a PCGS listing. It is a "Major find", but not a Major doubled die variety, if you catch the difference. >>
Good distinction, Rick. I would agree. I wouldn't argue a hair about it being in the CPG or given a PCGS listing (it's not as if it's a 'speared bison' thingie), and I would agree it could be considered a major find. It would end there though.
Will this be forever listed as one of the greatest error finds in history? No.
Is it a cool error to keep an eye out for? Certainly is! Congrats to whoever discovered it.
Now let's see what the market as a whole has to say when these start coming out graded by PCGS/NGC/ANACS in regards to price (that'll tell us how much the market really cares).
WTB: Eric Plunk cards, jersey (signed or unsigned), and autographs. Basically anything related to him
I don't appreciate getting YELLED at and being what told to appreciate!!!!
You lose a little credibility when telling some of the forumites, who are the most minutely detailed obsessed people there are, to BROADEN THEIR HORIZONS!!!!!!
Carry on.
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
I just remembered from some years back, a " double dot " Cent. A little research tells me it was a 1965 Cent. Will this new find be as exciting as the 1965 Double Dot?
<< <i>There are much better DDO, for the shield cent series, then this 1, thats for sure >>
Can youprovide a link to pictures?
Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
I like it. It would be easy to pick out with a 10x loupe. Makes me want to get a few rolls and have some fun looking. Major or minor? Who cares, it's something you can have fun searching for on the cheap so it's all good to me.
Comments
<< <i>As minor or major as it appears, this example is already off to a good start. Let's see where it lands a week from now. >>
Linkaroo
Is there still time to submit one for a First Strike?
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
Major - I don't think so, but certainly fun.
<< <i>Calling it a "main squeeze" would allow room mentally for other squeezes and maybe even a bounce or two. >>
Precisely , and well put from "OUR" introspective thought processes. This is a helluva think tank.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
<< <i>Hardly major. >>
Expand your horizons !!!
This IS MAJOR for SINGLE SQUEEZE die production.
You CAN'T further the hobby by staying in the past.
60 years into this hobby and I'm still working on my Lincoln set!
LET IT GO........... THERE WON'T BE ANYMORE '55s, 69's, 72's or 95's
<< <i>Jason Cuvelier was my high school painting teacher >>
It all comes into focus now!
<< <i>ALL you Antiquerians, dare I say Republicans
LET IT GO........... THERE WON'T BE ANYMORE '55s, 69's, 72's or 95's >>
As opposed to furthering the hobby by trying to pump up minor varieties as if they are significant...?
It's technically a DDO but not "major" in any sense of the word, single squeeze or not.
RIP Mom- 1932-2012
But to each his own.
Lance.
I can see the difference in this 2014,
but the first thought that pops in my
head when I see the close-ups is:
"Thick as a Brick"
(by Jethro Tull)
<< <i>ALL you Antiquerians, dare I say Republicans
LET IT GO........... THERE WON'T BE ANYMORE '55s, 69's, 72's or 95's >>
Do you still believe you can keep your doctor as well? You can't.
No matter how much you try to pump what you want, and convince others, at the end of the day, the truth comes out. Not only are you not able to keep your doctor but this is NOT a MAJOR DDO.
I guess, for those that want to believe anything to help further their desires, then they will continue to believe anything. For those that appreciate truth and the real thing, then this isn't it. Single hubbing be damned....it is what it is, but it sure isn't major.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
<< <i>This IS MAJOR for SINGLE SQUEEZE die production. >>
If you have to qualify "major" by adding "for single squeeze die production", is it really major?
<< <i>You CAN'T further the hobby by staying in the past. >>
IMO, forging into the future with hype isn't going to be helping much, either.
World Collection
British Collection
German States Collection
I think if it were a Class 1 it would be considered a Major discovery, not a Class 9. That's pretty far down the food chain.
- Bob -
MPL's - Lincolns of Color
Central Valley Roosevelts
The OP has really been roasted here, and for what? Trying to introduce something "new?" Daring to call something like this "MAJOR?" Boy, isn't everyone entitled to an opinion anymore?
He didn't discover this variety, and as far as I know, he doesn't OWN one either. So, how did he get accused of "pumping it up" and promoting it? At the very least, it is interesting, right guys?
After the mint changed to single squeeze die production in 1996 (soon after the famous 1995 doubled die was produced) it was thought that doubled dies were impossible going forward. However, some very interesting varieties have cropped up, most notably in the Lincoln cent series: the 1997 doubled ear, 2004 doubled die reverse, 2006 doubled ear and doubled die obverse (which is similar in distortion to this variety) and the 2011 doubled die, which again shows very nice distortion on the entire date and motto. Last year, I discovered a nice one on the reverse of the 2013 shield cents, which shows the incuse design "cut away" and distorted, as well as the designer initials offset. If you care to look it up, Wexler has assigned it as 2013 WDDR-002, but WARNING! It's nothing major.
Sure, none of these varieties compare to the 1955 doubled die. That is the king, and as a wise man once said,"It's good to be the king." Nothing that dramatic is escaping the mint. Even in 1955, the mistake was caught, and the shift manager simply let them go into circulation instead of melting them down. Most people commenting in this thread don't care about the error/variety area of the hobby, and that's ok. It's a small niche. But let me assure you that among our small circle of cent searchers (SCCS), that this is indeed a very nice doubled die. I don't own one, and it is not my auction linked in this thread. But, I expect it to bring a decent premium.
Another thing to note, is how we perceive varieties in general. A short while back, members were tripping over each other to celebrate another member's find of the "Scarface" Morgan dollar that was cherrypicked and auctioned off for upwards of $10,000. I, too joined in congratulating the member on a fine cherrypick. But, in the end this is a die crack, no? So why is it MAJOR? Because of its age? Because it has a sexy name and it is a part of the coveted Morgan dollar series which carries a VAM number? The price tag? More likely than not, it's because you can SEE IT AT ARM'S LENGTH! However, if you blew up this tiny cent to the size of a Morgan dollar, trust me you would have a similar wow factor.
All things considered, we are comparing grapes to grapefruits.
Dead Cat Waltz Exonumia
"Coin collecting for outcasts..."
Is a pump n dump mentality behind all this excitment ?
All collectors have different focus.
It's not like the biggest doubled dies from before "single squeeze" but still, it's very thick and distorted.
I'd get excited if I found one of this variety even if my friends yawned when I showed it.
Happy collecting
<< <i>The OP has really been roasted here, and for what? Trying to introduce something "new?" Daring to call something like this "MAJOR?" >>
I can't speak for anybody else, but my posts were not directed at the OP for trying or daring anything.
<< <i>Boy, isn't everyone entitled to an opinion anymore? >>
Sure they are. Even those who disagree with the OP as to what constitutes a major error, I presume?
<< <i>He didn't discover this variety, and as far as I know, he doesn't OWN one either. So, how did he get accused of "pumping it up" and promoting it? >>
This might have something to do with that: "You CAN'T further the hobby by staying in the past." I can see where "furthering the hobby" could be interpreted as promotion.
<< <i>At the very least, it is interesting, right guys? >>
"At the very least"? What do you mean? Are you saying it's not major?
<< <i>This really is a tough crowd. The OP has really been roasted here, and for what? Trying to introduce something "new?" Daring to call something like this "MAJOR?" >>
<< <i> But let me assure you that among our small circle of cent searchers (SCCS), that this is indeed a very nice doubled die. >>
Thank you DWC. It's not my article or my listing
<< <i>to be honest I just don't see it. >>
Are you blind?.............or you just don't wanna see it because the article said "MAJOR"?
<< <i>No matter how much you try to pump what you want, and convince others, at the end of the day, the truth comes out. >>
I didn't write the article, describe or submit the coin, or list it for sale.
So, my motive??................Only to further the discussion on MODERN SINGLE SQUEEZE DOUBLED DIES.
Broaden your horizons people .............
Distorted or Doubled; it's a darn good MAJOR variety !!!!
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
<< <i>
<< <i>For those saying this is nerdy, how is this different than variety collecting in general, say VAMs? >>
Or "Small & Large Dates"? >>
Or die states?
Nerdy is a relative thing. Fact is, anyone who is passionate about something not in the main stream is nerdy. Additional fact, any member of this forum is a nerd.
Can you post a picture of the two dates that were not taken with an electron microscope?
--------T O M---------
-------------------------
<< <i>I think it is a cool find and it should be listed in the Cherrypicker's Guide as well as given a PCGS listing. It is a "Major find", but not a Major doubled die variety, if you catch the difference. >>
Good distinction, Rick.
I would agree. I wouldn't argue a hair about it being in the CPG or given a PCGS listing (it's not as if it's a 'speared bison' thingie), and I would agree it could be considered a major find. It would end there though.
I've been told I tolerate fools poorly...that may explain things if I have a problem with you. Current ebay items - Nothing at the moment
Is it a cool error to keep an eye out for? Certainly is! Congrats to whoever discovered it.
Now let's see what the market as a whole has to say when these start coming out graded by PCGS/NGC/ANACS in regards to price (that'll tell us how much the market really cares).
Positive BST: WhiteThunder (x2), Ajaan, onefasttalon, mirabela, Wizard1, cucamongacoin, mccardguy1
Negative BST: NONE!
<< <i>I think "thin date" and "thick date" would be more descriptive of the visual differences between the two coins. >>
full agree. thick and thin date is a good understandable description to use to help people distinguish between this and a normal date.
i like that each numeral has pick up points to distinguish it from the normal date.
OP: THANK YOU FOR SHARING!
Now i have something else to look for!
But I find their dedication incredible and for their efforts I salute them:
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
?????......................I didn't write the article, describe or submit the coin, or list it for sale.
So, my motive??................Only to further the discussion on MODERN SINGLE SQUEEZE DOUBLED DIES.
Broaden your horizons people .............
Distorted or Doubled; it's a darn good MAJOR variety !!!!
I think it is tough for most to broaden their horizon when you are talking about a 2014 penny in 2014. I just tried, and it didn't work.
I don't appreciate getting YELLED at and being what told to appreciate!!!!
You lose a little credibility when telling some of the forumites, who are the most minutely detailed obsessed people there are, to BROADEN THEIR HORIZONS!!!!!!
Carry on.
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress
this new find be as exciting as the 1965 Double Dot?
major? No.
Interesting? yes.
<< <i>There are much better DDO, for the shield cent series, then this 1, thats for sure >>
Can youprovide a link to pictures?
Cheers,
Bob
<< <i>Most of us do not have access to an SEM to search for errors and varieties at the molecular level.
Cheers,
Bob >>