1794 One Cent
JackE
Posts: 6 ✭
Hi, new guy here. I am considering a trade for this coin and wanted to post some images to see what people thought about this coin's attributes. I haven't really ever been interested in old copper before I started reading this forum and seeing how vast the varieties are and how detailed the knowledge is about large cents and half cents.
The images are from a cell phone so I hope they are ok.
As you can see, it's pretty rough, but I don't have a US coin from that century.
Thanks,
Jack E.
4
Comments
Well it's genuine and the die break through the date will ID the variety. Offhand I'd say S-44 due to die break on the rev also. Guess it depends on the trade.
It has problems but if the price was right it would be a great pickup.
...and one day for sure, that obverse field will get "smoothed" to increase its eye appeal.
The quality of the copper is decent, and it is sharp enough to know exactly what it. I don’t care for the graffiti in the right obverse field, but something is almost always wrong with these early coppers.
The reverse is incomplete which par of the course on these coins. The 1794 large cent I owned as a young collector had a fairly sharp obverse and a virtually smooth, blank reverse. The lettering was in low relief, and the coin did not have an upset rim to protect the reverse wording. I’ll post a picture of an AU 1794 cent if you like. You will see what I mean.
As the Insider said, it all depends upon what you have to give up to get it.
Thank you for the responses. I searched S-44 and it sure looks to match those images. It has a nicer brown color than the photos show.
I don't know how much it's worth. Grey sheet says $225 for AG, which is way more than I would pay.The person that has it doesn't care much for it so I won't have to trade a lot. Probably a couple of nice AU common Indian cents will do it.
Bill Jones - I would like to see the picture. Thanks.
Is that W W or M&M. Cool coin in any state of condition. True 100% early Americana, really cool
Welcome to the boards from a fellow large cent collector.
A problem coin that you should avoid.
@JackE said: "The person that has it doesn't care much for it so I won't have to trade a lot. Probably a couple of nice AU common Indian cents will do it.
MAKE THE TRADE YESTERDAY! He will probably appreciate some whizzed "red" Indians.
Welcome Jack! Strong obverse details, but not a fan of the graffiti.
If you get this one and like it, you might be compelled to upgrade sometime in the future!
So let me get this straight, you would not trade a few "common" AU Indians for that thing which will eventually get repaired? Lot's of history to carry around as a show & tell.
The Liberty Cap large cents are a classic design; too bad about the scratches, though.
If your main goal is to get a US coin from the 1700s,
a 1797 draped bust cent is a lot cheaper and probably easier to find.
PCGS Price guide for a 1797 in G-4 is $145.
Every coin has it's "right" price.....
And I have no idea what that is for this coin.
"Problem coins" are always a crap shoot, unless you deal with them all the time. (Maybe someone in the know here has a number to throw out).
I'm usually way low when I guess....
Sometimes cheap is not cheap enough.
Beauty...eye....beholder....nuff said.
Honest wear and copper cut marks (to confirm if the copper is real?) from back in the day when these were widdled to be used for gears and such.
You can take your pick as to what the grade of this coin is. At any rate you can see that the reverse lettering is in low relief and was very prone to wear while in circulation.
As to the grade, PCGS called it MS-62, Brown, The EAC grade, at least in the Breen Encyclopedia, is AU-50. An ANA oriented grading class, called it “EF, I hate it.” (Boy, would I like to buy from them if they price coins the same way as they grade them!) My grade is AU-58.
For those who wish to place this piece in the condition census, this is the Byron Reed, Dan Holmes, S-21. Unfortunately the Breen book has the obverse photo of the wrong variety in its text.
I asked your permission to post the picture, but some people view it as bad form to post pictures of a coin that detracts from the interest in the opening post.
GORGEOUS COIN.
I would literally whittle my collection down to that one single coin.
Thank you!
I like it too. I find it interesting that an elegant looking coin like this was just a Cent in 1794.
I was picking up some eighteenth century coins and have noticed the supply is much lower and more expensive because the coin is pre 1800. Even the problem large cents command a premium because of this.
For the equivalent of about $50 as you indicated, jump on it. You can easily trade out of it later. I wouldn’t say that for many coins with those scratches but even the worst 94 large cents seem to bring >$100.
I remember I was at at a coin shop in Delaware many years ago. The owner asked me about I wanted to buy, and I told him. The list included a few pre-1800 pieces. "We don't have any pre-1800 coins," he replied. He spoke of those coins with such reverence that I gained a new insight into how important they were to some collectors.
IT is a 1794
BHNC #203
I don't like the graffiti but I'd probably still trade for it
BHNC #203
Why not make the trade? The risk/reward (happiness) trade off is in your favor. Seems to me there is not much of a downside.
"Got a flaming heart, can't get my fill"
Having owned both, I can tell you that the 1794 is a lot more interesting. The most available pre-1800 large cent date is the 1798 although none of them are readily available these days. It took me a while to locate this one, although I must admit that it was not at the top of my list when I found it.
This one is graded PCGS AU-53, CAC.
When I was a young collector I desperately wanted a US coun from the 1700s, so I saved up for a 1798 cent from my local coin shop.
It sounds like that 1794 is cheap enough so I'd trade for it and figure it out later. If you can upgrade later you will break even or make money on this one.
Welcome to the forum @jacke
I would certainly trade a few Indians for that, but you have to decide for yourself.
I'm glad you reached out to the members here.................there are a lot of friendly, educated coin guys here willing to share their opinions freely.
Let us know how you make out.
Successful transactions with : MICHAELDIXON, Manorcourtman, Bochiman, bolivarshagnasty, AUandAG, onlyroosies, chumley, Weiss, jdimmick, BAJJERFAN, gene1978, TJM965, Smittys, GRANDAM, JTHawaii, mainejoe, softparade, derryb
Bad transactions with : nobody to date
Beautiful coin!
By discussing all the assigned grades, members can see the subjectivity of grading. Hope to read others comments and my guess is the OP will also enjoy your coin as one day, when he can afford one like this, he may be able to make a decision on what to purchase.
Technically, the coin is a Choice AU-58. In a grading class, that means it has a slight amount of loss of surface luster on the high parts evidenced by a change of color to dark brown. Strike weakness does not look like this. The coin is "Choice" because there are virtually no marks on it.
Commercially, I believe it is correctly graded. MS-62's and some 63's have this amount of rub. I think it would have graded MS-63 if not for the patch of red corrosion on the neck and the possible "corrosion spot removal" at 5 o'clock.
I consider much of EAC grading to be "Folly." AU-50 = "typical." THERE IS NOTHING TYPICAL about this beautiful cent! I expect EAC has "NET" graded it to AU-50 due to the red patches, die rust, and tiny clip.
As for EF, whoever called the coin EF in a ANA grading class is an idiot and should be banned from teaching until he/she takes a few grading classes!
Go for it.
The coolness factor far outweighs the negatives.
It is like buying a 1960's muscle car. Some want them "perfect original" Others want them with a hole cut in hood for the high rise Edelbrock Intake, Big 8K Sun tach on the dash, Hurst Shifter, and US Indy mags all around with Gabriel HiJackers on the back.
One is a nice toy, one is a toy that has been played with and lived life in the, literally, fast lane.
Go for it.
Since we're sharing, here's my 1794. It's far-FAR from Bill Jones' example, but it still makes me smile. While heavily corroded, the corrosion is so even it almost gives a matte finish look to it.
Should one buy a Buffalo Nickel, or Lincoln Cent, or even a Seated Quarter in this condition? Guess it depends on your budget, but most would say "Heck no". Waste of time and money when acceptable examples exist in great numbers. But contrary to some comments in this thread, I think there is room in a collection for an "imperfect" classic coin that you wouldn't otherwise be able to afford. (As always....don't overpay!)
Pardon the small pictures, but that's all I have access to at the moment. I bought it raw, as shown here, but it now resides in a "Fine Details, Corroded" PCGS holder.
Added: To the question of value, for my own tracking purposes, I've been treating this as a G-4. That may be over-valuing, or under-valuing it, I really don't know....but I guess the only way to tell for sure would be to SELL it? And I'm not ready for that just yet....
Nothing wrong with that one, Tommy- I have 3-4 similar to that one myself. My high grade example is a genny XF with most of the minor issues on the reverse.
Awesome coin!!
- Bob -
MPL's - Lincolns of Color
Central Valley Roosevelts
Here was a 1794 cent I owned before I acquired a 1795 cent for the type. This one did not grade when I submitted to either PCGS or NGC. I forget which one. It has been smoothed a bit, but it has good eye appeal. I sold this one years ago.
To clarify, perhaps I should have phrased it as:
"a 1797 draped bust cent is a lot cheaper and probably easier to find than this 1794."
Thank you everyone that contributed to this thread. I traded two AU Indian cents (1900 & 1907) that were attractive coins with a little red still showing. I got this coin, an 1817 large cent that has decent details but is very corroded, and an 1849 large cent with a nice chocolate color that I like for my Indians. The 1817 cent has a big old die crack on the reverse that I couldn't match up with the Newcomb varieties on the coinfacts web site.
I don't care about the coin's problems. It is amazing to me that I'm holding a coin that was produced within the first couple of years of the founding of the mint. I'm happy to be its caretaker for a while.
I think I'm smitten with these old coppers. And, there is a big coin show in Chattanooga tomorrow to search.
Bill Jones: Thank you for sharing your photos of your amazing coin!
Jack E.
You probably found this website, but there are collectors who specialize in only the 1794 cents:
http://www.1794largecents.com/1794/
Pacific Northwest Numismatic Association
@JackE .... Welcome aboard.... I believe you did very well on your trade... Yes the '94 has some problems... however, they do not come around very often and just to have one is a great pleasure. Hope to see more of you around the forum... Cheers, RickO
agreed
BHNC #203
Bill's chocolate brown example has a lot of eye appeal.