@BillJones said:
These interest rates have been terrible for retirees who are living on the edge and take risks connected with the stock market. I'm not one of those people, but I understand what they are facing.
Agree. Hurts retirees, savers and those with risk aversion
m
I don't understand. There are inflation adjusted T-bills that retirees can invest in that will hold up against inflation. Unless exceptionally wealthy, most investment planners don't recommend riskier investments anyway at that age.
It's really this simple.
Let's say you are a retiree with $100,000 in the bank. I had a widowed "aunt-in-law" who was in this position. In the old days, when an interest rate of 4 to 5 percent was not unusual, she would get $4,000 to $5,000 in interest income. That added to $15,000 in Social Security and a tiny pension give her a little over $20,000 a year.
Now with interest rates at 0.3% or so, she would get $300 a year instead of 4 or 5 thousand. That's big cut in income.
The "ivory towner" economists are mostly interested in “the real interest rates” which are the nominal rate less the rate of inflation. Yes that means something to a retiree in the long run, if they live that long, but the short term income stream is more important to many of them.
Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
@BillJones said:
These interest rates have been terrible for retirees who are living on the edge and take risks connected with the stock market. I'm not one of those people, but I understand what they are facing.
Agree. Hurts retirees, savers and those with risk aversion
m
I don't understand. There are inflation adjusted T-bills that retirees can invest in that will hold up against inflation. Unless exceptionally wealthy, most investment planners don't recommend riskier investments anyway at that age.
Show me a product that pays 4-6% interest with no risk to principle. That's what banks and money markets used to achieve. Agree, retirees shouldn't be in risky investments. That's why they are screwed. Where are they going to go to have their money work for them in this low interest environment? That's why they are being " punished".
m
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Tough question for me. I guess I'd have to opt for BUYER though as I will continue searching great designs on the darkside.
Since CAC has (rightly or wrongly) sent me out of the US coin arena, my BUYING will be extremely curtailed.
However, I'm having fun finding esthetic examples of world coins. On that, I will continue to be a buyer.
@BillJones said:
These interest rates have been terrible for retirees who are living on the edge and take risks connected with the stock market. I'm not one of those people, but I understand what they are facing.
Agree. Hurts retirees, savers and those with risk aversion
m
I don't understand. There are inflation adjusted T-bills that retirees can invest in that will hold up against inflation. Unless exceptionally wealthy, most investment planners don't recommend riskier investments anyway at that age.
Show me a product that pays 4-6% interest with no risk to principle. That's what banks and money markets used to achieve. Agree, retirees shouldn't be in risky investments. That's why they are screwed. Where are they going to go to have their money work for them in this low interest environment? That's why they are being " punished".
m
This is what I had in mind: https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/products/prod_tips_glance.htm. The payouts are adjusted on the basis of the Consumer Price Index. It goes up with inflation. True enough, during deflation, the principal is adversely affected so it doesn't strictly meet your criteria. With that said, with the fed churning out billions of dollars of new bills each year and the federal reserve bank hell bent on 2% inflation per year, I thought it was a safer bet.
@BillJones said:
These interest rates have been terrible for retirees who are living on the edge and take risks connected with the stock market. I'm not one of those people, but I understand what they are facing.
Agree. Hurts retirees, savers and those with risk aversion
m
I don't understand. There are inflation adjusted T-bills that retirees can invest in that will hold up against inflation. Unless exceptionally wealthy, most investment planners don't recommend riskier investments anyway at that age.
Show me a product that pays 4-6% interest with no risk to principle. That's what banks and money markets used to achieve. Agree, retirees shouldn't be in risky investments. That's why they are screwed. Where are they going to go to have their money work for them in this low interest environment? That's why they are being " punished".
m
This is what I had in mind: https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/products/prod_tips_glance.htm. The payouts are adjusted on the basis of the Consumer Price Index. It goes up with inflation. True enough, during deflation, the principal is adversely affected so it doesn't strictly meet your criteria. With that said, with the fed churning out billions of dollars of new bills each year and the federal reserve bank hell bent on 2% inflation per year, I thought it was a safer bet.
Problem is that TIPS don't throw off much interest in a deflationary cycle like we were in. Seniors as Bill alluded to can't count on this for supplemental income as in the past. TIPS. Have their place but are best served for principal preservation and not income
mark
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I plan to trim slabs down to two boxes of twenty, raw coins maybe fill another short 2x2 box. Will try and use funds to fill / upgrade said boxes and slowly fill a 20th century Capital holder (last set was a Whitman folder)
By coin count - net sell
Dollar amount - buyer
Which opportunities present themselves will ultimately decide which way it goes. Its just a hobby and I'm having fun!
@BillJones said:
These interest rates have been terrible for retirees who are living on the edge and take risks connected with the stock market. I'm not one of those people, but I understand what they are facing.
Agree. Hurts retirees, savers and those with risk aversion
m
I don't understand. There are inflation adjusted T-bills that retirees can invest in that will hold up against inflation. Unless exceptionally wealthy, most investment planners don't recommend riskier investments anyway at that age.
Show me a product that pays 4-6% interest with no risk to principle. That's what banks and money markets used to achieve. Agree, retirees shouldn't be in risky investments. That's why they are screwed. Where are they going to go to have their money work for them in this low interest environment? That's why they are being " punished".
m
This is what I had in mind: https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/products/prod_tips_glance.htm. The payouts are adjusted on the basis of the Consumer Price Index. It goes up with inflation. True enough, during deflation, the principal is adversely affected so it doesn't strictly meet your criteria. With that said, with the fed churning out billions of dollars of new bills each year and the federal reserve bank hell bent on 2% inflation per year, I thought it was a safer bet.
Problem is that TIPS don't throw off much interest in a deflationary cycle like we were in. Seniors as Bill alluded to can't count on this for supplemental income as in the past. TIPS. Have their place but are best served for principal preservation and not income
mark
You two are absolutely correct. My original post (as someone younger looking longer term) was geared towards the preservation of the value of the principal. I didn't think about living off the interest. That is an interesting idea, but one that always puts you at the mercy on the markets. Thank you and Bill for giving me another perspective.
Comments
It's really this simple.
Let's say you are a retiree with $100,000 in the bank. I had a widowed "aunt-in-law" who was in this position. In the old days, when an interest rate of 4 to 5 percent was not unusual, she would get $4,000 to $5,000 in interest income. That added to $15,000 in Social Security and a tiny pension give her a little over $20,000 a year.
Now with interest rates at 0.3% or so, she would get $300 a year instead of 4 or 5 thousand. That's big cut in income.
The "ivory towner" economists are mostly interested in “the real interest rates” which are the nominal rate less the rate of inflation. Yes that means something to a retiree in the long run, if they live that long, but the short term income stream is more important to many of them.
As always... buyer..... Though my buying rate has slowed some....No sales.... so even buying one coin would make me a net buyer...
Cheers, RickO
yes, I am looking to sell raw for holders
Best place to buy !
Bronze Associate member
As Ben Franklin might have said: "Neither a buyer or seller be."
Show me a product that pays 4-6% interest with no risk to principle. That's what banks and money markets used to achieve. Agree, retirees shouldn't be in risky investments. That's why they are screwed. Where are they going to go to have their money work for them in this low interest environment? That's why they are being " punished".
m
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
Tough question for me. I guess I'd have to opt for BUYER though as I will continue searching great designs on the darkside.
Since CAC has (rightly or wrongly) sent me out of the US coin arena, my BUYING will be extremely curtailed.
However, I'm having fun finding esthetic examples of world coins. On that, I will continue to be a buyer.
This is what I had in mind: https://www.treasurydirect.gov/indiv/products/prod_tips_glance.htm. The payouts are adjusted on the basis of the Consumer Price Index. It goes up with inflation. True enough, during deflation, the principal is adversely affected so it doesn't strictly meet your criteria. With that said, with the fed churning out billions of dollars of new bills each year and the federal reserve bank hell bent on 2% inflation per year, I thought it was a safer bet.
Problem is that TIPS don't throw off much interest in a deflationary cycle like we were in. Seniors as Bill alluded to can't count on this for supplemental income as in the past. TIPS. Have their place but are best served for principal preservation and not income
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I plan to trim slabs down to two boxes of twenty, raw coins maybe fill another short 2x2 box. Will try and use funds to fill / upgrade said boxes and slowly fill a 20th century Capital holder (last set was a Whitman folder)
By coin count - net sell
Dollar amount - buyer
Which opportunities present themselves will ultimately decide which way it goes. Its just a hobby and I'm having fun!
Buy, if I can find what I need.
You two are absolutely correct. My original post (as someone younger looking longer term) was geared towards the preservation of the value of the principal. I didn't think about living off the interest. That is an interesting idea, but one that always puts you at the mercy on the markets. Thank you and Bill for giving me another perspective.
Buyer
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
I am not selling anything this coming year. I've been a serious buyer since 2005 and I don't expect that to change in 2018.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/