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Money Order or Bust

I recently had a transaction go south due to money orders.

Buyer asked about a coin. I provided a price for Paypal. Buyer asked to use money order instead.

I wrote back asking if the buyer would consider any other common forms of electronic payment (venmo, popmoney, zelle, etc.)

Buyer responded with, "I'll pass." Fair enough...

I'm just curious how common this type of "money order or bust" behavior is in the numismatic community? Also, what are the reasons a buyer would want to exclusively use money orders?

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    ECHOESECHOES Posts: 2,974 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 10, 2017 6:31PM

    May have been me, was this on BST?

    EDIT

    ~HABE FIDUCIAM IN DOMINO III V VI / III XVI~
    POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
    Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
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    GluggoGluggo Posts: 3,566 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 10, 2017 5:57PM

    I only use Pay Pal. It would have to be special like I will send it only after the Bank clears the Money Order. Extra days to wait for the check/money order. I had a Cashiers Check I sent and I had to wait 7 days.

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    ECHOESECHOES Posts: 2,974 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MorganMan94 said:
    I would much prefer a USPS money order, you get cash and save 3%. What's not to like?

    Exactly, USPS Money order same as cash, when received ship the coin.
    Guess I'm old school, have no need for pay-pal or the like.

    ~HABE FIDUCIAM IN DOMINO III V VI / III XVI~
    POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
    Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
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    BIGAL2749BIGAL2749 Posts: 742 ✭✭✭✭

    Most common scam on craigslist is the use of money orders.

    Had 5-6 funny requests (variations on those in the article) when I sold my daughter's wedding dress.

    You have to wait for a Money order to clear to be safe so taking a check and waiting for it to clear involves the same am't of time

    Same applies to cashier's checks

    https://thegarage.jalopnik.com/please-dont-fall-for-the-craigslist-money-order-scam-1742641006

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    ECHOESECHOES Posts: 2,974 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Are we talking about a United States Postal Service Money Order?

    ~HABE FIDUCIAM IN DOMINO III V VI / III XVI~
    POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
    Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
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    morgandollar1878morgandollar1878 Posts: 4,006 ✭✭✭✭✭

    As a few others have said a USPS money order is just like cash, as some people do not have a paypal account or anything similar. Usually when I do get one I cash it at the post office at the same time I am dropping the package off.

    Instagram: nomad_numismatics
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    CoinstartledCoinstartled Posts: 10,135 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ECHOES said:

    @MorganMan94 said:
    I would much prefer a USPS money order, you get cash and save 3%. What's not to like?

    Exactly, USPS Money order same as cash, when received ship the coin.
    Guess I'm old school, have no need for pay-pal or the like.

    Well they are as good as cash when the Post office confirms that they are. Plenty of fakes were floating around a decade ago.

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    ECHOESECHOES Posts: 2,974 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Coinstartled said:

    @ECHOES said:

    @MorganMan94 said:
    I would much prefer a USPS money order, you get cash and save 3%. What's not to like?

    Exactly, USPS Money order same as cash, when received ship the coin.
    Guess I'm old school, have no need for pay-pal or the like.

    Well they are as good as cash when the Post office confirms that they are. Plenty of fakes were floating around a decade ago.

    Very well may be the case, me personally, they come from the PO.
    BST; I would ask if a USPS MO would be accepted as payment, if seller agrees I would have payment to him/her ASAP, 99% of the time the next day.

    ~HABE FIDUCIAM IN DOMINO III V VI / III XVI~
    POST NUBILA PHOEBUS / AFTER CLOUDS, SUN
    Love for Music / Collector of Dreck
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    KollectorKingKollectorKing Posts: 4,820 ✭✭✭✭✭

    To me mo = to, or better than cash.
    I'll take mo w/zero hesitation.

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    @Coinstartled said:

    @ECHOES said:

    @MorganMan94 said:
    I would much prefer a USPS money order, you get cash and save 3%. What's not to like?

    Exactly, USPS Money order same as cash, when received ship the coin.
    Guess I'm old school, have no need for pay-pal or the like.

    Well they are as good as cash when the Post office confirms that they are. Plenty of fakes were floating around a decade ago.

    This has always been my concern with money orders. Is this not the case anymore?

    It seems much easier and faster for everyone involved to hit a couple of buttons and see the instant transfer. I can see the people not wanting an electronic trail for various reasons.

    This all might just be a generational thing. Younger people prefer electronic over paper?

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    CoinZipCoinZip Posts: 3,253 ✭✭✭
    edited October 10, 2017 7:06PM

    If I'm the seller I'll accept a USPS money order.

    If I'm the buyer and the seller requires a check or money order... I'll pass, it's just not worth the time to go to the post office to get the money order & it's not worth the time to mess with an envelope and stamp...

    As a buyer I appreciate the protection & convenience of using paypal. As a seller I'm willing to foot the bill (pay the fees) to extend the protection and convenience to my potential customers.

    Coin Club Benefit auctions ..... View the Lots

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    jwittenjwitten Posts: 5,077 ✭✭✭✭✭

    You always risk a credit card charge back with paypal. With a usps money order, I don't see any way you can try scamming the seller, as long as the seller takes it to a PO and confirms it is real.

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    morgandollar1878morgandollar1878 Posts: 4,006 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Coinstartled said:

    @ECHOES said:

    @MorganMan94 said:
    I would much prefer a USPS money order, you get cash and save 3%. What's not to like?

    Exactly, USPS Money order same as cash, when received ship the coin.
    Guess I'm old school, have no need for pay-pal or the like.

    Well they are as good as cash when the Post office confirms that they are. Plenty of fakes were floating around a decade ago.

    ...and this is why I take it directly to the post office. If USPS says it is fake them the coin does not ship.

    Instagram: nomad_numismatics
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    ChrisH821ChrisH821 Posts: 6,334 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Good info in this thread!

    Collector, occasional seller

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    3keepSECRETif2rDEAD3keepSECRETif2rDEAD Posts: 4,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    ...I would take a USPS money order from anyone over the age of 60...it’s hard to teach old dogs new tricks ;)

    ...going all electronic is worth 3 points to not have to touch a dirty money order and/or stand in line at the dirty bank or touch a dirty ATM machine...squeaky clean books are easier kept with electric payments...the juice is worth the squeeze here for me ;)

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    amwldcoinamwldcoin Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 11, 2017 4:29AM

    Here is an interesting twist to the Money Order payment.

    Ebay has pretty much phased out the possibility of accepting Money Orders. I had ebay cost me a couple of good sales for a different reason but the scenario would be the same. Even though I do not require immediate payment if you buy an item from me, ebay does! I went round and round with ebay about it on the phone...it's not supposed to do that unless it costs over $100 I was told. Well I told her all the items were less than $100. Oh it's not supposed to do that! They were supposed to get back to me but have not.

    Guess what? This is a major class action lawsuit waiting to happen. It is called "Restriction of Business Trade" and is against the law!

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    CascadeChrisCascadeChris Posts: 2,517 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I love money orders. Postal Money orders especially. I just sold a coin for $2700 And was paid by 3 postal money orders (limit on each is $1k) good thing is it doesn't run through your accounts, bad thing is that it may take a trip to multiple post offices to cash multiples in larger amounts. It's a very common form of payment especially among older casual collectors that don't do online banking with PayPal etc

    The more you VAM..
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    rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Years ago, back in the nineties, I purchased off ebay and paid with USPS money orders. Many sellers would not accept anything else. Yes, there was a spate of counterfeits... I recall reading about that, but being a buyer I never had that issue. During the high gold market, I did sell some darkside gold, but accepted personal checks and waited for clearance prior to shipping. I would say, some buyers now are avoiding or do not care to use, the electronic payment methods. Many older buyers have heard horror stories (some valid, many not) about electronic hacking etc., and fear that venue. Cheers, RickO

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    shorecollshorecoll Posts: 5,445 ✭✭✭✭✭

    There are lots of fake m.o., there are not lots of fake USPS m.o., I think it has something to do with the 20 year prison sentence for counterfeiting those. As Rick mentioned, there used to be many sellers that asked for them. It actually caused a significant surge in volume for those for a few years at USPS.

    ANA-LM, NBS, EAC
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    BAJJERFANBAJJERFAN Posts: 30,989 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BIGAL2749 said:
    Most common scam on craigslist is the use of money orders.

    Had 5-6 funny requests (variations on those in the article) when I sold my daughter's wedding dress.

    You have to wait for a Money order to clear to be safe so taking a check and waiting for it to clear involves the same am't of time

    Same applies to cashier's checks

    https://thegarage.jalopnik.com/please-dont-fall-for-the-craigslist-money-order-scam-1742641006

    Many consider it the most reliable/trustworthy way to send money. There is a place on the USPS site where you can look up to see if the MO is/was stolen, or take it to the PO and they will look it up for you. A clerk here said that she could cash one only for the amount in her drawer.

    Also, I believe that unless you have the serial number they are pretty much untraceable. Without the SN, the USPS would have to do a manual search of millions of negotiated MOs.

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    CoinstartledCoinstartled Posts: 10,135 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @morgandollar1878 said:

    @Coinstartled said:

    @ECHOES said:

    @MorganMan94 said:
    I would much prefer a USPS money order, you get cash and save 3%. What's not to like?

    Exactly, USPS Money order same as cash, when received ship the coin.
    Guess I'm old school, have no need for pay-pal or the like.

    Well they are as good as cash when the Post office confirms that they are. Plenty of fakes were floating around a decade ago.

    ...and this is why I take it directly to the post office. If USPS says it is fake them the coin does not ship.

    If Po bounces back as fake even after accepted by the PO you are still on the hook.

    Don't get me wrong...I would accept one from a highly respected buyer to save the 3% paypal fee. I have a decent ability to detect fakes so a couple hundred dollars would not be a concern. Large amounts though I would require 7-10 days to clear as a check would.

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    derrybderryb Posts: 36,209 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 11, 2017 9:11AM

    buyer has no protection/recourse when paying with a MO. MOs are frequently counterfeited, accept only USPS MOs and verify authenticity by cashing it at PO before shipping. PO clerks check their "stolen MO" list before cashing.

    Give Me Liberty or Give Me Debt

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    BIGAL2749BIGAL2749 Posts: 742 ✭✭✭✭

    @BAJJERFAN said:

    @BIGAL2749 said:
    Most common scam on craigslist is the use of money orders.

    Had 5-6 funny requests (variations on those in the article) when I sold my daughter's wedding dress.

    You have to wait for a Money order to clear to be safe so taking a check and waiting for it to clear involves the same am't of time

    Same applies to cashier's checks

    https://thegarage.jalopnik.com/please-dont-fall-for-the-craigslist-money-order-scam-1742641006

    Many consider it the most reliable/trustworthy way to send money. There is a place on the USPS site where you can look up to see if the MO is/was stolen, or take it to the PO and they will look it up for you. A clerk here said that she could cash one only for the amount in her drawer.

    Also, I believe that unless you have the serial number they are pretty much untraceable. Without the SN, the USPS would have to do a manual search of millions of negotiated MOs.

    On the wedding dress I had on craigslist, Most that were offered were Western Union money orders.

    Years back, I got annoyed with a seller on ebay on a $6000 note. I had sent a cashiers check and after what seemed to be a long wait I called him, he told me he was still waiting for it to clear. Told him I went to the bank to get a cashier's check to speed up the sale. Told me that cashiers checks are being counterfeited and was waiting for it to clear. Found out he was right!
    Now I just send a personal check.

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    amwldcoinamwldcoin Posts: 11,269 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Yeap...there are tales of those being deemed bad 30 days after being deposited! I would rather take a personal check from someone I don't know instead of a cashiers check. I absolutely think this is total BS that it is this way today with the instant banking available today!

    @BIGAL2749 said:

    @BAJJERFAN said:

    @BIGAL2749 said:
    Most common scam on craigslist is the use of money orders.

    Had 5-6 funny requests (variations on those in the article) when I sold my daughter's wedding dress.

    You have to wait for a Money order to clear to be safe so taking a check and waiting for it to clear involves the same am't of time

    Same applies to cashier's checks

    https://thegarage.jalopnik.com/please-dont-fall-for-the-craigslist-money-order-scam-1742641006

    Many consider it the most reliable/trustworthy way to send money. There is a place on the USPS site where you can look up to see if the MO is/was stolen, or take it to the PO and they will look it up for you. A clerk here said that she could cash one only for the amount in her drawer.

    Also, I believe that unless you have the serial number they are pretty much untraceable. Without the SN, the USPS would have to do a manual search of millions of negotiated MOs.

    On the wedding dress I had on craigslist, Most that were offered were Western Union money orders.

    Years back, I got annoyed with a seller on ebay on a $6000 note. I had sent a cashiers check and after what seemed to be a long wait I called him, he told me he was still waiting for it to clear. Told him I went to the bank to get a cashier's check to speed up the sale. Told me that cashiers checks are being counterfeited and was waiting for it to clear. Found out he was right!
    Now I just send a personal check.

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    BIGAL2749BIGAL2749 Posts: 742 ✭✭✭✭

    This article from the US Postal Inspection Service states they picked up over 21 million dollars in fake MOs in 2005

    Another article stated that the government rarely prosecutes

    https://postalinspectors.uspis.gov/raddocs/pressroom/fakemo.htm

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    tommy44tommy44 Posts: 2,195 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Back in the day all eBay sales were via check or money order. Even when PayPal evolved most of my sales were paid via check or money order. I even had several sellers send me cash.

    Postal money orders were the holy grail. Only problem was early in the morning often the clerks didn't have enough cash on hand to cash them. I always thought it was strange that the Post Office wouldn't have enough cash on hand somewhere in the building, imagine if your bank didn't have enough cash on hand to cash your check.

    I will still take a postal money order any time to make a sale.

    it's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide

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    moonshinemoonshine Posts: 1,039 ✭✭

    I do prefer Paypal, as it protects everyone involved and is hassle free, quick and smooth, altho for higher priced items the fees can add up - making a good deal, a not as good of a deal. I cut the 'paypal' part off of my labels I print from PP, to keep from raising red flag within post ofc., altho never had problem but one time in 20 years. I also will only accept the MO's by USPS - or cashier's check, but do prefer the USPS MO, as I feel they are safer, and heard they were also. I usually just cash mine at the post ofc.

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    BAJJERFANBAJJERFAN Posts: 30,989 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @tommy44 said:
    Back in the day all eBay sales were via check or money order. Even when PayPal evolved most of my sales were paid via check or money order. I even had several sellers send me cash.

    Postal money orders were the holy grail. Only problem was early in the morning often the clerks didn't have enough cash on hand to cash them. I always thought it was strange that the Post Office wouldn't have enough cash on hand somewhere in the building, imagine if your bank didn't have enough cash on hand to cash your check.

    I will still take a postal money order any time to make a sale.

    Even banks would like advance notice if you intend to cash a large check. same for your PO with MOs I'd guess.

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    tommy44tommy44 Posts: 2,195 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BAJJERFAN said:

    @tommy44 said:
    Back in the day all eBay sales were via check or money order. Even when PayPal evolved most of my sales were paid via check or money order. I even had several sellers send me cash.

    Postal money orders were the holy grail. Only problem was early in the morning often the clerks didn't have enough cash on hand to cash them. I always thought it was strange that the Post Office wouldn't have enough cash on hand somewhere in the building, imagine if your bank didn't have enough cash on hand to cash your check.

    I will still take a postal money order any time to make a sale.

    Even banks would like advance notice if you intend to cash a large check. same for your PO with MOs I'd guess.

    What would a bank consider a large check? The largest postal money order today is $1000, up from $700 in the past. I've had them unable to cash ones for under $100. If the post office wants to "make believe" they are a financial center of some sort they should have a stash of cash available somewhere.

    But that's another story, as I stated above I'll take a postal money order any time to make a sale.

    it's crackers to slip a rozzer the dropsy in snide

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    ctf_error_coinsctf_error_coins Posts: 15,433 ✭✭✭✭✭

    One of the last Postal Money orders I got, the Postal teller asked me if it was good, as if this one might be a fake.

    I said, it's good as I have got other ones from the same buyer in the past.

    I thought it a very odd question.

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    moonshinemoonshine Posts: 1,039 ✭✭
    edited October 17, 2017 1:20PM

    I'd have told her - look it up. (basically that's why I am here, waiting for you to do your job.)

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    BAJJERFANBAJJERFAN Posts: 30,989 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 17, 2017 2:28PM

    @tommy44 said:

    @BAJJERFAN said:

    @tommy44 said:
    Back in the day all eBay sales were via check or money order. Even when PayPal evolved most of my sales were paid via check or money order. I even had several sellers send me cash.

    Postal money orders were the holy grail. Only problem was early in the morning often the clerks didn't have enough cash on hand to cash them. I always thought it was strange that the Post Office wouldn't have enough cash on hand somewhere in the building, imagine if your bank didn't have enough cash on hand to cash your check.

    I will still take a postal money order any time to make a sale.

    Even banks would like advance notice if you intend to cash a large check. same for your PO with MOs I'd guess.

    What would a bank consider a large check? The largest postal money order today is $1000, up from $700 in the past. I've had them unable to cash ones for under $100. If the post office wants to "make believe" they are a financial center of some sort they should have a stash of cash available somewhere.

    But that's another story, as I stated above I'll take a postal money order any time to make a sale.

    $50,000? They may not have that much extra to spare, esp. later in the day. If the check was drawn from another bank, you have to have that much in your account before they'd cash it, otherwise you'd have to deposit it and withdraw an amount equal to or less than your total account balances.

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    BAJJERFANBAJJERFAN Posts: 30,989 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @moonshine said:
    I'd have told her - look it up. (basically that's why I am here, waiting for you to do your job.)

    This.

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    Cougar1978Cougar1978 Posts: 7,637 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 18, 2017 4:32AM

    Very rare. I specify “please pay via PayPal.”

    Any money order transaction do not ship until cashed (USPS) or that payment clears bank. Over a decade ago, I had some Bozo in NC send me bad USPS money order once which they would not cash. Fortunately I had not shipped the coin. I sent it back to him with note I don’t want his business.

    So Cali Area - Coins & Currency
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    OPAOPA Posts: 17,104 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Just because it's a PO MO...don't let down your guard. There are literally thousands of stolen, missing our counterfeit Postal M.O. floating around.
    If you have one, you can check it against their list of bad M.O.'s

    http://about.usps.com/postal-bulletin/2011/pb22306/html/mo_001.html

    "Bongo drive 1984 Lincoln that looks like old coin dug from ground."
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    AMRCAMRC Posts: 4,266 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ricko said:
    Years ago, back in the nineties, I purchased off ebay and paid with USPS money orders. Many sellers would not accept anything else. Yes, there was a spate of counterfeits... I recall reading about that, but being a buyer I never had that issue. During the high gold market, I did sell some darkside gold, but accepted personal checks and waited for clearance prior to shipping. I would say, some buyers now are avoiding or do not care to use, the electronic payment methods. Many older buyers have heard horror stories (some valid, many not) about electronic hacking etc., and fear that venue. Cheers, RickO

    My universe is shattered. Ricko has actually sold something!

    MLAeBayNumismatics: "The greatest hobby in the world!"
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    rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @AMRC .... Yes, I have mentioned this before. Back at the peak of the gold market I did sell some darkside gold... Britannia's..... offer too good to turn down. They are beautiful coins and it was hard to let them go. Cheers, RickO

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    291fifth291fifth Posts: 23,942 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Coinstartled said:
    Unusual on Ebay transactions. Some people do not have a Paypal account and do not want one.

    In order use these electronic forms of payment you have to agree to their terms. Some people, who have actually read the very one-sided terms, do not agree to do so. More power to them!

    All glory is fleeting.

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