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Wouldn't it be cool to start circulating gold and silver again?

Batman23Batman23 Posts: 4,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

They won't do it... but why not??

Make a circulating 90% one ounce silver or gold coin with a face value of something like $50 and $2,000 respectively. We pay face value from the mint. The mint makes a PILE of money from the difference of value. A guy could carry five gold coins for a quick $10,000 purchase. If inflation overtakes us terribly, we have some bullion value that might bail us out a little. A win-win for everyone!

Would you rather carry 100 Benjamins or 5 libertys? I could easily see argument for use of both!

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    RogerBRogerB Posts: 8,852 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Who is "They?"

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    Batman23Batman23 Posts: 4,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @RogerB said:
    Who is "They?"

    Those in charge. Government, overseeing the mint...

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,984 ✭✭✭✭✭

    You can still spend 90% at face value...if you'd like

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,984 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It would be a HUGE mistake. Either the value of the coin would have to far exceed the intrinsic value ($1 worth of silver, $10 face value) in which case what's the point OR everytime gold or silver spiked, people would pull change out of circulation creating a shortage that the Treasury would have to make up.

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,984 ✭✭✭✭✭

    there's no point to it. When there was gold and silver...and copper for that matter...in the coins, the intrinsic value matched the face value. What did that prevent? Inflation. Yes. But at the cost of a "Panic" (another name for a small depression) about once every 10 years.

    You want a "little bit" of gold or silver in the coins that is well below face value (not far enough in your example, gold flirted with $2000 5 years ago). That accomplishes nothing most of the time - when gold and silver are modestly priced. When gold and silver spike, it encourages melting.

    People forget that when there was gold and silver in the coinage, the price of gold and silver was FIXED. Even then, during times of trouble (civil war), the specie disappeared from circulation requiring scrip, paper money, tokens, etc. to fill the gap. Great for collectors 150 years later. Horrible for commerce at that time.

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    SoldiSoldi Posts: 2,024 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Something a kin to the Rentenmark would help or a gold backed currency would limit the amount of money in circulation, as there is too much. Although, I get the idea and I think as far as the "cool" factor is concerned "it's cool" just cool.

    Cool is 1950 when Engine Charlie Wilson ran General Motors and made $535,000 that year. His take home pay was $110,000 after taxes, enough to buy anything he needed. A large sucking sound was heard as the Fed took their tax toll and kept the value of money in place and coinage had silver, notes had silver value too, money was worth much, much more. "Cool" would be a complete do over, alas the can has been kicked down the road since 2008. Contrary to Ronald Reagan we didn't hit the proverbial jackpot and most people should "Revisit the Reagan Nightmare" it's online.

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    Batman23Batman23 Posts: 4,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    No circulating gold huh? Then why not do away with the gimmicky mint producing all of this precious metal "coins" and get back to creating simple circulating and useful money. At least the commems of the 20s and 30s were made and designed to circulate and hold their own.

    I think they should at least bring back the $1,000 bill! But I am sure there is a drug overlord or counterfeiting reason they won't...

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    Batman23Batman23 Posts: 4,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I am not talking about changing the metal standard or a metal backed currency. Just a high value circulating coin with a precious metal content that is worth something, but not close enough to melt, that would keep it circulating. And so what if gold went to $3,000/ounce. The owner could melt them all. The government could do the same if they held any. Why is there a concern for melting or making money off it? The vast majority of money will still be electronic, followed by paper, "change" will be the same. I am just fantasizing about a very seldom used but elite circulating coin...

    I just kind of like the idea, not that I could actually have a pocket full of them.

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    topstuftopstuf Posts: 14,803 ✭✭✭✭✭

    LBJ destroyed so much of the country that it will NEVER happen again.

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,984 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Batman23 said:
    I am not talking about changing the metal standard or a metal backed currency. Just a high value circulating coin with a precious metal content that is worth something, but not close enough to melt, that would keep it circulating. And so what if gold went to $3,000/ounce. The owner could melt them all. The government could do the same if they held any. Why is there a concern for melting or making money off it? The vast majority of money will still be electronic, followed by paper, "change" will be the same. I am just fantasizing about a very seldom used but elite circulating coin...

    I just kind of like the idea, not that I could actually have a pocket full of them.

    The purpose of "money" is to promote commerce. IT matters if it disappears from circulation.

    Sigh...read an economics book.

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    BillJonesBillJones Posts: 33,485 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @topstuf said:
    LBJ destroyed so much of the country that it will NEVER happen again.

    LBJ was guilty of destroying a number of things, but the end of the silver coinage was not his fault. The trend was in place, although the Kennedy Half Dollar, passed under his presidency, did contribute to it

    Retired dealer and avid collector of U.S. type coins, 19th century presidential campaign medalets and selected medals. In recent years I have been working on a set of British coins - at least one coin from each king or queen who issued pieces that are collectible. I am also collecting at least one coin for each Roman emperor from Julius Caesar to ... ?
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    rickoricko Posts: 98,724 ✭✭✭✭✭

    We will not be going back to circulating PM coins.... That system is long gone.. there are several excellent articles on why it is no longer feasible... Cheers, RickO

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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,780 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BillJones said:
    a nostalgic dream

    Those three words sum it up.

    Yes, it would be "cool" to have silver or even gold in our pockets like in the old days, but there is no practical reason for that to occur in today's economy. Just save up your base metal coinage and paper dollars and then buy silver and gold bullion coins (I remember the days when we didn't even have those).

    Some countries (Canada, the UK) will sell you a high value silver coin at "face value" but it is essentially non-circulating legal tender that can't be spent (or at least does not have to be accepted) and contains bullion that is worth far less than face. The worst of both worlds.

    I would love to run my hands through a pile of silver coins like some sort of pirate, but I won't dirty up my Silver Eagles and assorted other bullion coins. The next best thing would be to get a large supply of circulated pre-1965 silver if the mood strikes you.

    By the way, the day may come when future generations look back on this era and feel nostalgic over our copper and nickel coinage. For a time, "cheap" foreign coins were made of aluminum or zinc, but now plated steel seems to be the preferred way of reducing coinage costs.

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    ZoinsZoins Posts: 33,910 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 18, 2017 9:13AM

    Donald Trump may think so! Here are some quotes:

    We used to have a very, very solid country because it was based on a gold standard

    Bringing back the gold standard would be very hard to do, but boy, would it be wonderful. We’d have a standard on which to base our money.

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    HydrantHydrant Posts: 7,773 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Dream on.

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    sellitstoresellitstore Posts: 2,493 ✭✭✭✭✭

    They won't do it... but why not??

    Because "cool" isn't a good enough reason.

    Collector and dealer in obsolete currency. Always buying all obsolete bank notes and scrip.
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    JBKJBK Posts: 14,780 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Batman23 said:
    No circulating gold huh? Then why not do away with the gimmicky mint producing all of this precious metal "coins" and get back to creating simple circulating and useful money. At least the commems of the 20s and 30s were made and designed to circulate and hold their own.

    I think they should at least bring back the $1,000 bill! But I am sure there is a drug overlord or counterfeiting reason they won't...

    I am not 100% sure and I am certain there are people here who could confirm, but I believe that most commem halves from the first commem period were sold at a premium to benefit the sponsoring organization. (I know in some cases some excess inventory did make it into circulation as well as whatever people decided to spend among their former keepsake coins).

    Bring back the $1000 bill? The world is going the other way. The EU phased out the 500 euro note not too long ago, for example. I don't see the US reversing course (we were a trendsetter in this area), for the reasons you stated.

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    mustangmanbobmustangmanbob Posts: 1,890 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Drug dealers and Terrorists would love a $2000 coin.

    In Europe, the 500 euro note is nicknamed the Bin Laden note, because terrorists can move large amounts of money using the notes.

    Italy, Greece, Spain, countries with TERRIBLE financial accountability are the main users of these notes, to keep economies off the radar.

    Unless you fall into one of the top 2 groups, it does not seem like a good idea at all.

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    SoldiSoldi Posts: 2,024 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @sellitstore said:
    They won't do it... but why not??

    Because "cool" isn't a good enough reason.

    They won't do it because you are in their complete control at this point in time. Regardless of what you think you're given money that doesn't exist in the first place for your time here on earth. You want a new car or house, cant' afford one? Let me print you out a few hundred thousand ahhh why bother? I will just create the transfer electronically. Fractional banking reserve ratios, no real treasury or bond issued, debt ceilings raised to the sky. ....................So sorry, I cannot go on and on right now, but "cool" was as good an answer as any other since Reagan hit the proverbial jackpot and the Bush brothers doubled and tripled down on it.

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    SoldiSoldi Posts: 2,024 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Always remember I studied economics and forgot more than I know now, but this is certain. Although, I wasn't convinced 25 years ago, as I am now, IT IS A DISMAL SCIENCE. Consider Marx, the Philosopher and Economist, brilliant man, NOT THE COMMIE. Read some of Noriel Rubini (spelling) watch Noam Chomsky and you'll see why "cool" is just as good as any other answer. You do realize Socialism is gaining a strong foothold in this "economic arena" we have been thrown into. Remember "Dismal Science"

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    stevebensteveben Posts: 4,596 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 18, 2017 2:29PM

    trust me, THEY don't want US to carry around REAL money...nor do THEY want you easily transporting or exchanging large amounts of money anonymously easily (which is why they don't have large denominations any more, like 1K or higher bills) .

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    ambro51ambro51 Posts: 13,609 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I believe there was a medically therapeutic benefit to carrying a pocket full of silver coins. Silver has important antibacterial qualities that we all are now missing.

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,984 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Soldi said:

    @sellitstore said:
    They won't do it... but why not??

    Because "cool" isn't a good enough reason.

    They won't do it because you are in their complete control at this point in time. Regardless of what you think you're given money that doesn't exist in the first place for your time here on earth. You want a new car or house, cant' afford one? Let me print you out a few hundred thousand ahhh why bother? I will just create the transfer electronically. Fractional banking reserve ratios, no real treasury or bond issued, debt ceilings raised to the sky. ....................So sorry, I cannot go on and on right now, but "cool" was as good an answer as any other since Reagan hit the proverbial jackpot and the Bush brothers doubled and tripled down on it.

    And Barack Obama... your politics are showing

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,984 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited September 19, 2017 5:57PM

    @ambro51 said:
    I believe there was a medically therapeutic benefit to carrying a pocket full of silver coins. Silver has important antibacterial qualities that we all are now missing.

    Nonsense. At best that would keep your pocket clean while the germs are all in your eyes and mouth and your hands

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    ambro51ambro51 Posts: 13,609 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I guess you don't believe in the Easter Bunny either then. :-(

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    ambro51ambro51 Posts: 13,609 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Fein
    Fein or FEIN may refer to:

    Fein and Sebé, characters in the anime Zatch Bell!
    Fein (company), founded by Wilhelm Fein
    Sinn Féin, a series of political movements since 1905 in Ireland
    Federal Employer Identification Number, used by the United States Internal Revenue Service
    FEIN-Codierung (de) Friedberger Eigentümer-Identifikations-Nummer, a system to mark personal items

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,984 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ambro51 said:
    Fein
    Fein or FEIN may refer to:

    Fein and Sebé, characters in the anime Zatch Bell!
    Fein (company), founded by Wilhelm Fein
    Sinn Féin, a series of political movements since 1905 in Ireland
    Federal Employer Identification Number, used by the United States Internal Revenue Service
    FEIN-Codierung (de) Friedberger Eigentümer-Identifikations-Nummer, a system to mark personal items

    or it's autocorrect for "and"...

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    SoldiSoldi Posts: 2,024 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Despite the non-sequitur answers/comments about politics, which was as far as the east is from the west in any answers given, "Cool" was a good topic.

    PS read it again and now tell me my religion is showing.

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    WillieBoyd2WillieBoyd2 Posts: 5,038 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It would make CoinStar finds more interesting.

    :)

    https://www.brianrxm.com
    The Mysterious Egyptian Magic Coin
    Coins in Movies
    Coins on Television

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    BackroadJunkieBackroadJunkie Posts: 3,745 ✭✭✭✭✭

    And if you think counterfeiting is bad now, try introducing PM's back as circulating coinage.

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    Batman23Batman23 Posts: 4,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @BackroadJunkie said:
    And if you think counterfeiting is bad now, try introducing PM's back as circulating coinage.

    Very true. And a reason it would never happen.

    Wow did this this simple question go all over the place for responses. But we have not yet achieved Godwin's law so there must still be life left in this thread >:)

    OK, IF and I will put a big IF... IF the mint would produce a legal tender one ounce Gold or Platinum or Palladium coin with a face value of $2,000 and a cost of $2,000 plus shipping, would you buy a few just so you could spend them??? B)

    And lets not over-analyze this Economics majors...

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    BaleyBaley Posts: 22,658 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The counterfeiting problem is the first objection that occurred to me, surprised it took this long to be mentioned.

    Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry

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    jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,984 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Batman23 said:

    @BackroadJunkie said:
    And if you think counterfeiting is bad now, try introducing PM's back as circulating coinage.

    Very true. And a reason it would never happen.

    Wow did this this simple question go all over the place for responses. But we have not yet achieved Godwin's law so there must still be life left in this thread >:)

    OK, IF and I will put a big IF... IF the mint would produce a legal tender one ounce Gold or Platinum or Palladium coin with a face value of $2,000 and a cost of $2,000 plus shipping, would you buy a few just so you could spend them??? B)

    And lets not over-analyze this Economics majors...

    No.

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