Jim Rickards on gold price manipulation
derryb
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"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
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Another theory is that the sky brothers bred into humans a desire to amass gold around the time they also taught our ancestors to speak, do math, farm, and build structures.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Poor China...always getting the blame for something.
So its impossibe for an economy to function without gold? As the article states, all the economies of the world will be "on the bus", when they all have gold. I can't wait. Good times for all. Come on China, you can do it!!! Save us all from this decade long misery.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Well, that closing statement of gold at $10,000 per ounce sure looks good for stackers...
Now, can we live long enough to reap the rewards?? Cheers, RickO
A robust, even fragile economy works just fine without gold. However, like stackers, most countries realize a need for a plan B. Rickards points out that the US realizes when Plan B goes into effect, the world's second largest economy (China) will need a seat at the Plan B table - not because the US is looking out for China, but because the US realizes the world-wide consequences if China's economy, because of its size, does not survive the Plan A fallout. One of the pitfalls of globalization.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
An 8X asset gain is not that unheard of. Especially with one that reacts so quickly to bad things. As rosy as coho's glasses paint a unicorn economic landscape it's still a very disrupted and fragile landscape.
Those with clear vision see that the 2008 temporary fix is still in effect. Why is that? No doubt coho and baley would have sat back with their little umbrella fruity drinks and laughed while Noah built his ark.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Ah, yes, Noah. The sky brothers were responsible for that little incident too, but the tale has grown in the retelling over the generations. It wasn't all that bad.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
I fully expect to see $5000 gold in my lifetime (assuming I live a full life). I also expect to see the S&P 500 at 10000, $10/gallon gasoline and average home prices at $2 million at some point along the way.
When I was a kid gold was $75, the S&P was 100, gasoline was 35 cents/gallon and average homes were $18,000.
We going to wallpaper the Earth with USD over the next 30 years whether that takes gold to $10,000 remains to be seen. The USD is worth 4 cents of its value going back to the creation of The Fed.
Good luck in your 200+ year longevity.
Wasn't Noah said to be about 600 years old when he built the ark for the millions of pairs of animal species?
Back then, gold was a dollar an ounce. The S&P only had 5 companies and was 2, houses were twenty bucks, and a gallon of gas was free but one had to dig their own well and refinery
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Those were the days! (Before inflation and manipulation ruined everyone's lives)
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
200 years? Ha! I'm 52 and have watched prices increase 500% since I was in grade school. That's a 4% annual inflation rate guaranteed by your U.S. Federal Reserve.
We will print tens of trillions of USD over the coming decades to keep the wealthy in the money. That's another Fed guarantee.
Yes, so much exaggeration and hyperbole. I can't wait to see how this Coho dude's transcripts are interpretted in 2000 years. There has already been been much bastardation.
Yes, VanHalen. Inflation will cure us all. Even those who buy old Tonka trucks and gold. Unfortunately gains in each asset class are cyclical. Be on the wrong side of that cycle and well, that's sucks.
Or we can just say that the US and Europe are holding gold prices down so that China and "afford" more...then they can finish bringin down the house off cards. That does sound so much more romantic.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
It's a loosing proposition in stock piling PM's because everything else will have gone up proportionally, leaving you with a net purchasing power gain of zilch.
True in a healthy economic environment. From 1984 to 2000, an investor could buy stocks and hold them for a long time without worrying. The economy was growing, spurred by technological innovation and a favorable political landscape. Debt increases were relatively small, and in the late 90’s, a surplus even emerged. In this stable environment, gold acted like an insurance policy you never took a claim on.
However, since 2000, economic and political conditions have deteriorated. A “boom and bust” cycle now periodically threatens investors. In 2007, a housing bubble led to the Great Recession. Now, stocks and bonds are again overvalued. Government spending has surpassed all manageable limits and the world faces growing threats as US power wanes. In this environment, an allocation to gold is essential for any portfolio.
Increasing debt, reckless spending, and continuous asset bubble popping throws the "everything else will have gone up proportionally" argument right out the window.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Gold was created to be manipulated. Buy low . Keep a good coin or two.
Dated chart....
Current price: Gold $1267
S&P: $2415
Updated data...
Since 2000 S&P has gained 58% and gold has gained 446%.
And to those that would argue "it's because of the time frame chosen," the true message in the chart is that the boom and bust cycles created by FED policy and runaway deficits since the 2000 dot.com bubble have voided the "everything goes up proportionately" claim. The FED has, since 2000, destroyed the "buy and hold advantage" and they (we) are stuck with the policy that destroyed it.
Boom and bust cycles create uncertainty. As the right side of the chart shows, even in the face of price suppression, uncertainty is gold's best friend.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Since 2011 gold has lost 35% & the S&P is up by about 150%. It's been said many times before...charts are manipulated to validate some ones point.
And I said earlier "And to those that would argue "it's because of the time frame chosen," the true message in the chart is that the boom and bust cycles created by FED policy and runaway deficits since the 2000 dot.com bubble have voided the "everything goes up proportionately" claim. The FED has, since 2000, destroyed the "buy and hold advantage" and they (we) are stuck with the policy that destroyed it."
That's how a boom cycle works, the bubble gets air. Since 2008 a lot of it for equities.
However, as I said, when you look at the history of these boom/bust cycles that the FED has created, gold has done 8X better than the S&P 500 rather than your claim that it just "goes up proportionately." The chart does two things: It dispels your claim that stackers face only "proportionate gains" and it vividly demonstrates the effect of FED intervention in the markets.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
That's a good point. How and when they rise and fall are the telltale. Sure there will be times the net purchasing power is zero (or negative) and other times positive.
Wallpapering the world with USD will take its toll and that's what we're in the process of doing.
Why start at 1984? In any case this seems to prove that all asset prices appreciate at roughly the same rate over a long period of time. I think I've heard that on these boards before.
However, what the chart doesn't show is the value of dividends and reinvested dividends. So, yes, while the price of the SP500 is depicted correctly in your chart, the value of the investment is WAY OFF. The SP500 is would be closer to 4000.
Seems whomever drew that chart also forgot to show the 35% drop in gold in 2008.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
The chart compares the 16 years before the year 2000 to the 16 years after the year 2000 to illustrate the before and after affect of the FED's new business model - boom/bust cycles. The year 2000, and the change it brought to central bank market interference policy, marks a "new beginning" for your long period of time.
The S&P 500 price is actually the price of SPX, the index that tracks the S&P 500. While the index does not pay a dividend and many of the individual components do pay a dividend, S&P Dow Jones indices calculate a total return for the S&P 500 that includes the impact of investing dividends back into the index itself. Contrary to what you believe, the S&P 500 price quote does include reinvested dividends.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
the S&P 500 price quote does include reinvested dividends
No it does not. And one can easily buy the SP500 thru the SPY etf which in fact does pay a dividend that can be reinvested. It is quite easy to calculate the total value of an investment in the SPY with and without dividends reinvested. Try it yourself. Make 2 $1000 investments into SPY. Reinvest dividends in one and spend the dividends in the other. Match those results to the performance of the SP500 index. Talk to me in 10 years, or even one year. The result will prove you wrong. ....again.
Why is the year 2000 used as reference for FED "interference"? Didn't the FED make major policy shifts in the 70's or 40's or 30's or teens? Or is 2000 used because that's when gold finally woke up from a 20 year bear market that dramatically saw its purchasing power erode?
Still haven't answered why the 35% drop in gold in 2008 is not depicted.
I'm just searching for facts, not rhetoric construed in an attempt to prove assumptions.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Does the S&P 500 index include dividends?
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Because it's a yearly chart. Fact is gold started 2008 at 846.75 and ended the year at 869.75.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
So why does your first chart show a parabolic increase when your second chart shows a flat market?
Also, if it's a yearly chart, why show a low of 676, when the close in 2008 was 903 and in 2009 was 1115. Why show 676 as a low for the sp500 but not 681 as a low for gold?
You guys scream manipulation in everything, yet you are the ones doing the manipulation.
The problem I have with most of these charts you post is they depict "alternative facts", AKA fake news. Your story can be compelling if it wasn't for all the twisted logic, religion, conspiracy, manipulation, fear, ect.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Try again.... http://topforeignstocks.com/2016/06/02/on-the-difference-in-returns-between-sp-500-price-and-total-return-index/
When a stock pays a dividend it's price is reduced by the amount of the dividend.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-06-05/chats-by-metals-trader-reveal-spoofing-tricks-from-the-master?srnd=157390132
Manipulation is no "theory." Big banks have already confessed to fraud and paid big fines in the PM markets from 2007-2013, during both bull and bear markets? Who knew? LOL. It's only a matter of how extensive and widespread it was.
The latest scam was spoofing bids in the metals and illegal per Dodd Frank. Read the account above of a DB metal's trader on how it's done. Oh, that's a Bloomberg article....not Zero Hedge....LOL. Much more fall out to come as they guys squeal on plea bargains .
The sky brothers have been manipulating humans for over 30,000 years. It's fun and interesting when someone notices specific instances and believes that they are smart for pointing it out to the rest of us.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Hey, I remember 0.35c gas and $18,000 three bed room homes with a nice lot and a two car garage in Orange County, California. Back when $ilver was still in circulation.
100% Positive BST transactions
I'm sure this is the reason why gold is trading at the same price ask 7 years ago.
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
While "approved" assets have skyrocketed?
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Commodities Futures Trading Commission has brought charges for manipulating the gold and silver markets
Don't believe this has happened since the Hunt Brothers fiasco.
"Interest rates, the price of money, are the most important market. And, perversely, they’re the market that’s most manipulated by the Fed." - Doug Casey
Yah, Coastal real estate and profitable companies are such stupid things to buy, compared to a closrtfull of ASEs.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
That sounds like something I'd post.
Yeah, I remember those things. One of my childhood memories is the corner gas station's A-frame sign reading 36.9c/gal. On the bright side we're lucky to get respite from $3 to $4/gallon.
I remember it well, along with price wars and getting coffee mugs with your fill ups.
Please elaborate. What are these "approved" assets? When were they approved and by whom?
Knowledge is the enemy of fear
Yes, Gas station Free coffee mugs, free dishes, game board winnings, Gas price wars at 0.35c a gallon. Best was $ilver in circulation.
100% Positive BST transactions
And when:
could get you 
Those were the days!
Since 2011 gold has lost 35% & the S&P is up by about 150%. It's been said many times before...charts are manipulated to validate some ones point.
That being the case, one might be wise to follow Baley's portfolio rebalancing approach by selling stocks and buying gold now. Unless of course, stocks and gold are being manipulated. In that case, just take your best shot, eh?
I knew it would happen.
Do a search for "Bronze Age Catastrophe". From what I can tell, it was quite bad.
There have certainly been catastrophic disasters over the ages. Evolutionary biologists refer to them as Selection Events, and these genetic and behavioral bottlenecks are healthy opportunities for the survivors and their descendents, although conditions are difficult for a time.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry
Think about it, you are here, reading this post on Father's Day, for the simple reason that your Dad was a winner, like his dad, and his, and so on for millions of years into the past. Do all those men honor with your life, and pay it forward.
Liberty: Parent of Science & Industry