Do you think a CAC sticker is the equivalent to a + on certain coins ?
STEWARTBLAYNUMIS
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I think so but it is hard to ascertain
Exactly which coins until I see them.
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No, not in the areas where I concentrate. I view the CAC sticker as "it's solid for the grade and essentially problem-free" whereas I view the + as "nice try, but it's not the higher grade".
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It is merely an opinion.
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If a plus is nice try , but not quite a higher grade, than doesn't that imply if it weren't a plus, it's solid for its grade at a minimum, and thus a CAC.
I thought the plus was for splitting the grade and the star was for eye appeal.
When did that change?
And few of the "plus" graded gem Saints will CAC sticker, which tells you something. For me the plus means the coin has some extra eye appeal or attractiveness, but often these will not sticker, as CAC wants no problem coins, with most of the criteria for the grade all there.
"Their," and I disagree.
They normally realize a greater premium than without, but not usually as much as a premium as a '+',
so perhaps in the middle, depending on factors such as number certified of each, and also demand.
All grading is an opinion.......
How are you Stewart
Kevin
The CAC MS64 1798 dollar in Pogue realized the same as the non CAC MS65 ....right on the price guide for a 64+
The problem after numerous posts about the subjects is that many "knowlegdeable" people don't seem able to agree on just what each designation means. So I guess you have to look at it for what it means to you.
On certain coins I do, commems and bust halves. I haven't studied it much in other areas but..."it couldn't hurt".
With the series that interest me, usually there are far more CAC stickers for a coin type and grade than there are those with PCGS pluses.
Take the non-overdate 1808 bust half, as a random example. Across all grades there are just 11 pluses. Looking at AU's only: 293 graded, 4 pluses. But CAC has stickered 46 AU's (granted, that includes NGC but it is also true that many coins were never submitted).
Point is in many, if not most cases, a plus is rarer and, IMO, improves the coin's market value more than a green sticker. Again, with the series that interest me.
PCGS: "Plus Grades exhibit exceptional eye appeal for the grade and constitute the top 30% of the coins in the grade."
CAC: "The CAC GREEN Label signifies that a coin has met Certified Acceptance Corporation's stringent grading standards." (A and B coins, not C, is what we've been told.)
If I had to choose one or the other I'll take the plus.
Lance.
$12.50 well spent i'd say
Latin American Collection
What about PCGS instituting a ....MINUS.... grade?
Then there would be BARGAINS!
I guess the best way I would answer is this: If my slabbed coin has a plus, I will not send it to CAC, no need.....
Stewart yes price wise on certain coins
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
I think they're (CAC sticker vs. the "+" ) inherently different, but are perceived similarly as "better than what's inside the plastic". And typically our eyes can see this.
``https://ebay.us/m/KxolR5
Not to be nit-picky, a little bit higher for coins of that caliber. Here are the current submission prices and tiers;
◾$13.50 per coin – Insured value up to $10,000
◾$27.00 per coin – Insured value over $10,000
http://www.caccoin.com/submission-pricing/
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I have submitted one + (plus) coin and it did not receive the bean.
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if i am buying, no. if i am selling, yes.
that's probably the answer!
I had a proof coin that was a 67 and CAC. When it got the "plus" grade at PCGS and made it top pop, it jumped 4 grand more than the 67 and a CAC. So in this case, the CAC was not the equivalent. On a common Morgan ms66 coin, a CAC IS a plus, if not better.
In almost all cases I would rather have the plus grade versus a green sticker.
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Depends on the coin. In what I collect, neither of the two don't mean much. There are many stickered coins, which get no premium. There are few plus coins, but a smart collector won't pay a premium for them, either, although many dealers will try to get them.
If you're talking about gold or Morgans, that's a different story.
"Seu cabra da peste,
"Sou Mangueira......."
My comments apply to relatively generic mint state gold. (I do think CAC and plus mean different things in different series.)
In these coins, CAC seems to mean original surfaces, solid for grade, often with thick skin. They can range from satiny to very flashy. CAC doesn't mind copper spots (see: original surfaces).
Plus grade coins look the next grade up, and are usually quite flashy, but under a loupe have an obvious issue that is grade-limiting. In that sense, they are not particularly great upgrade candidates. They do NOT have copper spots.
Both CAC and plus coins are a step above average, but in different ways.
Then in essence, you are saying that if PCGS has added a PLUS, then they are saying what?
That the coin is NOT graded to their accepted standard but is a little better.
BUT.... if they have straight graded it WITHOUT a plus then there is some ...doubt... on the grade and it should be sent in to see if it is acceptable FOR the grade and if it is NOT then they screwed up by just grading it by their standards?
Is that what you're saying?
How much do worms cost in a BIG can?
In Peace dollars, there are loads of "plus"coins that do not CAC. This is especially true at the MS 66+ grade.
What does this mean? It means the graders in each case have a difference of opinion.
No.
A plus is how pcgs handles gradeflation
In general I would rather purchase a coin that is in a pre 2010 PCGS holder that is CAC'd, than a non CAC'd plus graded coin in post 2010 holder.
I can't say "NO" loud enough!!!
I would take the + grade. A CAC green bean only indicates that the coin is OK for the assigned grade, but a gold bean is better than a + grade.
OINK
No - did some seller try BS u with that line?
I'd rather turn in my green beans for a plus pcgs grade any day.
Certainly for Ms 67 red Lincoln cents in the 30's ,40's and 50's CAC stickers don't mean anything.
Getting a plus on these coins increases the sale price by 5x to 10x
However for 1943 cents in Ms 68 , coins with a CAC sticker will sell for almost double at auction
than those without a green bean.
Common date Saints graded Ms 65 + will sell for equal money as those with a CAC sticker
graded Ms 65
However most silver and gold coins will almost always sell for more money with a Gold CAC
Than with a PCGS plus
As noted by Oih82w8 - Except some 'plus' coins don't CAC, so?...........
Best, SH
I don't offer above the grade on the holder anyway. Of course I would not be surprised if somebody tried BS me w some spiel on that ......happens all the time.
Is it absolutely necessary to get COINS in slabs?
They seem to be taking a back seat to what's on the plastic.
Somehow, I like this simple answer best. Having said that, I have had + coins fail to CAC sticker.
Tom
Excellent liqiudity and protection against the strong elements. In today's world it is a must.
My goodness but my clarity is suffering today.
I shall try to SIMPLIFY....
IF....LIQUIDITY..... depends on a sticker.
Then WTH do we pay GRADING fees for?
As I have TRIED to say...... I would have NO qualms about a new SLABBING, GRADING, and AUTHENTICATION place.
We could all decide what we like.
BUT.....what ..WE... like is now immaterial. LIQUIDITY depends on APPROVAL.
I'm sure this will be misunderstood by someone so what the heck?
I shall just sit quietly now here with my XF bust dollar and....and.....AND......
OH MY GOSH!
How do I ....KNOW....it's XF?
AIYEEEEE!!!
You read more into my short statement I was not being negative.
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working on proof shield nickels # 8 with a bullet!!!!
RIP "BEAR"
Because the only people who care how nice their 67s are are those playing the registry game.
I assume that's being facetious because shouldn't everyone care how nice their coins are for the grade?
No Ronyahski, Actually dealers and collectors who sell their Ms 67+ 's make a lot of money
Selling them.
Almost as much as dealers who sell their BLUE INDIAN PROOFS !
PCGS also makes quite a lot of money in grading fees from resubmittals
TDN - As you know there are many Ms 67 coins that are nicer than the Ms 67+
That is because there are so many Ms 67's that have not and will not be submitted
Maybe not the equivalent of a plus.
More like 3 cherries on a slot.
I answer "Yes".
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/gold/liberty-head-2-1-gold-major-sets/liberty-head-2-1-gold-basic-set-circulation-strikes-1840-1907-cac/alltimeset/268163
I agree that the market places on a higher value on the "+" over a green bean in many areas, and I attribute that mostly to the registry. Later date Lincolns are a good example. It has happened before when the TPGs added attributions to coins, such as "Cameo", "FBL", etc.; prices initially shot up. Some current price spreads on "+" coins are too high and I believe they will adjust as more coins are submitted for the plus grade. Though it has been a long 7 years since plus grades were introduced, there are yet many more resubmissions to go.
There are high end Lincoln collectors who routinely take the green bean off their slabs. I wouldn't do that, but understand that CAC has no interest in the later date Lincoln market.
and I was going to say that a CAC-reject might indicate a C level coin for the grade or worse. You have to see it to know it.
I think the question is broad enough to say: yes.
some will be +, some will be spot on, a few not.
similarly for the CAC-jects.
grading <-> opinion <-> varies