Long Beach Part deux a NEWP ( my favorite) and a self inflicted wound

Justacommeman

Well I braved the the monsoon conditions and navigated the giant sink hole that sucked up a couple of cars in front of my bank in Studio City and I made the show both Friday and Saturday. It rained side ways on Friday. I'm declaring the drought officially over.

First off to new collectors and non experts please do seek out advise and second opinions from experts. That could be a mentor or CAC. Please don't make this a CAC thread I beg of you. In an earlier thread I mentioned I completed my toned Walker set. That lasted all of a few hours. I asked Bill Shamhart to vet a handful of coins that I had my doubts on. One was in my Walker set. Bill tells it only one way, the straight shooter way. Both barrels blazing. I didn't cry ( but I could have). Anyways he told me in no uncertain terms that two coins didn't belong in my collection. That's all I needed to hear. ( for those that don't know BIll is a CAC grader). FYI the two coins looked great but they had issues. I missed the issues. Easy to see them once he pointed them out. Im not as smart as I thought I was. Humbled. I sold them both within the hour. I took a beating.

Now the onto the good news. On Friday I had a second chance on a coin I passed on 18 months ago as I didn't want to reach to the moon for it at the time. Well the price came in some and I really wanted a set defining coin for my toned Walker set. I think all sets need a flag bearer. I bundled a package together American Pickers style and made the deal. It took a lot. I did not buy this as a top pop ( even though it is). I bought it because in my humble opinion this is the best long or short set Walker I have ever seen. It's the coin facts plate coin for a 1942 Walker.

PCGS 68 CAC

On a separate note I spent the rest of my time Saturday consigning coins to Legends May Auction. I also did some Spring Cleaning on some esoteric coins I needed a specialist to help liquidate. I'm refocusing some of my projects.

Bought some cool Carr coins from Ilini420 which I'll post in a DC thread.

mark

breakdown

Tremendous 42. And I have been there with Bill S. -- it is a good and humbling moment when you realize how little you know about how to grade coins.

TomB

Terrific WLH! Heck, I might have spent a moment or two with Bill over the years as well, don't you think?

Yorkshireman

It is great to hear Bill Shamhart is doing shows again.

Justacommeman

@TomB said:
Terrific WLH! Heck, I might have spent a moment or two with Bill over the years as well, don't you think?

And you lived to tell about it

mark

Lakesammman

That's a beaut!

TopographicOceans

That's sure one pretty WLH

Moldnut

That 42 is a beauty!

I'm curious about the issues that you missed, if you don't mind sharing?

Justacommeman

@Moldnut said:
That 42 is a beauty!

I'm curious about the issues that you missed, if you don't mind sharing?

More of falling in love with the positive attributes of a coin but ignoring flaws and what the whole story is. Tunnel vision on my part. They were purchased in my formative years but still on me. One of the coins was somewhat iconic in my genre to boot

mark

Kccoin

That's one heck of a Walker. Kudos for accepting an opinion and taking a loss. That's gotta be tough news to hear

Ablinky

Wow, a walker flag bearer if their ever was one, congrats on that amazing piece!

Walkerfan

That is a capstone Walker. Tremendous....Congrats!

WildIdea

I can see you respect this dealer friend, and if I sat my idols down and have them thrash my collection, it'd be a learning experience for sure. Hopefully more good critique than bad. I'm not sure though if I'd be too quick to move on from the pieces within an hour. That's what jumped out at me while reading your post. Maybe I'd process a little longer before selling or never. It's cool to me though, to hear that the money end of it was secondary to the decisions. So much emphasis placed on it.

northcoin

@Justacommeman said:

Now the onto the good news. On Friday I had a second chance on a coin I passed on 18 months ago as I didn't want to reach to the moon for it at the time. Well the price came in some and I really wanted a set defining coin for my toned Walker set. I think all sets need a flag bearer. I bundled a package together American Pickers style and made the deal. It took a lot. I did not buy this as a top pop ( even though it is). I bought it because in my humble opinion this is the best long or short set Walker I have ever seen. It's the coin facts plate coin for a 1942 Walker.

PCGS 68 CAC

mark

Stunning!

Justacommeman

@WildIdea said:
I can see you respect this dealer friend, and if I sat my idols down and have them thrash my collection, it'd be a learning experience for sure. Hopefully more good critique than bad. I'm not sure though if I'd be too quick to move on from the pieces within an hour. That's what jumped out at me while reading your post. Maybe I'd process a little longer before selling or never. It's cool to me though, to hear that the money end of it was secondary to the decisions. So much emphasis placed on it.

I asked for a consult. I wanted to know his opinion. He knows my collecting goals and standards. Ferreting out mistakes is a good thing. We all make them. My point is that it's ok to ask for advise no matter at what stage of collecting you are at. The two coins mentioned I got a fair price for them. I just happened to have paid a premium price for them. They weren't in fact premium. I feel great about the purge.

mark

Wabbit2313

What an amazing coin. In flipping through coinfacts walkers from time to time, this one always gave me pause, admiring the shades of red/purple. Glad it went to a good guy!

Cheers!

BryceM

Nice of you to share this. Friends try to make you happy but true friends tell you what you need to hear. I've been on the receiving end of a few honest assessments, and it's made me a better collector. Good for you to act immediately. Letting it fester would only make it more painful. If there were only two coins he didn't like, that must be a pretty outstanding set!

Ownership adds a point, and I can see it more clearly when I run into old coins that I used to own. Almost always they have issues I never noticed before. Probably most of us aren't nearly such good graders as we think either. Truly being objective and dispassionate is tough.

I weeded out a few pretenders and sent them to auction with Ian at GC yesterday.

Boosibri

stunning coin!

crazyhounddog

Now that is a true jaw dropper Mark.
Another bomb!!
Great score bud

astrorat

That's a remarkable WHL! Bill is not only an excellent grader, he is a good teacher as well. He teaches the ANA Summer Seminar course "Advanced Coin Grading" and it's well worth your time if you have the basic skills to enroll in the class (it's not for beginners) and you are willing to put your ego aside to learn. I have taught the class with him (many moons ago) and it's remarkable to see the change in many of the students over the week.

illini420

Great new purchase and thanks for letting me see it in hand yesterday. The TrueView photo is great, but it's even nicer in hand as the photo just doesn't fully capture the luster and overall eye appeal of this amazing Walker.

Congrats again!

Sonorandesertrat

MJ, That's a beaut! You need to give it a name, perhaps 'My Precious' or 'Carissima'.

Walkerguy21D

Wow - a capstone piece indeed!

ricko

@Justacommeman ....Mark, you are 100% correct about an expert opinion... and actually, replacing only two after Bill's review, speaks well of your collection. The WLH you bought is a great piece (and you know I am not a fan of tarnish), but the quality of the coin stands out. Congratulations on both accounts. Cheers, RickO

roadrunner

Thanks for this insight MJ. We all handle "reflection" a bit differently. I recall the first time CAC reviewed 40 of my coins for free at the Nov 2007 Coin Fest Show and I got some surprises on coins I felt were "untouchable." In my case I believe Bill saw them all and discussed a few with me. And like you, I was probably quick to want to be rid of "those" annoyances.

Upon reflection 9 years later, most of those coins were still very nice market acceptable for the grade despite CAC's assessment. The issues were fairly minor that pushed them from B's to C's per CAC. I think I reacted too quickly at the time getting low end money. The market today would likely see them differently. And even if I went out to find similar coins again today, I'm pretty confident most would cost near solid for the grade money. There's probably no one answer for every situation when your favorite coins don't sticker.

TONEDDOLLARS

@Wabbit2313 said:
What an amazing coin. In flipping through coinfacts walkers from time to time, this one always gave me pause, admiring the shades of red/purple. Glad it went to a good guy!

Cheers!

Please tell me how to cruise thru coin facts photos. I would love to take the journey

BryceM

Taking a dislike to something simply because someone doesn't share your assessment and becoming aware of previously unseen issues are two different things. Once you recognize the issues, they'll always be there staring back at you.

roadrunner

@BryceM said:
Taking a dislike to something simply because someone doesn't share your assessment and becoming aware of previously unseen issues are two different things. Once you recognize the issues, they'll always be there staring back at you.

If you show some of your favored coins to other collectors and dealers, you will eventually run into someone who strongly disagrees with your assessment. It's inevitable. And likely, sooner than you think. And they will tell you what "flaw(s)" on your coin bothers them. It doesn't mean they are right or wrong. But, no doubt, that input, will stick with you nonetheless.

BAJJERFAN

@Justacommeman said:
Well I braved the the monsoon conditions and navigated the giant sink hole that sucked up a couple of cars in front of my bank in Studio City and I made the show both Friday and Saturday. It rained side ways on Friday. I'm declaring the drought officially over.

First off to new collectors and non experts please do seek out advise and second opinions from experts. That could be a mentor or CAC. Please don't make this a CAC thread I beg of you. In an earlier thread I mentioned I completed my toned Walker set. That lasted all of a few hours. I asked Bill Shamhart to vet a handful of coins that I had my doubts on. One was in my Walker set. Bill tells it only one way, the straight shooter way. Both barrels blazing. I didn't cry ( but I could have). Anyways he told me in no uncertain terms that two coins didn't belong in my collection. That's all I needed to hear. ( for those that don't know BIll is a CAC grader). FYI the two coins looked great but they had issues. I missed the issues. Easy to see them once he pointed them out. Im not as smart as I thought I was. Humbled. I sold them both within the hour. I took a beating.

Now the onto the good news. On Friday I had a second chance on a coin I passed on 18 months ago as I didn't want to reach to the moon for it at the time. Well the price came in some and I really wanted a set defining coin for my toned Walker set. I think all sets need a flag bearer. I bundled a package together American Pickers style and made the deal. It took a lot. I did not buy this as a top pop ( even though it is). I bought it because in my humble opinion this is the best long or short set Walker I have ever seen. It's the coin facts plate coin for a 1942 Walker.

On a separate note I spent the rest of my time Saturday consigning coins to Legends May Auction. I also did some Spring Cleaning on some esoteric coins I needed a specialist to help liquidate. I'm refocusing some of my projects.

Bought some cool Carr coins from Ilini420 which I'll post in a DC thread.

mark

Did the person you sold them to note the deficiencies/issues that Bill pointed out?

TomB

I think what MJ was saying is more along the lines of "those of us who know who Bill is; know who Bill is". In other words, MJ wasn't falling out of love with coins simply because a random person with unknown levels of experience and working knowledge saw a ghost, but that while MJ doesn't know all that Bill knows in this arena, he is aware of Bill's depth of knowledge. That depth of knowledge can provide real insight in combination with Bill's willingness to illustrate what he sees and explain why it matters.

I write this because 20+ years ago (near 25-years ago) I was just some random guy walking the floor at coin shows and buying coins for my collection when Bill came up to me one day from behind a table and said something along the lines of "you look at coins they way I do...". Since then, he has been a friend, mentor, business associate and sometimes sparring partner. However, regardless of what status our relationship is at any given time, I would have to think long and hard if Bill and I saw a coin in a different light.

DIMEMAN

That's a beautiful 42.......where is the 42-S?

Wabbit2313

@BAJJERFAN said:

Did the person you sold them to note the deficiencies/issues that Bill pointed out?

If I sell a coin that I do not think is graded correctly, it does not change the fact that the grading company thinks it is, and they have to guarantee that. Graded coins are not my opinion, or anyone else's, except the company who puts their name and reputation on the label.

Justacommeman

@TomB said:
I think what MJ was saying is more along the lines of "those of us who know who Bill is; know who Bill is". In other words, MJ wasn't falling out of love with coins simply because a random person with unknown levels of experience and working knowledge saw a ghost, but that while MJ doesn't know all that Bill knows in this arena, he is aware of Bill's depth of knowledge. That depth of knowledge can provide real insight in combination with Bill's willingness to illustrate what he sees and explain why it matters.

I write this because 20+ years ago (near 25-years ago) I was just some random guy walking the floor at coin shows and buying coins for my collection when Bill came up to me one day from behind a table and said something along the lines of "you look at coins they way I do...". Since then, he has been a friend, mentor, business associate and sometimes sparring partner. However, regardless of what status our relationship is at any given time, I would have to think long and hard if Bill and I saw a coin in a different light.

Well said Tom. Can't say it any better.

mark

Justacommeman

@DIMEMAN said:
That's a beautiful 42.......where is the 42-S?

Being graded. Should have done a walk through. I was brain dead at the time

M

Justacommeman

@BAJJERFAN said:

@Justacommeman said:
Well I braved the the monsoon conditions and navigated the giant sink hole that sucked up a couple of cars in front of my bank in Studio City and I made the show both Friday and Saturday. It rained side ways on Friday. I'm declaring the drought officially over.

First off to new collectors and non experts please do seek out advise and second opinions from experts. That could be a mentor or CAC. Please don't make this a CAC thread I beg of you. In an earlier thread I mentioned I completed my toned Walker set. That lasted all of a few hours. I asked Bill Shamhart to vet a handful of coins that I had my doubts on. One was in my Walker set. Bill tells it only one way, the straight shooter way. Both barrels blazing. I didn't cry ( but I could have). Anyways he told me in no uncertain terms that two coins didn't belong in my collection. That's all I needed to hear. ( for those that don't know BIll is a CAC grader). FYI the two coins looked great but they had issues. I missed the issues. Easy to see them once he pointed them out. Im not as smart as I thought I was. Humbled. I sold them both within the hour. I took a beating.

Now the onto the good news. On Friday I had a second chance on a coin I passed on 18 months ago as I didn't want to reach to the moon for it at the time. Well the price came in some and I really wanted a set defining coin for my toned Walker set. I think all sets need a flag bearer. I bundled a package together American Pickers style and made the deal. It took a lot. I did not buy this as a top pop ( even though it is). I bought it because in my humble opinion this is the best long or short set Walker I have ever seen. It's the coin facts plate coin for a 1942 Walker.

On a separate note I spent the rest of my time Saturday consigning coins to Legends May Auction. I also did some Spring Cleaning on some esoteric coins I needed a specialist to help liquidate. I'm refocusing some of my projects.

Bought some cool Carr coins from Ilini420 which I'll post in a DC thread.

mark

Did the person you sold them to note the deficiencies/issues that Bill pointed out?

Both National dealers at the time. One out of business and the other a harsh critic of CAC. No they didn't point anything out. That's on me. They were selling coins that the TPG's rendered their opinions on. Both of these coins were purchased prior to CAC coming into its own. I hadn't put a loupe to these coins in years.

One more thing. Bill knows most of my coins. Several have come through his hands one way or another. It wasn't like he was pouring though boxes of my stuff. I asked for specific strategies on several specific coins. Cross, upgrade, crack, resubmit, leave as is etc etc. A couple were in my main sets.
Mark

DIMEMAN

@Justacommeman said:

@DIMEMAN said:
That's a beautiful 42.......where is the 42-S?

Being graded. Should have done a walk through. I was brain dead at the time

M

Mark....if you would unblock me I would like to ask you some questions on Walkers by way of PM.

Justacommeman

@DIMEMAN said:

@Justacommeman said:

@DIMEMAN said:
That's a beautiful 42.......where is the 42-S?

Being graded. Should have done a walk through. I was brain dead at the time

M

Mark....if you would unblock me I would like to ask you some questions on Walkers by way of PM.

I haven't had you blocked in years. I just let you think that

Don't go jamming up my inbox!

Mark

DIMEMAN

@Justacommeman said:

@DIMEMAN said:

@Justacommeman said:

@DIMEMAN said:
That's a beautiful 42.......where is the 42-S?

Being graded. Should have done a walk through. I was brain dead at the time

M

Mark....if you would unblock me I would like to ask you some questions on Walkers by way of PM.

I haven't had you blocked in years. I just let you think that

Don't go jamming up my inbox!

Mark

caddyshack

gorgeous Walker! even the fields look clean. congrats

BAJJERFAN

@Justacommeman said:

@BAJJERFAN said:

@Justacommeman said:
Well I braved the the monsoon conditions and navigated the giant sink hole that sucked up a couple of cars in front of my bank in Studio City and I made the show both Friday and Saturday. It rained side ways on Friday. I'm declaring the drought officially over.

First off to new collectors and non experts please do seek out advise and second opinions from experts. That could be a mentor or CAC. Please don't make this a CAC thread I beg of you. In an earlier thread I mentioned I completed my toned Walker set. That lasted all of a few hours. I asked Bill Shamhart to vet a handful of coins that I had my doubts on. One was in my Walker set. Bill tells it only one way, the straight shooter way. Both barrels blazing. I didn't cry ( but I could have). Anyways he told me in no uncertain terms that two coins didn't belong in my collection. That's all I needed to hear. ( for those that don't know BIll is a CAC grader). FYI the two coins looked great but they had issues. I missed the issues. Easy to see them once he pointed them out. Im not as smart as I thought I was. Humbled. I sold them both within the hour. I took a beating.

Now the onto the good news. On Friday I had a second chance on a coin I passed on 18 months ago as I didn't want to reach to the moon for it at the time. Well the price came in some and I really wanted a set defining coin for my toned Walker set. I think all sets need a flag bearer. I bundled a package together American Pickers style and made the deal. It took a lot. I did not buy this as a top pop ( even though it is). I bought it because in my humble opinion this is the best long or short set Walker I have ever seen. It's the coin facts plate coin for a 1942 Walker.

On a separate note I spent the rest of my time Saturday consigning coins to Legends May Auction. I also did some Spring Cleaning on some esoteric coins I needed a specialist to help liquidate. I'm refocusing some of my projects.

Bought some cool Carr coins from Ilini420 which I'll post in a DC thread.

mark

Did the person you sold them to note the deficiencies/issues that Bill pointed out?

Both National dealers at the time. One out of business and the other a harsh critic of CAC. No they didn't point anything out. That's on me. They were selling coins that the TPG's rendered their opinions on. Both of these coins were purchased prior to CAC coming into its own. I hadn't put a loupe to these coins in years.

One more thing. Bill knows most of my coins. Several have come through his hands one way or another. It wasn't like he was pouring though boxes of my stuff. I asked for specific strategies on several specific coins. Cross, upgrade, crack, resubmit, leave as is etc etc. A couple were in my main sets.
Mark

I was asking about the person or persons that you sold them to at the LB show. Did they say that because of some issues they could only offer x or did they buy them without comment?

Nic

@TomB said:
I think what MJ was saying is more along the lines of "those of us who know who Bill is; know who Bill is". In other words, MJ wasn't falling out of love with coins simply because a random person with unknown levels of experience and working knowledge saw a ghost, but that while MJ doesn't know all that Bill knows in this arena, he is aware of Bill's depth of knowledge. That depth of knowledge can provide real insight in combination with Bill's willingness to illustrate what he sees and explain why it matters.

I write this because 20+ years ago (near 25-years ago) I was just some random guy walking the floor at coin shows and buying coins for my collection when Bill came up to me one day from behind a table and said something along the lines of "you look at coins they way I do...". Since then, he has been a friend, mentor, business associate and sometimes sparring partner. However, regardless of what status our relationship is at any given time, I would have to think long and hard if Bill and I saw a coin in a different light.

Yup.

Justacommeman

@BAJJERFAN said:

@Justacommeman said:

@BAJJERFAN said:

@Justacommeman said:
Well I braved the the monsoon conditions and navigated the giant sink hole that sucked up a couple of cars in front of my bank in Studio City and I made the show both Friday and Saturday. It rained side ways on Friday. I'm declaring the drought officially over.

First off to new collectors and non experts please do seek out advise and second opinions from experts. That could be a mentor or CAC. Please don't make this a CAC thread I beg of you. In an earlier thread I mentioned I completed my toned Walker set. That lasted all of a few hours. I asked Bill Shamhart to vet a handful of coins that I had my doubts on. One was in my Walker set. Bill tells it only one way, the straight shooter way. Both barrels blazing. I didn't cry ( but I could have). Anyways he told me in no uncertain terms that two coins didn't belong in my collection. That's all I needed to hear. ( for those that don't know BIll is a CAC grader). FYI the two coins looked great but they had issues. I missed the issues. Easy to see them once he pointed them out. Im not as smart as I thought I was. Humbled. I sold them both within the hour. I took a beating.

Now the onto the good news. On Friday I had a second chance on a coin I passed on 18 months ago as I didn't want to reach to the moon for it at the time. Well the price came in some and I really wanted a set defining coin for my toned Walker set. I think all sets need a flag bearer. I bundled a package together American Pickers style and made the deal. It took a lot. I did not buy this as a top pop ( even though it is). I bought it because in my humble opinion this is the best long or short set Walker I have ever seen. It's the coin facts plate coin for a 1942 Walker.

On a separate note I spent the rest of my time Saturday consigning coins to Legends May Auction. I also did some Spring Cleaning on some esoteric coins I needed a specialist to help liquidate. I'm refocusing some of my projects.

Bought some cool Carr coins from Ilini420 which I'll post in a DC thread.

mark

Did the person you sold them to note the deficiencies/issues that Bill pointed out?

Both National dealers at the time. One out of business and the other a harsh critic of CAC. No they didn't point anything out. That's on me. They were selling coins that the TPG's rendered their opinions on. Both of these coins were purchased prior to CAC coming into its own. I hadn't put a loupe to these coins in years.

One more thing. Bill knows most of my coins. Several have come through his hands one way or another. It wasn't like he was pouring though boxes of my stuff. I asked for specific strategies on several specific coins. Cross, upgrade, crack, resubmit, leave as is etc etc. A couple were in my main sets.
Mark

I was asking about the person or persons that you sold them to at the LB show. Did they say that because of some issues they could only offer x or did they buy them without comment?

I told them that the coins no longer fit my set and they didn't cross once before. I didn't draw arrows if that's what you are asking. They will always holder. They just weren't strong coins

mark

SeattleSlammer

Sooooooo just an everyday 68 CAC with gorgeous complimentary rim toning and blazing luster.

Yeah, I've seen worse.

Nic

One beautiful half.

DrBuster

Is the toning expected to grow in the way you're looking for or maybe expecting? Or is this it and satisfactory?

For you...to me...this seems like 1/4 satisfactory toner, super strike, so maybe half+ weighted to your liking.

Sweet half across the board, nice pickup!

Unknown

This content has been removed.

AuroraBorealis

Beautiful Walker Mark and very fitting for your set!

AB

Broadstruck

Justacommeman

Miss you Broadstruck.....

M

DIMEMAN

Mark...I looked for your set and couldn't find it. Also, did you get my PM?

Wabbit2313

@Justacommeman said:

I told them that the coins no longer fit my set and they didn't cross once before. I didn't draw arrows if that's what you are asking. They will always holder. They just weren't strong coins

mark

You are being called out in your own thread by a guy who's 1942 Walker is a VF30. Click on his link! (Or it's right here:) https://collectivecoin.com/BAJJERFAN/FAFr7osj6KWV5Vib3ppB/0hISs1gaiAYR6QT33g2j

No wonder he is mad!