@drfish said:
His point is from the photos provided by the eBay seller those Peace dollars all look to be artificially toned and recently straight graded by PCGS
I used to be somebody, now I'm just a coin collector. Recipient of the coveted "You Suck" award, April 2009 for cherrypicking a 1833 CBHD LM-5, and April 2022 for a 1835 LM-12, and again in Aug 2012 for picking off a 1952 FS-902.
The seller is edynamicmarketing. I looked at his 2000+ completed auctions, most are toned coins. They range from the most ugly AT coins you'll ever see, to a handful of legit looking toners. Many are raw, I suspect those may have been body bagged by the TPG. NGC, PCGS, ANACs holders, Morgans to modern....
I used to be somebody, now I'm just a coin collector. Recipient of the coveted "You Suck" award, April 2009 for cherrypicking a 1833 CBHD LM-5, and April 2022 for a 1835 LM-12, and again in Aug 2012 for picking off a 1952 FS-902.
JMHO, and hoping my intelligence level doesn't eject me from the thread.
I only checked one cert and it was what it is. I will assume that the pictures are highly saturated with light and that the coins don't really look like we think they do. the trouble, for me, is that it is hard to judge pictures and the slabs look OK to me. I think I see the new anti-counterfeit diagnostics on these slabs which would mean they are legit.
as far as them being gassed in the holder, I don't think so. I would expect to see brilliance in the areas where the gasket holds the coin and tone where the coin is free of the gasket, not the opposite. that leaves one of two things --- they are toned OK and just look bad ---or--- they are AT and got by PCGS.
@keets , I am also not familiar with the new slab diagnostics asides from my very poor mind reading abilities, so if you can point me there it may add to my knowledge base.
You are correct, I just didn't notice your post, so my learning must have taken a step back. Perhaps next time someone tries to understand what you are saying you may give them the courtesy of a response instead of assuming some kind of an air of superiority.
I have no doubt that many here know more than me, actually, that is why I am here.
@lcoopie said:
You are correct, I just didn't notice your post, so my learning must have taken a step back. Perhaps next time someone tries to understand what you are saying you may give them the courtesy of a response instead of assuming some kind of an air of superiority.
I have no doubt that many here know more than me, actually, that is why I am here.
Fair enough. On your end, if you dont understand the context of my post, how about asking nicely instead of rudely and curtly stating, "Your Point?".
I have been shocked by the amount of (IMO) AT coins that I've seen at shows over the last couple years in both major TPG's more recently graded slabs (say the last two years). I'm HOPING this is just the current level of the market cycle, as I've seen both major TPG's gone through periods of tightening and loosening what they will accept for toning.
The seller is edynamicmarketing. I looked at his 2000+ completed auctions, most are toned coins. They range from the most ugly AT coins you'll ever see, to a handful of legit looking toners. Many are raw, I suspect those may have been body bagged by the TPG. NGC, PCGS, ANACs holders, Morgans to modern....
I totally agree my friend. This seller has some of thee worst artificially toned coins I've even seen. In my opinion he is a scam, and a bad one at that. As far as these images the OP is showing is another example of "Juiced" images. Just my opinion of course. It's either that or it's something more sinister by this seller. NOT pcgs. Just my opinion going by his other listings. My advice is stay the hell away from this dude
The bitterness of "Poor Quality" is remembered long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
Not that concerned. Those are ugly. Whoever buys these deserves what they get.
mark
Walker Proof Digital Album Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
@ChrisH821 said:
If only ebay had a way to search by certification number...
Edit: Apparently going to google and searching "ebay cert number" kinda works. 1923 1922 1923-s
All 3 sold by r_coin_shop
Great work ChrisH821
Not even the same coins. They've been Photoshopped into the slabs by this eBay scammer. This guy should be put in jail for fraud.
The bitterness of "Poor Quality" is remembered long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
@ChrisH821 said:
If only ebay had a way to search by certification number...
Edit: Apparently going to google and searching "ebay cert number" kinda works. 1923 1922 1923-s
All 3 sold by r_coin_shop
Great work ChrisH821
Not even the same coins. They've been Photoshopped into the slabs by this eBay scammer. This guy should be put in jail for fraud.
It appears they are the same coins, although it's hard to tell through all the environmental damage they have applied. On the 23-s there is a distinct mark above the O in dollar, on the 1923 the fingerprint under Trust is on both, and on the 1922 the marks on the eagle's back and the scuff on liberty's neck into the hair is the same on both.
It's been proven several times that he AT's coins after they're slabbed. I think there's a legal case to be made here if PCGS is at all concerned with their grades being misrepresented.
It's very obviously AT if you've seen any of the other coins he's listed. Almost every single coin he sells - whether it's silver, clad, copper, modern or classic - all have the same type of chromatics, color transition, appearance etc.
I'll just leave this one here too. ANACS 1922 White edynamic's ANACS 1922
And it still has the goo left on the back of the slab from removing the sticker from the original seller lol this guy is shameless
@ChrisH821 said:
If only ebay had a way to search by certification number...
Edit: Apparently going to google and searching "ebay cert number" kinda works. 1923 1922 1923-s
All 3 sold by r_coin_shop
Great work ChrisH821
Not even the same coins. They've been Photoshopped into the slabs by this eBay scammer. This guy should be put in jail for fraud.
the marks on the 1922 are the same
Am I missing something here? I see three coins, in the seller link that are toned. Now I see another link with the same slab numbers with coins in them with no toning at all.. What's up?
The bitterness of "Poor Quality" is remembered long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
@ChrisH821 said:
If only ebay had a way to search by certification number...
Edit: Apparently going to google and searching "ebay cert number" kinda works. 1923 1922 1923-s
All 3 sold by r_coin_shop
Great work ChrisH821
Not even the same coins. They've been Photoshopped into the slabs by this eBay scammer. This guy should be put in jail for fraud.
the marks on the 1922 are the same
Am I missing something here? I see three coins, in the seller link that are toned. Now I see another link with the same slab numbers with coins in them with no toning at all.. What's up?
I had a discussion with 'one of the top 5 submitters by volume to PCGS nationwide' (submitter's words) this weekend, and he mentioned the latest scam for PCGS was "microdrilling" of the slab and then gassing it after the owner receives the coin back. The hole is virtually impossible to detect but is quite effective in allowing the gas to pass through to tone the coin.
Considering the nature of the source I have and the history of the submitter, back to the early 1990s . . . . I have no doubt he is quite accurate and we can derail the red herrings on this thread right now and focus on how we deal with this latest infringement on the PCGS mark.
@ChrisH821 said:
If only ebay had a way to search by certification number...
Edit: Apparently going to google and searching "ebay cert number" kinda works. 1923 1922 1923-s
All 3 sold by r_coin_shop
Great work ChrisH821
Not even the same coins. They've been Photoshopped into the slabs by this eBay scammer. This guy should be put in jail for fraud.
the marks on the 1922 are the same
Am I missing something here? I see three coins, in the seller link that are toned. Now I see another link with the same slab numbers with coins in them with no toning at all.. What's up?
They are somehow "toning" them in the slabs.
I think hes doing something else. I don 't think toning them in the slab can be done. I sure don't know everything. But I'm skeptical about that one.
The bitterness of "Poor Quality" is remembered long after the sweetness of low price is forgotten.
Are they using some kind of laser to "microdrill". If they use a bit, I imagine they could drill the side of the slab and fill and Polish it back to hide the drill spot?
Definitely doctored in the slab....not difficult to do....drill, gas and fill.... then sell....research may be the only way to combat this.. and most buyers will not take the time. Cheers, RickO
I can agree that if someone micro drilled a hole, applied gas, refilled the hole and polished the "outside top of the hole" this repair may all sound pretty good except I think it would be difficult to polish the inside tubular walls of said drilled hole. Plus, injecting an polished "fill" into the hole might be difficult Unless it is liquid and in either case, this fill just knows exactly when to stop at the inside "end" perfectly??? (It's open, so no dripping past the inside plane? Maybe they can liquid fill from bottom up.
I know they can repair glass windshields with liquid repair just about undetectable but that's only on the top layer, not the underside layer.
Persuing choice countermarked coinage on 2 reales.
Enjoyed numismatic conversations with Eric P. Newman, Dave Akers, Jules Reiver, David Davis, Russ Logan, John McCloskey, Kirk Gorman, W. David Perkins...
jerseycat101
Posts: 1,341 ✭✭✭✭✭
Comments
It's happening with other series as well.
your point??
I'm sorry I'm not as intelligent as you. Please ignore my post. I'm obviously over my head in your thread.
His point is from the photos provided by the eBay seller those Peace dollars all look to be artificially toned and recently straight graded by PCGS
I'm guessing they were toned in the slab?
I appreciate your imput @drfish, thank you.
Ugly.
Recipient of the coveted "You Suck" award, April 2009 for cherrypicking a 1833 CBHD LM-5, and April 2022 for a 1835 LM-12, and again in Aug 2012 for picking off a 1952 FS-902.
+1
Potentially a great thread but I wasn't exactly sure either.
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress
Those are horrible
Latin American Collection
I agree, but I feel inadequate to post in this thread and I apologize to the op for doing so.
The seller is edynamicmarketing. I looked at his 2000+ completed auctions, most are toned coins. They range from the most ugly AT coins you'll ever see, to a handful of legit looking toners. Many are raw, I suspect those may have been body bagged by the TPG. NGC, PCGS, ANACs holders, Morgans to modern....
Recipient of the coveted "You Suck" award, April 2009 for cherrypicking a 1833 CBHD LM-5, and April 2022 for a 1835 LM-12, and again in Aug 2012 for picking off a 1952 FS-902.
JMHO, and hoping my intelligence level doesn't eject me from the thread.
I only checked one cert and it was what it is. I will assume that the pictures are highly saturated with light and that the coins don't really look like we think they do. the trouble, for me, is that it is hard to judge pictures and the slabs look OK to me. I think I see the new anti-counterfeit diagnostics on these slabs which would mean they are legit.
as far as them being gassed in the holder, I don't think so. I would expect to see brilliance in the areas where the gasket holds the coin and tone where the coin is free of the gasket, not the opposite. that leaves one of two things --- they are toned OK and just look bad ---or--- they are AT and got by PCGS.
Those coins are ruined imho.
Can't imagine paying up for them, too.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947)
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
@keets , I am also not familiar with the new slab diagnostics asides from my very poor mind reading abilities, so if you can point me there it may add to my knowledge base.
@jerseycat101 said:
If you can't discern my "point" from the information provided, I can't help you.
I said , I'm sorry I'm not as intelligent as you. Please ignore my post. I'm obviously over my head in your thread.
You may be impressed, but I was able to detect that you deleted your response to me, so I guess I am learning, though at a very limited pace.
edited
My mistake, your posts were ghosted out , they were not deleted.
I haven't deleted anything, although I do accept your apology for making a mockery of my thread.
You are correct, I just didn't notice your post, so my learning must have taken a step back. Perhaps next time someone tries to understand what you are saying you may give them the courtesy of a response instead of assuming some kind of an air of superiority.
I have no doubt that many here know more than me, actually, that is why I am here.
Fair enough. On your end, if you dont understand the context of my post, how about asking nicely instead of rudely and curtly stating, "Your Point?".
Seller has been gassing slabs for quite a while now.
I have been shocked by the amount of (IMO) AT coins that I've seen at shows over the last couple years in both major TPG's more recently graded slabs (say the last two years). I'm HOPING this is just the current level of the market cycle, as I've seen both major TPG's gone through periods of tightening and loosening what they will accept for toning.
U.S. Type Set
No more than melt. All rainbow ?
WOW! I am totally surprised that these got past PCGS. Blatant AT jobs!
Spring National Battlefield Coin Show is September 5-7, 2024 at the Eisenhower Hotel in Gettysburg, PA. WWW.AmericasCoinShows.com
I totally agree my friend. This seller has some of thee worst artificially toned coins I've even seen. In my opinion he is a scam, and a bad one at that. As far as these images the OP is showing is another example of "Juiced" images. Just my opinion of course. It's either that or it's something more sinister by this seller. NOT pcgs. Just my opinion going by his other listings. My advice is stay the hell away from this dude
Well that's interesting...
8 Reales Madness Collection
Busted!
"If I say something in the woods and my wife isn't there to hear it.....am I still wrong?"
My Washington Quarter Registry set...in progress
What can be done about these?
Just say no.
Hoard the keys.
mark
Fellas, leave the tight pants to the ladies. If I can count the coins in your pockets you better use them to call a tailor. Stay thirsty my friends......
If only ebay had a way to search by certification number...
Edit: Apparently going to google and searching "ebay cert number" kinda works.
(EDIT: Links removed because they were no longer valid)
All 3 sold by r_coin_shop
Collector, occasional seller
Great work ChrisH821
Not even the same coins. They've been Photoshopped into the slabs by this eBay scammer. This guy should be put in jail for fraud.
the marks on the 1922 are the same
It appears they are the same coins, although it's hard to tell through all the environmental damage they have applied. On the 23-s there is a distinct mark above the O in dollar, on the 1923 the fingerprint under Trust is on both, and on the 1922 the marks on the eagle's back and the scuff on liberty's neck into the hair is the same on both.
Collector, occasional seller
What happened to the distinctive toning? In one slab they are white. In this seller images they are toned. What's with that?
It's very obviously AT if you've seen any of the other coins he's listed. Almost every single coin he sells - whether it's silver, clad, copper, modern or classic - all have the same type of chromatics, color transition, appearance etc.
Check out my iPhone app SlabReader!
I'll just leave this one here too.
ANACS 1922 White
edynamic's ANACS 1922
And it still has the goo left on the back of the slab from removing the sticker from the original seller lol this guy is shameless
EDIT: Links in this post are no good either.
Collector, occasional seller
Am I missing something here? I see three coins, in the seller link that are toned. Now I see another link with the same slab numbers with coins in them with no toning at all.. What's up?
They are somehow "toning" them in the slabs.
Collector, occasional seller
Man I love google...
Original Note that this listing expired on the 13th of this month, 10 days ago
Edynamics special
Collector, occasional seller
Interesting . . .
I had a discussion with 'one of the top 5 submitters by volume to PCGS nationwide' (submitter's words) this weekend, and he mentioned the latest scam for PCGS was "microdrilling" of the slab and then gassing it after the owner receives the coin back. The hole is virtually impossible to detect but is quite effective in allowing the gas to pass through to tone the coin.
Considering the nature of the source I have and the history of the submitter, back to the early 1990s . . . . I have no doubt he is quite accurate and we can derail the red herrings on this thread right now and focus on how we deal with this latest infringement on the PCGS mark.
Drunner
I think hes doing something else. I don 't think toning them in the slab can be done. I sure don't know everything. But I'm skeptical about that one.
Definitely doctored in the slab....not difficult to do....drill, gas and fill.... then sell....research may be the only way to combat this.. and most buyers will not take the time. Cheers, RickO
Th> @gtstang said:
Nice work!
Hopefully PCGS acts on this aggressively.
Beautiful AT coins.
I hope someone spent a lot of money for those coins and for grading.
It's good for the economy and that's about all they're good for.
"“Those who sacrifice liberty for security/safety deserve neither.“(Benjamin Franklin)
"I only golf on days that end in 'Y'" (DE59)
I know they can repair glass windshields with liquid repair just about undetectable but that's only on the top layer, not the underside layer.
Enjoyed numismatic conversations with Eric P. Newman, Dave Akers, Jules Reiver, David Davis, Russ Logan, John McCloskey, Kirk Gorman, W. David Perkins...